British ex-teacher, 78, and his boyfriend, 27, killed in horror car crash in Thailand

[DjSilver]

It's always the Thais fault, never forget that and always the foreigners are victims.

[tonypattaya]

Proper learning to drive, proper tests, and stiffer penalties for dangerous driving, are needed to save many of the 20,000 who will otherwise die each year.

[Moonlover]

21 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

Following on from @SomchaiDIY's informative earlier post with the accident location, if you use Google Earth Street View and travel in the westerly direction the Yaris was taking, there's two lanes (in both directions), a 60 kmh speed limit sign, followed by a yellow school zone sign and then a 50 kmh limit sign, also painted on the road surface. There's no signage prohibiting left or right turns. The white dashes on the west-bound lane indicates that this is the side with the school and  hence a solid white line is between both lanes.

 

According to this version of the Thailand Highway Code YELLOW LINES: mark the center of a two-way road used for two-way traffic. You may pass on a two-way road if the yellow center line is broken. When a solid and a broken yellow line are together, you must not pass if you are driving next to the solid line. Two solid yellow lines mean no passing. Never drive to the left of these lines.

 

https://thaidrivinglicense.wordpress.com/traffic-sign/

 

It's ambiguous in that they seem to be for preventing cars passing or overtaking other cars but doesn't use the word cross or crossing as in, "Two solid yellow lines mean no crossing. Never cross to the left of these lines."

 

An earlier post suggested the pickup may have been partially to blame but looking at the picture below, taken from Google Earth Street View, the pickup would have been coming over a slight crest (heading east towards the street camera view). Also note in the picture that a car has just emerged from the right-side road (where the Yaris was turning into) and has crossed the solid yellow hatched zones do do this.

 

 

In my experience in Isaan, these solid yellow lines are crossed every day, not overtaken on but by vehicles entering and exiting from side streets. They are not prohibited from doing so.

The web site that you referred to mentions solid yellow lines. I referred to diagonal yellow markings such as we see in the photograph. These are not mentioned in the website, despite them being commonplace and here we have one of the many inconsistences that we come across on Thai roads. They use internationally recognized road markings but do not explain what they mean.

 

In the wider world, these markings are described as follows on one web site: 

 

'Yellow painted islands are there to tell drivers to stay to the left of the diagonal yellow stripes and to not drive on or over them. They are meant to act as imaginary boulevards'. 

 

That would, of course include making right turns. But this is Thailand and as you rightly explain, such rules are widely ignored anyway. Illegal or not, that is a very unwise spot to make a right turn.

[Yorkshire Tea]

39 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

Following on from @SomchaiDIY's informative earlier post with the accident location, if you use Google Earth Street View and travel in the westerly direction the Yaris was taking, there's two lanes (in both directions), a 60 kmh speed limit sign, followed by a yellow school zone sign and then a 50 kmh limit sign, also painted on the road surface. There's no signage prohibiting left or right turns. The white dashes on the west-bound lane indicates that this is the side with the school and  hence a solid white line is between both lanes.

 

According to this version of the Thailand Highway Code YELLOW LINES: mark the center of a two-way road used for two-way traffic. You may pass on a two-way road if the yellow center line is broken. When a solid and a broken yellow line are together, you must not pass if you are driving next to the solid line. Two solid yellow lines mean no passing. Never drive to the left of these lines.

 

https://thaidrivinglicense.wordpress.com/traffic-sign/

 

It's ambiguous in that they seem to be for preventing cars passing or overtaking other cars but doesn't use the word cross or crossing as in, "Two solid yellow lines mean no crossing. Never cross to the left of these lines."

 

An earlier post suggested the pickup may have been partially to blame but looking at the picture below, taken from Google Earth Street View, the pickup would have been coming over a slight crest (heading east towards the street camera view). Also note in the picture that a car has just emerged from the right-side road (where the Yaris was turning into) and has crossed the solid yellow hatched zones do do this.

 

 

In my experience in Isaan, these solid yellow lines are crossed every day, not overtaken on but by vehicles entering and exiting from side streets. They are not prohibited from doing so.

We had similar on road 1317 east of Chiang Mai.  Too many accidents, so now a concrete barrier has been erected to separate carriageways.  That central reservation is not wide enough to wait on to turn right, without risk of being hit from behind, or by on coming traffic.

[sambum]

9 hours ago, AhFarangJa said:

Thailand has one of the world's worst road safety records. Ministers have set the goal of reducing fatalities from 32.7 deaths per 100,000 people to 12 per 100,000 people by the year 2027.

However, a lack of road safety education in schools, cheap loans for cars, notoriously easy driving tests, police failures to enforce road laws as well as endemic corruption and chronic under-investment in infrastructure hamper the efforts.

 

Another couple of innocent people join the tally. The supporting paragraph in The Mail sums it up perfectly. 

R.I.P. 

"............notoriously easy driving tests,............"

 

Got to agree. In my neck of the woods, people get to pass their test in a "purpose built test track" some of whom have never driven on a main road, let alone a "motorway"!!! Ridiculous!

