Luma Health - Read before you sign & pay

[burner2014]

So I was quite happy with Luma Health. I was customer for over a year and their service was good.

 

Last year I got sick and stayed in hospital 2 days. (Yes only 1 night ???? ), claim worked well and I got my money back from the hospital bills.

 

But now I extended the insurance and they excluded this exact sickness (it's a very common one nothing crazy special) from my policy.

 

This seems to be a common method with Luma Health so I can just recommend you guys to always check the renewal early and read the renewal papers before paying. I am asking now for a refund lets see how much I can get back ???? .

 

Just crazy that this stuff is allowed, but yeah Asia stays Asia. In Europe you couldn't do that. 

 

[itsari]

In the first world the insurance company will tell you to insure elsewhere .

[scubascuba3]

1 minute ago, itsari said:

In the first world the insurance company will tell you to insure elsewhere .

I don't think they can exclude a condition claimed on

[burner2014]

9 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

I don't think they can exclude a condition claimed on

in Europe you can't or?

In Asia you can. Luma just did it and again it was a really common sickness, nothing special which is why I am so furious ????
 

But yeah they just told me to go somewhere else, Cigna here I come. 

[itsari]

14 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

I don't think they can exclude a condition claimed on

They do

[scubascuba3]

8 minutes ago, itsari said:

They do

western health insurance company?

[scubascuba3]

13 minutes ago, burner2014 said:

in Europe you can't or?

In Asia you can. Luma just did it and again it was a really common sickness, nothing special which is why I am so furious ????
 

But yeah they just told me to go somewhere else, Cigna here I come. 

Europe

[4MyEgo]

14 minutes ago, burner2014 said:

in Europe you can't or?

In Asia you can. Luma just did it and again it was a really common sickness, nothing special which is why I am so furious ????
 

But yeah they just told me to go somewhere else, Cigna here I come. 

Shop around, try AA Insurance Brokers here in Thailand, they will do the running around for you and get that condition included in the policy. I had a pre-existing condition included where Cigna and Southern Cross refused.

 

It might cost you a little extra in the policy, but up to you.

[burner2014]

4 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

Shop around, try AA Insurance Brokers here in Thailand, they will do the running around for you and get that condition included in the policy. I had a pre-existing condition included where Cigna and Southern Cross refused.

 

It might cost you a little extra in the policy, but up to you.

 

which insurance did you end up?

Yep checking with a broker now to shop around. I have no big problem getting some pre existing condition excluded, matter of fact I got that excluded by Luma ???? but I have a big problem getting on a renewal a condition excluded that I claimed one time.

[Bruno123]

17 minutes ago, burner2014 said:

in Europe you can't or?

In Asia you can. Luma just did it and again it was a really common sickness, nothing special which is why I am so furious ????
 

But yeah they just told me to go somewhere else, Cigna here I come. 

 

Similarly with my European policies. Though mine was a damaged hand. So they excluded that particular injury because of course it would then qualify as a pre-existing condition.

So now yours is a pre-existing condition. One time makes no difference. Though since you haven't told us the illness, we don't know if it seems an appropriate action.

Edited October 14, 2021 by Bruno123

[4MyEgo]

1 minute ago, burner2014 said:

 

which insurance did you end up?

Yep checking with a broker now to shop around. I have no big problem getting some pre existing condition excluded, matter of fact I got that excluded by Luma ???? but I have a big problem getting on a renewal a condition excluded that I claimed one time.

David Shield through AA Insurance Brokers, I am heading out for a few hours now, if you would like the contact I deal with, PM me and I will provide the details to you, all done via email for me, no pressure, no sale pitches whereas the others were just contractors who said they worked for the companies, but did not, commission, commission, commission, which I don't mind, but one lie is enough for me to move on,  

[burner2014]

Just now, 4MyEgo said:

David Shield through AA Insurance Brokers, I am heading out for a few hours now, if you would like the contact I deal with, PM me and I will provide the details to you, all done via email for me, no pressure, no sale pitches whereas the others were just contractors who said they worked for the companies, but did not, commission, commission, commission, which I don't mind, but one lie is enough for me to move on,  

yes please send me a PM.

 

 

[4MyEgo]

3 minutes ago, burner2014 said:

yes please send me a PM.

 

 

Just sent....

[4MyEgo]

6 minutes ago, Bruno123 said:

 

Similarly with my European policies. Though mine was a damaged hand. So they excluded that particular injury because of course it would then qualify as a pre-existing condition.

So now yours is a pre-existing condition. One time makes no difference. Though since you haven't told us the illness, we don't know if it seems an appropriate action.

I would argue that as it wasn't a pre-existing condition when I took out the policy, it cannot be a pre-existing condition, like health insurance, if you have a heart attack, they can't say when you joined us, you were healthy, now because of your heart attack, you are a higher risk.

