UK pension - general question

[Moonlover]

19 minutes ago, Thailand said:

19 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

Did you take the trouble to work out how much you'd saved by living in a country with a much lower cost of living? (or if not saved, at least spent on things more to your liking)

 

19 minutes ago, Thailand said:

Yes

I trust it was worthwhile. I've never worked it out, but I'm pretty sure I'm better off out here, even without the annual increment, than I would be back in the UK.

 

Edited May 12, 2022 by Moonlover

[Thailand]

4 minutes ago, nchuckle said:

It is quite credible and not unusual  for someone to return to uk in their twilight years as circumstances change and medical insurance/health care becomes prohibitive in their adopted country. Basically they do take your word for it in the first place without requiring proof ,but you would need an address (relative?) in the UK (or other qualifying country) . I would also register on the electoral roll (can be done on line) and ideally with a local GP to get those details on the NHS register. A bigger hurdle might be getting a uK bank account ,unless you maintained one, given they will do ID / address checks to open one. 
One thing for everyone to be aware of is "connectivity " whereby increasingly, government departments are swapping information. So for instance you renew your UK passport in Thailand and that gets flagged. 
It is doable,but can be much more difficult depending on your circumstances. If you’ve basically cut most ties for 30 years it’ll be much harder than say you own but rent out your house in uk ,have maintained a uk driving licence,bank account , GP etc. 

Forget the fraud prosecution /forfeiture of pension hysteria mentioned by the ignorant , that’s not happened to my knowledge ,but you would likely have to repay any excess payments. In summary,if your circumstances enable a facade to be created fairly easily it’s definitely worth the effort!

My pension pays for my golf. No plans to return to the UK!

Will be maintaining the status quo.

[anchadian]

Simple answer is to purchase a small house or condo in the PH and rent it out, which would solve the PH address and mail re-direction, whilst spending most of your time here in Thailand.  

 

Open a bank of your choosing.

 

 

[Tuvoc]

1 hour ago, tanner said:

Thousands of expats from UK are still receiving full pension via address of family or friends back home.

And they're all committing fraud.

[billd766]

4 hours ago, Doctor Tom said:

Stop scare mongering. 

Perhaps he is NOT scaremongering, but giving a gentle warning of what may or can happen.

[billd766]

1 hour ago, anchadian said:

Simple answer is to purchase a small house or condo in the PH and rent it out, which would solve the PH address and mail re-direction, whilst spending most of your time here in Thailand.  

 

Open a bank of your choosing.

 

 

And how much would it cost?

 

Firstly to buy a small house or condo in the Philippines.

Secondly to rent it out, presumably through the agency who bought the small house or condo for you. 

[Doctor Tom]

36 minutes ago, billd766 said:

Perhaps he is NOT scaremongering, but giving a gentle warning of what may or can happen.

BS

[ivor bigun]

4 hours ago, chilly07 said:

It wouldn't take much effort to check where you are really living especially if a government official subs it out to an agency on no win no fee. Then you would loose your pension permanently. The agent would probably search Asean News for leads!

you cant lose your pension ,that is a fact ,not fiction like you just posted.

[Moonlover]

2 hours ago, nchuckle said:

2 hours ago, Moonlover said:

Absolutely no chance of that one! Fraud is fraud and you'll get no sympathy in a court of law. Nor would anyone who assisted you by the way, by allowing you to use their address. That's aiding and abetting. 

 

2 hours ago, nchuckle said:

Tell me your knowledge of anyone who’s been prosecuted for fraud in relation to this? I’ll wait….

I haven't suggested, or even hinted that they do prosecute. I was responding to a comment from an earlier poster.

 

The two cases that I was aware of in Egypt (see my earlier post) were settled when the culprits agreed to pay back the overpayments plus a fixed penalty and to comply with the rules in the future.

 

That would, of course be the preferred option for both parties. Prosecution costs money and I would suspect that the threat of it would be enough to bring transgressors to heel. Plus of course they can always withhold your pension until matters are settled. Either way, DWP have the whip hand.

 

Edited May 12, 2022 by Moonlover

[billd766]

1 hour ago, Doctor Tom said:

BS

That is just your opinion, and you are welcome to express it.

 

Others may think differently and they are also welcome to express it, whether you agree with it or not.

 

 

[Andycoops]

If you are declared non resident in the UK, as I am, both HMRC and DWP send all mail to my Thai address,, as does my UK bank etc.

 

Never had a problem with either, the only disadvantage is of course that your pension is frozen for being non resident.

 

I did know someone who spent 9 months or so of the year here but used his sons address to keep his pension as a UK resident.

