Isaan thinking of Falang

[stereolab]

7 minutes ago, Lemsta69 said:

Bonking ban?

No, but her attempt was futile, some very good looking girls around here with passable English. 

[Gecko123]

4 hours ago, Goat said:

That is amazing. I have met many [foreigners who speak Thai.]

Curious to know in what settings you were able to assess their Thai skills. Maybe in a work or teaching setting, or seeing a bar or hotel owner interact with Thai staff, but in a rural setting, how much opportunity is there really to assess an expat's Thai skills? Huddled together for a meet up at a local restaurant English is going to be spoken amongst the boys. If spouses happen to tag along, and the husband speaks Thai to his wife, most of the time conversation is limited. If another foreigner who does speak Thai is introduced to the Thai spouse of a foreigner and that foreigner tries to start yacking away in Thai with his wife, usually the foreigner who can't speak Thai will get impatient and start resenting being left out of the conversation. Sometimes, the Thai wife, sensing the foreign husband's insecurities, will disparage your Thai when they get home just to make the husband feel better.

 

I once had a long conversation in Thai with an American woman in front of her Thai husband. The Thai husband couldn't speak English well, so in that case speaking Thai was kind of showing consideration to the Thai husband. It was kind of surreal conversing in Thai with a foreigner while a Thai person listened in.

 

Again, I'm just curious in what setting you have had the chance to assess a foreigner's Thai skills?

 

For me, most of the examples I've seen of foreigners with a high proficiency in Thai have come from U-tube videos, TV shows featuring the foreigner because of their language skills, or participants on Thai language internet forums. In the 20 years I've been living in a province bordering Isaan, there has only been one or two foreigners I've met locally who I would describe as being highly proficient in Thai.

Edited May 3, 2023 by Gecko123

[Fat is a type of crazy]

3 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

I have a friend in UK who works nights. He often posts during his break. That's 2am. 8 am Thai time. How would someone know that?

 

There used to be a guy I knew, Norwegian, in Buriram who was insomniac. He'd often post at 1 or 2am Thai time. How would someone know that?

You wouldn't ... over time though in the mornings they'd be lots of new posts by a particular New Zealander apparently catching up on the last ten hours or whatever and you notice other posters posting at particular times here and there. Poms less likely to post their night time. Not foolproof though... 

I notice these things .. not sure why

To get on topic I think the poster has too much life in him at 48 and is going stir crazy in the heat and tediousness of his locale. I would spend a couple of days at my ex wifes and though they were nice people I had had enough. Language part of the problem but seemed like a stultifying atmosphere. Maybe my fault and your fault but it is what it is and best to get away from the woman and get back to work and maybe see the kid once a month or something. 

[Lemsta69]

On 4/28/2023 at 1:26 PM, Stevey said:

I copied it from my iPhone notes App. I wasn’t gonna lose an Epic masterpiece like this. I remember losing a massive trip report to Savannakhet when the page just closed on me.  

After you submit a post you can edit it and remove any dodgy formatting. Just select the offending text and then click on the 'clear formatting' button.

 

[Stevey]

6 hours ago, JimTripper said:

Did you become your father?

You haven’t quoted a post you’re commenting about ? 

[Stevey]

6 hours ago, Gecko123 said:

In the 20 years I've been living in a province bordering Isaan, there has only been one or two foreigners I've met locally who I would describe as being highly proficient in Thai.

I’ve been knocking around Thailand for about 15 years and was interested in the language from day one. It has been a very odd occasion when I have met a Falang who sounded proficient. The @Goat apparently runs into fluent speakers regularly he says, that’s quite the achievement. The best speaker I have a run into was years ago in HuaHin in the late night karaoke area. I was hanging out in the Nancy bar. A Guy came in called Dominic. He was a stallholder on the pier at Blackpool UK and probably still is, I haven’t seen him for about five years..

