Trans athletes should be allowed to play women's sports, South Carolina coach Dawn Staley

[bamnutsak]

On 4/9/2024 at 7:10 AM, bamnutsak said:

The NAIA Council of Presidents approved the policy in a 20-0 vote at its annual convention in Kansas City, Missouri. The NAIA, which oversees some 83,000 athletes competing in more than 25 sports, is believed to be the first college sports organization to take such a step.

 

 

Seventeen of the twenty are presidents of Christian-aligned schools.

 

Props to Coach Staley, I thought she handled the question with poise, honesty and class. She's qualified to offer her opinion given her storied career as a player (three Olympic gold medals), and coach (38:0 this year, also one gold medal as a coach)

 

I think there are ~ 520,000 NCAA student-athletes.

 

Some ~ 40 identify as trans, with most competing in team sports. So 0.015% (assuming a 50/50 split).

 

AFAIK, the NCAA is not planning a total ban, but like most sporting governing bodies, has rules that most find acceptable.

 

 

Many individuals have remarkable physical assets that offer them a significant advantage. I see you Victor Wembanyama. Why not ban tall people?

 

We have weight classes in many sports to offset these advantages. And even have girls wrestling boys in HS, sanctioned in Iowa for example.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[JonnyF]

6 minutes ago, bamnutsak said:

We have weight classes in many sports to offset these advantages. And even have girls wrestling boys in HS, sanctioned in Iowa for example.

 

So you'd put a 140lb female in a boxing ring with Subriel Matias? Or a 175lb female in with Artur Beterbiev? 😃

 

Any governing body that sanctioned such a fight would likely end up on charges of involuntary manslaughter. It's lunacy to even suggest that men and women of an equal weight should compete in a sport like boxing. 

[Chomper Higgot]

23 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

 

Greenwich Park... Lovely. Many a lazy day spent there with Uni friends having a cheeky joint, and only a short walk to The Princess of Wales overlooking the common.

 

It really depends what you call Elite sport. I would classify it as either Pro or Amateur. Pro sport focuses on profit, the clue is in the name. However, I wouldn't support biological men competing against women in amateur sport either. We need to encourage a level playing field for girls and women, not send them out onto a Rugby field on a Sunday morning with a bloke with an identity crisis that is likely to injure them due to the disparity in physical strength (and possible psychological issues). 

Add a transgender category.

 

Jobs a good ‘un.

 

 

[youreavinalaff]

5 hours ago, JonnyF said:

 

Actually they are based on fact. Women's football is miles behind the men's game. 

 

https://www.cbssports.com/soccer/news/a-dallas-fc-under-15-boys-squad-beat-the-u-s-womens-national-team-in-a-scrimmage/

 

Quoting from 2017.

 

Like I said, your views are outdated.

[youreavinalaff]

4 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I’ve organized dozens of Amateur cycle racing events and a handful events that were listed in the National Cycling Calendar.

 

Non made a profit or were required to make a profit.

 

A brief reading on the matter of government funding to grass roots sports will give you a clue, however ass roots sports is not a profit enterprise.

 

 

 

I've taken part in many sports events. Some at sports clubs some in pubs. Some organised by local charities. All making profits for the causes represented.

 

Even my primary school sports day made profits.

 

Maybe your events didn't make a profit because they were organised by an "ass roots" organiser.

[Chomper Higgot]

29 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

 

I've taken part in many sports events. Some at sports clubs some in pubs. Some organised by local charities. All making profits for the causes represented.

 

Even my primary school sports day made profits.

 

Maybe your events didn't make a profit because they were organised by an "ass roots" organiser.

Oh fund raisers.

 

I’ve done a few of those too.

[youreavinalaff]

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Oh fund raisers.

 

I’ve done a few of those too.

No. Not fundraisers. 

 

Grass roots sporting events making a profit. 

[Chomper Higgot]

Just now, youreavinalaff said:

No. Not fundraisers. 

 

Grass roots sporting events making a profit. 

Grass roots fund raisers

[youreavinalaff]

Common sense prevails once again.

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/netball/68767815

[Chomper Higgot]

29 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

Common sense prevails once again.

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/netball/68767815

Right response.

 

Let the sports organizations deal with the issue.

 

No need for all the flush faced, bulging vein outrage.

 

 

 

[youreavinalaff]

13 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Grass roots fund raisers

No. The events were sporting events. 

 

[JonnyF]

44 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

Quoting from 2017.