[BritScot]

9 hours ago, bkk6060 said:

Appears the CRV is at fault, but what are the other factors?  Was he making a legal turn? Was it safe to make a turn there? Did he signal prior or suddenly stop in moving traffic to turn?  Looks like he had an old cheap car without airbag support.

Sad 2 died, but could could deaths have been avoided?

 

 

Did you bother to read the article? It said they slowed down to make the turn then hit from behind. However you cut it the fault lies with the crv "Due Care and Attention". There is no excuse for rear ending a vehicle.

[whereyougo]

How did they known it was a boyfriend? 

[NanLaew]

2 hours ago, Moonlover said:

In the wider world, these markings are described as follows on one web site: 

 

'Yellow painted islands are there to tell drivers to stay to the left of the diagonal yellow stripes and to not drive on or over them. They are meant to act as imaginary boulevards'. 

 

That would, of course include making right turns. But this is Thailand and as you rightly explain, such rules are widely ignored anyway. Illegal or not, that is a very unwise spot to make a right turn.

Good point well made. This yellow-painted median commences about 2.5 km east of the accident scene and extends all the way to the outskirts of Ubon Ratchatani, some 15 km to the west. Using the 'imaginary boulevard' reasoning, traffic headed west would be prohibited from turning to/from the yellow-painted median until a cross-roads about 2 km outside Ubon Ratchatani.

 

Unfortunately, there's also a third lane enabled U-turn less than 300 m west of where they were killed.

 

I would apportion the bulk of any blame on the driver of the CR-V that rear-ended the Yaris. The pickup driver would be blameless as the still shot from cctv doesn't show if there was anything occupying his right-hand lane. Either way, having dashed lines, vehicles headed east are allowed to overtake whereas vehicles headed west, like the CR-V aren't.

[Burma Bill]

1 hour ago, whereyougo said:

How did they known it was a boyfriend? 

From the OP:-

 

 

"Thong Supachai, a friend of the couple" (possibly?)

 

Edited December 14, 2022 by Burma Bill
additional information

[Orinoco]

2 hours ago, sambum said:

"............notoriously easy driving tests,............"

 

Got to agree. In my neck of the woods, people get to pass their test in a "purpose built test track" some of whom have never driven on a main road, let alone a "motorway"!!! Ridiculous!

Yes amazing what goes on.

Only 5,000 baht and one day learning how to drive, and a nice nice bit of paper is provided, to go and get your first driving license.

( family friend did it, last month) 

TIT.

 

 

 

[wombat]

13 hours ago, Bangkok Barry said:

We had the same happen a couple of hundred metres from our house. Pickup waiting to turn right, hit from behind into the path of a lorry. Three dead in that case. Since then, if we need to turn left into our house and there is anything behind, my wife pulls off to the left and waits until the road is clear. You are never, ever safe on Thai roads.

I applauded your Mrs...

.Drive to Arrive Alive.

No point in being dead right.

[Neeranam]

5 hours ago, Moonlover said:

Two solid yellow lines mean no passing. Never drive to the left of these lines.

Shouldn't this be 'right', not 'left'?

[Neeranam]

13 hours ago, Bangkok Barry said:

Since then, if we need to turn left into our house and there is anything behind, my wife pulls off to the left and waits until the road is clear.

Don't you mean 'right'? Can't you drive?

 

Edited December 14, 2022 by Neeranam

[Neeranam]

3 hours ago, whereyougo said:

How did they known it was a boyfriend? 

It's called reporting.

[Moonlover]

7 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

5 hours ago, Moonlover said:

Two solid yellow lines mean no passing. Never drive to the left of these lines.

 

6 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Don't you mean 'right'? Can't you drive?

 

I never said that. You'll have to ask @NanLaew it came from his post, not mine.

 

PS. Yes I can drive.

[Neeranam]

1 minute ago, Moonlover said:

 

I never said that. You'll have to ask @NanLaew it came from his post, not mine.

 

PS. Yes I can drive.

Are you Bangkok Barry?

[CG1 Blue]

8 hours ago, KhunLA said:

Along with their relationship.

 

How many accident reports of unmarried people killed in vehicle, simply state, 'passenger killed at scene, and driver died at hospital.'

 

ages & 'his boyfriend' have to be the headliner ...

... why I wouldn't support such a rag.

That said, him being an ex-teacher having had a career surrounded by young boys, and then ends up dating a man 51 years his junior might cause some concern to people. If he'd been an ex-plumber or accountant less so. 

 

In any case RIP to them both. I hope the old chap was having the best time of his life before he met this untimely end. And as for the 27 year old - he had his whole life ahead of him ???? 

[whereyougo]

47 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

It's called reporting.

555

[rattlesnake]

15 hours ago, chricha said:

So much conjecture about the Yaris driver's actions. The reality is the CRV driver didn't see the Yaris as s/he was either on the phone, drunk or asleep  and then collided with the rear of the Yaris which likely had the wheels turned already to assist moving into the oncoming vehicle. 

