Top Thai virologist says if you’re healthy “you can ditch the face mask”

[Moonlover]

1 hour ago, Red Phoenix said:

On 1/13/2023 at 11:21 AM, Moonlover said:

Thanks Dr. Yong. It's high time someone spoke up with a bit of common sense on this issue.

 

1 hour ago, Red Phoenix said:

When you look at the messages of dr Yongele over the last 2-3 years, 'common sense' is the last thing I would credit him for...

I have seen Dr. Yong's postings over the last 3 years and he has always demonstrated 'common sense', a lot more than can be said of the drivel I often see on this forum in connection with Covid 19.

[Red Phoenix]

2 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

If it was in a Thai visa article then that would have come from a media source. So either of those will do: Your claim being:

 

I suspect you'll not be back because I've found nothing to substantiate that claim anywhere online. 

Don't worry, I'll be back once I found it. The search engine from AseanNow is not great to use an understatement, but will look in my own archive.  I started referring to him as dr Yong(ele) after he advocated to innoculate all Thai children, so I am pretty sure I will find it back. 

[BangkokHank]

On 1/13/2023 at 1:01 PM, proton said:

If masks are useless why do surgeons wear them?

Masks are not useless for everything. But they are useless for preventing the transmission of viruses:

 

https://cnsnews.com/commentary/dr-jim-meehan/surgeon-destroys-myth-if-masks-dont-work-why-do-surgeons-wear-them

[BangkokHank]

15 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

IMO - the social norm should be.... if you have a cold wear a mask when out and about, but that relies on people being considerate of others. 

That relies more on people being uninformed.

[jacko45k]

4 hours ago, vinci said:

question for the anti masker, why does it bother you that people wearing mask? is there a reason why it bother you so much, I'm just curious to the logic of it.

Have you ever seen a toddler stomp his feet and make a fuss when not getting his own way? Something like that  I believe!

[mania]

3 hours ago, connda said:

By the way, the term "anti-masker" is a pejorative that is meant to demean and discredit another persons views and opinions right out of the gate, and immediately set a confrontational tone.

Exactly!

 

Sometimes I wonder if these people also call folks

anti -drinkers

anti-smokers

anti-meat eaters

Are single people anti-marriage?

etc etc etc

[BritScot]

6 hours ago, BKKBike09 said:

Yeah - I know. I was being sarcastic.

 

I find it interesting that China has been aggressively masking for ages and yet look how Covid is now spreading there. I'm sure masks do a reasonable job of reducing risk of infection when used properly, but as soon as they're not (ie same mask worn all day, on off on off on off), or not worn at all when around other people (ie eating), all bets are off. If you're not going to wear one constantly, and avoid being near anyone not wearing one whenever you are not wearing one, frankly what's the point when Omicron is so obviously a) very very easy to catch and b) not at all serious for the vast majority of people.

I think the underlying fact is even surgical masks are incapable of stopping a virus and the fact that masks are worn to stop droplets being transmitted. There are several medical peer reviewed papers on masks pre covid comparing a mask trying to stop a virus is like a chain link fence stopping a mosquito....

[richard_smith237]

2 hours ago, BangkokHank said:

18 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

IMO - the social norm should be.... if you have a cold wear a mask when out and about, but that relies on people being considerate of others. 

That relies more on people being uninformed.

No it doesn’t.... it relies on people being considerate and socially responsible. 

 

IF someone has a cold and they wear a mask the risk of them spreading that cold to others is reduced... 

 

 

Masks are effective at preventing transmission of a respiratory virus in the same manner as our covering our mouths / nose when we cough or sneeze...  it limits the distance to which with expel respiratory droplets.... 

 

Masks are effective in the same way and effective when we talk, laugh etc... 

 

Thus: While mask wearing won’t stop the spread it certainly limits the extent and range which respiratory droplets and aerosol is expelled - that can make a difference.... 

 

Hence my comment about wearing a mask if you have a cold. 

That said, there is no reason for perfectly healthy people to wear a mask IMO.

Edited January 14, 2023 by richard_smith237

[richard_smith237]

6 hours ago, vinci said:

question for the anti masker, why does it bother you that people wearing mask? is there a reason why it bother you so much, I'm just curious to the logic of it.

I can see why it would bother some....   

