Medicine / herb to relieve anger, stress

[Kenny202]

Wife's sister having quite a few issues with anger. She lived with us for a time and have seen it first hand. Can be nice as pie for 2 days- 2 weeks and next minute the slightest thing will trigger her into a rage....usually after stewing for several hours and making herself worse to the point where she let's go and enter rampaging bull. Anyway got to the point where it is going to destroy her marriage. She's too young (34yo) to be be change of life and doesn't seem to be menstrual related. Like I said seen it myself and by the look on her face she has no control over what she is doing.

 

She has finally admitted herself she needs help and is going to see a doctor for blood tests etc. I would prescribe a small whiskey myself but she doesn't drink or smoke weed nor will she. I am no expert but have had a bit to do with depression and it doesn't seem to be like that. I did know a girl once was diagnosed with Borderline personality disorder which is different to Bi polar or depression....worse than both really and much of that about anger and selfishness. Seems to be more of a physical thing than psychological.......though who knows what some of these people go through growing up in villages, could be some past trauma there or something. A nurse walked past her about 6 months ago visiting someone in hospital and told her that her eyes looked like she needs to go and check her liver. She didn't of course but I have noticed myself her eyes not nice and clear.

 

Is there anything available over the counter that hopefully wont turn her into a zombie or make you sleep, but something that can be taken as needed and work quickly for a calming effect / mood changer? She went to a pharmacy this morning and all they could suggest is Evening primrose oil, which I think is more for menstrual / hormonal symptoms (Correct me if I am wrong?) and in any case I think some of these herb things need a month or two to kick in. I am pretty sure she doesn't have that long before her life is going to fall apart.    

 

So she is going to a doctor tomorrow start the ball rolling. I imagine the usual tests etc and come back next week and possibly a month before there is anything starting to happen or become apparent. Will follow the doctors advice of course but in the meantime anything available over the counter that has a calming effect / possible mood changer? Appreciate any advice you have of you are around Sheryl

[MichaelHunt]

Has she tried exercising?

 

https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/stress-management/in-depth/exercise-and-stress/art-20044469

 

[FritsSikkink]

Alcohol for an angry person will work great to make them more angry.

[Kenny202]

1 hour ago, FritsSikkink said:

Alcohol for an angry person will work great to make them more angry.

I find its usually the other way around. The people I have met in my past that turn into monsters on the grog are usually the nicest people normally

[Kenny202]

2 hours ago, MichaelHunt said:

Has she tried exercising?

 

https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/stress-management/in-depth/exercise-and-stress/art-20044469

 

Yeah all of those sort of thoughts are nice and of course exercise is one of the best cures for depression, anxiety etc but this is a Thai person with no other interests in life except a phone, Facebook and a very poor diet. I think in this case a more direct / immediate solution is required first. Have met many like that with seemingly very little regard for their health or future. nearly like it is a chore to live

[fredwiggy]

People who have depression, bipolar, BPD all can experience anger. My ex became a covert narcissist because of abuse and neglect in her childhood. Admitting she has a problem is the first step, as many will be in denial . Some SSRI's help with anger, like Prozac, but she has to see a doctor and be evaluated before anything is done. This is one other cause .....................               https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/diseases/17786-intermittent-explosive-disorder

Edited May 9, 2023 by fredwiggy

[Sheryl]

While there are various supplements that have a mild calming effect they are unlikely to help with what you describe and also would have to be ordered from abroad.

 

Anti-depressents  can be bought over the counter but definitely not a good idea to self prescribe them.Have her go ahead and see doctor.

 

How have you determined it is nto menstrual cycle related? Contrary to what many men think, menstrual related mood swings and rages do not occur while menstruating. In fact quite the opposite, the mood improves once menstruation occurs. The problems occur in the 14 days or so before menstruation, which is about half the month so easy to miss the connection. The only way to know is to to keep a careful diary of the episodes relative to dates of menstruation. If this is the problem, the severe episodes will only happen during the 14 days before menstruation  and she will be markedly better once her period arrives.

 

Given her age, which for a Thai could qualify as peri-menopausal (i.e. the 10-15 years before onset of menopause, which is often when PMDD starts to manifest or worsen) ,  good chance it is in fact hormonal issue. In which case there is a great deal I can advise.  But first, need to keep that calendar.

