Donald Trump's return could leave Europe 'on its own', De Croo warns

[Walker88]

1 hour ago, Liverpool Lou said:

You're getting him confused with that Joe Biden pot plant.

Apparently you do not like economic growth and low unemployment. That's understandable. Many trumpers in the US are on Social Security Disability Insurance, which allows them to sit on their similarly bloated butts at home, watching Jerry Springer re-runs and stuffing their gullets with KFC, chocolate-covered cherries, chips and cookies, adding to their obesity. SSDI is the top 'employer' in many of the States trump won, such as Kentucky, Tennessee and West Virginia.

 

trump inherited a growing economy and 4.8% unemployment, but left Biden a Recession and 6.8% unemployment. Covid is no excuse, because it didn't hit the US until trump's disastrous tenure was 81% done.

 

That 'pot plant' Biden has presided over economic growth that dwarfs your nation as well as other OECD countries and more job creation that ever. (trump was the first US president since Herbert Hoover in 1932 to leave office with fewer Americans employed than when he came to office.) Biden got a bipartisan infrastructure Bill passed and forced drug companies to lower the cost of insulin (which fat trumpers need) from $600 per month to $35 per month. Biden has also continued to bolster Obamacare (which trump was to destroy, despite having zero healthcare plan). So popular is Obamacare that an additional 20 million Americans signed up in 2023 alone.

 

Pretty damn good for a "pot plant", especially when compared to the failure that was/is trump.

[Hanaguma]

1 hour ago, Lacessit said:

Please get real. The GDP of South Korea is 1.8 trillion. The GDP of North Korea ( estimated ) is 100 billion. Who is the greater threat in the region?

Apples and oranges.

 

If the EU could get off their addiction to Uncle Sugar and rouse themselves enough to actually defend their own countries, Russia would be no threat whatsoever. But they won't. They prefer to bitch and moan and look down their noses at their benefactor.  They've had a free ride for far too long and it is time they actually defended themselves. No need for the US to help them out. Four of the G7 countries are in Europe, plus myriad others. Up to them to provide for their own collective needs.

[Hanaguma]

4 minutes ago, Walker88 said:

 

 

trump inherited a growing economy and 4.8% unemployment, but left Biden a Recession and 6.8% unemployment. Covid is no excuse, because it didn't hit the US until trump's disastrous tenure was 81% done.

 

 

True. And until Covid blew up the world's economy, those numbers were even better. Unemployment was down, inflation down, cost of fuel down.  Plus peace in the Middle East, ISIS removed from the field, the Abraham Accords. ... ya may not like the Bad Orange Man's style or personal life, but he was effective.

[NoDisplayName]

21 hours ago, stats said:

Donald Trump's potential re-election in 2024 could leave Europe "on its own", Belgium's Prime Minister Alexander De Croo warned on Tuesday.

 

You say that like it's a bad thing.

 

Maybe then they could build a big, beautiful gas pipeline, and make Brandon pay for it.

[RayC]

8 hours ago, sirineou said:

But not to worry, What deficit  the US creates with it's departure , Belgium will make up with chocolate. 

 

The US contributes +/- $.5bn/ annum towards NATO's running costs (US total defence spending is obviously a whole lot more).

 

Imo Belgian chocolate is delicious. Nevertheless, increasing spending on Belgian chocolate by +/-$.5bn/ annum is not a good idea. Just think of the increase in diabetes, obesity, tooth decay, etc. The health care services worldwide simply wouldn't be able to cope🤷

[Tug]

5 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

Please get real. The combined GDP of the EU  is more than 10 times that of Russia. You can't seriously think that they are threatened in any way? 

I don’t think they are worried about Russias gdp besides Putin and his pals skim quite a bit of it off the top.I think they are more worried about those pointy thingies that go bang bang and kill people humm??you know like Putin has expressed his desire to return Russia to its post ww2 borders.then as an American citizen I look at trump having the Russians in the oval his first day in office on the last go around then his shameful treatment of our institutions that have along with our people made America what it is (flaws and good) his traitorous performance in helinsky Finland.so yea they feel threatened and more vulnerable and I don’t blame them they are prudent responsible leaders

[Trippy]

9 hours ago, Georgealbert said:

You do understand that NATO is not just EU countries?

 

Albania, Canada, Iceland, Montenegro, North Macedonia, Norway, Türkiye, the United Kingdom and the United States.

 

Don't let that hatred of the EU distort the facts

I don't hate the EU, why would I hate a place I've never been? The topic is Trump and the EU, so that's what I commented about.

You should stay on Topic with your wild accusations. 

[Walker88]

1 hour ago, Hanaguma said:

True. And until Covid blew up the world's economy, those numbers were even better. Unemployment was down, inflation down, cost of fuel down.  Plus peace in the Middle East, ISIS removed from the field, the Abraham Accords. ... ya may not like the Bad Orange Man's style or personal life, but he was effective.

