Foreign survivor criticises slow response of Thai police in Siam Paragon shooting (video)

[webfact]

 

A foreign man shared his experience of the shooting incident at Bangkok’s Siam Paragon shopping mall on October 3 with Thai media and accused the Thai police and authorities of being slow to act.

 

The Royal Thai Police (RTP) faced substantial criticism from Thai citizens on social media in the aftermath of the mall shooting.

 

People accused the officers of being slow in their response and the rescue efforts for those trapped inside. Some individuals highlighted the close proximity of the RTP headquarters, a mere 500 meters from the shooting scene.

RTP officials clarified that their headquarters was not equipped with the necessary special operations team required for such emergencies.

The criticism extended beyond the Thai community, as the foreign survivor of the shooting shared his ordeal with ThaiRath in an interview. The man also agreed with Thai netizens that the police were slow to act.

 

“I think the response was very slow. You see those ambulances behind us, they probably just got here. It took them about an hour and a half or two hours to get here. So, I don’t think it was that fast, I don’t think they were well prepared for this at all.”

 

 

 

 

Mall mayhem

 

The Indian man said he was visiting the shopping centre with his wife and baby. While they were inside, they heard several gunshots and people started running all over the place. Everyone was scared.

 

The man added that there was a lot of chaos and it was almost like a stampede. Police later cleared people out of the mall 45 minutes after the shooting, according to the foreign man.

 

by Petch Petpailin

TOP: A bouquet of flowers is offered by a Chinese man in front of the Siam Paragon mall in Bangkok. Photo by Wason Wanichakorn via AP.

 

Full story: The Thaiger 2023-10-05

 

- Cigna offers a range of visa-compliant plans that meet the minimum requirement of medical treatment, including COVID-19, up to THB 3m. For more information on all expat health insurance plans click here.

 

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[alyx]

20 minutes ago, webfact said:

 

A foreign man shared his experience of the shooting incident at Bangkok’s Siam Paragon shopping mall on October 3 with Thai media and accused the Thai police and authorities of being slow to act.

 

The Royal Thai Police (RTP) faced substantial criticism from Thai citizens on social media in the aftermath of the mall shooting.

 

People accused the officers of being slow in their response and the rescue efforts for those trapped inside. Some individuals highlighted the close proximity of the RTP headquarters, a mere 500 meters from the shooting scene.

RTP officials clarified that their headquarters was not equipped with the necessary special operations team required for such emergencies.

The criticism extended beyond the Thai community, as the foreign survivor of the shooting shared his ordeal with ThaiRath in an interview. The man also agreed with Thai netizens that the police were slow to act.

 

“I think the response was very slow. You see those ambulances behind us, they probably just got here. It took them about an hour and a half or two hours to get here. So, I don’t think it was that fast, I don’t think they were well prepared for this at all.”

 

 

 

 

Mall mayhem

 

The Indian man said he was visiting the shopping centre with his wife and baby. While they were inside, they heard several gunshots and people started running all over the place. Everyone was scared.

 

The man added that there was a lot of chaos and it was almost like a stampede. Police later cleared people out of the mall 45 minutes after the shooting, according to the foreign man.

 

by Petch Petpailin

TOP: A bouquet of flowers is offered by a Chinese man in front of the Siam Paragon mall in Bangkok. Photo by Wason Wanichakorn via AP.

 

Full story: The Thaiger 2023-10-05

 

- Cigna offers a range of visa-compliant plans that meet the minimum requirement of medical treatment, including COVID-19, up to THB 3m. For more information on all expat health insurance plans click here.

 

Get our Daily Newsletter - Click HERE to subscribe

 

 

When trapped, for any reason, the rescue is always too slow, too long.

It is always  very easy to point fingers especially when no details is provided.

[daveAustin]

They were probably too busy doing real police work like stopping motorcyclists without helmets 

[HaoleBoy]

Why don't the Thai's teach "drop and shelter" in the event of gunshots?

Better to stay in 1 place rather than running around in chaos since you wouldn't know where the gunman was.  Sounds echo in a big shopping mall and a gunman can come down floor(s) using an escalator.

[sqwakvfr]

Not defending the RTP but getting to everyone in this type of circumstance in a rapid manner is essentially “mission impossible”.  Otherwise BKK can become like Manila  where most shopping malls have actual security guards posted at all entrances along with actual bag searches.  One can imagine how long it would take to get people into the malls if actual security procedures were implemented in BKK.  