[Doctor Tom]

7 minutes ago, Kenny202 said:

I find its usually the other way around. The people I have met in my past that turn into monsters on the grog are usually the nicest people normally

I have never found that to be true.

[Doctor Tom]

Just stay away from her.  People like her rarely accept help, unless it's from a medical professional and trying to placate individuals with an anger/rage problem is almost always counter productive. She needs professional help by the sounds of it, so stay clear until that works; or doesn't. 

[bignok]

https://draxe.com/nutrition/l-theanine/

[NativeBob]

Just now, Doctor Tom said:

Just stay away from her.  People like her rarely accept help, unless it's from a medical professional and trying to placate individuals with an anger/rage problem is almost always counter productive. She needs professional help by the sounds of it, so stay clear until that works; or doesn't. 

Great advice, exactly same happened with me. Unless I knew what am I suggesting/doing/prescribing don't bother to engage and offer any help. If it fails (100% it will) everybody will consider that was your fault. My ex went banana without any rational reason until we couldn't tolerate it any longer. Never been happier ever since )

Any shrink will suggest "tranks", some might suggest Xanax, however just keep yourself as far as possible from her. Person that has such mental breakout is dangerous. 

[Kenny202]

15 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

While there are various supplements that have a mild calming effect they are unlikely to help with what you describe and also would have to be ordered from abroad.

 

Anti-depressents  can be bought over the counter but definitely not a good idea to self prescribe them.Have her go ahead and see doctor.

 

How have you determined it is nto menstrual cycle related? Contrary to what many men think, menstrual related mood swings and rages do not occur while menstruating. In fact quite the opposite, the mood improves once menstruation occurs. The problems occur in the 14 days or so before menstruation, which is about half the month so easy to miss the connection. The only way to know is to to keep a careful diary of the episodes relative to dates of menstruation. If this is the problem, the severe episodes will only happen during the 14 days before menstruation  and she will be markedly better once her period arrives.

 

Given her age, which for a Thai could qualify as peri-menopausal (i.e. the 10-15 years before onset of menopause, which is often when PMDD starts to manifest or worsen) ,  good chance it is in fact hormonal issue. In which case there is a great deal I can advise.  But first, need to keep that calendar.

I didn't know that Sheryl but I will make sure we are taking note of when the incidents occur. I would say in 2 - 3 week cycles. She doesn't appear to suffer from any PMT symptoms like some do.....pain, cramps etc. I really don't think anti depressants would help her. I have had a bit to do with depression and anti depressants and she doesn't really fit that mold. Depressed people tend to be negative and sullen and get worse...spiral down. Not so much Dr Jekyll today and Mr Hyde tomorrow. This person doesn't sit around moping etc. Although loves attention and pity. Sounds like Bi polar sort of thing on the surface but from what I have read about that doesn't seem to fit. If anything like that maybe BPD. But I think you are right...either hormonal imbalance or PMT or both. It's totally irrational and mass over reactions to every day little blips at random times. She is going to the hospital tomorrow to start the ball rolling but you know these things take time (tests etc) so was hoping maybe there was something she could take immediately should she get these feelings, if not for anything but to calm her down and hopefully have a reset. Would something like Valium help in the meantime if the doctor will prescribe it. Even if it zonks her out, better than the alternative. The good thing is she is open to trying to do something about it....today at least anyway. Just hoping she will follow it through. The person is generally a good, decent person and its such a shame to see her destroying her life and happiness as well as those around her if it is something that can be treated.  

[Kenny202]

15 minutes ago, NativeBob said:

Great advice, exactly same happened with me. Unless I knew what am I suggesting/doing/prescribing don't bother to engage and offer any help. If it fails (100% it will) everybody will consider that was your fault. My ex went banana without any rational reason until we couldn't tolerate it any longer. Never been happier ever since )

Any shrink will suggest "tranks", some might suggest Xanax, however just keep yourself as far as possible from her. Person that has such mental breakout is dangerous. 

I totally agree and spent my own period of time here with a very unstable and violent women here. She had a horrid past / upbringing and clearly a very broken person. She was diagnosed with borderline personality disorder and by all accounts the doctor told me the only way to treat it was with heavy tranq's and intensive psyche therapy for 2 to 3 years..... but he said there was a very low success rate. Dangerous was exactly how I would describe it. This woman was physical and it was only a matter of time before I snapped or there was an accident. Was the very reason in the end why I removed myself away from her. Her life continues to be a train wreck to this day 

[indyo]

CBD oil should be effective and harmless, just be sure there's no any THC.