I’m not an anti-masker and as written above, believe we should be encourage to wear a mask if we have a cold or feel unwell.

 

BUT... I see no reason for perfectly healthy people to be wearing a mask... there is 'asymptomatic transmission’ discussion to be had here, but a line has to be drawn somewhere otherwise we’d be mask wearing 100% of the time...

 

Thus: Perhaps those you are accusing of being ‘anti-maskers’ are actually viewing from a perspective of common sense and they see all those around them as having none which is concerning. 

 

It's concerning to see so many around us blindly following everyone else without critical thought.

 

It’s also of concern that when not ‘conforming’ with the masses some may become judgemental and make a scene, give a dirty look....  not wearing a mask can draw the odd Karen (male or female).... 

 

Thus: IMO - it would be better if society just reverted back to pre-covid social norms with the caveat - wear a mask if you have the snivels...  IMO thats all it needs to be now with no rules and no judgements. 

[Bkk Brian]

2 hours ago, BangkokHank said:

Masks are not useless for everything. But they are useless for preventing the transmission of viruses:

 

https://cnsnews.com/commentary/dr-jim-meehan/surgeon-destroys-myth-if-masks-dont-work-why-do-surgeons-wear-them

Try to find better sources next time, the doctor from that extreme right wing site you linked to Dr Jim Meehan:

 

Dr. Jim Meehan is another anti-vaccine physician who lacks credibility

His claims are nothing new – they are strictly out of the anti-vaccine playbook. But the post has received some attention in the anti-vaccine world and was shared several thousand times, likely because many people treat an MD as an authority on the subject.

Since then, Dr. Jim Meehan has become one of the go-to anti-vaccine doctors who is trotted out to dismiss the safety and effectiveness of vaccines. Furthermore, he has become a COVID-19 denier, testifying against the use of face masks and claiming that the disease isn’t dangerous. Furthermore, Meehan was forced to settle a libel suit filed by Dr. Eve Switzer.

 

Judge rejects doctors’ testimony in student mask lawsuit

Moukawsher also refused to accept as an expert Dr. James Meehan Jr., an ophthalmologist from Oklahoma. The state had sought to disqualify Meehan in part based on his past statements that mask mandates were “about symbolism, fear, and psychological operations to control the population.” The state also objected to his marketing and profit from vitamin sales as an alternative to face masks.

Moukawsher said it was not Meehan’s beliefs that disqualified him, it was his professional background. The judge said the group could have sought the testimony of any of the 12,000 members of the Infectious Diseases Society of America but instead chose a doctor whose specialty was in eye diseases and vision problems.

 

 

 

 

 

[Pattaya Spotter]

We've known this for 3 years.

[sungod]

7 hours ago, Moonlover said:

 

At least he has something sensible to say, which is more than can be said for most people on this forum.

I can remember many on the forum said wearing a mask on the beach was totally unnecessary about 2 years ago.

 

Now, if only he could persuade people to wear a helmet when on a motorbike..............

[JensenZ]

On 1/13/2023 at 11:36 AM, PCUSHING said:

Thai's are the greatest hypochondriacs in the world.

From their mask wearing on motorbikes, mask wearing in restaurants and the real danger of catching respiratory diseases when it rains, the list is endless.

To be fair to Indian visitors, they don't give a flying <deleted>. Sneezing and coughing without a face diaper in sight.

Go get double vaxxed plus your booster and get on with your life.

I don't wear a mask, but there have been some incidents where I wish I had. I was in a 7Eleven the other night and an Indian lady was coughing up and down the isles. It was so bad I said to her if you're going to cough like that, you should wear a mask.

[JensenZ]

8 hours ago, vinci said:

question for the anti masker, why does it bother you that people wearing mask? is there a reason why it bother you so much, I'm just curious to the logic of it.

Not wearing a mask does not mean you're an anti-masker.

 

I haven't been wearing masks since July 1, when the mandate was dropped. I'm very happy that everyone else is still wearing them - no complaints at all. I couldn't call myself an anti-masker, because if I was sick, I would most definitely wear one, or if I was coughing or sneezing.

[PCUSHING]

4 minutes ago, JensenZ said:

I don't wear a mask, but there have been some incidents where I wish I had. I was in a 7Eleven the other night and an Indian lady was coughing up and down the isles. It was so bad I said to her if you're going to cough like that, you should wear a mask.

