The REAL EV vehicle discussion thread.....

[Photoguy21]

Biggest problem I Have with EV's is the distance on a full charge, the time to fully charge if driving somewhere and the availability of charging stations.

Of course despite what some people say the idea is good but the technology and price right now isnt.

[transam]

7 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Bigotry & Ignorance is Bliss & Expensive ... visual alternative

 

Nissan Leaf @ ฿1.5 mill, a fine Jap vehicle, w/OK specs.

 

OR ... for that same ฿1.5 mill baht, you can have all of these in you driveway.

 

AND ... over ฿100k in the pocket ... choice is yours ????

 

 

 

 

So you would mock folk who buy expensive EV cars....?

 

I watched a vid last night on the Audi E-tron EV, very nice, but it was about 90,000 UK pounds, now if we look at it from your point of view, you would rather have your yard full of cheap Chinese EV's.

 

Chap, you are still forgetting that folk who want or are thinking about an EV may want a ride of the own brand choice..

 

So, high horse, off....????

[vinny41]

6 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Prefer new, not used, and best apple & apple, equal comparison.

This is new price as listed on Nissan website

SPECIAL PRICE 1,499,000 BAHT WITH SPECIAL INTEREST 0% FOR 72 MONTHS1ST JUN - 30TH JUN 2022

https://en.nissan.co.th/offers.html#category=Personal+Finance&model=B12P

[KhunLA]

Just now, vinny41 said:

This is new price as listed on Nissan website

SPECIAL PRICE 1,499,000 BAHT WITH SPECIAL INTEREST 0% FOR 72 MONTHS1ST JUN - 30TH JUN 2022

https://en.nissan.co.th/offers.html#category=Personal+Finance&model=B12P

Noticed that, (take note of my 'visual' price comparison) and was making reference to the other price in your same post for a used car, I think.

 

[transam]

3 minutes ago, Photoguy21 said:

Biggest problem I Have with EV's is the distance on a full charge, the time to fully charge if driving somewhere and the availability of charging stations.

Of course despite what some people say the idea is good but the technology and price right now isnt.

True, even in the UK with its pretty big spread of chargers it seems maybe not plain sailing. Out of order chargers, queues to use them, and of course charge time away from home.

 

To me there is a long way to go to smooth things out, I reckon in LOS the PHEV is the way to go if you use your ride regularly, long-ish trips etc...

[KhunLA]

32 minutes ago, transam said:

So you would mock folk who buy expensive EV cars....?

NO, just mocking your bigotry to 'WHOLLY' Chinese made cars vs cars with Chinese parts in them.

 

Feel free to pay more for less spec'd vehicle.  I prefer the best product for the best price.  Right now, EVs in Thailand, that's the MGs, IMHO.

 

And we've had this discussion before also.  Really need to do again ?

 

Please bring something new to the table, besides your bias of 'WHOLLY' made Chinese cars & new MGs.

Edited June 27, 2022 by KhunLA

[vinny41]

5 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Noticed that, (take note of my 'visual' price comparison) and was making reference to the other price in your same post for a used car, I think.

 

Not a used car as you think 

Red plastic car has not been unwrapped.
Guaranteed brand new car quality At an excellent price

New car, nice red label. Plastic hasn't been opened yet, great value for money, only 1 car,
all conditions are the same as a red car from Nissan Motor PTT Co., Ltd.

https://www.one2car.com/en/for-sale/nissan-leaf-bangkok-metropolitan-kanchanaphisek/9406065?auc=true

[Photoguy21]

1 minute ago, transam said:

True, even in the UK with its pretty big spread of chargers it seems maybe not plain sailing. Out of order chargers, queues to use them, and of course charge time away from home.

 

To me there is a long way to go to smooth things out, I reckon in LOS the PHEV is the way to go if you use your ride regularly, long-ish trips etc...

Agreed. Once the obvious technicalities are resolved there is course where is the extra power to be generated from? Currently we dont have as many blackouts as we used to have say 10 years ago but I dont believe the system is sufficient to support the millions of cars on the road that will need to be accommodated.

Of course assuming the above is adequately met what is going to happen with the old batteries that can be refurbished to some extent but there will be a lot of what people consider to be toxic waste as a result.

How are the garages going to provide servicing and fault finding? The vehicles will essentially be a computer on wheels and I dont think currently many mechanics can adequately handle such a technology.

