Why is the UK struggling more than other countries?

[Chomper Higgot]

6 minutes ago, puchooay said:

You said "will". That is the future tense. Hence my comment.

The outcome of COVID + WAR + BREXIT is already impacting the UK economy.

 

That is the present any it will continue into the future.

 

The impacts of COVID and the WAR will diminish over time, the impacts of BREXIT will continue.

 

 

The UK is in recession, the only nation in the G7 with an economy that has not recovered to pre-pandemic levels, the only nation to choose to have trade barriers against itself.

 

[puchooay]

Just now, Chomper Higgot said:

The outcome of COVID + WAR + BREXIT is already impacting the UK economy.

 

That is the present any it will continue into the future.

 

The impacts of COVID and the WAR will diminish over time, the impacts of BREXIT will continue.

 

 

The UK is in recession, the only nation in the G7 with an economy that has not recovered to pre-pandemic levels, the only nation to choose to have trade barriers against itself.

 

Maybe so but that does not change the fact you made a prediction for the future.

 You just made another prediction too. However, this one is acceptable as you did not define whether the impact will be good or bad. 

[Mac Mickmanus]

8 minutes ago, Phoenix Rising said:

UK Pork Producer Flies in Filipino Butchers to Replace Lost EU Workers

 

Brexit a roaring success I see!

 

 

Do you think that there's anything wrong with Filipino workers coming to the UK , or would it be better if there workers were Caucasian/European from say , Poland ? 

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, puchooay said:

Maybe so but that does not change the fact you made a prediction for the future.

 You just made another prediction too. However, this one is acceptable as you did not define whether the impact will be good or bad. 

No, I did not make a prediction of the future.

 

I presented two calculations identical except for one variable BREXIT and asked “which one will produce the most severe outcome?”

 

 

That is not a prediction of the future, it’s asking a question.

[puchooay]

2 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

No, I did not make a prediction of the future.

 

I presented two calculations identical except for one variable BREXIT and asked “which one will produce the most severe outcome?”

 

 

That is not a prediction of the future, it’s asking a question.

Good try. 

 

However, it was a veiled question as we all know what you were getting at.

 

Anyway, nobody knows the answer to your veiled question so you should stop with the Brexit doom and gloom and let time show us the results.

[Chomper Higgot]

12 minutes ago, puchooay said:

Good try. 

 

However, it was a veiled question as we all know what you were getting at.

 

Anyway, nobody knows the answer to your veiled question so you should stop with the Brexit doom and gloom and let time show us the results.

It wasn’t a ‘veiled question’.

 

I very clearly used a question mark at the end of it, a question mark denotes a question. Nothing veiled about it at all.

 

 

As I pointed out, the impacts of BREXIT are already with us.

 

Refer multiple examples throughout this thread of businesses and business leaders identifying BREXIT as a cause of the problems they are facing.

 

 

Edited November 26, 2022 by Chomper Higgot

[GinBoy2]

Trouble is you need to pick one of two models in Capitalism

 

There is the European model of high tax and high social support

 

Or, you pick a North American model of low tax and self support.

 

The UK has tried to have the best of both worlds, and the chickens have come home  to roost.

 

As many of you know I'm a total Anglophile, I love your country, but....

 

This almost religious obsession you have with the NHS. Give it up, it was designed in the 1940's  not for the 2020's and will suck you dry.

 

I'm not defending the absurd US system, but I can get a Dr appointment tomorrow if I want for a $35 copay. Far cry from what I read about the UK and 'free at point of service'

 

Even those other European countries have grappled with these challenges and come up up a middle path.

 

You guys need to buckle down and have those hard discussions before you tumble into a Eastern European Basket Case

[Phoenix Rising]

52 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Do you think that there's anything wrong with Filipino workers coming to the UK , or would it be better if there workers were Caucasian/European from say , Poland ? 

I don't care in the slightest but you could ask the employers of the Filipinos if they would have preferred things as they were before Brexit or not.

And nice try on making this about race! Very sneaky, almost fell for it!

 

[PS. Irony alert.]

[Phoenix Rising]

3 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

I just wondered why it mattered to you as to whether Polish guy or a Filipino guy went to the U.K to work ?

   Could be that the flight time is shorter and so its less of a carbon footprint ?

  Why would you prefer a Polish guy and not a Filipino ?

Could be some sub conscious racism going on there ?

Do try to pay attention, all your questions were answered in my previous post. 

 

 

[Mac Mickmanus]

1 minute ago, Phoenix Rising said:

Do try to pay attention, all your questions were answered in my previous post. 

 

 

But you didn't .

But as you are trolling by laughing at my posts , its better we stop the discussion right here , otherwise we will end up in a laughing emoji battle and I wouldn't want to participate in one of those 

[puchooay]

49 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

It wasn’t a ‘veiled question’.

