Latest developments and discussion of recent events in the Ukraine War

[Bkk Brian]

3 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

The Russians are nasty mfeckers to nobodies surprise as are nearly all armies in war it brutalises people and nations. Remember My Lai or Abu Ghraib or the treatment of Palestinian prisonsers in Israel? Good job the International Criminal Court exists to try these crimes , indeed it has indicted Putin amongst others Brian. I'm sure you are in full agreement with that august body ? If not then I'm not listening. And the Express , really ? Let's stick to the broadsheets lest we descend into imbelic progandising.

Remember My Lai or Abu Ghraib or the treatment of Palestinian prisonsers in Israel?

 

No and even if I did that's just deflection from the topic and this current war crime from Russian orcs. 

 

Yes the Express really, I'll stick to whatever has credible news at the time, however the evidence is also in the actual video on X and Rumble video if you actually followed the thread. 

 

Its not like it can be denied, only lame deflections as you have clearly demonstrated.

 

[beautifulthailand99]

8 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Remember My Lai or Abu Ghraib or the treatment of Palestinian prisonsers in Israel?

 

No and even if I did that's just deflection from the topic and this current war crime from Russian orcs. 

 

Yes the Express really, I'll stick to whatever has credible news at the time, however the evidence is also in the actual video on X and Rumble video if you actually followed the thread. 

 

Its not like it can be denied, only lame deflections as you have clearly demonstrated.

 

This is a one sided debate though as I suspect your post will stand. I can show X videos of Ukrainian prisoners back in Ukraine reporting they were treated well and videos of Russian prisoners being mistreated by Ukrainains. But they will get deleted under the acceptable sources rule. So I won't. 

 

I want this war to stop and the brutality and suffering to stop with it , a war that Ukraine is losing and a war that is damaging the long term survival of the west whilst purporting to do the opposite. That's my line , period , that and the thought of an old man , me, sitting comfortably cheerleading a war far away where youing men are dying in their thousands just doesn't feel right. Sorry about that.

[Bkk Brian]

1 minute ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

This is a one sided debate though as I suspect your post will stand. I can show X videos of Ukrainian prisoners back in Ukraine reporting they were treated well and videos of Russian prisoners being mistreated by Ukrainains. But they will get deleted under the acceptable sources rule. So I won't. 

 

I want this war to stop and the brutality and suffering to stop with it , a war that Ukraine is losing and a war that is damaging the long term survival of the west whilst purporting to do the opposite. That's my line , period , that and the thought of an old man , me, sitting comfortably cheerleading a war far away where youing men are dying in their thousands just doesn't feel right. Sorry about that.

Why would you think I've not seen those vids? Just more off topic deflection from this incident.

[transam]

2 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

This is a one sided debate though as I suspect your post will stand. I can show X videos of Ukrainian prisoners back in Ukraine reporting they were treated well and videos of Russian prisoners being mistreated by Ukrainains. But they will get deleted under the acceptable sources rule. So I won't. 

 

I want this war to stop and the brutality and suffering to stop with it , a war that Ukraine is losing and a war that is damaging the long term survival of the west whilst purporting to do the opposite. That's my line , period , that and the thought of an old man , me, sitting comfortably cheerleading a war far away where youing men are dying in their thousands just doesn't feel right. Sorry about that.

Oh, your weirdo sites, you mean.........I bet all you Red's watch that stuff.......

[beautifulthailand99]

1 minute ago, Bkk Brian said:

Why would you think I've not seen those vids? Just more off topic deflection from this incident.

Well then if you have - that underlines my point that war brutalises mostly men of whatever stripe and in Russia a brutalised country to start with it's  nasty brutal business. Also when I see all this Orc, Mordor nonsense labelling then I know the poster is a one-sided propagandist. You would have been, no dount , big on the shovels, washing machines, no toilets in Russia, will be deposed in a coup , running out of missiles, Putin is dying / has cancer tropes that were common way back which seem notably absence from current discourse.

[transam]

2 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

Well then if you have - that underlines my point that war brutalises mostly men of whatever stripe and in Russia a brutalised country to start with it's  nasty brutal business. Also when I see all this Orc, Mordor nonsense labelling then I know the poster is a one-sided propagandist. You would have been, no dount , big on the shovels, washing machines, no toilets in Russia, will be deposed in a coup , running out of missiles, Putin is dying / has cancer tropes that were common way back which seem notably absence from current discourse.

