Important video clarifications on the new taxes for foreign residents in the Swiss embassy

[BE88]

 

 

[KhunBENQ]

For Swiss it was stated that state pensions won't be taxed by Thailand.

Company pensions/benefits will be subject to Thai taxation.

I just quickly scrolled through the video yesterday.

The expert promised to approach his superiors to create more website content in English.

Cross your fingers.

 

Edited February 28 by KhunBENQ

[BE88]

57 minutes ago, KhunBENQ said:

For Swiss it was stated that state pensions won't be taxed by Thailand.

Company pensions/benefits will be subject to Thai taxation.

I just quickly scrolled through the video yesterday.

The expert promised to approach his superiors to create more website content in English.

Cross your fingers.

 

 

Sorry but, I think you need to listen to the video better, because it was clear, if you live in Thailand you pay taxes but if you pay taxes in Switzerland you don't pay them in Thailand, and since if you live in Thailand more than 90 days you pay taxes on your pension, Swiss regulation is clear, you pay where you live, i.e. in Thailand.

Edited February 28 by BE88

[topt]

Firstly it would have been good of the OP to mention that there is nothing to listen to until after the first 9 and a half minutes and even longer until they get into anything of any note - in fact 11 minutes and 45 seconds...........

 

First question at 14 minutes 20......

[TheAppletons]

I'd have to be in the hospital and immobilized from the waist down before I would consider watching a 67 minute video on taxation.

[topt]

53 minutes ago, BE88 said:

and since if you live in Thailand more than 90 days you pay taxes on your pension

Not sure if this is a Swiss specific or a typo? Thai tax residency is 180 days not 90.

[BE88]

4 minutes ago, topt said:

Not sure if this is a Swiss specific or a typo? Thai tax residency is 180 days not 90.

Sorry you have right, i have lost same number on my typo, 180 is correctly

Edited February 28 by BE88

[CartagenaWarlock]

Nothing new, really. If the pension is specifically mentioned, in the double-taxation strategy, it is not taxed. All other income brought to Thailand will be taxed. LTR visa holders are never taxed. All others will be treated equally. US SS won't be taxed because it is specifically mentioned in the Double Taxation Treaty. If not mentioned, you pay tax. Plain and simple.

Edited February 28 by CartagenaWarlock

[topt]

Around 48 minutes the Swiss guy relates how in Switzerland you can extend the deadline for filing and goes into some detail and requests the Thai guy to consider something similar........

 

Overall I did not learn anything new that has not been covered in the AN tax threads but thanks to the OP for posting.

Unfortunately the Swiss ambassador did not really question/push whether if you think you have no tax to pay you still need to file.

[Somrak]

Tit. The gouverment has nothing new to say.

I only understad If i send only safed Money = No tax! . ?

[motdaeng]

sorry, but the whole thing was rather embarrassing ... no worth to watch 😔

 

[BE88]

3 hours ago, topt said:

Around 48 minutes the Swiss guy relates how in Switzerland you can extend the deadline for filing and goes into some detail and requests the Thai guy to consider something similar........

 

Overall I did not learn anything new that has not been covered in the AN tax threads but thanks to the OP for posting.

Unfortunately the Swiss ambassador did not really question/push whether if you think you have no tax to pay you still need to file.

 

The Thai representative said that 190,000 + 60,000 = 250,000 THB are exempt so I can understand that if you are below this figure you do not have to make an income declaration as for all Thais.

 

But he also said that the application for extension must be complete with the tax declaration.

 

So the aim is also to scare expats into paying taxes.

Edited February 28 by BE88

[topt]

2 hours ago, BE88 said:

But he also said that the application for extension must be complete with the tax declaration.

If you listen to that part closely he seemed very unsure of himself but at the end he seemed to be suggesting it was for people with work permits. I know nothing about work permits to say whether that is in fact the case or not.

IMO it appeared to me that other than the LTR he did not really have a handle on anything to do with Immigration which is what I would expect.