[KhunLA]

23 minutes ago, Photoguy21 said:

Biggest problem I Have with EV's is the distance on a full charge, the time to fully charge if driving somewhere and the availability of charging stations.

Of course despite what some people say the idea is good but the technology and price right now isnt.

Distance (to next CS), and available CS in TH is NOT a problem.  Charging time, depends how impatient you are.  Frankly I would enjoy a 30-45 min break after driving 3-4 hrs on Thai roads.

 

Idea, technology & especially price is good NOW.  IMHO

 

Nothing right around the corner that I see is worth waiting for, especially at 67 yrs old, and a ฿240k incentives that WILL expire.

Edited June 27, 2022 by KhunLA

[KhunLA]

5 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

Not a used car as you think 

Red plastic car has not been unwrapped.
Guaranteed brand new car quality At an excellent price

New car, nice red label. Plastic hasn't been opened yet, great value for money, only 1 car,
all conditions are the same as a red car from Nissan Motor PTT Co., Ltd.

https://www.one2car.com/en/for-sale/nissan-leaf-bangkok-metropolitan-kanchanaphisek/9406065?auc=true

I'm a bit suspect of that offer.  If it sounds too good ..... 

Besides, I'd take the MG EP over the Leaf any day, cheaper,

and 25% larger battery.  Rest of specs seem about the same.

[transam]

6 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

NO, just mocking your bigotry to 'WHOLLY' Chinese made cars vs cars with Chinese parts in them.

 

Feel free to pay more for less spec'd vehicle.  I prefer the best product for the best price.  Right now, EVs in Thailand, that's the MGs, IMHO.

 

And we've had this discussion before also.  Really need to do again ?

 

Please bring something new to the table, besides your bias of

'WHOLLY' made Chinese cars & new MGs.

Where have I mocked Chinese cars, if you are referring to buying cheap cars, which happen to be Chinese, that is your problem, not mine.

Now go back to my opening post, read it, then stop sulking.  OK.. 

[transam]

2 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

I'm a bit suspect of that offer.  If it sounds too good ..... 

Besides, I'd take the MG EP over the Leaf any day, cheaper,

and 25% larger battery.  Rest of specs seem about the same.

Thank you, so all your input revolves around a cheap car, I am glad we got that sorted out.

Let's move on....

[KhunLA]

23 minutes ago, transam said:

So you would mock folk who buy expensive EV cars....?

 

I watched a vid last night on the Audi E-tron EV, very nice, but it was about 90,000 UK pounds, now if we look at it from your point of view, you would rather have your yard full of cheap Chinese EV's.

 

Chap, you are still forgetting that folk who want or are thinking about an EV may want a ride of the own brand choice..

 

So, high horse, off....????

I'm in TH, not the UK, and if I had 1 mill USD extra in my pocket, I wouldn't be spending $110k of that on a car.   I don't like spending $27k / ฿955k  on the ZS.  Considering our new house only contracted out for ฿1.1 mill to build.

 

It's a car, a machine to go from point A to B.  Other want to romanticize about them, and spend silly money for them, that's great .... for them.   I have a different opinion.

[transam]

Just now, KhunLA said:

I'm in TH, not the UK, and if I had 1 mill USD extra in my pocket, I wouldn't be spending $110k of that on a car.   I don't like spending $27k / ฿955k  on the ZS.  Considering our new house only contracted out for ฿1.1 mill to build.

 

It's a car, a machine to go from point A to B.  Other want to romanticize about them, and spend silly money for them, that's great .... for them.   I have a different opinion.

Here you go again, me me me......

Do folk buy BMW, MERCEDES, AUDI petrol cars in Thailand...

Yes or NO...?

[KhunLA]

8 minutes ago, transam said:

Thank you, so all your input revolves around a cheap car, I am glad we got that sorted out.

Let's move on....

Yes, a well made, with good track record, less expensive car.

 

Yes do move on, but without me.  Thai motor forum/EV.

 

Not silly apple & oranges comparisons along with UK cars,

and apparently CS issues in the UK.

[KhunLA]

4 minutes ago, transam said:

Here you go again, me me me......

Do folk buy BMW, MERCEDES, AUDI petrol cars in Thailand...

Yes or NO...?

Then they should chime in.  I can only speak of me and my experiences.

 

I wait with baited breath ... 

Edited June 27, 2022 by KhunLA

[vinny41]

11 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

I'm a bit suspect of that offer.  If it sounds too good ..... 

