I reckon the Savannakhet Embassy is about to become very busy..

[JeffersLos]

6 minutes ago, StayinThailand2much said:

stop me from leaving

Very easy.

 

The same as when departure tax had to be paid in cash before exiting, before it was hidden in the ticket price.

 

No pay tax, no leave. It was their immigration system at borders for years. 

[StayinThailand2much]

7 minutes ago, JeffersLos said:

Very easy.

 

The same as when departure tax had to be paid in cash before exiting, before it was hidden in the ticket price.

 

No pay tax, no leave. It was their immigration system at borders for years. 

This was about cash, not an official document which to get might be both, time-consuming and/or requiring being fluent in Thai as for taxation. Will they hand out tax forms at all border posts, and assign an employee to help you fill it out for the next 30-60 minutes?

Edited October 13, 2023 by StayinThailand2much

[KhaoNiaw]

1 hour ago, BritTim said:

If they become really serious about collecting tax from foreigners, it will be done by requiring a tax clearance before leaving Thailand if you have spent more than a specified number of days in Thailand. This was the system about 30 years ago. If staying long term in Thailand, you needed to visit the local tax office where you were interrogated and, once they were satisfied, given a stamp in the last page of your passport allowing you to leave. It was way worse than any of the other bureaucracy I have ever needed to deal with in Thailand (and I was not even living in Thailand then). The system was abolished during the short lived, foreigner friendly, technocrat government led by Anand Panyarachun.

It was a pain going to the office but the whole conversation could be quite amusing. As a student, I'd saved up the cash to travel from working on a farm during holidays, weekends etc. This was met with some disbelief in the Thai tax office and they suggested I must have been teaching English to support myself in Thailand. The officer on that occasion was a nice young lady who who was trying to be stern but ended up having a bit of a giggle when she gave me the stamp. Lesson learned though, it was better to have a more white collar story for them. 

[bob smith]

26 minutes ago, Pattaya57 said:

To avoid tax residence status it's maximum 179 days in Thailand and 181 days in Cambodia so you'll need to find a 3rd country to spend 5 days in ????

Shouldnt be too hard that mate ???? 

[mokwit]

3 hours ago, bob smith said:

As a Multi Entry Non O visa grants you stay of maximum 90 days per time, this would negate the tax resident status.

Wrong. 180 days within the calendar (also tax) year.

[a3tsw]

37 minutes ago, bob smith said:

Shouldnt be too hard that mate ???? 

Maybe Gammaglobulin could put you up for a few days on his futon in ????????

[Summerinsiam]

Its not real. Why dont you get it!

[JeffersLos]

59 minutes ago, StayinThailand2much said:

This was about cash, not an official document which to get might be both, time-consuming and/or requiring being fluent in Thai as for taxation. Will they hand out tax forms at all border posts, and assign an employee to help you fill it out for the next 30-60 minutes?

You're obviously new here. ????

 

Getting a TIN and paying income tax is simple. No work permit or employment needed. 

The same as handing over your departure card, hand over a simple tax clearance cert too. 

 

A simple booth for those with Non-Imm visas to show their tax declaration cert, stamped, then in through immigration. Simple. ????

 

The exact same as when we needed to pay the departure tax in cash before being allowed enter the departure zone. But you wouldn't remember that because you're new here. ????

 

 

[StayinThailand2much]

1 minute ago, JeffersLos said:

Getting a TIN and paying income tax is simple. No work permit or employment needed. 

The same as handing over your departure card, hand over a simple tax clearance cert to

Yes, it is so simple. That's why there are hundreds of pages and thousands of posts now discussing this topic on this very forum...

[StayinThailand2much]

9 minutes ago, JeffersLos said:

The same as handing over your departure card, hand over a simple tax clearance cert (...)

I'm sure, they'll hand them out at the airport... LOL

Edited October 13, 2023 by StayinThailand2much

[JeffersLos]

2 minutes ago, StayinThailand2much said:

Yes, it is so simple. That's why there are hundreds of pages and thousands of posts now discussing this topic on this very forum...

They're discussing the reasoning and implications, not the simple process of getting a TIN lol ????????????

