I hear that in the U.K. re pensions claw backs.

[transam]

1 minute ago, scottiejohn said:

At the moment the DWP and HMRC cannot automatically access each others databases for two very good reasons;

1 They are not compatible and cannot automatically interconnect

2 The GDPR does not allow it, even if they could!

The police or the department concerned has to get the equivalent of a warrant to get access to the department accounts and only then access a persons account if "fraud" etc is "suspected"!  

Cool down everyone!

 

 

 

I am cooled down, dunno about a few on here though..........🤭

[beautifulthailand99]

2 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Government workers are the laziest and most inefficient people in the world, even if they could do what you suggested, it's too much effort for them to bother.

Most IT work is outsourced. The minister gets a report on their desk outlining savings and costs to implement. With £100 million quid on the table for a modest small project in the scheme of things, they will bite the companies hands off for it.

[BritManToo]

4 minutes ago, transam said:

I am cooled down, dunno about a few on here though..........🤭

Tell us how much your frozen pension pays you? Just so we can all have a laugh!

[transam]

2 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

Most IT work is outsourced. The minister gets a report on their desk outlining savings and costs to implement. With £100 million quid on the table for a modest small project in the scheme of things, they will bite the companies hands off for it.

Probably right.

A few years back I emailed pensions that folk abroad can claim full pension using a UK address, can I do that as I have read you can on the Internet.......No reply..........😂

[transam]

3 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Tell us how much your frozen pension pays you? Just so we can all have a laugh!

My state pension is none of your business, and I think it is only the likes of you that would laugh because you are a chancer, bit like dope junkies, once started, can't stop.

 

A chancer that will not come back on here to tell us if he's been caught on the fiddle, mind you if you did, a few here would undoubtably laugh........😁

[BritManToo]

15 minutes ago, transam said:

My state pension is none of your business, and I think it is only the likes of you that would laugh because you are a chancer, bit like dope junkies, once started, can't stop.

 

A chancer that will not come back on here to tell us if he's been caught on the fiddle, mind you if you did, a few here would undoubtably laugh........😁

While the rest of us will be laughing at your frozen 500 pound state pension.

 

Odd that our unfrozen pensions are your business, but your frozen pension is none of our business.

Edited February 27 by BritManToo

[proton]

36 minutes ago, Mike Lister said:

I also have heard that several times. But I have also heard that payments can be suspended, until fines are fully paid, in fact, one of the links posted earlier says the same thing.. 

 

Says the same thing, but where is the evidence pensions can be stopped until over payments are made?

[Tropicalevo]

Sorry if I am in the minority, but if you are mainly living overseas and collecting pension increases then you are breaking the law.

Why is this a worry to law abiding people?

 

[Mike Lister]

3 minutes ago, proton said:

 

Says the same thing, but where is the evidence pensions can be stopped until over payments are made?

I don't know I imagine the pension payment is not stopped at all, merely diverted to pay the fine. Dunno, guessing.

[beautifulthailand99]

39 minutes ago, scottiejohn said:

At the moment the DWP and HMRC cannot automatically access each others databases for two very good reasons;

1 They are not compatible and cannot automatically interconnect

2 The GDPR does not allow it, even if they could!

The police or the department concerned has to get the equivalent of a warrant to get access to the department accounts and only then access a persons account if "fraud" etc is "suspected"!  

Cool down everyone!

 

 

 

It would be done in batch runs Border Force would run a program to produce a file of targets that would then be taken to the DWP for the cross checking.

 

The Border Force query would be to produce a list of British Citizens over the age of 65 who have left the country for a period of more than 6 months without returning.

With that file DWP will run that against UK Pension Claimants who are receiving full benefits.  Frozen benefit claimants will have flag already, so are easily excluded from the trawl.

Then send a letter to their registered address asking them to provide proof of residency and reply within 28 day or some such time or the account will be assumed to not be entitled to the uplift.

 

GDPR can be covered off with a Statutory Instrument rather than requiring new legislation.

https://www.parliament.uk/globalassets/documents/commons-information-office/l07.pdf

 

Job done.

Edited February 27 by beautifulthailand99

[proton]

7 minutes ago, Tropicalevo said:

Sorry if I am in the minority, but if you are mainly living overseas and collecting pension increases then you are breaking the law.

Why is this a worry to law abiding people?

 

 

Never been with a Thai prostitute, parked in a disabled space, bought booze out of hours, used illegal drugs or watched iplayer without a license ? You must be a saint.

