Thai gov. to tax (remitted) income from abroad for tax residents starting 2024 - Part I

[jerrymahoney]

7 hours ago, Mike Teavee said:

Love this post... Thank you for reminding us that "This is Thailand" & so everything we think we know, we don't.

Or as the late former Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld put it in a  Press conference 12 FEB 2002:

 

Reports that say that something hasn't happened are always interesting to me, because as we know, there are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns—the ones we don't know we don't know. And if one looks throughout the history of our country and other free countries, it is the latter category that tends to be the difficult ones.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/There_are_unknown_unknowns

Edited December 31, 2023 by jerrymahoney

[DonniePeverley]

So it's 2024 and we've got no clarification.

 

Welcome to Thailand. 

[lexxy]

This thread didnt even hit 200 pages.

[jerrymahoney]

15 minutes ago, lexxy said:

This thread didnt even hit 200 pages.

So it's Taxes 191 pages 

 

God * 605 pages

 

God wins.

 

* Do you believe in God and why

[Karma80]

5 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

2024 tax returns do not have to be submitted until March 2025.

RD still has some time up it's sleeve to work out the details.

 

Then, spring the "details" on taxpayers retrospectively. Amazing Thailand.

[The Cyclist]

6 hours ago, lexxy said:

This thread didnt even hit 200 pages.

 

Plenty of time yet before the RD extract their finger and make another announcement.

 

When that eventually happens there might be a massive surge, to leap ahead of

 

6 hours ago, jerrymahoney said:

So it's Taxes 191 pages 

 

God * 605 pages

 

God wins.

 

* Do you believe in God and why

 

 

Calm down to a panic, this thread has a long way to go yet 

[Jingthing]

3 hours ago, Karma80 said:

 

Then, spring the "details" on taxpayers retrospectively. Amazing Thailand.

Yeah I think it's unethical to not specify details before the effective date. It makes tax planning impossible. All we can do is guess. 

[The Cyclist]

11 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Yeah I think it's unethical

 

Ethics and Politicos are 2 words that do not deserve to be on the same page, let alone the same sentence.

 

In any Country.

[Jingthing]

5 minutes ago, The Cyclist said:

 

Ethics and Politicos are 2 words that do not deserve to be on the same page, let alone the same sentence.

 

In any Country.

Yeah well sure but doesn't make it right.

[Ralf001]

26 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Yeah I think it's unethical to not specify details before the effective date. It makes tax planning impossible. All we can do is guess. 

 

IN the eyes of the RD the effective date will be 31/12/24, the end of the financial year for individual taxpayers.

[Jingthing]

8 minutes ago, Ralf001 said:

 

IN the eyes of the RD the effective date will be 31/12/24, the end of the financial year for individual taxpayers.

Yes but that applies to financial stuff this year which means it's totally black box for expats.

[Ralf001]

2 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Yes but that applies to financial stuff this year which means it's totally black box for expats.

 

Yeah I hear ya.

The details for my 2025 tax return are already calculated based on pure salary... thats how my monthly with holding tax is calculated.

 

[StayinThailand2much]

2024 already; waiting for reports of members who had transfers to Thailand this year...

Edited January 1 by StayinThailand2much

[StayinThailand2much]

16 hours ago, Mike Teavee said:

Love this post... Thank you for reminding us that "This is Thailand" & so everything we think we know, we don't.

 

Yes, any other country they would have clarified 'when', 'how', and 'who'. But this being Thailand, only an informal press release that 'all foreign income will be taxed'... Just like a restaurant advertising: "Come visit us! We have food."

Edited January 1 by StayinThailand2much

[Ralf001]

1 minute ago, StayinThailand2much said:

 

Yes, any other country they would have clarified 'when', 'how', and 'who'. But this being Thailand, only an informal press release that 'all foreign income will be taxed'... Just like a restaurant advertising: "Come visit us! We have food."

The when has been known for many many years if anyone bothers to look up financial year Thailand for individual taxpayers.... its always been Jan 1 to Dec 31.

The who will be (I assume) enforcement of tax laws also been in place for many years, this announcement is merely closing the loop holes used to avoid them.

The how will be same as any other country.... lodge a tax return by the due date, in this instance it will be 31/03/25.

 

Or something like that anyways !

[StayinThailand2much]

9 minutes ago, Ralf001 said:

The when has been known for many many years if anyone bothers to look up financial year Thailand for individual taxpayers.... its always been Jan 1 to Dec 31.

The who will be (I assume) enforcement of tax laws also been in place for many years, this announcement is merely closing the loop holes used to avoid them.

The how will be same as any other country.... lodge a tax return by the due date, in this instance it will be 31/03/25.

 

Or something like that anyways !

 

So, according to this, who has no income in Thailand doesn't need to lodge a tax return. Who receives transfers or cash from abroad, and has been staying for 180+ days in Thailand, should lodge a return if they think there might be tax liability in Thailand. And the RD will wait for any tax returns in the mail. Sounds good to me.