 

I very clearly used a question mark at the end of it, a question mark denotes a question. Nothing veiled about it at all.

 

 

As I pointed out, the impacts of BREXIT are already with us.

 

Refer multiple examples throughout this thread of businesses and business leaders identifying BREXIT as a cause of the problems they are facing.

 

 

I have noted that impacts of Brexit are possibly with us. However difficult it maybe to define to what extent.

 

However, you are asking questions about the future. I have pointed out that nobody knows what the impacts of Brexit will be in the future. You, on the other hand, seem to know. Hence, all the way back to my original post, I mentioned borrowing your crystal ball.

[Rimmer]

A post discussing links has been removed

[nauseus]

5 hours ago, RayC said:

No one held a gun to Johnson's head and forced him to sign.

 

The responsibility and accountability for the chaos associated with Brexit rests with the UK government.

Not a gun but enormous pressure, after 3 years of May's messing about, only ending up with that so-called "Chequers Agreement" failure. In Boris's haste to pick up the gauntlet and get Brexit done, he only succeeded in minor changes to that agreement - that was all done to quickly in the end but it is one reason why Brexit is such a mess, even though, technically, we are out. Yes, responsibility lies with UK governments - not only the recent ones but also the Heath regime of 1972 and after that - if there had been referendums held then, and before each major treaty signing, then we would either have never joined in the first place or been out long ago.  

 

There is no requirement for a withdrawal agreement but after so long as a member, then a sensible one is obviously best, especially w.r.t. all EU and UK citizens rights and status. Article 50 of the Lisbon Treaty is worded so simply and briefly, that anyone reading it might assume that it would be easy to leave the EU but these words are rather meaningless to any member trying to extract itself from the rats maze that the EU has become after successive treaties, over decades. The EU reaction after the referendum revealed its fear that the UK leaving might mean the disintegration of the EU itself. by prompting others to follow suit. The post referendum vengeful behaviour of the EU commissioners has now been seen and noted around the continent and the world - they would have been far better off being more reasonable and, using their own words, acted in "good faith".  

 

[Chomper Higgot]

4 minutes ago, puchooay said:

I have noted that impacts of Brexit are possibly with us. However difficult it maybe to define to what extent.

 

However, you are asking questions about the future. I have pointed out that nobody knows what the impacts of Brexit will be in the future. You, on the other hand, seem to know. Hence, all the way back to my original post, I mentioned borrowing your crystal ball.

BREXIT has resulted in UK trade barriers between the UK and its largest trading partner.

 

There is no need to have a crystal ball to see trade barrier will negatively impact the economy.

 

Numerous examples of this are already being reported and referenced within this thread.

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

But you didn't .

But as you are trolling by laughing at my posts , its better we stop the discussion right here , otherwise we will end up in a laughing emoji battle and I wouldn't want to participate in one of those 

It’s probably best if you stop implying other members are racists just because they make the factual observation that the UK is having to import Filipino Butchers to replace EU National Butchers after Brexit.

 

 

[bannork]

1 hour ago, puchooay said:

I have noted that impacts of Brexit are possibly with us. However difficult it maybe to define to what extent.

 

However, you are asking questions about the future. I have pointed out that nobody knows what the impacts of Brexit will be in the future. You, on the other hand, seem to know. Hence, all the way back to my original post, I mentioned borrowing your crystal ball.

The government's Office for Budget Responsibility sticks to its original forecast of a slash of 4% off the UK GDP due to Brexit .

https://www.ft.com/content/7a209a34-7d95-47aa-91b0-bf02d4214764

[nauseus]

2 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

The outcome of COVID + WAR + BREXIT is already impacting the UK economy.

 

That is the present any it will continue into the future.

 

The impacts of COVID and the WAR will diminish over time, the impacts of BREXIT will continue.

 

 

The UK is in recession, the only nation in the G7 with an economy that has not recovered to pre-pandemic levels, the only nation to choose to have trade barriers against itself.

 

Nasty echo in here.

[Chomper Higgot]

33 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Nasty echo in here.

Do you have any comments on the subject under discussion?

 

 

Edited November 26, 2022 by Chomper Higgot

[Mac Mickmanus]

9 minutes ago, bannork said:

The government's Office for Budget Responsibility sticks to its original forecast of a slash of 4% off the UK GDP due to Brexit .

https://www.ft.com/content/7a209a34-7d95-47aa-91b0-bf02d4214764

Although that is just a forecast, a predication .

[RayC]

4 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

It seemed to me that you were ridiculing my suggestion that Covid and Ukraine war was responsible for the company closing down , but now you are saying you were just making a joke . 

You don't seem to able to stop yourself from misrepresenting the facts. This is yet another example.

