Does it annoy you when a Thai person doesn't understand your spoken Thai?

[BritManToo]

7 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Well, she let's me know if someone on YouTube speaks fluently, I think it is more to some foreigners ego and who did put down some effort to learn the language, and nobody tells him he do not speaks not fluently. 

 

If someone speaks fluently, why do they have to tell me? It is some of the first things foreigners say after how long they lives here, and I did not even ask 😁

If only I could understand your English!

[Hummin]

1 minute ago, BritManToo said:

If only I could understand your English!

Exactly, I never claimed I'm fluent 🙄

[Hummin]

2 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

If only I could understand your English!

But some claim they are fluent in Thai, and their ego is hurt when they feel misunderstood. I'm quite sure my English is better than most of those who think they are fluent in Thai 😁

[Gecko123]

13 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Well, she let's me know if someone on YouTube speaks fluently, I think it is more to some foreigners ego and who did put down some effort to learn the language, and nobody tells him he do not speaks not fluently. 

 

If someone speaks fluently, why do they have to tell me? It is some of the first things foreigners say after how long they lives here, and I did not even ask 😁

 

All of the posters who are clinging to the hypothesis that the root of the problem is that the non-native speaker's proficiency must not be that good still can't explain why the majority of his communication with Thais generally goes smoothly. It doesn't make sense to say someone who is generally able to communicate effectively, but occasionally encounters someone who struggles to understand them, must have a proficiency problem.

 

I remember a situation where a foreign guy's wife made a snide comment about having trouble understanding my Thai. I pointed out that just the day before I had had an hour long conversation with her parents and her sister, and I hadn't detected any comprehension problems. How do you explain that?

[Hummin]

1 minute ago, Gecko123 said:

 

All of the posters who are clinging to the hypothesis that the root of the problem is that the non-native speaker's proficiency isn't in fact that good, still can't explain why the majority of his communication with Thais generally goes smoothly. It doesn't make sense to say someone who is generally able to communicate effectively but occasionally encounters someone who struggles to understand them must have a proficiency problem.

 

I remember a situation where a foreign guy's wife made a snide comment about having trouble understanding my Thai. I pointed out that just the day before I had had an hour long conversation with her parents and her sister, and I hadn't detected any comprehension problems. So how do you explain that?

I'm sure most of times the staff around is not even Thai, so there some of the problems is explained, for the rest? Can't say, but if they understand some of what you say, they always pretend they understand to mot loose face or make you feel uncomfortable. 

 

 

[simon43]

11 minutes ago, Hummin said:

I'm sure most of times the staff around is not even Thai, so there some of the problems is explained, for the rest? Can't say, but if they understand some of what you say, they always pretend they understand to mot loose face or make you feel uncomfortable. 

 

 

Yes, that happens of course.  But in my 'test' in the hardware store, we engaged in conversation about my plans for this wire (making an antenna) - so the Thai man certainly wasn't bluffing.

 

Also, my post is nothing to do with boasting that I speak Thai. Posters who made these kind of comments have totally misunderstood the reasons for this thread.  It is to do with how the brain makes linguistic assumptions that can render understanding impossible, until the person 'clicks' that you are speaking Thai, not English.

[Hummin]

3 minutes ago, simon43 said:

Yes, that happens of course.  But in my 'test' in the hardware store, we engaged in conversation about my plans for this wire (making an antenna) - so the Thai man certainly wasn't bluffing.

 

Also, my post is nothing to do with boasting that I speak Thai. Posters who made these kind of comments have totally misunderstood the reasons for this thread.  It is to do with how the brain makes linguistic assumptions that can render understanding impossible, until the person 'clicks' that you are speaking Thai, not English.

I understand, that's quite normal, and I do often as well when Americans try to speak Norwegian when in Norway. Mostly because of the dialect, and very rear they speak fluently even after many years if even ever living in Norway. Thai is harder to learn, so I can only imagine how some foreigners sounds for an native. 