 

Lovely guy to speak to and I would run into him from time to time over the years. He would go to places like Bali or Indonesia to get craft work made like wristbands et cetera and then he would take them back to Blackpool and sell them at a profit to pay for his time in Asia.  He looks about late 50s. With a very deep tan and a big mop of curly hair. The last time I seen him we were staying in the same cheap hotel and we were talking about some small food shop he was recommending. And this is where we had our Incident. I’d first met him probably 15 years ago, but over the years I had learned Thai and stuck at trying to learn to read it. He was with a Thai woman who spoke no English and he called the shop an ‘ Ahaan Tam Sang ‘ and told me it literally said in Thai ‘ Food make order ‘ to which I replied “ Do you mean “ Ahaan Taam Sang … Food Ask Order  “ like a la carte at which he got this little book out of his pocket. He had been learning Thai in an immersion method for years  but had never learned the written script. What he has done was when people said a word over the years he would write it down in the little book and add his own transliteration.  The woman he was with looked amazed and so was I. If he had just learned the script he would see that over the restaurant was a sign board which read in Thai อาหารตามสร้าง Ahaan Dtaam Saang but if you read the Thai consonants and vowels you pronounce the works correctly. Dom took such a hit to his pride on that one he never spoke to me again ????

[JimTripper]

13 hours ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

You wouldn't ... over time though in the mornings they'd be lots of new posts by a particular New Zealander apparently catching up on the last ten hours or whatever and you notice other posters posting at particular times here and there. Poms less likely to post their night time. Not foolproof though... 

I notice these things .. not sure why

To get on topic I think the poster has too much life in him at 48 and is going stir crazy in the heat and tediousness of his locale. I would spend a couple of days at my ex wifes and though they were nice people I had had enough. Language part of the problem but seemed like a stultifying atmosphere. Maybe my fault and your fault but it is what it is and best to get away from the woman and get back to work and maybe see the kid once a month or something. 

I had a similar experience. To add to it, I note that the environment and weather had nothing to do with it as I had lived in that situation before in other countries. 

The difference is the people, not the “location”. Or in my case the inability to get away from the family and people, having to interact with people who don’t fully understand you, etc.

 

Very draining to say the least. Could not wait to get out of there after a few days. It seemed to sap my energy and I was very tired. I kept going on long walks alone, coming back to find the neighbors, uncles there waiting. They never seemed to “go away” into their homes, like they needed to be around you the entire time.

 

Sorry if this sounds negative on Thai people. Just my experience.

 

Edited May 4, 2023 by JimTripper

[Stevey]

3 hours ago, JimTripper said:

I had a similar experience. To add to it, I note that the environment and weather had nothing to do with it as I had lived in that situation before in other countries. 

The difference is the people, not the “location”. Or in my case the inability to get away from the family and people, having to interact with people who don’t fully understand you, etc.

 

Very draining to say the least. Could not wait to get out of there after a few days. It seemed to sap my energy and I was very tired. I kept going on long walks alone, coming back to find the neighbors, uncles there waiting. They never seemed to “go away” into their homes, like they needed to be around you the entire time.

 

Sorry if this sounds negative on Thai people. Just my experience.

 

And I’d be very interested, as I’m sure others would, to know how you got in your situation. How did you meet your partner? Where do you live? What is the living situation ?  Is it a small village. How old are you and are you forthright enough to have it your way. I have to put my foot down all the time and it causes lots of bad moods and friction but the alternative is having those lot running your life. 

[473geo]

1 hour ago, Stevey said:

And I’d be very interested, as I’m sure others would, to know how you got in your situation. How did you meet your partner? Where do you live? What is the living situation ?  Is it a small village. How old are you and are you forthright enough to have it your way. I have to put my foot down all the time and it causes lots of bad moods and friction but the alternative is having those lot running your life. 