 

2 hours ago, BE88 said:

So the aim is also to scare expats into paying taxes.

if anybody is at fault because of that I would say it is the Swiss ambassador..............

[BE88]

Your observation is right and also what I thought but since you are dealing with a lawyer you can be sure that he will never tell you exactly how things are and their way of thinking and acting.

The lawyer achieved his aim of answering without specifying, thus leaving his interlocutors uncertain, only that of encouraging them to pay their taxes.

For the ambassador, as you observed at the end of the video, encouraging everyone to get their ID soon and therefore pay their taxes.

 

Swiss big finance  interests far outnumber the 10,000 Swiss residents in Thailand.

[Sydebolle]

The ambassador's 15 minutes of fame; something to show back to his ministerial boss on how proactive and busy he is. 

[Wrwest]

This meeting presented by the Swiss Ambassador is the closest thing I have seen to officially assist foreign retired nationals as to the new taxation requirements announced by Thailand. It may serve to help clarify but … Thailand has, IMHO really opened a can of worms here and each foreign national will need to reflect on their own countries double tax agreement with Thailand. Naturally, being an American our system is more complicated than those countries supplying a national government pension to retirees. From this presentation, government pensions would be exempt under the tax treaty. Hmm, I earned my income from a U.S. state government but, it is not a state entity paid pension, as such. The funds were immediately put into a 403(b) retirement fund. Will this income be exempt like my Social Security is exempt? The extra paperwork for which Thailand if famous will be enough to cause some to keep their time in Thailand below the 180 days thus depriving Thailand of the spending … perhaps to be spent in another lower cost country.

[Wrwest]

17 hours ago, BE88 said:

 

The Thai representative said that 190,000 + 60,000 = 250,000 THB are exempt so I can understand that if you are below this figure you do not have to make an income declaration as for all Thais.

 

But he also said that the application for extension must be complete with the tax declaration.

 

So the aim is also to scare expats into paying taxes.

Or turn away retirees unless wealthy on Elite, they are evidently tax exempt.

[BE88]

12 minutes ago, Wrwest said:

Or turn away retirees unless wealthy on Elite, they are evidently tax exempt.

 

Elite visas are not exempt from taxes Thai.

 

18 minutes ago, Wrwest said:

This meeting presented by the Swiss Ambassador is the closest thing I have seen to officially assist foreign retired nationals as to the new taxation requirements announced by Thailand. It may serve to help clarify but … Thailand has, IMHO really opened a can of worms here and each foreign national will need to reflect on their own countries double tax agreement with Thailand. Naturally, being an American our system is more complicated than those countries supplying a national government pension to retirees. From this presentation, government pensions would be exempt under the tax treaty. Hmm, I earned my income from a U.S. state government but, it is not a state entity paid pension, as such. The funds were immediately put into a 403(b) retirement fund. Will this income be exempt like my Social Security is exempt? The extra paperwork for which Thailand if famous will be enough to cause some to keep their time in Thailand below the 180 days thus depriving Thailand of the spending … perhaps to be spent in another lower cost country.

 

The lawyer Thai said that if you pay taxes in your country of origin you do not pay taxes in Thailand if tax exemption agreements exist between the two countries. So you won't have to pay taxes in my opinion.

[jojothai]

18 hours ago, BE88 said:

 

The Thai representative said that 190,000 + 60,000 = 250,000 THB are exempt so I can understand that if you are below this figure you do not have to make an income declaration as for all Thais.

People need to know that if they are over 65 they have the 160,000 and an extra 190,000 allowance for over 65. 

[jojothai]

33 minutes ago, BE88 said:

So you won't have to pay taxes in my opinion.

Only if the tax exemption agreements exist between the two countries and provide that it will not be double taxed.
Check the tax agreements between your country and Thailand.

[BE88]

37 minutes ago, jojothai said:

People need to know that if they are over 65 they have the 160,000 and an extra 190,000 allowance for over 65. 

 

Who knows why the lawyer didn't mention it knowing that he speaks to the majority of retired Swiss on Thailand ?