Not accurate.

 

trump inherited the recovery that began after Obama saved the world's financial system from the 2008 debacle (by restoring confidence in the banking system and insurance industry, both of which were days from going belly up).

 

trump now tries to claim the much stronger US growth under Biden is a continuation of what he elft behind, which is silly considering he came in at 4.8% UE and GDP growth, but left Biden 6.8% UE and a Recession.

 

Even before Covid hit, GDP growth under trump was in the bottom 30% since the end of WWII, and the lowest since the end of WWII. AFter trump's mishandling of Covid, it just got worse.

 

As for ISIS, the eradication began under Obama. trump just continued the policies of Obama. As for the Middle East, there are always brief periods of peace. Remember Camp David, the be-all, end-all of ME strife?  The ME ALWAYS collapses and always will.

 

trump's 'deregulation' was largely allowing pollution by rolling back EPA standards. If bad air and Flint-Michigan style water is your thing, then trump is your man. He 'deregulated' in ways that allow manufacturers to dump pollutants straight into rivers and streams.

 

trump also ran up new $7,800,000,000,000 in National Debt, which---combined with his tariffs on Chinese imports---were the cause of the inflation he passed on to Biden. Of course, unless you think printing $24,000 for every man, woman and child in the US might not have inflationary implications.

[Hanaguma]

5 minutes ago, Tug said:

I don’t think they are worried about Russias gdp besides Putin and his pals skim quite a bit of it off the top.I think they are more worried about those pointy thingies that go bang bang and kill people humm??you know like Putin has expressed his desire to return Russia to its post ww2 borders.then as an American citizen I look at trump having the Russians in the oval his first day in office on the last go around then his shameful treatment of our institutions that have along with our people made America what it is (flaws and good) his traitorous performance in helinsky Finland.so yea they feel threatened and more vulnerable and I don’t blame them they are prudent responsible leaders

Again, Putin can't do that without the obesiance of the western European nations. Maybe they should shell out a few Euros for a few of their own bang bang sticks, hmmm? They can certainly afford it. Much more so than their impoverished neighbour. If they did that, then Putin would be emasculated.  Up to them, not the US. 

[Georgealbert]

9 minutes ago, Trippy said:

I don't hate the EU, why would I hate a place I've never been? The topic is Trump and the EU, so that's what I commented about.

You should stay on Topic with your wild accusations. 

No it is about Trump and the whole of Europe

 

The comments were raised in the EU parliament.

 

You seem not to understand that Non EU countries are also in NATO,  and also all the countries in Europe are not in the EU.

 

Maybe you should travel and visit, it may improve you limited knowledge.

 

[candide]

2 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

True. And until Covid blew up the world's economy, those numbers were even better. Unemployment was down, inflation down, cost of fuel down.  Plus peace in the Middle East, ISIS removed from the field, the Abraham Accords. ... ya may not like the Bad Orange Man's style or personal life, but he was effective.

Pre-covid, unemployment decrease rate was lower under Trump than under Obama's last mandate, inflation rate increased compared to Obama's last mandate, and GDP growth was similar. Debt increase rate was also higher. Oh, and oil price increased pre-Covid under Trump, but as you know, oil prices are global so it was not his fault.

There was not much to claim  compared to Obama's last mandate.

 

Life was better per-Covid, for sure, as in any other developped country.

 

As to Trump's peace initiatives in the ME, negotiated without involving the Palestinian authority and Iran, what could have gone wrong after that? 😅

Edited January 18 by candide

[Lacessit]

2 hours ago, retarius said:

Putin has no plans to invade Europe, you dope. You are parroting the scaremongering which justifies the warmongering. It's all nonsense. 

Putin has repeatedly stated his desire to see the Soviet Union restored to the Cold War boundaries of the eighties, and bemoans the fall of the USSR as the worst thing ever to happen to Russia. If he is successful in Ukraine, he won't be stopping there.

It's delusional to think otherwise.

[nauseus]

28 minutes ago, Walker88 said:

Not accurate.

 

trump inherited the recovery that began after Obama saved the world's financial system from the 2008 debacle (by restoring confidence in the banking system and insurance industry, both of which were days from going belly up).

 

trump now tries to claim the much stronger US growth under Biden is a continuation of what he elft behind, which is silly considering he came in at 4.8% UE and GDP growth, but left Biden 6.8% UE and a Recession.

 

Even before Covid hit, GDP growth under trump was in the bottom 30% since the end of WWII, and the lowest since the end of WWII. AFter trump's mishandling of Covid, it just got worse.

 

As for ISIS, the eradication began under Obama. trump just continued the policies of Obama. As for the Middle East, there are always brief periods of peace. Remember Camp David, the be-all, end-all of ME strife?  The ME ALWAYS collapses and always will.