 

Like I said, your views are outdated.

How about 2023?

 

https://www.nationalreview.com/news/u-k-mens-soccer-team-crushes-u-s-womens-players/#:~:text=A professional men's soccer team,have over their female counterparts.

[youreavinalaff]

6 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

How about 2023?

 

https://www.nationalreview.com/news/u-k-mens-soccer-team-crushes-u-s-womens-players/#:~:text=A professional men's soccer team,have over their female counterparts.

That's men against women. Your link helps in the views agaibst trans women competing with biological women.

 

However, it still doesn't back your original comment in its entirety.

 

It's US too. The England ladies team would give the US mens team a good run for their money. 🤣🤣🤣

[JonnyF]

1 hour ago, youreavinalaff said:

That's men against women. Your link helps in the views agaibst trans women competing with biological women.

 

However, it still doesn't back your original comment in its entirety.

 

It's US too. The England ladies team would give the US mens team a good run for their money. 🤣🤣🤣

 

Did you read it? They were playing Wrexham, a second rate side. And still got hammered.

 

Imagine if they were playing Man City. Or a national side like Brazil. 20-0? Maybe more.

 

The gulf is massive. It's almost a different sport. 

[youreavinalaff]

47 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

 

Did you read it? They were playing Wrexham, a second rate side. And still got hammered.

 

Imagine if they were playing Man City. Or a national side like Brazil. 20-0? Maybe more.

 

The gulf is massive. It's almost a different sport. 

You have obviously not kept up.

 

I'm not saying there is not a difference 

 

However, for entertainment value it's good to watch.

 

No laying on the floor crying over a scratch, no arguing with the referee, no acting like prima donnas.

 

Anyhow, it seems your link points to an exhibition match.

 

"The Wrexham squad was composed of former, current and guest players and the U.S. squad was composed of former players including World Cup winner Heather O’Reilly."

[James105]

2 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Right response.

 

Let the sports organizations deal with the issue.

 

No need for all the flush faced, bulging vein outrage.

 

 

 

 

Let's not.  It needs to be taken out of their hands as the flush faced vein bulging with outrage trans hate mobs have form for bullying those who who do not conform to the fantasy that men can change their sex.  Have you seen the hate and threats that the likes of Sharon Davies or Martina Navratalova get for asking for fairness in women's sports?  There are 2 sexes so there should be 2 categories.  Nobody would object if the mens category was open to accommodate as many genders as you can think and that way nobody is excluded and leave the women's category for actual women.   Simple, fair and inclusive.    

[Chomper Higgot]

38 minutes ago, James105 said:

 

Let's not.  It needs to be taken out of their hands as the flush faced vein bulging with outrage trans hate mobs have form for bullying those who who do not conform to the fantasy that men can change their sex.  Have you seen the hate and threats that the likes of Sharon Davies or Martina Navratalova get for asking for fairness in women's sports?  There are 2 sexes so there should be 2 categories.  Nobody would object if the mens category was open to accommodate as many genders as you can think and that way nobody is excluded and leave the women's category for actual women.   Simple, fair and inclusive.    

Is that one of your freedom to live your life without large government interference arguments?

 

Erm if there are categories for transgender sports participants, how does that impact women’s sports.

 

Take your time, give it your best go.

[0ffshore360]

For those individuals who are  medically assigned a gender in the case of non definitive /hermaphrodite babies at time of birth almost invariably the medical advice is for female. Most are sterile anyway and hormone treatment offsets any obvious male characteristics . IMO such individuals are valid contenders  in female sports .

"Gender reassignment" at or post  puberty should disqualify consideration as  genuinely "female" due to the physique developed as primarily male.

Some cultures cultivated Eunuchs as guardians of such as harems due to the physical attributes despite being ( at minimum) castrated as youths.

The whole debate over athletes  who "declare" affinity to a specific gender entirely involves female competition.

I have yet to see any similar attention given to the use of drugs in sport any more. Testosterone intake etc as an example. Why not as much objection to estrogen intake by would be trans females? Or do the athletic contingent avoid that?

The perpetual distractions ramped up by the media over "minority rights" while ignoring "majority disasters" indicates how close the world is to imploding once again.

Natural cycles and nature does not consider "rights".

"Human rights" is a denialist invention by the most self destructive animal currently in existence.

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

47 minutes ago, 0ffshore360 said:

The perpetual distractions ramped up by the media over "minority rights" while ignoring "majority disasters" indicates how close the world is to imploding once again.