 

But I do not doubt some of you guys speaking well enough Thai to get understood.

[jayboy]

1 hour ago, Gecko123 said:

The point I was making is that just because a native speaker fails to understand you or another non-native speaker does not automatically reflect poorly on their proficiency level, and anyone - including you - had they achieved a high degree of proficiency would have experienced this phenomena, and the fact that they - and you and jay boy - don't realize this tells me that it highly likely that your proficiency in the language isn't that high.

 

My level of proficiency in Thai is irrelevant and in any case from the forum's point of view is unknowable - as is yours.Your rather tortuously expressed, and if I may say rather commonplace point is regularly heard from foreigners, often though not always with an execrable level of Thai. For those genuinely interested I would recommend turning to Stuart Jay Raj who is illuminating in the subject.

[daveAustin]

6 hours ago, Lacessit said:

When you've got a language where the word for knee, rice and the color white all sound the same.....there are dozens of examples like that.

... and enter, he/she/they.

 

Some will just brain freeze, as said, and almost don't want to understand. Bit naff at a hotel reception though, but she probably very rarely hears a farang speaking Thai in a place like Lanta. If op sat down with her and she got her head around it, she'd have clicked. Doing the 'do you speak Thai?' to a Thai when they do the above is very satisfying though. 😋 

[Gecko123]

5 hours ago, jayboy said:

 

My level of proficiency in Thai is irrelevant and in any case from the forum's point of view is unknowable - as is yours.Your rather tortuously expressed, and if I may say rather commonplace point is regularly heard from foreigners, often though not always with an execrable level of Thai. For those genuinely interested I would recommend turning to Stuart Jay Raj who is illuminating in the subject.

 

You may find this hard to believe but I would be willing to bet that if Stuart Jay Raj started jabbering away in Thai to a total stranger that he could easily experience the same 'brain freeze' reaction that the OP and others have reported experiencing. As I said earlier, if your proficiency was anything approaching advanced level, you would have experienced this for yourself and know how common it is, and wouldn't be so quick to dismiss this frustrating experience as a lack of proficiency on the part of the non-native speaker.

[stoner]

7 hours ago, Gecko123 said:

Asking someone if someone speaks Thai is a perfectly legitimate question. Someone can look Thai, perhaps even be Thai, and not speak the language.

 

example.

 

my stepson. full thai. born in bkk. left thailand at 9 years old for canada. when we lived in canada we never spoke thai in the house. only english. moved back to thailand in 2019 and he had to start learning thai all over again. lived in canada for over 10 years so he lost it all pretty much. 

 

he has a canadian accent now and is very quickly learning thai again.... but when he first went back no one understood his attempts at speaking thai. 

[richard_smith237]

9 hours ago, simon43 said:

I'm sure that there are many foreigners who think that their Thai language abilities are better than they really are.  However, I'm pretty sure that my Thai is very good, as demonstrated by the 99.99% of Thais who have no problem to understand me immediately when I speak Thai 🙂

 

What is also clear is that you do not understand my very dry, very British SoH!

A number of facets at play:

- Eyes don’t believe the ears

- Other party is not Thai

- The foreigners Thai is too rubbish

 

In many cases I’ve had the issue of the other party not identifying that I’m speaking Thai in the first place & just get a blank stare, only to have someone behind me tell the shop assistant whatever that I’m speaking Thai - from then on it’s easy.

But, it often highlights the issue of ‘intelligence of the listener’.

 

I’ve also often even caught out trying to speak Thai to waiter / waitress who’s a migrant worker & doesn’t speak Thai do well & struggles to understand, so its better to speak English.

 

Then there are times when I’m missing a ‘key word’ I.e. looking for an item in HomePro etc…  (transliterating “bum-gun” raises a few eyebrows!).

 

Ultimately, no - I never get annoyed if someone doesn’t understand my Thai as I often see the same issue with my Wife’s (central) Thai not being understood & often waiting staff will just get the wrong order anyway, not because of poor understanding but because they are not paying attention! 