 

This is why I never drive a small car not just because I am a tall (196cm) man but you are so much better protected in an MUX or Isuzu DMax both of which I have and drive regularly. Small cars are hit low and the impact from a larger 2 tonne vehicle is so much more if your car is only 800Kg.

 

Nobody has mentioned the Izuzu ute - was s/he asleep also? The Yaris would have come towards them at maybe 40 or 50km per hour as it was stationary until shunted. So imho they were also negligent, When I drive in Thailand, which is often, I am always vigilant especially when I see stationary cars or bikes and/or people. So two drivers were negligent - one criminally - resulting in this tragedy.

 

Why the reporter felt it necessary to mention that the young man was the boyfriend I have no idea! How did he know this or is it just speculation? 

Re the U-turns in the fast lane comment - yes they are bloody dangerous. I have had so many near misses from cars pulling from left on highway to then slowly proceed to U-turn 1km down the road!! Not to mention the 2 lane U-turns which some drivers feel is their right to do even though there is only 1 lane!! They go to the turn area in the fast lane and stop!! If it's a big truck I understand although it is dangerous but for a small car to do it is insane as they stop quickly in the 90km/h+ lane!!

So when I need to U-turn I do it as quickly as possible hopefully without stopping (freaks my wife out ???? ) and keep my foot on the brakes to reduce the shunt effect. In summary you cannot take your eyes off the road/rear view mirror in Thailand. There is an accident waiting to happen to you every 5 minutes in my experience

I'll second that, MUX highly recommended.

[BTB1977]

R.I.P sad ending for these two. Rear ending is the number one cause of injuries and deaths in  most countries.  

[jak2002003]

13 hours ago, Foghorn said:

Man with young woman , not strange

Old man with young man here in thaild also is normal.. 

[CG1 Blue]

3 hours ago, Jingthing said:

So you just accused the Brit of being a pedo based on nothing.

Homophobia -- the "gift" that keeps on giving.

No I didn't. 

[Jingthing]

12 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

No I didn't. 

Imagine if they were a straight couple.

Nobody would gave posted what you did with the same set of facts.

It was a disgusting post and totally unfounded.

[tgw]

9 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Imagine if they were a straight couple.

Nobody would gave posted what you did with the same set of facts.

It was a disgusting post and totally unfounded.

let's not forget the Daily Mail's role in that.

[Mac Mickmanus]

49 minutes ago, tgw said:

let's not forget the Daily Mail's role in that.

What did the Daily Mail do ?

[tgw]

2 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

What did the Daily Mail do ?

gutter press sensationalism appealing to the lowest divisive hate instincts - and they make money from it.

Edited December 14, 2022 by tgw

[Mac Mickmanus]

4 minutes ago, tgw said:

gutter press sensationalism appealing to the lowest divisive hate instincts - and they make money from it.

How did they do that ?

How did they sensationalise it ?

[tgw]

8 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

How did they do that ?

How did they sensationalise it ?

the following source material will help you to find the answers to your interrogations yourself:

 

Sensationalism in Media
https://reporter.rit.edu/news/sensationalism-media

 

Why sensationalized news stories are damaging to society
https://www.thewilkesbeacon.com/opinion/2019/04/16/why-sensationalized-news-stories-are-damaging-to-society/

https://academy4sc.org/video/sensationalism-breaking-news-watch-this-video-now/

 

Sensationalism Explained
https://fairygodboss.com/career-topics/sensationalism

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sensationalism

 

 

 

[Jingthing]

20 minutes ago, tgw said:

gutter press sensationalism appealing to the lowest divisive hate instincts - and they make money from it.

I'm going to have to disagree on this one.

Although it's true the press often does what you're saying, if you look at this specific article, it does not do that at all.

In fact, I see the opposite.

They were obviously a long term couple, the foreigner Mr. Keith Miles, had been a popular and well liked teacher, and the article is saying that they were a couple SEES them in the wake of their tragic deaths as what they were. Good chance if same sex marriage was legal in Thailand, they would have been married. So gay couples like they were can often be INVISIBLE as their relationships have no legal status.

 

On the other hand, the completely disgusting and uncalled post on this thread insinuating that the ex teacher was a pedo is homophobia on steroids. There is this fascist tendency internationally (Putin, DeSantis, etc.) to falsely conflate gay men with pedos, using the toxic word "groomers" for any mention of anything gay in any context in schools, etc. and certainly targeting teachers. Such bigotry needs to be called out for what it is. 

[Jingthing]

I just disagree. 

I get your one point though.

Do they cover every British expat traffic death in Thailand. 

I assume not.

So if they covered this one because they were a gay couple with a big age difference (as we all know big age differences are very common among expat couples and married people here) they still handled the story very respectfully going as far as to provide multiple quotes about what a good guy the Brit was.

I don't see the harm. 

I don't see how friends or family of either of the accident victims would have objections to this coverage.

Edited December 14, 2022 by Jingthing