In my opinion, learning the subtlety of managing your surroundings without too much conflict is at the head of the 'survival in Issan' noteworthy necessities

It doesn't do to piss people off, but being a doormat gains no respect either 

No need to go at things like a bull at a gate, if there are too many people around I go to the local town for a coffee, 

I don't mind the sisters kids coming to play as ours go to grandma's too, but I make it clear first thing in the morning to last thing at night is not on!

So how to do that without conflict ???? well I told my wife if they were living with us they and grandma could have the spare room, aircon, hot shower

 

I guessed grandma wouldn't want to leave her home, that turned out to be the case we are now seeing a bit less of them ???? as the point was made 

 

I guess I am lucky in that usually after a bit of thinking time and discussion with friends who can put forward an 'outside family' view my wife sees my point 

 

I see the subtle changes, my people skills also let me know who does not like it, but I am learning my happiness is important and being allowed to be comfortable in my own home is part of that, irrespective of 'family expectations' 

 

I also look around me people do not go into other peoples homes without specific invitation, they sit outside, a quaint Issan habit that respects privacy 

 

[BritManToo]

2 minutes ago, 473geo said:

In my opinion, learning the subtlety of managing your surroundings without too much conflict is at the head of the 'survival in Issan' noteworthy necessities

It doesn't do to piss people off, but being a doormat gains no respect either 

No need to go at things like a bull at a gate, if there are too many people around I go to the local town for a coffee, 

I tell my woman grandma has 3 children, so she is OK to stay with us for 4 months a year.

After that I'll be in Pattaya, with my wallet, until she's gone.

Works every time!

Edited May 4, 2023 by BritManToo

[JimTripper]

4 hours ago, Stevey said:

And I’d be very interested, as I’m sure others would, to know how you got in your situation. How did you meet your partner? Where do you live? What is the living situation ?  Is it a small village. How old are you and are you forthright enough to have it your way. I have to put my foot down all the time and it causes lots of bad moods and friction but the alternative is having those lot running your life. 

It was actually just a family visit, a couple weeks, not moving in! I was in my early 40’s I think at the time, a lifetime ago.

 

I can’t see a foreigner fitting in there. It was just too different. Maybe in a bigger city nearby like Khon Kaen, where you live with your partner and she is able to travel in easily to see family, but not in the rural areas where your the only foreigner around.

Edited May 4, 2023 by JimTripper

[youreavinalaff]

8 hours ago, JimTripper said:

It was actually just a family visit, a couple weeks, not moving in! I was in my early 40’s I think at the time, a lifetime ago.

 

I can’t see a foreigner fitting in there. It was just too different. Maybe in a bigger city nearby like Khon Kaen, where you live with your partner and she is able to travel in easily to see family, but not in the rural areas where your the only foreigner around.

What's the point in moving to a foreign country dnd getting married, to someone whose background you know, if you're not going to get on with the family, language and culture. 

 

I wonder how many on here would accept things this way if the shoe was on the other foot. What if you took your lady home and she refused to live in your town, do your things, speak your language and get on with your family?

[it is what it is]

50 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

What's the point in moving to a foreign country dnd getting married, to someone whose background you know, if you're not going to get on with the family, language and culture. 

 

I wonder how many on here would accept things this way if the shoe was on the other foot. What if you took your lady home and she refused to live in your town, do your things, speak your language and get on with your family?

 

agree, i see far too many guys cede control to their other halves, like they are scared to stand up for themselves in the relationship, don't know whether it's a lack of confidence, or low self esteem but seems to happen much more here than back home.

[JimTripper]

6 hours ago, youreavinalaff said:

What's the point in moving to a foreign country dnd getting married, to someone whose background you know, if you're not going to get on with the family, language and culture. 

 

I wonder how many on here would accept things this way if the shoe was on the other foot. What if you took your lady home and she refused to live in your town, do your things, speak your language and get on with your family?

To start your own family.