Natural cycles and nature does not consider "rights".

"Human rights" is a denialist invention by the most self destructive animal currently in existence.

You might want to revisit some history.

[0ffshore360]

10 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

You might want to revisit some history.

Revisit? Can not be done. But reference to verifiable records provide many examples of futility.

 

[CharlieH]

Reported post and responses removed.

[James105]

13 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Is that one of your freedom to live your life without large government interference arguments?

 

Erm if there are categories for transgender sports participants, how does that impact women’s sports.

 

Take your time, give it your best go.

 

It doesn't, but it is a pointless endeavour as we already have sex based categories that includes everyone.  

 

Your turn.  How does having an open category exclude anyone.  

 

Take your time, give it your best go.  

[thaibeachlovers]

On 4/8/2024 at 5:51 PM, Will B Good said:

Why not have women, men and open categories?

Because that's too sensible. IMO the modern corporate world operates on BS.

The free publicity generated by this sort of BS furore about BS must save corporations millions of $ in advertising costs.

[thaibeachlovers]

On 4/10/2024 at 11:22 PM, 0ffshore360 said:

For those individuals who are  medically assigned a gender in the case of non definitive /hermaphrodite babies at time of birth almost invariably the medical advice is for female. Most are sterile anyway and hormone treatment offsets any obvious male characteristics . IMO such individuals are valid contenders  in female sports .

"Gender reassignment" at or post  puberty should disqualify consideration as  genuinely "female" due to the physique developed as primarily male.

Some cultures cultivated Eunuchs as guardians of such as harems due to the physical attributes despite being ( at minimum) castrated as youths.

The whole debate over athletes  who "declare" affinity to a specific gender entirely involves female competition.

I have yet to see any similar attention given to the use of drugs in sport any more. Testosterone intake etc as an example. Why not as much objection to estrogen intake by would be trans females? Or do the athletic contingent avoid that?

The perpetual distractions ramped up by the media over "minority rights" while ignoring "majority disasters" indicates how close the world is to imploding once again.

Natural cycles and nature does not consider "rights".

"Human rights" is a denialist invention by the most self destructive animal currently in existence.

 

 

It's good to see a sensible post. Unfortunately sense will never be an issue in the circles where such policies are formed, as it's all about greed money now, and controversy is worth millions in free publicity. Too bad about the unfortunate women that dreamed of sporting success as their dreams are being crushed by corporates that care only about the god of money.

[thaibeachlovers]

On 4/10/2024 at 3:29 PM, bamnutsak said:

We have weight classes in many sports to offset these advantages. And even have girls wrestling boys in HS, sanctioned in Iowa for example.

What could possibly go wrong with that?

How long before some girl complains that the boy she was wrestling put his hand in the wrong place, and his life is over?

 

[thaibeachlovers]

On 4/9/2024 at 1:03 PM, JonnyF said:

 

Actually men are better at darts (and many other non physical sports) due to concentration levels (single tasking), spatial awareness, judgement of distance etc.

 

https://www.mdx.ac.uk/news/2023/02/linda-duffy-darts-psychology#:~:text=ex-darts pro-,Men are 'better at throwing sports due to concentration skills,academic and ex-darts pro&text=Men are often better than,one darts player turned psychologist.

 

Men and Women are just different. Physically, Psychologically etc. That's why sports have been separated since the beginning of sports. Progressives always want to change things, even if it's for the worse. They seem to be taking race relations back about 5 decades at the moment with Critical Race Theory and Identity Politics. 

 

Back to sports that could be mixed sex, perhaps they could introduce a sport which involves multi tasking mundane jobs? Or possibly some kind of 48 hour endurance arguing contest? Women could probably dominate that 😃.

It's all about females invading male spaces. Remember the controversy when women demanded to be let in to male only clubs? Was there any controversy about men wanting to join the Country Women's Institute, or the sewing circle etc? Of course not, and why would women even want to join a male only club if not for gender politics?

 

Both the boys only schools I attended are now co ed through pressure. Imagine if it was boys wanting to join a girl's only school?

 

Back to sports that could be mixed sex, perhaps they could introduce a sport which involves multi tasking mundane jobs? Or possibly some kind of 48 hour endurance arguing contest? Women could probably dominate that 

From my experience in working in a female dominated workforce for decades, females would do well in any backstabbing competition. They were great at that. They were also much better at bullying than men- they'd clean up in any bullying competition.