 

You posted the exact same post twice, are you as new to the internet as you are to Thailand? ????

Edited October 13, 2023 by JeffersLos

[Pattaya57]

14 minutes ago, JeffersLos said:

Getting a TIN and paying income tax is simple. No work permit or employment needed. The same as handing over your departure card, hand over a simple tax clearance cert too. 

 

A simple booth for those with Non-Imm visas to show their tax declaration cert, stamped, then in through immigration. Simple. ????

2024 tax doesn't have to be filed until 31 March 2025. So how to show tax clearence in those 15 months if you weren't required to do tax before?

 

Like every tax thread here it's just all speculation 

[retarius]

2 hours ago, bob smith said:

What do you mean?

 

6 months in Cambodia/Laos and 6 months here sounds more than fine to me.

Bob, if you are British, and you haven't done so already, and wish to avoid taxes on your gifts to gf/wives since 1974, then you need to learn the difference between residence and domicile. People domiciled in the UK are liable to inheritance taxes on all of their worldwide estate.If you only have a small estate (including all gifts made sine 1974) then it doesn't matter. Check it out with a British qualified accountant.

[AAArdvark]

4 hours ago, bob smith said:

No, its not my plan B.

 

How would they enforce tax collection for people on Non O Multiple entry visas?

 

Is the tax man going to be knocking on my door when he doesn’t know where I live??

You don't do TM-30s or TM-47s? 

[stix40]

6 hours ago, NanLaew said:

Income tax isn't related to anyone's Thailand immigration status or their Thailand long-stay entitlement.

 

If you have a Thai bank account in your name, the Thailand Revenue Department already know where to "find" you.

 

If you are happy to fund your long-stay through credit cards and cash withdrawals from foreign banks via the ATM, you'll be OK.

I'll be using my foreign debit cards with zero charges and avoid as much as possible scanning etc from Thai bank .

That's if this comes to fruition? 

 

[NoshowJones]

3 hours ago, tomazbodner said:

Very easily. To issue you a visa, after checking time in country, they could ask you to provide them receipt of paid tax or reject your visa application. So easy to add one line to the requirements to apply for visa.

 

On leaving the country, they could force you to get tax clearance document like many decades ago, if you stayed long time on wrong type of visa, or reject you exit. Philippine immigration loves to reject exit to their citizens, Thailand could do the same to you.

 

Actually they aren't going to enforce anything. It is your responsibility to declare and settle taxes. If you don't and they find out, then they could penalise you later. The World is getting ever more connected. I don't think it's beyond imagination that immigration could get access to revenue department's data to verify whether taxes were paid or not.

Thai immigration is more into paperwork than computers. It will be a lot harder for them to sift through all their paperwork, as most of them are not that computer literate.

[NanLaew]

4 hours ago, JeffersLos said:

4 hours ago, NanLaew said:

It will be even more challenging when opening a new account in Thailand requires the applicant to have a Thailand TIN (Tax ID Number).

Why?

 

You don't need a work permit or visa to get a TIN.

 

You can then pay income tax on Thai rental income, stock dividends, overseas income which can be offset your home country's tax. 

It will be more challenging to the likes of the OP and those who can't get their head around income tax.

 

Not a challenge to me.

[Bangkok Barry]

My pensions in the UK do not reach the level where I have to pay tax there. How would that affect my monthly transfers of it to Thailand? No tax due in the UK so none in Thailand?

 

And no comments are needed asking how I can live on such a small amount. I do, perfectly well, in comfort and with all I need, on 25-30,000 a month.

[NanLaew]

4 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Cambodia, Philippines, Vietnam are much more fun.

I did 5 years of Multi non-Os (Savannakhet and Saigon) when CM immigration were a little 'difficult', but now they're really easy so I'm back to Non-O extensions at CM.

 

Enjoyed all the travelling the Multis forced me to do.

China, Vietnam, Cambodia, Philippines were all great.

And yet despite them all being "much more fun", here you are back in Thailand.