[473geo]

3 good responses above 

 

I make the point if a Thai generously gives away their last baht they will survive because they have family and friends Thai culture being what it is Buddha will provide 

 

No matter how jai dee the farang is, last baht, immigration could be knocking at his door and pointing homeward 

 

And that gentlemen and ladies highlights why there are differing views of adaptation/ implementation of Thai culture 

I am happy for my wife to take the lead, she is Thai this is Thailand, however as I come to understand more Thai and deal with people more regularly they do tend to include me in the 'explanation' 

Edited May 5, 2023 by 473geo

[asf6]

On 5/4/2023 at 12:50 AM, Stevey said:

...he called the shop an ‘ Ahaan Tam Sang ‘ and told me it literally said in Thai ‘ Food make order ‘ to which I replied “ Do you mean “ Ahaan Taam Sang … Food Ask Order  “ like a la carte 

If he had just learned the script he would see that over the restaurant was a sign board which read in Thai อาหารตามสร้าง Ahaan Dtaam Saang but if you read the Thai consonants and vowels you pronounce the works correctly. Dom took such a hit to his pride on that one he never spoke to me again ????

 อาหารตามสร้าง is not correct, Stevey. Your last word is wrong. It should be สั่ง (order) not สร้าง (build). 

Different spelling, different vowel lengths, different tones, different meanings.

 

So, อาหารตามสั่ง - food-according to-order. Yours says something like: food according to build.

 

FYI: ตาม can also mean follow/following. 

[NanLaew]

On 5/3/2023 at 7:11 PM, youreavinalaff said:

Indeed, there are many expats who cannot or will not learn the language.

 

Personally for me, I found it quite easy to pick up the language. I had no choice. where I lived there was almost zero English being spoken. When I me my wife she could not speak English eitrher so we communicated in Thai. I guess was a lot younger when I first arrived in Isaan than many other expats. Many expats find age a factor in learning a new language. I would say that, on a day to day basis in our village, I probably speak Thai more than I speak English.

Same for me when I was living and working in northern Brazil where hardly anyone spoke any English. On a break from work, I did an immersive Brazilian Portuguese class at the University of Houston over 4 weekends and then went back to work. It made for an amazing and fulfilling experience that kept me away from Thailand for over twelve years. On a subsequent Houston visit, I enquired about the next level language classes. The Brazilian-born teacher chatted with me for only a couple of minutes before saying I would be wasting my money as my immersive experience in Brazil had put me at a level far above what her UH classes delivered. She did offer that if I had time, I could assist with some of her classes.

 

Back on topic, it's very hard to find a decent Portuguese speaker in Isaan so I muddle through with my broad Scottish brogue and a bit of arm waving but I have found that mastering how to point with your lips is essential.

[NanLaew]

20 hours ago, it is what it is said:

 

agree, i see far too many guys cede control to their other halves, like they are scared to stand up for themselves in the relationship, don't know whether it's a lack of confidence, or low self esteem but seems to happen much more here than back home.

Could also depend of what the foundation of the relationship is built on. If there's a dependency on the wife/marriage to enable their long stay, one wouldn't want to needlessly rock the boat. If the foreigner has also burned all those bridges back home or otherwise had all familai ties expire, then putting up with "other people's crap" may mandate a far higher threshold of tolerance.

[Stevey]

6 hours ago, asf6 said:

 อาหารตามสร้าง is not correct, Stevey. Your last word is wrong. It should be สั่ง (order) not สร้าง (build). 

Different spelling, different vowel lengths, different tones, different meanings.

 

So, อาหารตามสั่ง - food-according to-order. Yours says something like: food according to build.

 

FYI: ตาม can also mean follow/following. 

 

As in สร้างบ้าน I know that. I was so tired when I rattled that off I just got it off Google Translate and IT Was Wrong !!! ????. I don’t profess to be able to recall perfect spellings of words but I read ok. I find speaking into Google translate does bring up the right spellings most of the time.
 

Also I know ตาม is follow. You can say for football fans “ I don’t follow football “ ไม่ติดตามเตะบอล” 

[Stevey]

1 hour ago, NanLaew said:

I have found that mastering how to point with your lips is essential.