[norbra]

33 minutes ago, jojothai said:

People need to know that if they are over 65 they have the 160,000 and an extra 190,000 allowance for over 65. 

19 hours ago, BE88 said:

 

The Thai representative said that 190,000 + 60,000 = 250,000 THB are exempt so I can understand that if you are below this figure you do not have to make an income declaration as for all Thais.

 

But he also said that the application for extension must be complete with the tax declaration.

 

So the aim is also to scare expats into paying taxes.

I missed picking up on the +60,000 deduction, can you please  clarify what this entailed.

Thanks

 

[motdaeng]

just as an example (for switzerland),

khun nathanan mentions that swiss pensioners need not worry about taxes due to a double tax agreement.

however, individuals residing outside switzerland don't pay any taxes in switzerland, and the pension received

abroad is not taxed by the swiss government! i think khun nathanan is wrong in his conclusion!

i believe the swiss people have to fill a tax return and pay tax for their pension in thailand ...

 

the entire situation could become a chaotic mess, with endless bureaucracy, and each tax office establishes its own regulations ...

[BE88]

7 minutes ago, norbra said:

 

This means that every citizen in Thailand who resides more than 180 days is entitled to a tax deduction of 190,000 + 60,000 THB if he is legally married yet another deduction of 60,000 THB and so on if he has other minor children dependent on each 60,000 THB.

[norbra]

1 minute ago, BE88 said:

This means that every citizen in Thailand who resides more than 180 days is entitled to a tax deduction of 190,000 + 60,000 THB if he is legally married yet another deduction of 60,000 THB and so on if he has other minor children dependent on each 60,000 THB.

Thanks for that information 

[BE88]

4 minutes ago, motdaeng said:

just as an example (for switzerland),

khun nathanan mentions that swiss pensioners need not worry about taxes due to a double tax agreement.

however, individuals residing outside switzerland don't pay any taxes in switzerland, and the pension received

abroad is not taxed by the swiss government! i think khun nathanan is wrong in his conclusion!

i believe the swiss people have to fill a tax return and pay tax for their pension in thailand ...

 

the entire situation could become a chaotic mess, with endless bureaucracy, and each tax office establishes its own regulations ...

 

What you write is my case, I don't pay any taxes in Switzerland and I will have to pay taxes here in Thailand and I also think it will be a big mess, to avoid it I can not reside beyond 180 days and a solution that I am envisaging. I'm sure I pay less taxes in Switzerland.

 

[CartagenaWarlock]

18 hours ago, BE88 said:

But he also said that the application for extension must be complete with the tax declaration.

It'll be interesting to see how the agents do it. When they implemented the minimum holding period of 800K and 400K for the entire year, all the experts predicted the agent fee would explode, and the same was true when there was health insurance for an OA visa. So, please don't post your proven wrong expert predictions of how the agent fees will explode. 

[Ben Zioner]

Great to hear from the "Horse's" mouth that LTR holders are exempt from foreign sourced Income Tax.

[Ben Zioner]

2 hours ago, Wrwest said:

Or turn away retirees unless wealthy on Elite, they are evidently tax exempt.

Not Elite, LTR. Not same.

 

But Elite holders are so rich that they won't care, as they will use only their savings.

Edited February 29 by Ben Zioner

[scorecard]

23 hours ago, CartagenaWarlock said:

Nothing new, really. If the pension is specifically mentioned, in the double-taxation strategy, it is not taxed. All other income brought to Thailand will be taxed. LTR visa holders are never taxed. All others will be treated equally. US SS won't be taxed because it is specifically mentioned in the Double Taxation Treaty. If not mentioned, you pay tax. Plain and simple.

But:  For Australian Old age Pensioners the payments are not subject to tax (but if the person has other income then the situation changes).

 

So for Aussie OAP recipients with no other income residing permanently in Thailand does the 'not subject to tax' mean that tax has been considered by the Aussie system and not taxable, therefore the 'not subject to tax' flows through to the Thai tax scenario?