Edited February 27 by proton

[BritManToo]

Just now, Mike Lister said:

I don't know I imagine the pension payment is not stopped at all, merely diverted to pay the fine. Dunno, guessing.

If you don't have a link, you shouldn't be posting this.

[GroveHillWanderer]

56 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

Border Force passport control, of course they know that you have left the UK and for how long.

DWP know your pension payments history it is very easy to tie that to a Border Force file and identify suspicious payments and do a run to produce a file of potential suspects. You then get a letter to your UK address saying you have been potentially identified as receiving overpayments. You have 28 days to explain your situation and sign a statement under threat of prosecution. If they don't accept your reasons, or you don't reply, then they automatically stop the uplift as a minimum. If they are feeling vindictive they can do historical analysis and demand overpayment back possibly by withholding future payments.

 

I used to do batch processing data runs on big computer systems  - this is a relatively easy small project to execute with a very high return on investment. To poo poo this is either naivety or wishful thinking.

Unless it's changed recently, my understanding was that the Border Force did not routinely check passports for people leaving the country, but did random checks only (usually for "high risk" destinations).

 

Whenever we go to the UK, my wife gets an entry stamp, but there's no exit stamp.

 

I seem to recall them saying something last year about starting to collect data from airlines but I don't know if that was implemented yet.

[transam]

1 minute ago, BritManToo said:

While the rest of us will be laughing at your frozen 500 pound state pension.

 

Odd that our unfrozen pensions are your business, but your frozen pension is none of our business.

"The rest of us will be laughing", you're a dreamer...........😂

 

Are you saying I cannot post on this thread, are those on the fiddle the only ones that can............?  🤣

 

You seem to find simple things complicated, why should I post my pension payment for all to read on here, I/we have not asked how much you fiddle, for the simple reason, I/we don't care. Anyhow, is anybody interested in what any thief makes.....I doubt it..........

[Mike Lister]

4 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

If you don't have a link, you shouldn't be posting this.

It's in the link in the OP, if you would bother to watch it:

 

 

[transam]

7 minutes ago, Tropicalevo said:

Sorry if I am in the minority, but if you are mainly living overseas and collecting pension increases then you are breaking the law.

Why is this a worry to law abiding people?

 

I think the thread maybe pointing out that all the dots are beginning to line up, well tech is moving on.

[proton]

Just now, Mike Lister said:

It's in the link in the OP, if you would bother to watch it:

 

 

watched it, has false claims they do not back up as well

[transam]

1 minute ago, Mike Lister said:

It's in the link in the OP, if you would bother to watch it:

 

 

Queue, BMT's bum burp.............😂

[transam]

They are going to tell you ..............🤭

Edited February 27 by transam

[beautifulthailand99]

12 minutes ago, GroveHillWanderer said:

Unless it's changed recently, my understanding was that the Border Force did not routinely check passports for people leaving the country, but did random checks only (usually for "high risk" destinations).

 

Whenever we go to the UK, my wife gets an entry stamp, but there's no exit stamp.

 

I seem to recall them saying something last year about starting to collect data from airlines but I don't know if that was implemented yet.

UK Border Force work with the airlines to gather that data for their Semaphore system - it's all there. Big Brother really is watching you.

 

Passengers on flights entering and leaving the UK are screened by the NBTC.[citation needed] The airlines pass data (passenger name record, or PNR) on each passenger to the NBTC, including date of birth. The NBTC tracks former flights taken by each individual going back up to a decade, and determines whether an individual's flight history could be suspicious. Each individual is checked against criminal record databases. Exit checks are conducted at ferry ports connecting to European ports by the ferry operators.[4]

It looks at the e-Borders Semaphore system for suspects. It tracks around 250 million passenger movements per year. It operates the Pre-Departure Checks Scheme.

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5abb708440f0b67d67479bb5/An_inspection_of_exit_checks.pdf

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Border_Targeting_Centre

Edited February 27 by beautifulthailand99

[scottiejohn]

20 minutes ago, Mike Lister said:

It's in the link in the OP, if you would bother to watch it:

 

 

Is the above an approved source? 

The comments made, would appear to me, were just that guys inaccurate (IMO)! opinion and no real facts with any evidence or source presented!

[scottiejohn]

33 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

It would be done in batch runs Border Force would run a program to produce a file of targets that would then be taken to the DWP for the cross checking.