Eh.......?  

[Bkk Brian]

2 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

Well then if you have - that underlines my point that war brutalises mostly men of whatever stripe and in Russia a brutalised country to start with it's  nasty brutal business. Also when I see all this Orc, Mordor nonsense labelling then I know the poster is a one-sided propagandist. You would have been, no dount , big on the shovels, washing machines, no toilets in Russia, will be deposed in a coup , running out of missiles, Putin is dying / has cancer tropes that were common way back which seem notably absence from current discourse.

Another off topic rant from Israel to washing machines 

[beautifulthailand99]

All you people who cheer for a neverending war, take a good look.Imagine another 2.5 years of this.

 

 

Edited June 4 by beautifulthailand99

[rabas]

26 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

All you people who cheer for a neverending war, take a good look.Imagine another 2.5 years of this.

 

 

Soundbite propaganda.  No one wishes for never ending war. Most reasonable people wish that Russia (perhaps without despot Putin) could find better ways to work together with the rest of the world. Maybe not start the first war of territorial conquest since forever. 

 

Edited June 4 by rabas

[beautifulthailand99]

3 minutes ago, rabas said:

 

Soundbite propaganda.  No one wishes for never rending war. Most reasonable people wish that Russia (perhaps without despot Putin) could find better ways to work together with the rest of the world. Maybe not start the first war of territorial conquest since forever. 

 

 

 

 

Time to talk - an eye for an eye will make everyone blind.

 

https://www.rand.org/pubs/perspectives/PEA2510-1.html

 

"Since avoiding a long war is the highest priority after minimizing escalation risks, the United States should take steps that make an end to the conflict over the medium term more likely."

 

 

President Biden has said that this war will end at the negotiating table.[74] But the administration has not yet made any moves to push the parties toward talks. Although it is far from certain that a change in U.S. policy can spark negotiations, adopting one or more of the policies described in this Perspective could make talks more likely. We identify reasons why Russia and Ukraine may have mutual optimism about war and pessimism about peace. The literature on war termination suggests that such perceptions can lead to protracted conflict. Therefore, we highlight four options the United States has for shifting these dynamics: clarifying its plans for future support to Ukraine, making commitments to Ukraine's security, issuing assurances regarding the country's neutrality, and setting conditions for sanctions relief for Russia.

A dramatic, overnight shift in U.S. policy is politically impossible—both domestically and with allies—and would be unwise in any case. But developing these instruments now and socializing them with Ukraine and with U.S. allies might help catalyze the eventual start of a process that could bring this war to a negotiated end in a time frame that would serve U.S. interests. The alternative is a long war that poses major challenges for the United States, Ukraine, and the rest of the world.

[rabas]

12 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

 

Time to talk - an eye for an eye will make everyone blind.

 

https://www.rand.org/pubs/perspectives/PEA2510-1.html

 

"Since avoiding a long war is the highest priority after minimizing escalation risks, the United States should take steps that make an end to the conflict over the medium term more likely."

 

 

President Biden has said that this war will end at the negotiating table.[74] But the administration has not yet made any moves to push the parties toward talks. Although it is far from certain that a change in U.S. policy can spark negotiations, adopting one or more of the policies described in this Perspective could make talks more likely. We identify reasons why Russia and Ukraine may have mutual optimism about war and pessimism about peace. The literature on war termination suggests that such perceptions can lead to protracted conflict. Therefore, we highlight four options the United States has for shifting these dynamics: clarifying its plans for future support to Ukraine, making commitments to Ukraine's security, issuing assurances regarding the country's neutrality, and setting conditions for sanctions relief for Russia.

A dramatic, overnight shift in U.S. policy is politically impossible—both domestically and with allies—and would be unwise in any case. But developing these instruments now and socializing them with Ukraine and with U.S. allies might help catalyze the eventual start of a process that could bring this war to a negotiated end in a time frame that would serve U.S. interests. The alternative is a long war that poses major challenges for the United States, Ukraine, and the rest of the world.

 

Unrelated to my post. Talking is a two way process where people focus on what each other is saying. 

 

Your 1.5 year old post is also not related to current events in Ukraine and violates forum cut and past rules. 

 

[GroveHillWanderer]

On 6/2/2024 at 9:23 AM, Gweiloman said:

As if anyone knows Putin’s ambitions lol. 

They do, because he has been clear about what they are. He hankers after restoring the former Russian Empire as it was under Peter the Great.