Could just as easily happen in a restaurant.

You going to ask her to mask up when she's eating or just tell her to leave the restaurant?

One of my favourite games is watching the terrified Asians coming into Jasmin's on Pattaya Klang.

I remember a group of 6 sitting at a table masked up until the food arrived and then they all removed their masks to breath, spit and possibly cough all over each other.

Luckily Mr Covid takes his lunch break while these people were eating.

You can run but you can't hide.

It's laughable.

 

[transam]

C19, in one form or another, is still rife in LOS, so I still use a mask in every shop I go into, or anywhere where staff are masked up.

 

I haven't had C19 yet, and I don't intend dropping my guard at this time..

..............

[BKKBike09]

8 hours ago, vinci said:

 

question for the anti masker, why does it bother you that people wearing mask? is there a reason why it bother you so much, I'm just curious to the logic of it.

 

It bothers me greatly when I see parents inflicting masks on toddlers here: drumming into them "be scared all the time"; "people who don't wear masks are selfish and bad", "thinking for yourself is bad". If the parents want to wear them, so be it, but leave the toddlers out of it. "Oh but we look so cute at Paragon in our matching floral print masks". 

[BE88]

On 1/13/2023 at 12:17 PM, stoner said:

what planet am i on ? 

Yellow planet ???? of the Chinese system.

Edited January 14, 2023 by BE88

[transam]

13 minutes ago, BKKBike09 said:

It bothers me greatly when I see parents inflicting masks on toddlers here: drumming into them "be scared all the time"; "people who don't wear masks are selfish and bad", "thinking for yourself is bad". If the parents want to wear them, so be it, but leave the toddlers out of it. "Oh but we look so cute at Paragon in our matching floral print masks". 

I don't think kids mind masks, I don't think it harms them one bit. My mum had to carry one around in an army shoulder bag, so did all the siblings, they all lived to a ripe old age....

 

 

 

[edwardandtubs]

On 1/13/2023 at 1:01 PM, proton said:

If masks are useless why do surgeons wear them?

Because they're cutting people open, not something I've ever seen on public transport.

[Thai Visa Member 999999]

On 1/13/2023 at 10:17 AM, richard_smith237 said:

They don’t quite filter the individual ‘virus particles’....  they filter the aerosol and water-vapour which can carry a virus. 

 

As you indicate - N95 masks are clearly better, but when worn for any length of time incredibly uncomfortable. 

On the other hand, standard surgical masks are pretty ineffective at protecting the wearer, but serve as a ‘community measure’ protecting a lot of others from your own expelled aerosol when talking, coughing etc if in the event you are carrying something. 

 

IMO - the social norm should be.... if you have a cold wear a mask when out and about, but that relies on people being considerate of others. 

 

 

 

 

 

No, they filter the respiratory droplets and aerosols that carry the virus particles not water vapor. Water vapor is water in its gaseous state and N95 masks do not filter vapors. Those are much too small. Just think about the molar weight of ozone, much bigger than water vapor, and N95s can't filter anywhere close to that. I had to wear a respirator in a hood on the few occasions I worked with gases.

[paulikens]

3 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

No it doesn’t.... it relies on people being considerate and socially responsible. 

 

IF someone has a cold and they wear a mask the risk of them spreading that cold to others is reduced... 

 

 

Masks are effective at preventing transmission of a respiratory virus in the same manner as our covering our mouths / nose when we cough or sneeze...  it limits the distance to which with expel respiratory droplets.... 

 

Masks are effective in the same way and effective when we talk, laugh etc... 

 

Thus: While mask wearing won’t stop the spread it certainly limits the extent and range which respiratory droplets and aerosol is expelled - that can make a difference.... 

 

Hence my comment about wearing a mask if you have a cold. 

That said, there is no reason for perfectly healthy people to wear a mask IMO.

@richard_smith237  Can you honestly tell me you wore a mask pre-covid if you had a cold???          

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

N95 masks, when worn and fit properly, have repeatedly been shown and proven to be very effective in blocking airborne virus particles and significantly reducing exposure to infections, including from COVID. Because the virus particles aren't just floating around in the air by themselves, but instead as part of respiratory exhaling.

