Do we all have to be activists these days or at least do we have to support those activists?

[BritManToo]

Just now, Fat is a type of crazy said:

You say you are a Marxist, which is clearly to the left, but make blanket criticism of the left which you assume are woke and therefore apparently insincere. Contradictions. 

The great man Karl Marx believed women were property, married a Baroness and lived off her income, then had children with both her and her maid.

 

Nothing woke about Karl!

[ozimoron]

Just now, BritManToo said:

The great man Karl Marx believed women were property, married a Baroness and lived off her income, then had children with both her and her maid.

 

Nothing woke about Karl!

That basically just says its a meaning epithet coined by the right. Yes, I do know the work was invented by the left.

[Mac Mickmanus]

3 minutes ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

Helping people who would not otherwise get ahead. Sounds like a left leaning thing. 

Rather stereotypical there .

Right wing people also help out and help others . 

Left wing stereotypes were left wingers are nice friendly generous honest helpful people and right wingers are nasty mean dishonest  racists , which isn't true at all 

[Fat is a type of crazy]

8 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Rather stereotypical there .

Right wing people also help out and help others . 

Left wing stereotypes were left wingers are nice friendly generous honest helpful people and right wingers are nasty mean dishonest  racists , which isn't true at all 

I am not saying right leaning people don't help others. But in terms of political philosophy the left is more about the idea that it is worth spending money and providing other assistance to the poorer or disadvantaged folk, to get them a helping hand, and level the playing field, paid for with taxes, whereas the right is about leading by example and self reliance and low taxes.  

Edited November 27, 2022 by Fat is a type of crazy

[Mac Mickmanus]

1 minute ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

I am not saying right leaning people don't help others. But in terms of political philosophy the left is more about the idea that it is worth spending money and other assistance to the poorer folk to get them a helping hand and level the playing field, paid for with taxes, whereas the right is about leading by example and self reliance and low taxes.  

Or Left wing policies are about giving people things for free and Right wing policies are about getting people to acquire things for themselves through working for it .

  Ends up with Right wingers working and left wingers protesting about wanting more things for free  

[Fat is a type of crazy]

1 minute ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Or Left wing policies are about giving people things for free and Right wing policies are about getting people to acquire things for themselves through working for it .

  Ends up with Right wingers working and left wingers protesting about wanting more things for free  

That's one extreme. The other is that it's not a level playing field, between rich families and poor families, and worker and employee, and the power of large business and small business. Regulation and taxation can make for a more level playing field without distorting free markets too significantly. If you look at the difference between taxation policies in the United States and in Australia, between the main parties on the left and right, it is not much different - a few per cent here and there.   

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

That's one extreme. The other is that it's not a level playing field, between rich families and poor families, and worker and employee, and the power of large business and small business. Regulation and taxation can make for a more level playing field without distorting free markets too significantly. If you look at the difference between taxation policies in the United States and in Australia, between the main parties on the left and right, it is not much different - a few per cent here and there.   

It's hard to talk about equality when a very small group of people have inherited vast tracts of land through accident of birth. Add to that the 'charitable organisations' and the Church that have permanently removed large areas of land from the people, and the general public are well and truly shafted.

 

I see no way forward without revolution

Edited November 27, 2022 by Rimmer
Inflammatory removed

[ozimoron]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

It's hard to talk about equality when a very small group of people have inherited vast tracts of land through accident of birth. Add to that the 'charitable organisations' and the Church that have permanently removed large areas of land from the people, and the general public are well an truly shafted.

 

I see no way forward without revolution

Why not just vote out their enablers (The Tories) and force them to pay their fare share of taxes? That goes for companies too, especially fossil fuel companies. Another way to save trillions would be to end fossil fuel subsidies which would also have an enormous knock on effect of reducing cost of environmental and agricultural damage due to climate change.

[OneMoreFarang]

I don't like the idea that some people, and it seems more and more people, like to sort everybody into left and right baskets. Why?

 

I.e. support for people: Should some people in need get some support? I.e. should people who just survived a hurricane get food and water and some basic shelter? I think most of us would support that.

Should everybody who has no house get one supplied by the government? Maybe including a big TV and money for cigarettes? I guess most of us don't want that.

 

And there are of course many other issues like taxation, health, which drugs should be legal and which illegal? Which immigrants should be accepted under which conditions, and and and.

 

I think many of us have an idea what the radical left and the radical right would like. But with many issues it's not just left or right. I.e. some immigrants are welcome, others not. There should be a balance. And each of us can have ideas where that balance is. And we are not automatically left or right because of that single issue.