Tricky game to play as if they catch you out, you'll be paying it back.

 

[BritManToo]

23 minutes ago, Andycoops said:

the only disadvantage is of course that your pension is frozen for being non resident.

Proof of life forms is another disadvantage ....... did you forget that one?

Not being able to use the NHS is another disadvantage ....... did you forget that one too?

 

[BritManToo]

14 hours ago, chilly07 said:

It wouldn't take much effort to check where you are really living ..........

How would anyone do that?

The police in the UK never managed to find where I was living ..... and they were definitely looking.

[Chongalulu]

10 hours ago, Moonlover said:

 

I haven't suggested, or even hinted that they do prosecute. I was responding to a comment from an earlier poster.

 

The two cases that I was aware of in Egypt (see my earlier post) were settled when the culprits agreed to pay back the overpayments plus a fixed penalty and to comply with the rules in the future.

 

That would, of course be the preferred option for both parties. Prosecution costs money and I would suspect that the threat of it would be enough to bring transgressors to heel. Plus of course they can always withhold your pension until matters are settled. Either way, DWP have the whip hand.

 

"Fraud is fraud and you’ll get no sympathy in a court of law" is rather more than a hint suggesting prosecution. How would you appear in court without a prosecution? 

[Chongalulu]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

How would anyone do that?

The police in the UK never managed to find where I was living ..... and they were definitely looking.

I think they’re reluctant to go into those gypsy traveller's camps…? ???? 

[Chongalulu]

11 hours ago, billd766 said:

Perhaps he is NOT scaremongering, but giving a gentle warning of what may or can happen.

It’s a warning with no basis in fact. You cannot have your pension forfeit for not declaring your correct residency. It was just bull ???? off the top of his head .

[BritManToo]

11 hours ago, Moonlover said:

That would, of course be the preferred option for both parties. Prosecution costs money and I would suspect that the threat of it would be enough to bring transgressors to heel. Plus of course they can always withhold your pension until matters are settled. Either way, DWP have the whip hand.

I always let 'them' take me to court ........ 'they' usually lose and pay significant costs.

Small claims twice, mobile phone companies lost both times (my costs ZERO).

Magistrates court once, Law Society lost (my costs ZERO).

Police, spent 120,000GBP in costs, settled out of court, only paid half the compensation I wanted (my costs were ZERO).

 

Convictions against private citizens are really hard to get, no need to fear court cases.

And in the rare cases you lose, plead poverty and get ordered to repay 1GBP/month (or a weeks community service).

Edited May 13, 2022 by BritManToo

[BritManToo]

20 minutes ago, nchuckle said:

I think they’re reluctant to go into those gypsy traveller's camps…? ???? 

I don't think they enter Tower Hamlets either.

When I lived in Oxford there were a few no-go zones as well.

Edited May 13, 2022 by BritManToo

[Tuvoc]

5 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Not being able to use the NHS is another disadvantage ....... did you forget that one too?

A good case there for pensioners living abroad being paid more, not less !

[superal]

17 hours ago, Tuvoc said:

And they're all committing fraud.

Including the DWP who are hiding behind ancient state pension rules that need a revision / upgrading to be up to date with modern day living when retirees can spend their autumn years in warmer climates that benefit their health and also save the UK NHS millions of £s . There is no justifiable reason to meddle with a persons pension , that has been earned  by way of their contributions , if they decide to live outside of the UK . Is bad enough that the UK pension is not sufficient to live a comfortable life in the UK especially with the cost of living spiralling out of control .

[ivor bigun]

17 hours ago, Moonlover said:

 

I haven't suggested, or even hinted that they do prosecute. I was responding to a comment from an earlier poster.

 

The two cases that I was aware of in Egypt (see my earlier post) were settled when the culprits agreed to pay back the overpayments plus a fixed penalty and to comply with the rules in the future.

 

That would, of course be the preferred option for both parties. Prosecution costs money and I would suspect that the threat of it would be enough to bring transgressors to heel. Plus of course they can always withhold your pension until matters are settled. Either way, DWP have the whip hand.

 

read the govt rules ,they cannot withhold your pension . its written there in black and white

[Moonlover]

1 hour ago, ivor bigun said:

read the govt rules ,they cannot withhold your pension . its written there in black and white

You're probably right, but I'm certainly not going to the trouble of searching through 'government rules' to find out.

 

But how many people actually know that? It's very easy to intimidate people when they know they've been caught out and they would much rather make a deal than risk loosing their pension or ending up in court. (or both!)

 

And that how it worked for the 2 guys I knew in Egypt. They paid back the over-payments, accepted the reduced pension and were very happy to have been, in their eyes, let off the hook.