 

You imply - by omission - that Brexit was not a contributory factor in this company's closure. Yet again, that is untrue. The following is taken from the link which you posted:

 

"The former Five Star Fish facility was taken on by Icelandic Seafood International in 2020 but has recorded a staggering £8 million in losses, with bosses blaming Brexit, the pandemic, and Russia's invasion of Ukraine."

 

Perhaps, you'd like to email the CEO and inform him that he's got it wrong? (Up to you whether you consider this sarcastic or a serious proposal).

 

4 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

   I now have no idea about whether you are joking or being serious ,

To avoid any future ambiguity, I will make it explicitly clear when I am being sarcastic.

 

4 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

were 1200 Brits working in Brussels or is that another joke ?

That was a fact.

 

Again, another of my comments taken of context and the meaning distorted. 

 

What I said was that 1200 Brits worked for the EU institutions prior to Brexit and those posts will not be filled by Brits when the incumbents leave/ retire.

 

4 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

  I do have difficulty it telling the difference between your  serious posts and your jokes

Problem solved (see above).

 

4 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

 and I have also now lost track of the discussion 

Can't help you there.

 

Maybe take a bit more care before you post factually incorrect information or distort the meaning of others' comments.

[RayC]

5 hours ago, puchooay said:

We'd need to borrow your crystal ball.

No need for that. Have a look at the OBR report.

[Mac Mickmanus]

3 minutes ago, RayC said:

You don't seem to able to stop yourself from misrepresenting the facts. This is yet another example.

 

You imply - by omission - that Brexit was not a contributory factor in this company's closure. Yet again, that is untrue. The following is taken from the link which you posted:

 

Right this is my opinion :

The Company would not have closed down if it wasn't for Covid and the Ukraine war , the Company would have survived if it was just Brexit , but with Brexit AND Covid AND Ukraine , all three combined lead to its closure

 

[RayC]

4 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Our point is that Covid and Ukraine are the main causes of the current problems in the U.K .

My point is that, to the best of my knowledge, no Brexiters - with the exception of @nauseus - have acknowledged that Brexit has had a negative impact on the UK economy.

 

4 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

  Remainers are trying to claim that all the current problems in the UK are caused by Brexit and Brexit alone and that Covid and Ukraine are insignificant 

That is yet another lie (I'm losing count of the number).

 

I have acknowledged on numerous occasions that Covid and the war in Ukraine have had a negative effect on (the UK's) economy, as have many other remainders.

[Mac Mickmanus]

7 minutes ago, RayC said:

 

You imply - by omission - that Brexit was not a contributory factor in this company's closure. Yet again, that is untrue. The following is taken from the link which you posted:

 

"The former Five Star Fish facility was taken on by Icelandic Seafood International in 2020 but has recorded a staggering £8 million in losses, with bosses blaming Brexit, the pandemic, and Russia's invasion of Ukraine."

 

Perhaps, you'd like to email the CEO and inform him that he's got it wrong? (Up to you whether you consider this sarcastic or a serious proposal).

 

 

Stop there , that is what I am saying . 

I agree with the CEO. 

It was the combination of Brexit, Covid and Ukraine which caused the Company to close down, and it wasnt solely because if Brexit , that has been my point all along

[ozimoron]

4 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Right this is my opinion :

The Company would not have closed down if it wasn't for Covid and the Ukraine war , the Company would have survived if it was just Brexit , but with Brexit AND Covid AND Ukraine , all three combined lead to its closure

 

How did Ukraine affect the operations of a British fishing company?

[bannork]

UK car industry in decline since Brexit.

[Mac Mickmanus]

1 minute ago, RayC said:

My point is that, to the best of my knowledge, no Brexiters - with the exception of @nauseus - have acknowledged that Brexit has had a negative impact on the UK economy.

 

That is yet another lie (I'm losing count of the number).

 

I have acknowledged on numerous occasions that Covid and the war in Ukraine have had a negative effect on (the UK's) economy, as have many other remainders.

Please do not accuse me of lying .

If you personally agree that Brexit wasn't the reason why the Company closed down , then I admit that I was wrong about my suggestion .

   There are indeed some people who claim that all the UK's problems are caused by Brexit , but fair enough, it isn't ALL of Remainers who think that and I should have write "Some" Remainers

[RayC]

4 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

I don't disregard anything it does no good to go on about the past and didn't do that didn't do this, deal with present. 

So no accountability or responsibility should be levied against those who got us into this mess in the first place?

 

As for dealing with the present. We've had 3 PMs in 3 months, and who knows how many cabinet ministers in the same period. You think it wise to let these people continue to deal with the problems?

[Mac Mickmanus]

3 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

How did Ukraine affect the operations of a British fishing company?

The huge rise in UK utility costs caused by sanctions on Russia

[RayC]

4 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Remainers want to re-join and they are trying to convince everyone that leaving has been disastrous and it would be better if we re-joined 

It has and it would be.

 

Unfortunately, it won't happen for the foreseeable future.