[how241]

 Try the edible weed , if might work.  Also kratom is legally available now,  in tea or cold drinks.  Facebook sells it in pre-mixed drinks.  Worth a try.

[stoner]

57 minutes ago, Kenny202 said:

Yeah all of those sort of thoughts are nice and of course exercise is one of the best cures for depression, anxiety etc but this is a Thai person with no other interests in life except a phone, Facebook and a very poor diet. I think in this case a more direct / immediate solution is required first. Have met many like that with seemingly very little regard for their health or future. nearly like it is a chore to live

get off the phone. all i hear is excuses about her choices in life. 

 

 

[stoner]

10 minutes ago, indyo said:

CBD oil should be effective and harmless, just be sure there's no any THC.

this may have some positive effects. 

[save the frogs]

crap diet might be part of the problem. the brain needs the right nutrients to function well. 

 

there are some herbs on the market ... but maybe not helpful for people with serious psychological issues. 

 

Ashwaganda, St John's Wort ...

 

RediCalm combines 5 natural ingredients to help relieve anxiety by boosting levels of calming neurotransmitters.

https://www.nutreance.com/products/redicalm?gs=1&utm_medium=google_shopping&utm_campaign=redicalm_ca&utm_source=144089851858&utm_term=&gclid=CjwKCAjw3ueiBhBmEiwA4BhspJ2KQtFDvSgG_90JqZEdFOiuT68FFkCsltuRHYygDE5Eu-nuDmIAchoCmyIQAvD_BwE

 

https://ca.iherb.com/pr/now-foods-mood-support-with-st-john-s-wort-90-veg-capsules/8214?gclid=CjwKCAjw3ueiBhBmEiwA4BhspKN6tZ3G9eMIKudaADai1RtZPr16EeM8KVcPeBci_RY1lUHvZxtvcRoCdUQQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

Edited May 9, 2023 by save the frogs

[fredwiggy]

26 minutes ago, Kenny202 said:

I didn't know that Sheryl but I will make sure we are taking note of when the incidents occur. I would say in 2 - 3 week cycles. She doesn't appear to suffer from any PMT symptoms like some do.....pain, cramps etc. I really don't think anti depressants would help her. I have had a bit to do with depression and anti depressants and she doesn't really fit that mold. Depressed people tend to be negative and sullen and get worse...spiral down. Not so much Dr Jekyll today and Mr Hyde tomorrow. This person doesn't sit around moping etc. Although loves attention and pity. Sounds like Bi polar sort of thing on the surface but from what I have read about that doesn't seem to fit. If anything like that maybe BPD. But I think you are right...either hormonal imbalance or PMT or both. It's totally irrational and mass over reactions to every day little blips at random times. She is going to the hospital tomorrow to start the ball rolling but you know these things take time (tests etc) so was hoping maybe there was something she could take immediately should she get these feelings, if not for anything but to calm her down and hopefully have a reset. Would something like Valium help in the meantime if the doctor will prescribe it. Even if it zonks her out, better than the alternative. The good thing is she is open to trying to do something about it....today at least anyway. Just hoping she will follow it through. The person is generally a good, decent person and its such a shame to see her destroying her life and happiness as well as those around her if it is something that can be treated.  

People with some forms of depression experience bouts of anger also. Depression in itself can be anger turned inward, and BPD, which it also sounds like, has people with extreme bouts of anger out of "nowhere". My ex was very nice much of the time, but when something bothered her when she was in a "mood", she went ballistic like I've never seen in a woman, or men for that matter. Relationships with these types, like with narcissists is very hard or impossible, especially if they are also experiencing PTSD. In a narcissists case. this is a learned behavior from childhood, as BPD can be, but BPD can be treated with psychotherapy over time. Narcissism is a lot harder, but not impossible if they are willing and accept that their behavior is wrong.

[IvorBiggun2]

Depression. Get her on Sertroline. Cheap antidepressant easily available. It takes about a few weeks to kick in so don't expect miracle cures. So stick with it.

[save the frogs]

11 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

Get her on Sertroline. Cheap antidepressant easily available.

and turn her into a zombie

[IvorBiggun2]

13 minutes ago, save the frogs said:

and turn her into a zombie

You know nothing about antidepressants.