[NanLaew]

4 hours ago, pagallim said:

The definition of tax residency in Thailand is that of already paying Thai tax, typically through employment, in which case those liable for tax would have a work permit.    Nothing to do with typical retirees and others who do not work here and fund their stay through overseas earnings such as pensions and/or investments etc.   This whole overseas tax thing is aimed at Thais who have undeclared overseas earnings/offshore accounts etc, not Joe Soap who is renting out his house in Birmingham to fund his Thai life.

Thanks for sharing your interpretation of the pending changes to the tax laws.

[BritManToo]

13 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

And yet despite them all being "much more fun", here you are back in Thailand.

Much more fun than Laos.

Equal in fun to Thailand.

 

But I already have a house, wife and kids in Thailand.

[pagallim]

23 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

Thanks for sharing your interpretation of the pending changes to the tax laws.

I take your point, though the relevancy is all in the definition of 'tax residency'.   How many of us who do not file Thai tax returns for financial activity/employment for earned/unearned income within Thailand?   Sadly this forum has become a never ending click bait rendering of controversial topics, submitted by undoubted Asean administrators under a variety of probable same person member names, to boost post counts.

 

These are the countries with whom Thailand currently has DTT's (Double Tax Treaties):

 

https://taxsummaries.pwc.com/thailand/individual/foreign-tax-relief-and-tax-treaties

Edited October 13, 2023 by pagallim

[Lemsta69]

6 hours ago, bob smith said:

As a Multi Entry Non O visa grants you stay of maximum 90 days per time, this would negate the tax resident status.

No, it would not, tax residency is based on total time spent in the Kingdom in a fiscal year. Also it is "180 days or more", not "in excess of 180 days".

Edited October 13, 2023 by Lemsta69

[alanrchase]

33 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

My pensions in the UK do not reach the level where I have to pay tax there. How would that affect my monthly transfers of it to Thailand? No tax due in the UK so none in Thailand?

 

And no comments are needed asking how I can live on such a small amount. I do, perfectly well, in comfort and with all I need, on 25-30,000 a month.

Your UK pensions have been subject to UK tax at the nil band rate. The dual taxation agreement will mean that Thailand should not tax them.

[crazykopite]

As I own my own property my outgoings are small my plan is to bring over enough money from my U.K. savings to see me through 2024 I will do that in December and every December after that 
Happy Days !!! Having said that I am considering sharing my time between Thailand and a neighbouring country just throw a few things in the car and off I go 

[Toby1947]

Much ado about nothing 

[thecyclist]

9 hours ago, Prubangboy said:

Laos business visa is very iffy to get. Prob have to pay under the table. I had a cultural visa there for six months. It required a donation.

 

Also, in Laos, if they are unhappy with you, they just drive you to a border and send you on your way. No hearing, no nothing. 2 Christians were handing out Jesus DVD's in Vientiane. They were relieved of their dvd's, allowed to collect their luggage, and dropped at The Friendship Bridge. So a little insecure as a residence.

 

Rent's in Sakanavet? Prob not a lot of places to rent.

Cambodia and Vietnam are probably better alternatives. 

[ChaiyaTH]

Being taxed is based on how many days you are in a country within a calendar year, leaving every 90 days does not stop that. Nonsense post.

 

To get relevant, savannakhet for sure will remain busy, because for example places like Hanoi already make it near impossible to get a tourist visa, unless you have all your days pre-booked + financial receipt + flight out + financial receipt + 6 months bank history and statement. 

 

And for those who wonder, yes you understand that right, the financial receipt part is to make it impossible using websites like onwardflight etc.

Edited October 13, 2023 by ChaiyaTH

[ericthai]

11 hours ago, bob smith said:

How would they enforce it?

 

come on, enlighten me..

tax returns at consulates abroad? You are havin a laff!

They could make it that if you have a Non-O visa and want to leave Thailand that you have to present your Tax ID card showing your in the tax system. 

[JensenZ]

12 hours ago, bob smith said:

I agree with you and I made that very same point when the story first broke.

 

however, I like to speculate a bit and I’m taking it to extremes and weighing up the possible outcomes if such a policy were to be implemented. 

The reply that made the most sense was that you'd probably spend more money travelling around than what you could save by avoiding a small tax liability, if any at all. 

 

Use a visa agent - I'm sure they'll have it covered.

Edited October 13, 2023 by JensenZ