 

trump's 'deregulation' was largely allowing pollution by rolling back EPA standards. If bad air and Flint-Michigan style water is your thing, then trump is your man. He 'deregulated' in ways that allow manufacturers to dump pollutants straight into rivers and streams.

 

trump also ran up new $7,800,000,000,000 in National Debt, which---combined with his tariffs on Chinese imports---were the cause of the inflation he passed on to Biden. Of course, unless you think printing $24,000 for every man, woman and child in the US might not have inflationary implications.

 

 

Not accurate from you.

 

This "recovery" was only enabled by the creation of trillions of magic dollars by the Federal Reserve, along with the setting of zero, or even negative interest rates. The price of that has yet to be paid.

 

Before Covid hit, GDP growth under trump was similar to and slightly better than Obama's. Certainly not the lowest since the end of WWII. The very recent stronger US growth is post covid rebound. UE was 3.7% pre Covid. 

 

As for ISIS, about 50/50 - Trump completed the job .

 

This $7,800T National Debt was mostly accrued in the first covid years (2020/1). Despite the retreat of covid, Biden is spending even more now:

 

https://www.statista.com/chart/28393/us-public-debt/

 

[Lacessit]

52 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

Again, Putin can't do that without the obesiance of the western European nations. Maybe they should shell out a few Euros for a few of their own bang bang sticks, hmmm? They can certainly afford it. Much more so than their impoverished neighbour. If they did that, then Putin would be emasculated.  Up to them, not the US. 

The more nuclear arms proliferate, the more likely it is they will fall into the hands of some fruitcake who is prepared to use them in a conflict, or as a terrorist act.

Are you deranged?

[johng]

1 hour ago, NoDisplayName said:

Maybe then they could build a big, beautiful gas pipeline, and make Brandon pay for it.

Yes who blew up the Nord stream pipelines ? ..... silence   why of course Russia blew up its own pipeline

just as Germany was complaining about the high cost of natural gas and America saying  it was a great opportunity.

 

[Liverpool Lou]

3 hours ago, Lacessit said:

It's why Trump has publicly stated he wants the US economy to crash

No, he has not said the he "wants the US economy to crash".

[Liverpool Lou]

3 hours ago, Lacessit said:

the comparison of his administration's economic performance with that of Biden is not flattering.

...for Biden, of course.

[NoDisplayName]

1 hour ago, nauseus said:

 

 

Not accurate from you.

 

This "recovery" was only enabled by the creation of trillions of magic dollars by the Federal Reserve, along with the setting of zero, or even negative interest rates. The price of that has yet to be paid.

 

Before Covid hit, GDP growth under trump was similar to and slightly better than Obama's. Certainly not the lowest since the end of WWII. The very recent stronger US growth is post covid rebound. UE was 3.7% pre Covid. 

 

As for ISIS, about 50/50 - Trump completed the job .

 

This $7,800T National Debt was mostly accrued in the first covid years (2020/1). Despite the retreat of covid, Biden is spending even more now:

 

https://www.statista.com/chart/28393/us-public-debt/

 

 

Sorry, but your Statista graph is out of date!

The debt has increased $2,500,000,000,000 in the last 8 months, now standing at $34 trillion.

 

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

 

 

 

[Lacessit]

1 hour ago, Liverpool Lou said:

No, he has not said the he "wants the US economy to crash".

 Words out of his own mouth........

 

 

[Lacessit]

1 hour ago, Liverpool Lou said:

...for Biden, of course.

Debt to GDP ratio increased 25% in Trump's last year of office. It was a decrease of 5.8% in Biden's first year in office.

My apologies if these facts interfere with your fantasies.

[nauseus]

6 hours ago, NoDisplayName said:

 

Sorry, but your Statista graph is out of date!

The debt has increased $2,500,000,000,000 in the last 8 months, now standing at $34 trillion.

 

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

 

 

 

 

Yes, I know.

 

But thanks. The update proves my point, Biden is spending even more now.

 

Let's go Brandon.

[Lacessit]

11 hours ago, johng said:

Yes who blew up the Nord stream pipelines ? ..... silence   why of course Russia blew up its own pipeline

just as Germany was complaining about the high cost of natural gas and America saying  it was a great opportunity.

 

The most viable explanation is Gazprom blew up the pipeline. When the Kremlin shut off the gas supply to Germany, Gazprom was liable for billions in penalties for defaulting on its supply contracts.

When the pipeline was blown up, Gazprom was no longer liable for the penalties, as it could invoke force majeure.

It's a pretty short-sighted decision by the Russians. Nordstream 1 cost about 8 billion euros, and seawater has by now ruined the pipeline for good. No country in Europe is going to pay to build another one.

The Chinese might shell out for one. However, that's going to take 7-8 years to build, by then Russia will IMO be a failed state.