 

Still Confused About Masks? Here’s the Science Behind How Face Masks Prevent Coronavirus

https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2020/06/417906/still-confused-about-masks-heres-science-behind-how-face-masks-prevent

 

-----------------------

 

"After all, N95s were what ER doctors wore to treat COVID patients at the very beginning of the pandemic—before vaccines or boosters were available, and before most people began wearing masks indoors at all. “These masks are literally designed to block out infectious aerosols,” says Abraar Karan, an infectious-disease doctor at Stanford. He thinks that more everyday people should upgrade their masks, and that for health-care workers, N95s should be made mandatory."

 

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2022/01/does-it-help-wear-mask-if-no-one-else/621177/

 

-------------------------------------

 

By Reuters Fact Check

 

"Reuters recently debunked claims about masks and lockdowns, finding they effectively slow the spread of COVID-19 (here).

 

Several studies show mask-wearing helps reduce transmission of the virus (here, here).

...

A Sept. 2020 Duke University study found that out of 14 different face covering types, a fitted N95 respiratory mask, commonly used by healthcare workers to prevent transmission of infectious diseases, provided the most effective protection against respiratory droplets (here)."

 

https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-coronavirus-masks-idUSL1N2ST0OO

 

 

 

Edited January 14, 2023 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[spidermike007]

14 hours ago, Lucky Bones said:

I  can understand the guy on the tractor and his co-workers being masked up.

They have been wearing masks of some type for decades to protect from chemies and ingesting bugs etc.

Otherwise, yes. Fear, obsession and timidity to be the first in a group to ditch the muzzles will live in Thailand for many a year.????????

That guy on the tractor was not wearing a mask before Covid. I've never seen a farmer in Issan wearing a mask on a tractor, unless he is spraying his crops. This is all covid related. He thinks that the mango trees are going to give him covid!

 

It's so over the top right now that reason is completely out of the picture. It is all about fear. 

Edited January 14, 2023 by spidermike007

[Captain Monday]

On 1/13/2023 at 3:16 PM, nickmondo said:

im lost for words.

The blue masks are full of tiny holes.

they are used only to stop spit and avoid blood in the face for surgeons.

the holes are 600 microns in size.

the virus is 5 microns.

 

 

The virus is in the aerosolised particles of spit that are partially blocked by masking. "The virus is smaller than the mask holes" is just a stupid internet trope.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Perhaps the good Thai Dr. should check in with his colleagues at the WHO:

 

WHO updates COVID-19 guidelines on masks, treatments and patient care

13 January 2023

 

WHO has updated its guidelines on mask wearing in community settings, COVID-19 treatments, and clinical management.

...

Masks continue to be a key tool against COVID-19

WHO continues to recommend the use of masks by the public in specific situations, and this update recommends their use irrespective of the local epidemiological situation, given the current spread of the COVID-19 globally. Masks are recommended following a recent exposure to COVID-19, when someone has or suspects they have COVID-19, when someone is at high-risk of severe COVID-19, and for anyone in a crowded, enclosed, or poorly ventilated space. Previously, WHO recommendations were based on the epidemiological situation."

 

(more)

 

https://www.who.int/news/item/13-01-2023-who-updates-covid-19-guidelines-on-masks--treatments-and-patient-care

 

In other words, they've now broadened their face masking recommendations to be more expansive, and not merely based on whether infections, hospitalizations, deaths are rising or falling in any particular area.

 

 

 

Edited January 14, 2023 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[ViajeroLA]

Top Thai virologist told the same thing everyone with a bit of common sense had been telling for years ???? What next? Some MSB will discover Santa is not real?

[still kicking]

3 minutes ago, ViajeroLA said:

Top Thai virologist told the same thing everyone with a bit of common sense had been telling for years ???? What next? Some MSB will discover Santa is not real?

You just spoiled my Christmas. 

[jacko45k]

14 hours ago, BritScot said:

I find it interesting that China has been aggressively masking for ages and yet look how Covid is now spreading there.

I don't recall your comments regarding how well masks worked before China opened up and their figures reflected a near zero Covid situation? They have proved masks alone are not effective.....

[sammieuk1]

Anyone know what Dr google virus Yong dose when he is not bashing his keyboard ????