[wprime]

Tramadol is readily available from pharmacies and can calm her down on a temporary basis while you seek better help. It's very mild and she should be able to live her life normally on it. It's addictive and only ideal for short term use though.

 

If you're willing to try herbal remedies, cannabis indica a safer alternative and is more broadly effective. She won't be able to function well on it though as it dulls the senses and makes it difficult to think.

 

I should add, try at your own risk, a small percentage of people react badly to the above suggestions.

[save the frogs]

17 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

You know nothing about antidepressants.

https://freerange.org/antidepressants-are-turning-millions-into-zombie-robots/

Antidepressants Are Turning Millions Into Zombie Robots

they rob people of the very emotions that make them human.

[IvorBiggun2]

20 minutes ago, save the frogs said:

they rob people of the very emotions that make them human.

Absolute tosh. If they're a placebo and they help why burst the bubble? 

Edited May 9, 2023 by IvorBiggun2

[Sheryl]

6 hours ago, Kenny202 said:

I didn't know that Sheryl but I will make sure we are taking note of when the incidents occur. I would say in 2 - 3 week cycles. She doesn't appear to suffer from any PMT symptoms like some do.....pain, cramps etc. I really don't think anti depressants would help her. I have had a bit to do with depression and anti depressants and she doesn't really fit that mold. Depressed people tend to be negative and sullen and get worse...spiral down. Not so much Dr Jekyll today and Mr Hyde tomorrow. This person doesn't sit around moping etc. Although loves attention and pity. Sounds like Bi polar sort of thing on the surface but from what I have read about that doesn't seem to fit. If anything like that maybe BPD. But I think you are right...either hormonal imbalance or PMT or both. It's totally irrational and mass over reactions to every day little blips at random times. She is going to the hospital tomorrow to start the ball rolling but you know these things take time (tests etc) so was hoping maybe there was something she could take immediately should she get these feelings, if not for anything but to calm her down and hopefully have a reset. Would something like Valium help in the meantime if the doctor will prescribe it. Even if it zonks her out, better than the alternative. The good thing is she is open to trying to do something about it....today at least anyway. Just hoping she will follow it through. The person is generally a good, decent person and its such a shame to see her destroying her life and happiness as well as those around her if it is something that can be treated.  

Pain and cramps are completely unrelated to PMDD. And occur (if at all) during menstruation not before it which is when PMDD occurs.

 

Valium would not help. At best it would mask sympyoms slightly at considerable risk of addiction.

 

If it is PMDD the treatment Is a combination of low dose SSRI plus natural  progesterone during the luteal phase of The cycle. Does not matter that she is not depressed, in PMDD SSRIs serves a different function.

 

However if she does not have PMDD -- for example if it is BPD or something rlse --  an SSRI could make matters much worse. 

 

Essential to kerp a diary showing dates of her menstruation and dates when this occurs

 

A key criteria for PMDD is that these states never occur in the interval from day 2 of menstruation to 14 days later.  Usualy does not occur on day 1 either but if already in progress may take a few hours to maximum one day to clear once menstruation starts.  

 

If these episides do happen days 2 - 14 of her cycle then it is not PMDD. 

 

 

 

 

[jts-khorat]

I do not want to come from very far off-field, but for anger issues unrelated to physical problems (like the ones Sheryl describes), I do recommend meditation. It is the one thing closest to the Thai way of life, is accepted by everybody (different to Kratom or CBD) and, in the right setting, can really help the person identify underlying emotional issues all by herself.

 

As you seem to be in Bangkok, according to your location, there might be 'real' meditation offered to laypeople in a temple nearby. If the setting is more rural, it can be difficult for women, but there the morning chanting at the temple gives at least a structured and calm start in the day and a tight social environment, which in itself is very worthwile to have if there are issues like depression.

 

Best of all, it is free, non-addictive, will not make the situation worse, so well worth a try.

 

If the issue is more serious than that, I would, of course, also recommend seeing a real doctor.

Edited May 9, 2023 by jts-khorat

[Kenny202]

4 hours ago, Sheryl said:

Pain and cramps are completely unrelated to PMDD. And occur (if at all) during menstruation not before it which is when PMDD occurs.

 

Valium would not help. At best it would mask sympyoms slightly at considerable risk of addiction.