[Liverpool Lou]

13 hours ago, Lacessit said:

15 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

No, he has not said the he "wants the US economy to crash".

 Words out of his own mouth........

 

 

Yes, part of an interview in which he did not say that he "wants the US economy to crash".  Thank you for confirming my comment.  If you've got a clip in which he actually stated that "I want the US economy to crash", that'd be interesting.

[Hanaguma]

14 hours ago, Lacessit said:

Debt to GDP ratio increased 25% in Trump's last year of office. It was a decrease of 5.8% in Biden's first year in office.

My apologies if these facts interfere with your fantasies.

Yes, the LAST year. Gee, anything happen in that last year that may have triggered a lot of spending, along with tanking the economy?  How about looking a bit longer scale...

 

Inflation in the US was;

2017 2.1%

2018 2.4%

2019 1.8%

2020 1.2%

 

Unemployment was' 

2017 4.3%

2018 3.9%

2019 3.6%

2020 8.0%

 

Oh, and the S and P 500  rose by more than 50%. Gas down to $2.20 a gallon.

 

Not bad numbers for the Bad Orange Man

 

 

[NoDisplayName]

9 hours ago, nauseus said:

 

Yes, I know.

 

But thanks. The update proves my point, Biden is spending even more now.

 

Let's go Brandon.

 

Don't you mean.............. "Let's go Bankrupt!"

[NoDisplayName]

5 hours ago, Lacessit said:

The most viable explanation is Gazprom blew up the pipeline. When the Kremlin shut off the gas supply to Germany, Gazprom was liable for billions in penalties for defaulting on its supply contracts.

When the pipeline was blown up, Gazprom was no longer liable for the penalties, as it could invoke force majeure.

It's a pretty short-sighted decision by the Russians. Nordstream 1 cost about 8 billion euros, and seawater has by now ruined the pipeline for good. No country in Europe is going to pay to build another one.

The Chinese might shell out for one. However, that's going to take 7-8 years to build, by then Russia will IMO be a failed state.

Don't you mean when Germany nationalized the Gazprom offices and seized assets and changed the laws to only impact Gazprom and refused to certify Nordstream-2 and Canada held the compressor turbines hostage and.................

[candide]

1 hour ago, Hanaguma said:

Yes, the LAST year. Gee, anything happen in that last year that may have triggered a lot of spending, along with tanking the economy?  How about looking a bit longer scale...

 

Inflation in the US was;

2017 2.1%

2018 2.4%

2019 1.8%

2020 1.2%

 

Unemployment was' 

2017 4.3%

2018 3.9%

2019 3.6%

2020 8.0%

 

Oh, and the S and P 500  rose by more than 50%. Gas down to $2.20 a gallon.

 

Not bad numbers for the Bad Orange Man

 

 

Yet, GDP growth under Trump was similar to previous years under Obama, inflation was higher than previous years under Obama, and unemployment decrease was lower than under Obama. And average debt increase/year was also higher than during Obama's last mandate.

 

As to retail gas prices, they increased under Trump (pre-Covid), apart from a short episode in January 2019 -which is, of course, the price you cite as a proof that Trump decreased gas price! 😃

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/GASREGW

Edited January 19 by candide

[Lacessit]

51 minutes ago, NoDisplayName said:

Don't you mean when Germany nationalized the Gazprom offices and seized assets and changed the laws to only impact Gazprom and refused to certify Nordstream-2 and Canada held the compressor turbines hostage and.................

Russia had already invaded Crimea, and was in the process of invading the Donbas. Quite apart from the sanctions, there's the small matter of Russia nationalizing every Western asset it could, for zero compensation.

 

Why would anyone certify a pipeline when the supplier through that pipeline is behaving like a d!ck?

[Hanaguma]

17 minutes ago, candide said:

Yet, GDP growth under Trump was similar to previous years under Obama, inflation was higher than previous years under Obama, and unemployment decrease was lower than under Obama. And average debt increase/year was also higher than during Obama's last mandate.

 

As to retail gas prices, they increased under Trump (pre-Covid), apart from a short episode in January 2019 -which is, of course, the price you cite as a proof that Trump decreased gas price! 😃

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/GASREGW

You can keep trying to parse the data, but the fact is that the US economy under Trump was good. I seem to remember so many 'economists' and hacks in the media losing their minds when he was elected, predicting doom and gloom, etc. It didn't happen.  

I have no problem in saying that the Obama years were fine in terms of the domestic economy.  Unemployment did fall under Barak, but it had a long way to fall. Kept falling under Trump.  Deficits under both, now higher deficits under Biden (even considering that the Covid induced spending is gone).  

 

Why is it so hard to even spare a faint word of praise for the man with the big hair?

[Hanaguma]

Oh, and for gas prices I used Statista...

 

https://www.statista.com/statistics/204740/retail-price-of-gasoline-in-the-united-states-since-1990/