 

Don't quote me, but those are my thoughts, as far as the life insurance, I know they can't do it because you are covered for life insurance.

[Bruno123]

Just now, 4MyEgo said:

I would argue that as it wasn't a pre-existing condition when I took out the policy, it cannot be a pre-existing condition, like health insurance, if you have a heart attack, they can't say when you joined us, you were healthy, now because of your heart attack, you are a higher risk.

 

Don't quote me, but those are my thoughts, as far as the life insurance, I know they can't do it because you are covered for life insurance.

Here I am, quoting you. 

 

Quote

they can't say when you joined us, you were healthy, now because of your heart attack, you are a higher risk.

 

 

That is exactly what they can say and that is exactly what they can do and did to the OP when it came time to renew.

 

[4MyEgo]

3 minutes ago, Bruno123 said:

That is exactly what they can say and that is exactly what they can do and did to the OP when it came time to renew.

It would have to be in the policy and if I read something on those lines, I wouldn't take out the policy in the 1st place.

 

When Cigna and Southern Cross said they wouldn't insure my pre-existing condition, I said fine, and move on, and found an insurer who would for an extra $60USD a month, the way I figure it is if you are going to take thousands of dollars off of me for insurance, then I want to be insured, not excluded, that said, when you have funds to back you, you can self insure, however, better to have insurance IMO that way if something does happen, your back up money doesn't get touched.

 

If no one would insure my pre-existing condition, then I would self insure, as much as it is their right to knock me back, I can also knock them back.

[Bruno123]

7 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

It would have to be in the policy and if I read something on those lines, I wouldn't take out the policy in the 1st place.

 

When Cigna and Southern Cross said they wouldn't insure my pre-existing condition, I said fine, and move on, and found an insurer who would for an extra $60USD a month, the way I figure it is if you are going to take thousands of dollars off of me for insurance, then I want to be insured, not excluded, that said, when you have funds to back you, you can self insure, however, better to have insurance IMO that way if something does happen, your back up money doesn't get touched.

 

If no one would insure my pre-existing condition, then I would self insure, as much as it is their right to knock me back, I can also knock them back.

 

 

You are missing the point and I made it quite clear. RENEWAL. It was there when he tried to renew and in Europe they would insist on reading it out to you too.

Did the OP ask if it would simply cost more to cover the pre-existing?

It was only for a period and now I am covered for everything as usual.

[4MyEgo]

1 hour ago, Bruno123 said:

 

 

You are missing the point and I made it quite clear. RENEWAL. It was there when he tried to renew and in Europe they would insist on reading it out to you too.

Did the OP ask if it would simply cost more to cover the pre-existing?

It was only for a period and now I am covered for everything as usual.

No point being missed, e.g. he was insured with them, then went to renew his policy with them.

 

I suppose it all depends on the country the policy is taken out in and what protection the customer has, suffice to say that there are arbitrary establishments their to protect the customer if there was a complaint, time consuming, just depends on the avenue one wants to take.

 

This might be of some interest ?

https://www.healthcare.gov/coverage/pre-existing-conditions/

[brewsterbudgen]

I'm quite shocked by this.  My wife and kid are insured with Luma, and so far they've been great, apart from a substantial increase in premium now that my wife is 31.   Is it 'official' that if a claim is made, any renewals will not cover a repeat of the condition?  Sounds ridiculous to me. 

[scubascuba3]

7 hours ago, brewsterbudgen said:

I'm quite shocked by this.  My wife and kid are insured with Luma, and so far they've been great, apart from a substantial increase in premium now that my wife is 31.   Is it 'official' that if a claim is made, any renewals will not cover a repeat of the condition?  Sounds ridiculous to me. 

check the policy document, ask them to confirm in an email. They will also cancel your policy if they find a pre existing condition not disclosed and ask for a refund of any claims to date even if unrelated

Edited October 14, 2021 by scubascuba3

[brewsterbudgen]

3 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

check the policy document, ask them to confirm in an email. They will also cancel your policy if they find a pre existing condition not disclosed and ask for a refund of any claims to date even if unrelated

I understand about preexisting conditions. I haven't seen anything in the policy documents about a  claim for a non-preexisting condition making further claims for the same condition void. If my 6-year-old son gets sick with flu and is hospitalised, are they really saying they won't pay up for future hospitalizations for flu?

[scubascuba3]

3 hours ago, brewsterbudgen said:

I understand about preexisting conditions. I haven't seen anything in the policy documents about a  claim for a non-preexisting condition making further claims for the same condition void. If my 6-year-old son gets sick with flu and is hospitalised, are they really saying they won't pay up for future hospitalizations for flu?