Besides, I'd take the MG EP over the Leaf any day, cheaper,

and 25% larger battery.  Rest of specs seem about the same.

Problem is the MG is Tested according to the energy efficiency standard NEW EUROPEAN DRIVING CYCLE (NEDC)

 

The NEDC, which is supposed to represent the typical usage of a car in Europe, is repeatedly criticised for delivering economy-figures which are unachievable in reality. It consists of four repeated ECE-15 urban driving cycles (UDC) and one Extra-Urban driving cycle (EUDC).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_European_Driving_Cycle

Climate conitions between Europe and Thailand is completely different 

I have spent winters in Germany where it was on a regular basis -20C  has it ever reached -20C in Thailand I don't think so

[transam]

4 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Then they should chime in.  I can only speak of me and my experiences.

 

I wait with baited breath ... 

I thought you moved on.....????

[KhunLA]

1 minute ago, vinny41 said:

Problem is the MG is Tested according to the energy efficiency standard NEW EUROPEAN DRIVING CYCLE (NEDC)

 

The NEDC, which is supposed to represent the typical usage of a car in Europe, is repeatedly criticised for delivering economy-figures which are unachievable in reality. It consists of four repeated ECE-15 urban driving cycles (UDC) and one Extra-Urban driving cycle (EUDC).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_European_Driving_Cycle

Climate conitions between Europe and Thailand is completely different 

I have spent winters in Germany where it was on a regular basis -20C  has it ever reached -20C in Thailand I don't think so

I'll follow the advice and listen to the folks here that actually own MGs, ZS, EP, HS, EVs, along with one on YT that has owned and tested them, both in TH, and Norway, the MG EVs & other brands & models.

 

Instead of the speculation of folks with little to no experience, who apparently don't know what they are talking about.

 

Have a nice day ... PEACE OUT

[transam]

5 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

Problem is the MG is Tested according to the energy efficiency standard NEW EUROPEAN DRIVING CYCLE (NEDC)

 

The NEDC, which is supposed to represent the typical usage of a car in Europe, is repeatedly criticised for delivering economy-figures which are unachievable in reality. It consists of four repeated ECE-15 urban driving cycles (UDC) and one Extra-Urban driving cycle (EUDC).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_European_Driving_Cycle

Climate conitions between Europe and Thailand is completely different 

I have spent winters in Germany where it was on a regular basis -20C  has it ever reached -20C in Thailand I don't think so

Thanks for that, a real world insight into stuff..

[billd766]

16 minutes ago, transam said:

Where have I mocked Chinese cars, if you are referring to buying cheap cars, which happen to be Chinese, that is your problem, not mine.

Now go back to my opening post, read it, then stop sulking.  OK.. 

His story is about he, and only he has the experience and knowledge about EVs and that you are nothing but an arrogant know nothing Jack me lad.

 

With varying inputs from different posters with varying experience and questions I have learnt far more from this thread than I ever got from his. I will stick with this thread.

[KhunLA]

1 minute ago, transam said:

I thought you moved on.....????

Thought that deserved a reply, and didn't see it, until my notifications popped up, after got typing my last reply.

[richard_smith237]

16 minutes ago, transam said:

24 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

NO, just mocking your bigotry to 'WHOLLY' Chinese made cars vs cars with Chinese parts in them.

 

Feel free to pay more for less spec'd vehicle.  I prefer the best product for the best price.  Right now, EVs in Thailand, that's the MGs, IMHO.

 

And we've had this discussion before also.  Really need to do again ?

 

Please bring something new to the table, besides your bias of

'WHOLLY' made Chinese cars & new MGs.

Where have I mocked Chinese cars, if you are referring to buying cheap cars, which happen to be Chinese, that is your problem, not mine.

Now go back to my opening post, read it, then stop sulking.  OK.. 

To be fair KhunLA.... I don’t think a strong distrust of Chinese products is bigotry, its experience. 

For years many Chinese products have been substandard - my First question when looking at or discussing a Chinese made vehicle is safety.... 

I’ve hurt myself using Chinese made spanners (snapped and I smashed my knuckles).

 

Thus, with something as important as a car, its going to take a long time to install trust in overseas customers who are used to higher standards. For this very reason alone I will avoid MG cars (and also the Havel and Ora).

 

In 10 years things may be different.... for now, I’m not yet there and would prefer to go Japanese or European. 