Edited January 1 by StayinThailand2much

[Ralf001]

1 minute ago, StayinThailand2much said:

 

So, according to this, who has no income in Thailand doesn't need to file a tax return. Who receives transfers or cash from abroad should file a return if they think there might be tax liability in Thailand. And the RD will wait for any tax returns in the mail. Sounds good to me.

 

Always been one has to pay tax on income brought into the country.

 

Old law was tax is due id brought into Thailand in the same year earn't... thats one of the loopholes I reckon is being closed.

[Jingthing]

2 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

 

Always been one has to pay tax on income brought into the country.

 

Old law was tax is due id brought into Thailand in the same year earn't... thats one of the loopholes I reckon is being closed.

So you're the one!

[Jingthing]

2 hours ago, StayinThailand2much said:

2024 already; waiting for reports of members who had transfers to Thailand this year...

If you're suggesting that the banks might be withholding a portion for tax, no need to wait. They will not.

 

Next 

...

[mfd101]

I have a cunning plan: I'm going to keep hiding under the bed until 1 Jan 2026. By then we should have a fair idea how things are panning out.

[Ralf001]

13 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

So you're the one!

 

the one, what ?

[CartagenaWarlock]

On 12/21/2023 at 6:14 PM, Danderman123 said:

IIRC, foreign nationals with capital gains in the US are subject to a substantial withhold upon a sale.

https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/06/nonusresidenttax.asp

Dividends are taxed at 30%. Capital gains are not. Let's assume a Thai person buys a home in the USA and then sells it at a profit after a few years. It is called capital gains.

Edited January 1 by CartagenaWarlock

[Jingthing]

Another reason that it totally sucks that we don't have the details yet (and have no idea when we will know) is that this is hurtful to the Thai economy itself. The ye olde shooting themselves in the foot syndrome.

 

To wit --

 

People being scared off and not coming in the first place (people starting new households spend a lot)

 

Most dramatically -- BUYING CONDOS! (Or other optional large purchses that you need to import money for.)

Also optional medical procedures.

I think you have to be beyond concerns about money or crazy to buy a condo in Thailand now. 

 

Of course this hurts foreigners hoping to sell condos to foreigners now as well.  The supply of very wealthy, clueless, or insane foreigners is presumably limited.

Edited January 1 by Jingthing

[Mike Lister]

6 hours ago, StayinThailand2much said:

2024 already; waiting for reports of members who had transfers to Thailand this year...

US Social Security overseas is paid primarily on 3rd each month, not long to wait.

[Trippy]

11 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Another reason that it totally sucks that we don't have the details yet (and have no idea when we will know) is that this is hurtful to the Thai economy itself. The ye olde shooting themselves in the foot syndrome.

 

To wit --

 

People being scared off and not coming in the first place (people starting new households spend a lot)

 

Most dramatically -- BUYING CONDOS! (Or other optional large purchses that you need to import money for.)

I think you have to be beyond concerns about money or crazy to buy a condo in Thailand now. 

 

Of course this hurts foreigners hoping to sell condos to foreigners now as well.  The supply of very wealthy, clueless, or insane foreigners is presumably limited.

Good news for the poor renters.

[stat]

17 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

 

2024 tax returns do not have to be submitted until March 2025.

RD still has some time up it's sleeve to work out the details.

The directive is already "active". Usually law or directives are defined and explained before coming into effect. I also suspect thai RD may just look at your lifestyle and demand proof of how those monies came to Thailand to pay for your rental condo etc...

[stat]

7 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

 

IN the eyes of the RD the effective date will be 31/12/24, the end of the financial year for individual taxpayers.

Nonsense, sorry mate. That is just the deadline for the tax calendar year. Starting 1 Jan 2024 you are liable to pay tax on your remittance without any substantial guidance on how profit of this remitance will be calculated (Lifo or Fifo for example etc). I know TiT but this time there are 6-7 digit USD taxes on the horizon for some people.

[stat]

2 hours ago, CartagenaWarlock said:

https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/06/nonusresidenttax.asp

Dividends are taxed at 30%. Capital gains are not. Let's assume a Thai person buys a home in the USA and then sells it at a profit after a few years. It is called capital gains.

30% tax on dividends is the normal rate yes, but most countries have a DTA with the US (Germany, Thailand etc... ) and so the tax rate ist 15% on dividends and no tax on cap gains.

[stat]

There will be no withholding tax deducted in the coming months as a change like this will take years to implement on bank IT Level, not to mention Thai RD would need to confirm that Joe Sixpack is now a thai tax resident at excat the moment he has spend 180 days in Thailand.

[Misty]

5 hours ago, CartagenaWarlock said:

https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/06/nonusresidenttax.asp

Dividends are taxed at 30%. Capital gains are not. Let's assume a Thai person buys a home in the USA and then sells it at a profit after a few years. It is called capital gains.

If a Thai or other nonresident foreigner buys real estate in the USA and then sells it at a.profit, the gain is taxable in the USA. Gains on investment portfolios would not be taxable, however, as these types of gains are considered sourced at the location of the taxpayer.