Get them to confirm by email

[burner2014]

7 hours ago, brewsterbudgen said:

I understand about preexisting conditions. I haven't seen anything in the policy documents about a  claim for a non-preexisting condition making further claims for the same condition void. If my 6-year-old son gets sick with flu and is hospitalised, are they really saying they won't pay up for future hospitalizations for flu?

you got my point ????

[dinga]

On 10/14/2021 at 3:27 PM, 4MyEgo said:

David Shield through AA Insurance Brokers, I am heading out for a few hours now, if you would like the contact I deal with, PM me and I will provide the details to you, all done via email for me, no pressure, no sale pitches whereas the others were just contractors who said they worked for the companies, but did not, commission, commission, commission, which I don't mind, but one lie is enough for me to move on,  

Suggest you get AA to give you the Comparative Premium table, showing current premiums against Age Categories for a lot of Insurance Policies.  I had an unwelcome experience with David Shield/Passport Card premium increases when the underwriter, Allianz, closed its previous UK-based Affiliate and moved clients onto policies subject to EU requirements for its French-based Affiliate.  

[4MyEgo]

9 hours ago, dinga said:

Suggest you get AA to give you the Comparative Premium table, showing current premiums against Age Categories for a lot of Insurance Policies.  I had an unwelcome experience with David Shield/Passport Card premium increases when the underwriter, Allianz, closed its previous UK-based Affiliate and moved clients onto policies subject to EU requirements for its French-based Affiliate.  

As David Shield are the only insurer that I know of who will actually cover my pre-existing condition, I will stick with them as it's cost for the premium vs the outlay/benefit suites my situation thanks.

 

 

Edited October 16, 2021 by 4MyEgo

[dinga]

13 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

As David Shield are the only insurer that I know of who will actually cover my pre-existing condition, I will stick with them as it's cost for the premium vs the outlay/benefit suites my situation thanks.

 

 

Of course - everyone's circumstance is different.  Coverage for pre-existing conditions (or not) are a major consideration.  In my case - after some dramas with very large proposed DS/Passport Card premium increases - April International offered not just very competitive premiums (both current and projected) as well as optional coverage for existing conditions at a 25% loading.  

 

In summary - see if options are available that meet your personal circumstances (there is no "one size fits all")  

 

  

[Sheryl]

On 10/14/2021 at 2:52 PM, scubascuba3 said:

I don't think they can exclude a condition claimed on

Not in most Western countries. They cannot newly exclude a condition not present when you first got the policy. (They can however decline to let you upgrade the terms of the policy, or allow it with the exception of that condition).

 

It pretty much negates the whole purpose of insurance if you cannot rely on continued coverage after developing a chronic condition.

 

This sort of thing is exactly wht I advise against getting a policy from a Thai country.

 

[burner2014]

5 hours ago, Sheryl said:

Not in most Western countries. They cannot newly exclude a condition not present when you first got the policy. (They can however decline to let you upgrade the terms of the policy, or allow it with the exception of that condition).

 

It pretty much negates the whole purpose of insurance if you cannot rely on continued coverage after developing a chronic condition.

 

This sort of thing is exactly wht I advise against getting a policy from a Thai country.

 

100% agree. I had 4 years a European insurance (travel) and then I switched to a Thai Insurance named here.

I am quite happy with their service and the claiming worked well, BUT if they exclude stuff after you had it on a renewal the purpose of a health insurance is not there anymore for me. I want to stay with one company more years and don't want to be feared that they exclude something else next year.

 

I will most probably pay the premium and just go with Allianz Global. You get what you pay is still valid sometimes ????  but again I would never ever caught this if I didn't read through 30 pages.. that's all i want to tell everyone to read it carefully. 

[LoeiI]

On 10/16/2021 at 9:17 PM, dinga said:

Of course - everyone's circumstance is different.  Coverage for pre-existing conditions (or not) are a major consideration.  In my case - after some dramas with very large proposed DS/Passport Card premium increases - April International offered not just very competitive premiums (both current and projected) as well as optional coverage for existing conditions at a 25% loading.  

 

In summary - see if options are available that meet your personal circumstances (there is no "one size fits all")  

 

  

I'm just looking at a quote from April international through AA, just a couple of questions, are April an International company (as the name suggests) or a Thai company and if you develop a condition during the term of the policy would this become a pre existing condition for the remainder of the policy term or upon renewal or both or neither ? I'm quite confused 

Thanks for any replies

[scubascuba3]

59 minutes ago, LoeiI said:

I'm just looking at a quote from April international through AA, just a couple of questions, are April an International company (as the name suggests) or a Thai company and if you develop a condition during the term of the policy would this become a pre existing condition for the remainder of the policy term or upon renewal or both or neither ? I'm quite confused 

Thanks for any replies

AA will probably provide you details of Thai April, they did with me, you need to ask for the April France. Ask AA the question they should know rather than us guessing

Edited October 19, 2021 by scubascuba3