[sqwakvfr]

2 minutes ago, HaoleBoy said:

Why don't the Thai's teach "drop and shelter" in the event of gunshots?

Better to stay in 1 place rather than running around in chaos since you wouldn't know where the gunman was.  Sounds echo in a big shopping mall and a gunman can come down floor(s) using an escalator.

Retired American Police Officer here and most people forget when the “real” event actually happens. Panic is usually the first reaction for most.  

[Sydebolle]

RTP officials clarified that their headquarters was not equipped with the necessary special operations team required for such emergencies. “It ....... took them about an hour and a half or two hours to get here" was apparently a statement by a bystander. 

Well, the police head quarters is 500 meters away and the Chulalongkorn hospital a little further down. And, as far as SWAT team equipment is concerned, I wonder how many units you could fix instead of getting those Chinese submarines without engines - your call! 

[ezzra]

When a disaster happens there always be someone/s who will blame the police/government/authorities, it is an automatic response to such event whether they have merits or not...

[bamnutsak]

22 minutes ago, ezzra said:

When a disaster happens there always be someone/s who will blame the police/government/authorities, it is an automatic response to such event whether they have merits or not...

I'm not seeing a lot of "blame", well maybe here on this forum, but I think people are looking for explanations. What happened to this child? How'd he get a gun? How'd he get inside the mall/hotel? Why was the response so slow? It is not unreasonable for the public to ask these questions, nor for the authorities, civil and police, to not be able to answer them honestly.

 

After the Nong Bua Lamphu Massacre the Police and various government officials promised action on gun control/safety. But all the public got was crickets, apparently.

 

I think it is unreasonable to expect the RTP to be proficient at handling a situation for which they were unprepared for, and untrained for. 

[hotchilli]

1 hour ago, daveAustin said:

They were probably too busy doing real police work like stopping motorcyclists without helmets 

The heavily armed response team were probably round at Surachates... keeping an eye on things.

[swm59nj]

The police might had been able to respond quicker.  But they are probably not trained to handle this sort of situation.  Except for a special operations team unfortunately. 
The ambulances were probably held up in traffic as part of the reasons.  But the usual protocol is an ambulance won’t enter an area  unless a serious situation in completely contained 

[FruitPudding]

2 hours ago, HaoleBoy said:

Why don't the Thai's teach "drop and shelter" in the event of gunshots?

Better to stay in 1 place rather than running around in chaos since you wouldn't know where the gunman was.  Sounds echo in a big shopping mall and a gunman can come down floor(s) using an escalator.

Cos that would be very unThai.

 

What you need to see is how Thai schools do a fire drill.

 

Run! Quick! Even teachers are running (and they knew it was a drill, lol). Crush onto the stairs. Pushing. Shoving. Stampede. Panic.

 

Foreign teachers standing there talking about how bad it is

 

Successful fire drill to the Thais. Got everyone out quickly. What more is there to consider?

Edited October 5, 2023 by FruitPudding

[FruitPudding]

18 minutes ago, swm59nj said:

The ambulances were probably held up in traffic as part of the reasons. 

Yeah, stuck behind stubborn drivers, "Not today, sucka"

[Celsius]

2 hours is way too long.

 

Excuses

[Eloquent pilgrim]

5 hours ago, webfact said:

RTP officials clarified that their headquarters was not equipped with the necessary special operations team required for such emergencies

Surely their Headquarters is the one place that you would expect to be housing both a “special operations team” and a “rapid response team” ….. if not there, then where ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[ChipButty]

I would have thought a major city like Bangkok would have rapid response units stationed in areas like the shopping centers were a high volume of damage could be done. 

Shopping centers are a target for maximum damage, 

 

[KannikaP]

2 hours ago, sqwakvfr said:

Not defending the RTP but getting to everyone in this type of circumstance in a rapid manner is essentially “mission impossible”.  Otherwise BKK can become like Manila  where most shopping malls have actual security guards posted at all entrances along with actual bag searches.  One can imagine how long it would take to get people into the malls if actual security procedures were implemented in BKK.  

Actually, you are correct.

[300sd]

500 meters away and the police can't make it for 1-2 hours because they are not equipped!

 

What garbage. They are useless to the public and don't deserve to be employed as police. Get rid of them.