 

@Bkk Brianalready posted one link attesting to this, here's another.

 

Putin’s history lecture reveals his dreams of a new Russian Empire

 

Quote

His core message was chillingly simple: Ukraine has no right to exist and he is fully justified in waging a war of aggression to reclaim historically Russian lands.

 

[jvs]

 

[Danderman123]

8 hours ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

All you people who cheer for a neverending war, take a good look.Imagine another 2.5 years of this.

 

 

You are correct. Russia should leave Ukrainian territory immediately.

[kwonitoy]

[thaibeachlovers]

On 6/3/2024 at 7:00 PM, thaibeachlovers said:

It's likely to come at the meeting Zelensky is promoting now.

To the poster that gave that a laugh emoji- what is so funny about it? The meeting is a fact and "it" is likely to be discussed during the meeting. Do you just like posting laugh emojis on posts or are you < insert word(s) of choice >?

[thaibeachlovers]

15 hours ago, rabas said:

Your 1.5 year old post is also not related to current events in Ukraine and violates forum cut and past rules. 

and just what forum cut and past rules would those be? I just did a check and I was unable to locate any rule relating to cut and paste. Perhaps you meant something else, and if so please refer to the correct rule.

[thaibeachlovers]

8 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

You are correct. Russia should leave Ukrainian territory immediately.

I know you can't be serious. Why would the winning side give up?

[thaibeachlovers]

12 hours ago, GroveHillWanderer said:

They do, because he has been clear about what they are. He hankers after restoring the former Russian Empire as it was under Peter the Great.

 

@Bkk Brianalready posted one link attesting to this, here's another.

 

Putin’s history lecture reveals his dreams of a new Russian Empire

 

 

LOL. If he's attempting to reclaim all of Ukraine, he's not doing a very good job of it. If he just wants the eastern areas he already has, he's winning on that already. IMO it's simply a case of waiting for Zelensky to admit that sending more men to die is not going to change that and negotiating an end.

[thaibeachlovers]

16 hours ago, rabas said:

 

Soundbite propaganda.  No one wishes for never ending war. Most reasonable people wish that Russia (perhaps without despot Putin) could find better ways to work together with the rest of the world. Maybe not start the first war of territorial conquest since forever. 

 

Perhaps if the rest of the ( western ) world didn't try to move nukes up to the Russian border Putin wouldn't start any wars.

Russia's red line as stated long ago was Ukraine in NATO.

[Gweiloman]

16 hours ago, rabas said:

 

Soundbite propaganda.  No one wishes for never ending war. Most reasonable people wish that Russia (perhaps without despot Putin) could find better ways to work together with the rest of the world. Maybe not start the first war of territorial conquest since forever. 

 

No one wishes for never ending war? Let’s see..

 

No negotiations with Russia as long as Putin is President- can you think of a more stupid law apart from 90day report?

Peace summit without inviting the main protagonist, in reality the only party that can materially affect the course of the war

Further escalation by the west on a daily basis

 

I don’t see a single action by the west that makes any attempt to end this conflict. In fact, it seems to me that certain western powers are more than happy to keep the war going as it is extremely profitable business. Same same with trying to provoke a hot war in Asia. After all, it’s not as if their own citizens are dying, not that they would care anyway, apart from hurting their re-election chances.

[Gweiloman]

18 hours ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

This is a one sided debate though as I suspect your post will stand. I can show X videos of Ukrainian prisoners back in Ukraine reporting they were treated well and videos of Russian prisoners being mistreated by Ukrainains. But they will get deleted under the acceptable sources rule. So I won't. 

 

I want this war to stop and the brutality and suffering to stop with it , a war that Ukraine is losing and a war that is damaging the long term survival of the west whilst purporting to do the opposite. That's my line , period , that and the thought of an old man , me, sitting comfortably cheerleading a war far away where youing men are dying in their thousands just doesn't feel right. Sorry about that.

Those of us who are not biased and prejudiced look elsewhere for information regarding the causes of this conflict and the real situation on the battlefield. Anything that shows even remotely that Russia might be justified or that Russia might be gaining the upper hand is immediately labelled as propaganda or being an apologist and even being labelled as a communist by some less educated.

[jvs]

I see the putin groupies are up early.

I am posting this video just for you,enjoy!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1

[rabas]

3 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

and just what forum cut and past rules would those be? I just did a check and I was unable to locate any rule relating to cut and paste. Perhaps you meant something else, and if so please refer to the correct rule.