[susanlea]

Yes. Only happens 10% of the time. Sometimes I speak too fast. Country people speak slow.

[jayboy]

1 hour ago, Gecko123 said:

 

You may find this hard to believe but I would be willing to bet that if Stuart Jay Raj started jabbering away in Thai to a total stranger that he could easily experience the same 'brain freeze' reaction that the OP and others have reported experiencing. As I said earlier, if your proficiency was anything approaching advanced level, you would have experienced this for yourself and know how common it is, and wouldn't be so quick to dismiss this frustrating experience as a lack of proficiency on the part of the non-native speaker.

 

Another irrelevant reference to my proficiency of which you are by definition ignorant and which in any case is irrelevant.Perhaps you have had personal experience of experiencing baffled expressions when you attempt Thai with a native speaker, just speculation but I seem to have touched a nerve.I of course agree there are some occasions when even a proficient foreign Thai speaker finds the interlocutor discombobulated - as touched on with examples previously.But general speaking, it's a reasonable assumption that foreigners who complain Thais don't understand their version of Thai - just don't have the facility they assume.

[Denim]

Never mind Simon. Don't take it so hard. Even Thais get confused sometimes.

 

 

[watthong]

 

deleted

[BangkokReady]

8 hours ago, Gecko123 said:

All of the posters who are clinging to the hypothesis that the root of the problem is that the non-native speaker's proficiency must not be that good still can't explain why the majority of his communication with Thais generally goes smoothly. It doesn't make sense to say someone who is generally able to communicate effectively, but occasionally encounters someone who struggles to understand them, must have a proficiency problem.

 

They want him to be bad at Thai, because then they get to put him down and feel better about themselves.

[JeffersLos]

Yes, I was banned from the local language center for throwing the textbook (which I suspect was an illegal photocopy) at the teacher when they didn't understand me.

 

[watthong]

7 hours ago, Hummin said:

Thai is harder to learn, so I can only imagine how some foreigners sounds for an native. 

 

As I have mentioned before. The native could hear foreign right away the moment the first (non-native) sound reaches their (native) ear. So being fluent per non-native  standard doesn't always guarantee a smooth transaction. And when that happens the annoyance that happened happens first to the listener, something along the line "wtf this guy is saying?" - which then produces the second annoyance on the part of the (non-native) speaker as the (native) listener reacted accordingly to his/her own annoyance. 

 

OP should ask who ought to be annoyed first, but it seems that what the native might be feeling was not in his consideration. Sad to say, a behavior quite prevalent among expats.

[watthong]

14 minutes ago, BangkokReady said:

 

They want him to be bad at Thai, because then they get to put him down and feel better about themselves.

 

Judgemental seems to be the tool of your trade...Even in a topic as neutral as this. Something not quite right in your childhood?

[Utalk2mutt]

Have lived here for just over 7 years and I speak reasonable Thai. I could live here another 20 years and genuinely don’t think I would ever class myself as being fluent. I’m happy so long as I can make myself understood some of the time. I have found there are Thais who just don’t want to engage or maybe it’s my mispronounciation which causes the issue. Whatever it is I don’t get mad about it. 

[MalcolmB]

8 hours ago, Gecko123 said:

All of the posters who are clinging to the hypothesis that the root of the problem is that the non-native speaker's proficiency must not be that good still can't explain why the majority of his communication with Thais generally goes smoothly.

OP definitely can read write, read and speak Thai well.

 

Many Thais don’t understand each other. Different areas have different slang, accents etc etc 

Put a country bumpkin from the Deep South with someone from Issan and many wouldn’t understand each other.

 

Some can not understand Simon. He might speak too well for some of the more simpler Thais.

[Hummin]

Interesting question! Ever had a conversation with another foreigner speaking Thai? And how was that experience?

[Hummin]

Just now, MalcolmB said:

OP definitely can read write, read and speak Thai well.