 

If it is PMDD the treatment Is a combination of low dose SSRI plus natural  progesterone during the luteal phase of The cycle. Does not matter that she is not depressed, in PMDD SSRIs serves a different function.

 

However if she does not have PMDD -- for example if it is BPD or something rlse --  an SSRI could make matters much worse. 

 

Essential to kerp a diary showing dates of her menstruation and dates when this occurs

 

A key criteria for PMDD is that these states never occur in the interval from day 2 of menstruation to 14 days later.  Usualy does not occur on day 1 either but if already in progress may take a few hours to maximum one day to clear once menstruation starts.  

 

If these episides do happen days 2 - 14 of her cycle then it is not PMDD. 

 

 

 

 

I understand Benzo's Opiods etc are addictive Sheryl. What about as a one off thing when one of these attacks" occur? Obviously not a thing taken every day. Definitely does seem to be a thing where you can tell this person is going to have an episode just by the look on their face. And then there is a stewing period of a few hours where she seems to work herself up to an explosion. It really is a Jekyll and Hyde thing. And the justification for such behavior is always the slightest every day little thing. It is often impossible to ignore also as the person becomes provocative. Latest episode about 1 week from menstruation.....big explosion then angry and resentful for a few more days..... then the sweetest person you could ever meet about a day into actual menstruation so I am hoping you are on the right track. I just hope the doctor takes it seriously. Apart from us tracking when the issue is happening, I assume they can test for this sort of thing and have some sort of treatment?

 

Was reading Xanax and Tramadol available over the counter here. I understand both very strong and addictive drugs but what if used as a one off sedative when the monster comes, maybe as a mood changer until all this can be sorted out medically? The situation is really that bad something more immediate is required whist sorting out what the actual issue is and finding a long term solution. We are hoping the doctor will give her something today. The problem is once this person explodes, it is like they even know they have "done it again" so may as well go to town.   

[Kenny202]

4 hours ago, jts-khorat said:

I do not want to come from very far off-field, but for anger issues unrelated to physical problems (like the ones Sheryl describes), I do recommend meditation. It is the one thing closest to the Thai way of life, is accepted by everybody (different to Kratom or CBD) and, in the right setting, can really help the person identify underlying emotional issues all by herself.

 

As you seem to be in Bangkok, according to your location, there might be 'real' meditation offered to laypeople in a temple nearby. If the setting is more rural, it can be difficult for women, but there the morning chanting at the temple gives at least a structured and calm start in the day and a tight social environment, which in itself is very worthwile to have if there are issues like depression.

 

Best of all, it is free, non-addictive, will not make the situation worse, so well worth a try.

 

If the issue is more serious than that, I would, of course, also recommend seeing a real doctor.

Exercise, medication, diet etc of course would all be immensely helpful, and possibly a large part of the problem but for this to occur requires the person to commit, participate and recognize (admit?) they have a problem themselves. A bit like an alcoholic or drug addict that isn't at the stage of wanting to help themselves. It is impossible. That mixed with closed minded Thai cultural stuff that makes it impossible to show or explore any inward feelings.... better to put on a hard face than deal with problems means we are a long way off from the self help stage.  

[fredwiggy]

10 hours ago, save the frogs said:

https://freerange.org/antidepressants-are-turning-millions-into-zombie-robots/

Antidepressants Are Turning Millions Into Zombie Robots

they rob people of the very emotions that make them human.

This is why you don't take advice from anyone besides a professional that has experience working with many patients, and cares enough about them to keep up with their progress all the while they are taking medicine. The right medicine can do wonders for improving one's mood, and life. The wrong can make them worse, or much worse. You don't tell someone what they should take. That's the psychiatrist's job. Then the doctor has to follow up with them, and tell them that they need to come back immediately if their symptoms worsen or they feel suicidal. Many things can cause anger, from depression, loss, medications, past abuse or neglect, genetics and environment. That's why you see a doctor, and explain your past and present history, so they can prescribe what they think is needed, along with psychotherapy. Everyone reacts differently to medications, and that's the main reason they need to be evaluated asap.You can buy most anything in Thailand OTC, and that's a concern. Self medicating can lead to extreme problems. She has admitted to having a problem, so the next step is the doctor's office. Anyone can look something up online and then post it here, as many seem to do. You could do that yourself, and go to one of many sources like WebMD. Going directly to those that specialize in helping others with mental illnesses is always the first choice.

Edited May 10, 2023 by fredwiggy