Sigh.

 

27. You will not post any copyrighted material except as fair use laws apply (as in the case of news articles). Only post a link, the headline and three sentences from the article. Content in the public domain is limited to the same restrictions.

[rabas]

3 hours ago, Gweiloman said:

No one wishes for never ending war? Let’s see..

 

No negotiations with Russia as long as Putin is President- can you think of a more stupid law apart from 90day report?

Peace summit without inviting the main protagonist, in reality the only party that can materially affect the course of the war

Further escalation by the west on a daily basis

 

I don’t see a single action by the west that makes any attempt to end this conflict. In fact, it seems to me that certain western powers are more than happy to keep the war going as it is extremely profitable business. Same same with trying to provoke a hot war in Asia. After all, it’s not as if their own citizens are dying, not that they would care anyway, apart from hurting their re-election chances.

Sigh.

 

"Peace summit without inviting the main protagonist, in reality the only party that can materially affect the course of the war"

 

Putin was "not invited" because he repeatedly and publicly refused to attend [reference- see section Russia]. It is now reported that he also demanded China not go. This was one of his 3 demands on his recent trip to Beijing. [reference].

 

So you mean Putin wishes never ending war?

 

Edited June 5 by rabas

[beautifulthailand99]

2 hours ago, rabas said:

Sigh.

 

"Peace summit without inviting the main protagonist, in reality the only party that can materially affect the course of the war"

 

Putin was "not invited" because he repeatedly and publicly refused to attend [reference- see section Russia]. It is now reported that he also demanded China not go. This was one of his 3 demands on his recent trip to Beijing. [reference].

 

So you mean Putin wishes never ending war?

 

The barroom lawyers and excessive rules are why I spend little time here. Context is everything in understanding the totality of the situation and since we can't do that what's the point of endlessly posting links from one side or the other. Putin is not Hitler and beyond the Russian dominated regions of Ukraine he has little appetite or ability to take more. Besides which he has nukes. The pushing of Russia into China's arms, which was never a given, will, in the annals of history be seen as the biggest foreign policy mistep of the 21st century and a further step on the road to the ruin of the west.

Edited June 5 by beautifulthailand99

[beautifulthailand99]

Betrayal , what betrayal ? Oh and shift the narrative to prep the ground for that betrayal. Putin has said he would prefer Biden to win the election and I beleive him - Trump is just too much of a wild card.

 

Mr Biden said: “I am not prepared to support the Nato-isation of Ukraine,” adding he had seen “significant corruption” in Ukraine when he visited as vice president.

 

Joe Biden has ruled out Ukraine joining Nato in the aftermath of a ceasefire with Russia in a major blow to Volodymyr Zelensky.

Ahead of Nato’s annual summit on July 9, the US president said Ukraine would have to rely on supplies of Western weapons to ward off a second Russian offensive.

Peace, he said, “doesn’t mean Nato.”

“It means we have a relationship with them like we do with other countries, where we supply weapons so they can defend themselves in future,” he told Time magazine.

 

https://archive.ph/0oRKa

Edited June 5 by beautifulthailand99

[beautifulthailand99]

https://kyivindependent.com/us-embassy-in-ukraine-men-with-dual-citizenship-will-no-longer-be-able-to-leave-the-country/

 

Here is the official U.S. Government statement saying it does not have enough influence:

 

"The U.S. Embassy is limited in our ability to influence Ukrainian law, including the application of martial law and the mobilization law to Ukrainian citizens. If you are in Ukraine and cannot leave the country, shelter in place and obey all local orders. If you are not currently in Ukraine, we strongly recommend against all travel to Ukraine by U.S. citizen males aged 18 to 60 who also have Ukrainian citizenship or a claim to Ukrainian citizenship and who do not wish to stay in Ukraine indefinitely. There is an extremely high risk you will not be allowed to depart, even with a U.S. passport."

 

[beautifulthailand99]

6 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

To the poster that gave that a laugh emoji- what is so funny about it? The meeting is a fact and "it" is likely to be discussed during the meeting. Do you just like posting laugh emojis on posts or are you < insert word(s) of choice >?

Just ignore them I do they are of no consequence. I would be ashamed to use one personally.

[transam]

4 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

Just ignore them I do they are of no consequence. I would be ashamed to use one personally.

You would, with the actual Red diatribe you post daily........................🤣