 

 

Now... If dealing specifically with EV’s... IF there were Japanese and European EV’s which were the same price as their ICE counterparts then I’d have likely made the switch to EV’s already. 

 

i.e. our current car is a Mazda CX-5.... It cost about 1.8MB... IF that came as an EV for the same price, I’d have got that. But I’m not buying an MG EV at 1.0MB (or whatever its costs) because its an MG.

 

That said: I can understand why you may have no issues with an MG, specifically if basing your choice on cost alone and removing any ‘emotion’ and perhaps even irrational and incorrect concerns others such as myself may have. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[transam]

1 minute ago, billd766 said:

His story is about he, and only he has the experience and knowledge about EVs and that you are nothing but an arrogant know nothing Jack me lad.

 

With varying inputs from different posters with varying experience and questions I have learnt far more from this thread than I ever got from his. I will stick with this thread.

Thank you, that was my goal, real world EV ups and downs.  ????

[Photoguy21]

36 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Distance (to next CS), and available CS in TH is NOT a problem.  Charging time, depends how impatient you are.  Frankly I would enjoy a 30-45 min break after driving 3-4 hrs on Thai roads.

 

Idea, technology & especially price is good NOW.  IMHO

 

Nothing right around the corner that I see is worth waiting for, especially at 67 yrs old, and a ฿240k incentives that WILL expire.

Disagree. The technology is getting there but right now it isnt there. If you was driving from say Bangkok to Chiang Mai charging could add several hours onto your journey. Maybe you are happy with that but I certainly wouldnt be and I am sure many others wouldnt be either.

[SomchaiDIY]

42 minutes ago, Photoguy21 said:

How are the garages going to provide servicing and fault finding? The vehicles will essentially be a computer on wheels and I dont think currently many mechanics can adequately handle such a technology.

Cars already computer on wheels for many years 

 

All car tech now use scan tool and logic list to find fault at complex engine controls

 

ev car same all info on can bus for scan tool read
 

[KhunLA]

10 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

To be fair KhunLA.... I don’t think a strong distrust of Chinese products is bigotry, its experience. 

For years many Chinese products have been substandard - my First question when looking at or discussing a Chinese made vehicle is safety....

Not seeing much of a difference, if safety is one of the primary concerns:

[vinny41]

For anyone thinking about buying electric

Electric Vehicle Range Testing:UNDERSTANDING NEDC VS. WLTP VS. EPA

 

NEDC vs. WLTP: Which is More Accurate?

In Europe, the NEDC was established in the 1980s and was last updated in 1997. In addition to being old and outdated

These changes make the WLTP more accurate, with EV range estimates approximately 10% higher than what Europeans experience. Compare that to the NEDC’s tendency to overestimate by 25% to 30%, and you’ll understand why the WLTP is more trustworthy.

https://www.jdpower.com/cars/shopping-guides/electric-vehicle-range-testing-understanding-nedc-vs-wltp-vs-epa

 

Jaguar Thailand uses the WLTP testing  and explains the reason why here

The new tests are designed to better reflect current engine technology. NEDC was last updated in 1997, when the first generation of modern hybrid vehicles became widely available. Two decades later and — in addition to PHEV and MHEV vehicles — electric vehicles, like our own Jaguar I‑PACE, are on the roads. The tests for NEDC were not designed for these kinds of vehicles, WLTP addresses that.

https://www.jaguar.co.th/owners-wltp

[Photoguy21]

2 minutes ago, SomchaiDIY said:

Cars already computer on wheels for many years 

 

All car tech now use scan tool and logic list to find fault at complex engine controls

 

ev car same all info on can bus for scan tool read
 

Not really. You may think they are but they are not. In part yes but not to the extent an EV is. Do you really believe the technicians that are currently working on vehicles will have the capability of analysing the system? You are dreaming if you think that.

[KhunLA]

1 minute ago, Photoguy21 said:

Disagree. The technology is getting there but right now it isnt there. If you was driving from say Bangkok to Chiang Mai charging could add several hours onto your journey. Maybe you are happy with that but I certainly wouldnt be and I am sure many others wouldnt be either.

There's a vid on YT, (documented, real use) that's been posted before, and it took about 1+ hour longer, if memory serves, than Gmap estimate in an ICE.

 

Actually damn impression, as someone chimed in, and stated he couldn't do in that time, last time he made the trip.

 

That of course is driving straight through, if overnighting, then probably no real time difference.  Again, I'll stick with real life, instead of speculation.