 

 

[ChipButty]

I would have thought of all places to have a rapid response units would be the head office, great planning that is, now we know why it's chaos on the roads, 

[tandor]

2 hours ago, sqwakvfr said:

Not defending the RTP but getting to everyone in this type of circumstance in a rapid manner is essentially “mission impossible”.  Otherwise BKK can become like Manila  where most shopping malls have actual security guards posted at all entrances along with actual bag searches.  One can imagine how long it would take to get people into the malls if actual security procedures were implemented in BKK.  

a rapid bag and body scanner system..Im sure 10 seconds of your precious time would be acceptable.

[bkk6060]

Most Special Operations Teams are not sitting around Police headquarters.  They need space for training, vehicles and equipment.  Also, some anominity.  If they were at Police Headquarters and this happened at a mall 45 minutes away, people would ask the same question.

 

On this, most western countries due to mass shootings and terrorism have trained and equiped all officers and their field units appropriately.  They obviously have not done that here in fact many field cops dont even wear a gun.  Seems very very stupid the lack of training and preparation here they have been very very lucky that there are not more incidents like this.

[lopburi3]

39 minutes ago, ChipButty said:

I would have thought of all places to have a rapid response units would be the head office, great planning that is, now we know why it's chaos on the roads, 

Commando Unit has been out in Latphao forever.

 

[sqwakvfr]

37 minutes ago, tandor said:

a rapid bag and body scanner system..Im sure 10 seconds of your precious time would be acceptable.

How many scanners and how many additional trained, qualified and competent security officers would each mall have to hire?  Even the TSA misses firearms , grenades and even explosives on a frequent basis. 

[VocalNeal]

2 hours ago, ezzra said:

When a disaster happens there always be someone/s who will blame

There FTFY

[Eloquent pilgrim]

51 minutes ago, sqwakvfr said:

How many scanners and how many additional trained, qualified and competent security officers would each mall have to hire?  Even the TSA misses firearms , grenades and even explosives on a frequent basis. 

This is a very negative take on things; scanners are used at the entrances to malls all over the world. They are far from perfect as you point out, and they cost money, but we are talking about trying to save the lives of innocent members of the public.

 

Are there any better solutions out there that you know of, rather than doing nothing at all  ?

[HampiK]

8 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

This is a very negative take on things; scanners are used at the entrances to malls all over the world. They are far from perfect as you point out, and they cost money, but we are talking about trying to save the lives of innocent members of the public.

 

Are there any better solutions out there that you know of, rather than doing nothing at all  ?

The problem, even if the scanner show something is there. nobody stop you and look.. The scanners are there but nobody really looks on it. It's even simple to walk around the scanners. And this works in every mall. If you want bring anything inside a mall.. this is a very easy task.

 

But what I do not understand is the complain about how long it took. They need long to clear up the whole shopping center after they cached the shooter. But I think before you can go inside shopping mall and release all the customers and staff waiting inside the stores. you have to make sure there is no danger anymore.

What I saw and heard the security this time have done in general a great job... closed the store, and told all the customer and staff to go inside store in the back-part. This is a much better thing, than let run out all customers so they can run directly into the shooter.

[reefsurfah]

Complainer

[sqwakvfr]

30 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

This is a very negative take on things; scanners are used at the entrances to malls all over the world. They are far from perfect as you point out, and they cost money, but we are talking about trying to save the lives of innocent members of the public.

 

Are there any better solutions out there that you know of, rather than doing nothing at all  ?

I did not say “do nothing at all”.  I said the cost  would be a major impediment for any company to consider.  No security screening system is 100-%.  

[fallup88]

Special Ops team is not located in city center. Given how bad traffic is during rush hour, they wouldn’t have made it to the scene fast unless by helicopter.
 

It’s up to police to make the arrests, which is what happen in this cases police had to search floor by floor. And they were on the scene within 15 minutes. Keeping people safe and evacuating is just as important.

 

Rescue takes time, and yes it feels like forever if you are in the middle of the incident.

 

From what I read online, Paragon security and many staff were well prepared for the scenario. They were trained to close doors and keep visitors safe in the event of a situation like this.

 

Since Royal Thai Police headquarters is nearby, you would imagine they would / should a tactical unit stationed there at all times. 

[phili52]

my questions:

does the security control room with  CCTV monitors properly manned?

is the a direct line from the control room to Police, fireman, ambulances, available.?

is there an emergency situation policy available and known by all security guards?

how often the security guards are trained to deal with various situations?