 

The Border Force query would be to produce a list of British Citizens over the age of 65 who have left the country for a period of more than 6 months without returning.

With that file DWP will run that against UK Pension Claimants who are receiving full benefits.  Frozen benefit claimants will have flag already, so are easily excluded from the trawl.

Then send a letter to their registered address asking them to provide proof of residency and reply within 28 day or some such time or the account will be assumed to not be entitled to the uplift.

 

GDPR can be covered off with a Statutory Instrument rather than requiring new legislation.

https://www.parliament.uk/globalassets/documents/commons-information-office/l07.pdf

 

Job done.

But they cannot do that at present.

They must have just cause for each individual they SUSPECT! They cannot just pick/compare people at random!

[beautifulthailand99]

I think we can fairly assume from the evidence presented to date that ;

 

1) The technology and the political will exist to implement such a system.

2) Work is underway to create such a system.

3) That as a minimum from the date of implementation, frozen pensions will be applied automatically from that date subject to verification by the claimant.

4) Past over payments may or may not come into scope.

[BritManToo]

31 minutes ago, Mike Lister said:

It's in the link in the OP, if you would bother to watch it:

 

 

Didn't think YouTube links were allowed?

[MangoKorat]

55 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

They also don't know where you went, so again even if they know you left, they don't know if you're entitled to the uplift or not.

That is not correct, the UK authorities have access already to exactly where your flight is heading - from the moment the airline enter your passport details on the system at check in.  Granted, you may not always be staying in the final destination point entered but most are.

 

There are ways of leaving and entering the UK that are not recorded on the UK's systems and would require further investigation to locate your movements but computers/technology are slowly removing your privacy.

 

I read yesterday that banks in countries that are signed up to the Automatic Exchange of Information System (AEOI) are required to notify the tax authority of an expats home country that the expat has an account with them.  The tax authority can then request further information if they require it. Thailand joined the AEOI system last year:

 

https://www.mazars.co.th/Home/Insights/Doing-Business-in-Thailand/Tax/Automatic-Exchange-of-Information

 

Therefore, those transferring money into Thailand can no longer be assured of privacy and the sources of that cash will be revealed to UK authorities if requested. This would for example, show up any convoluted methods such as a family member transfering funds (your pension) into your Thai account.

 

Under the new rules on pensions and banking discussed in other posts here, HMRC, who will be the recipients of information gleaned under AEOI, will now share information with the DWP.  UK government departments are finally starting to join up.

 

All I have to say is Cash is KIng - but even that's getting harder.

[Mike Lister]

6 minutes ago, scottiejohn said:

Is the above an approved source? 

The comments made, would appear to me, were just that guys inaccurate (IMO)! opinion and no real facts with any evidence or source presented!

The rules state that we have some latitude in deciding what is suitable or not. Given that there are four separate external links on the first page, all discussing the same thing plus several moderators have looked at this, I think it's sufficiently reliable to leave in place. 

[scottiejohn]

Just now, beautifulthailand99 said:

I think we can fairly assume from the evidence presented to date that

Wrong!

Only you "can fairly assume from the evidence presented to date that" and even then you are wrong. 

Look at the UK laws as they stand.  Your crystal ball is no better than anyone else's!

[transam]

39 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

If you don't have a link, you shouldn't be posting this.

That read like a worried man..........😂

[Mike Lister]

2 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Didn't think YouTube links were allowed?

18. Social media content is acceptable in most forums. However in factual areas such as but not limited to news, current affairs and health topics, social media cannot be used unless it is from a credible news media source or a government agency, and must include a link to the original source. In some circumstances a moderator may relax this rule and this will be determined on a case by case basis. If this rule is relaxed a moderator will post a public notice explaining the limit and scope of the relaxation.

 

See notice above, reposted here:

 

The rules state that we have some latitude in deciding what is suitable or not. Given that there are four separate external links on the first page, all discussing the same thing plus several moderators have looked at this, I think it's sufficiently reliable to leave in place. 

[beautifulthailand99]

Just now, scottiejohn said:

But they cannot do that at present.

They must have just cause for each individual they SUSPECT! They cannot just pick/compare people at random!

Just cause would be that they are suspected (subject to additional checks of proof required from the claimant) of overpayment of monies. All of these issues will be addressed and sorted out at the design phase of the system. A Statutory Instruments or instruments can be used to amend current legislation to deal with any legal anomalies and will no doubt be part of that process.