I do that ???? “ Poon Poon “ over There ! 

[Stevey]

6 hours ago, asf6 said:

 อาหารตามสร้าง is not correct, Stevey. Your last word is wrong. It should be สั่ง (order) not สร้าง (build). 

Different spelling, different vowel lengths, different tones, different meanings.

 

So, อาหารตามสั่ง - food-according to-order. Yours says something like: food according to build.

 

FYI: ตาม can also mean follow/following. 

 

Apart from picking me up on my spelling, which is totally okay, because I agree that anything that could be considered learning material on the net should be perfect. What did you think of the story?

[youreavinalaff]

35 minutes ago, Stevey said:

What did you think of the story?

Jackanory.

 

And, by the way, ไม่ติดตามเตะบอล”  means " Don't follow the ball". Football is ฟุตบอล. 

Edited May 5, 2023 by youreavinalaff

[Stevey]

35 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

Jackanory.

 

And, by the way, ไม่ติดตามเตะบอล”  means " Don't follow the ball". Football is ฟุตบอล. 

No Not everyone says Footboon many say Deh Born. Getting petty now for an old man aren’t you ?

[youreavinalaff]

11 hours ago, Stevey said:

No Not everyone says Footboon many say Deh Born. Getting petty now for an old man aren’t you ?

Actually, it's "footbon". Also it's "dee bon". Meaning " hit ball".

 

I'm not old. I'm only 5 years older than you.

[asf6]

13 hours ago, Stevey said:

Apart from picking me up on my spelling, which is totally okay, because I agree that anything that could be considered learning material on the net should be perfect. What did you think of the story?

Which part of the story? You met a guy who was learning Thai? You met a guy who made notes to try to improve his Thai? Or the part where the guy made a mistake in his Thai and you you tried to correct him but told him something that was also wrong?  Or the part where you tell us what it should have been but get that wrong too? Well, I've read more interesting stories but also more boring stories. The best bit for me was when you wrote the Thai word for build and not order. If only you had read the Thai consonants and vowels you had written. If you had read them out loud, you would have known they were two completely different words because of the different tones and different vowel lengths (assuming you can tell the difference in tones - some people can't). Anyway, Stevey, carry on. It's easy to criticize but I always try to look for the positives. ????

[Stevey]

11 hours ago, youreavinalaff said:

Actually, it's "footbon". Also it's "dee bon". Meaning " hit ball".

 

I'm not old. I'm only 5 years older than you.

Dee born ? Maybe but not up here. 
 

เตะบอล Deh-born 

 

I’m with kids all the time I hear this to all the time

 

[youreavinalaff]

5 minutes ago, Stevey said:

Dee born ? Maybe but not up here. 
 

เตะบอล Deh-born 

 

I’m with kids all the time I hear this to all the time

 

You are obviously not up to scratch with the short sounding vowels. 

 

 

[Stevey]

13 hours ago, youreavinalaff said:

You are obviously not up to scratch with the short sounding vowels. 

 

 

Ok ???? 

[Goat]

On 5/5/2023 at 4:29 PM, asf6 said:

 อาหารตามสร้าง is not correct, Stevey. Your last word is wrong. It should be สั่ง (order) not สร้าง (build). 

Different spelling, different vowel lengths, different tones, different meanings.

 

So, อาหารตามสั่ง - food-according to-order. Yours says something like: food according to build.

 

FYI: ตาม can also mean follow/following. 

 

Thats correct. 

On 5/6/2023 at 1:12 PM, asf6 said:

the guy made a mistake in his Thai and you you tried to correct him but told him something that was also wrong?

If you are going to correct someone make sure you are corrct yourself or you look like a real d....head.

[Goat]

On 5/6/2023 at 1:12 PM, asf6 said:

you would have known they were two completely different words because of the different tones and different vowel lengths

Back to his OP ordering a tree in a tree shop and it is easy to see why he is struggling. But blaming everyone else.