 

Many Thais don’t understand each other. Different areas have different slang, accents etc etc 

Put a country bumpkin from the Deep South with someone from Issan and many wouldn’t understand each other.

 

Some can not understand Simon. He might speak too well for some of the more simpler Thais.

Sorry to say, Thai wherever they come from speaks Thai without slang or dialects, at least those who are 60 years and younger. 

[vangrop]

The problem I encountered communicating with Thais is a total lack of logic thinking skills. When you are in a conversation with a Thai talking about some understood topic and you have to fill in a word in Thai language mostly they won't understand you. If you don't pronounce the word exactly how they would say it, they are lost. They are unable to transpose themselves in the context of the topic so that even if you don't pronounce it perfectly they would get the meaning by logic deduction.

[GammaGlobulin]

13 hours ago, simon43 said:

I'm not talking about 'pidgin' Thai.  This is a question for those of us who can speak Thai to a high level.

 

I just had one of those experiences, at a hotel on Koh Lanta.  I wandered in and asked if they had any available rooms and what the price was.  The reception lady looked at me completely blank.  I repeated my request and got the same response.  I therefore said in slowly-spoken English 'Do you speak Thai?'.  (Actually, I was 99% sure that the woman was Thai, and this was my way of winding her up!).  Yes, there are many Burmese working in Thailand, but I was pretty sure that she was Thai.

 

Anyway, the only way to complete my transaction was in English... 

 

The point being, I'm pretty sure that she didn't understand my spoken Thai was because her brain didn't expect a western foreigner to speak Thai. The hotel had many Swedish tourists and I'm sure the poor lady was trying to decipher my utterances as some form of English spoken with a thick Swedish accent!

 

 

 

After all your years in Burma/Laos/Wherever, are you sure that you speak passa Thai?

Maybe you only think you do.

Have you ever been tested?

 

I'm just trying to eliminate potential hypotheses which could explain your observations at the hotel.

 

 

[GammaGlobulin]

7 minutes ago, vangrop said:

The problem I encountered communicating with Thais is a total lack of logic thinking skills.

 

I agree.

Often it is just a matter of logic that is beyond the ken of some, and not a language issue, per se.

 

[GammaGlobulin]

29 minutes ago, Utalk2mutt said:

Have lived here for just over 7 years and I speak reasonable Thai. I could live here another 20 years and genuinely don’t think I would ever class myself as being fluent. I’m happy so long as I can make myself understood some of the time. I have found there are Thais who just don’t want to engage or maybe it’s my mispronounciation which causes the issue. Whatever it is I don’t get mad about it. 

 

I never get mad at anyone who is unable to understand my passa Thai.

 

What I do is to just revert to speaking English.

 

But, instead of speaking completely standard English, I just speak Pig Latin.

 

Most Thai people at hotels have rarely heard Americans speaking Pig Latin.

 

Pig Latin sounds like English, and they think they are actually hearing English sounds....

 

But, it's English with a TWIST.

 

 

 

 

[123Stodg]

7 minutes ago, GammaGlobulin said:

 

I never get mad at anyone who is unable to understand my passa Thai.

 

What I do is to just revert to speaking English.

 

But, instead of speaking completely standard English, I just speak Pig Latin.

 

Most Thai people at hotels have rarely heard Americans speaking Pig Latin.

 

Pig Latin sounds like English, and they think they are actually hearing English sounds....

 

But, it's English with a TWIST.

 

 

 

 

How pathetic, disrespectful, and impolite is that? I hope they throw you out when you do that. Farang Key Nok!

[FritsSikkink]

13 hours ago, simon43 said:

Perhaps 'annoy' is a tad too strong, but it does give me an opportunity to demonstrate my warped sense of British humour by slowly saying "Do you speak Thai?".  Perhaps I can rub it in next time by slowly saying "Are you from Burma"?  🙂

Or maybe you should become aware that in every country people use different accents on different locations.

Maybe your Thai isn't as good as you think?