[OneMoreFarang]

2 hours ago, seedy said:

Social media - just like everything else people find in life.

Politics - Religion - etc.

Take what you want from it, use it, ignore the rest.

All this Doom and Gloom people P and M about - all that is - is they way you look at it, and making judgements about how and why other people do what they do on it.

Live your Life - Let others Live Theirs. The Second is no business of the First.

I don't think it's that easy.

Obviously we can decide if we look what some celebrities do, or we ignore it.

But if social media is used for propaganda and for spreading (sometimes wrong) information then it's not a question of individual taste anymore.

Too many people just accept "news" without questioning the facts. And obviously some people want to manipulate other people - and some are very successful in that.

Personally I ignore what some idiots say. But millions of people follow lots of bad people who manipulate them.

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, ozimoron said:

Why not just vote out their enablers (The Tories) and force them to pay their fare share of taxes? That goes for companies too, especially fossil fuel companies. Another way to save trillions would be to end fossil fuel subsidies which would also have an enormous knock on effect of reducing cost of environmental and agricultural damage due to climate change.

Voting is pointless as all the candidates, from all the parties, are from the people that own everything.

As examples, Tony Blair is a millionaire, Tony Benn is a lord.

Edited November 27, 2022 by BritManToo

[Skallywag]

1 hour ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I.e. should people who just survived a hurricane get food and water and some basic shelter? I think most of us would support that.

Off topic, yet want to say:

Insurance companies should be the ones supporting that IMO.  Federal assistance from taxpayer monies in the USA should be used for fixing infrastructure and supply lines, not helping people who now need shelter and sustenance.  This is why homeowners and business owners have insurance.  BUT insurance companies never seem to be honest and quick about paying out and helping when people need it the most.  

[OneMoreFarang]

11 minutes ago, Skallywag said:

Off topic, yet want to say:

Insurance companies should be the ones supporting that IMO.  Federal assistance from taxpayer monies in the USA should be used for fixing infrastructure and supply lines, not helping people who now need shelter and sustenance.  This is why homeowners and business owners have insurance.  BUT insurance companies never seem to be honest and quick about paying out and helping when people need it the most.  

Ok

And what about people who have/had no insurance?

Should they just die? Or hope someone will give them some money?

How about children who lost their parents?

 

I think there are always some people which should be supported with tax payers' money. The question is how much support and for how long.

[ozimoron]

26 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Ok

And what about people who have/had no insurance?

Should they just die? Or hope someone will give them some money?

How about children who lost their parents?

 

I think there are always some people which should be supported with tax payers' money. The question is how much support and for how long.

When it comes to health care, as long as it takes, just like in my country. Our social contract is that everyone should contribute to reduce overall costs. Anyone who doesn't like that should go live on a desert island.

 

[Skallywag]

On 11/26/2022 at 7:02 AM, OneMoreFarang said:

Personally I don't like the radical left and I don't like the radical right. Both are bad.

Is there still a center?

I enjoy watching Club Random with Bill Maher., he strives to find a center in many ways,

A podcast but live on video with guests from all sides of the spectrum

https://www.youtube.com/@ClubRandomPodcast

[nausea]

2 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Voting is pointless as all the candidates, from all the parties, are from the people that own everything.

People will get pi@#ed off eventually. Personally, I just avoided the issue by moving to Thaiiland, and taking advantage of whatever the current system offered me. Yeah, I can see people going for something radical, not yet though. My family is still doing OK, not starving yet. Ha!

[farmerjo]

1 hour ago, ozimoron said:

When it comes to health care, as long as it takes, just like in my country. Our social contract is that everyone should contribute to reduce overall costs. Anyone who doesn't like that should go live on a desert island.

 

This is where we disagree,i come from the same country as you.

I would have been happy to see half of that money spent on building prisons.

 

[ozimoron]

1 minute ago, farmerjo said:

This is where we disagree,i come from the same country as you.

I would have been happy to see half of that money spent on building prisons.

 

Because, despite being only 3% of the popualtion, 29% of prisoners are indigenous?

 

https://www.creativespirits.info/aboriginalculture/law/aboriginal-prison-rates

 

 

[farmerjo]

12 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

Because, despite being only 3% of the popualtion, 29% of prisoners are indigenous?

 

https://www.creativespirits.info/aboriginalculture/law/aboriginal-prison-rates

 

 

 Weird reply.

Edited November 27, 2022 by farmerjo

[ozimoron]

2 minutes ago, farmerjo said:

 Weird reply.

There's no good motive for wanting to expand the prison system given those statistics.

[farmerjo]

 

17 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

There's no good motive for wanting to expand the prison system given those statistics.

Criminals come in all races,i could argue all night on this but we would still never find any common ground.

On the street or locked up.

I know what i prefer but all is well as i moved off that desert island.

 

[xkkpafi]

10 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

I think good judgment and discrimination in regard to one's actions has gone out the window.

I agree, its the middle ground and respect for others views that has gone. Its all Me Me. The only human rights violation I can see is the beer ban 2 days before the footy started. Really below the belt, a clear case for dragging Qatar to the Hague.

[thaibeachlovers]

21 hours ago, GammaGlobulin said:

He is still sharp as a tack, true.

But, his political views are now outdated.

He is living in a world of his own, back in 1968.

When I can actually remember stuff I'm not too dull a tack myself, but I "dislike" ( being polite ) the modern age so much, I not only want to live in a different age, but in a different existence, such as those one can only see in movies. If "ying" is good and "yang" is bad, there has been far too much yang for my liking, not just now, but for my entire life, since I was able to understand such, and the yang is winning.

[thaibeachlovers]

2 hours ago, xkkpafi said:

I agree, its the middle ground and respect for others views that has gone. Its all Me Me. The only human rights violation I can see is the beer ban 2 days before the footy started. Really below the belt, a clear case for dragging Qatar to the Hague.

Again, the alcoholic beer ban is only for the stadiums. It's available elsewhere. Unless Al Jazeera is promoting a lie.

I have to wonder if footy fans are all alcoholics, given the uproar it has caused. Can they not survive a couple of hours without being boozed up?

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, farmerjo said:

 

Criminals come in all races,i could argue all night on this but we would still never find any common ground.

On the street or locked up.

I know what i prefer but all is well as i moved off that desert island.

 

I'm all for expanding the prison population and removing parole. A small element of society causes most of the crime, and I would like as many of them as possible removed from society for as long as possible.

However, I think prisoners should be safe from harm, whatever that takes.

[seedy]

14 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Or Left wing policies are about giving people things for free and Right wing policies are about getting people to acquire things for themselves through working for it .

  Ends up with Right wingers working and left wingers protesting about wanting more things for free  

So ... fail to budget enough for schools, and people can not get decent paying jobs, or health care.

But with cost rising so fast and so high that the middle class is feeling the pinch, what would you have the poor do ?

 

[seedy]

5 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I'm all for expanding the prison population and removing parole. A small element of society causes most of the crime, and I would like as many of them as possible removed from society for as long as possible.

However, I think prisoners should be safe from harm, whatever that takes.

80% of the people incarcerated are for non violent drug charges. Many causes but being people of color, poor, uneducated, and lacking health care is right up there in the reasons.

So you discriminate against these people their whole lives, and when they can not make ends meet and despair turns to drug use, your answer is "Lock 'Em Up"

Do you know how that sounds ? How that makes anyone saying it sound ?

[ozimoron]

14 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Or Left wing policies are about giving people things for free and Right wing policies are about getting people to acquire things for themselves through working for it .

  Ends up with Right wingers working and left wingers protesting about wanting more things for free  

This exceedingly simplistic policy ignores the plight of the disadvantaged. Not just those profoundly disadvantaged like somebody with down's syndrome but even somebody with a mild intellectual incapacity. Or any of millions of other conditions which may affect their ability to work or get paid decently.

[Mac Mickmanus]

1 hour ago, ozimoron said:

This exceedingly simplistic policy ignores the plight of the disadvantaged. Not just those profoundly disadvantaged like somebody with down's syndrome but even somebody with a mild intellectual incapacity. Or any of millions of other conditions which may affect their ability to work or get paid decently.

I was referring to people who are able to work and fend for themselves , people with disabilities are a different issue .

[OneMoreFarang]

7 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

When I can actually remember stuff I'm not too dull a tack myself, but I "dislike" ( being polite ) the modern age so much, I not only want to live in a different age, but in a different existence, such as those one can only see in movies. If "ying" is good and "yang" is bad, there has been far too much yang for my liking, not just now, but for my entire life, since I was able to understand such, and the yang is winning.

That's why I meet the guys in Soi Cowboy. Nobody likes woke modern times - ok, most of it.