Suspect in Southport Murders Charged with Terror Offences and Producing Ricin

[Chomper Higgot]

3 hours ago, mokwit said:

The information wasn't available because it was deliberately withheld.

 An you please provide evidence that the information was deliberately withheld.

[proton]

Just now, Chomper Higgot said:

Again what lies did I spread.

 

Let’s see you provide facts available at the time that contradicted my posts.

 

 

The lie of no motivation 

[Chomper Higgot]

Just now, proton said:

 

The lie of no motivation 

What lie of ‘no motivation’?

[JonnyF]

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Again what lies did I spread.

 

Let’s see you provide facts available at the time that contradicted my posts.

 

 

Just apologize for goodness sake. 

 

Your attempts to wriggle out of it are pathetic. 

[Chomper Higgot]

Just now, JonnyF said:

 

Just apologize for goodness sake. 

 

Your attempts to wriggle out of it are pathetic. 

You need to first tell me what I should apologise for. 
 

If you want to alleged I lied or spread misinformation then the onus on you is to demonstrate the truth of your allegation.

 

So let’s have your evidence.

[Bday Prang]

3 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

 

It's absolutely shocking. I really don't know how he can survive this politically. Surely there are some people within the Labour Party with an ounce of decency to start the process to remove him? 

 

Johnson was removed for Partygate for goodness sake. This is several levels beyond that. That's without the whole scandal over hundreds of thousands of pounds worth of gifts. The freezing of pensioners etc. And all of it within a few months. Unreal.  

Sadly the only way he will be removed is if the media gets on the case, there is no incentive for change otherwise, at least not with years to go till the next election.  Johnsons removal over party gate  only came after a long and intense media campaign against him    I very much doubt there is anybody "decent" in the whole party

[Bday Prang]

3 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

An you please provide evidence that the information was deliberately withheld

Well it would be somewhat strange for any  information to be withheld "accidentally " by a government 

[JonnyF]

2 minutes ago, Bday Prang said:

Sadly the only way he will be removed is if the media gets on the case, there is no incentive for change otherwise, at least not with years to go till the next election.  Johnsons removal over party gate  only came after a long and intense media campaign against him    I very much doubt there is anybody "decent" in the whole party

 

The only decent ones already resigned.

 

What a disgrace Labour have become. 

[JonnyF]

3 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

You need to first tell me what I should apologise for. 

 

For repeating/spreading the lies and misinformation that was provided to you by your hero Starmer.

 

I guess you thought the truth would never come out.

 

Didn't work out too well, did it?

[Chomper Higgot]

6 minutes ago, proton said:

 

No motivation? making lethal poison , downloading a terrorist manual and slaughtering the kuffar, are you serious? It's called jihad, inspired by the hate in the Quran and the violent example of the fake Prophet who said 'I was victorious by terror'  What do you expect a written admission? Coming up will be the usual excuses of mental issues and not a real muslim.

You don’t seem to understand the difference between acts committed and motivation for committing those acts.

 

The police have given statements on acts committed, they have given no indication of the motivation for those acts.

https://www.merseyside.police.uk/news/merseyside/news/2024/october/statement-from-chief-constable-serena-kennedy-and-partners-following-further-charges-for-axel-rudakubana/

 

[Chomper Higgot]

1 minute ago, JonnyF said:

 

For repeating/spreading the lies and misinformation that was provided to you by your hero Starmer.

 

I guess you thought the truth would never come out.

 

Didn't work out too well, did it?

Again you repeat your allegation of lying, but provide zero evidence to back your allegation.

 

I suggest you come up with some evidence.

 

[Chomper Higgot]

4 minutes ago, Bday Prang said:

Well it would be somewhat strange for any  information to be withheld "accidentally " by a government 

Then how about proving evidence that it was deliberately withheld.

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

11 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

 

Just apologize for goodness sake. 

 

Your attempts to wriggle out of it are pathetic. 

Post your evidence of me lying Jonny lets see what you’ve got.

 

Or is this wriggling thing you refer to projection on your part?

[proton]

4 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

No motivation has been given.

 

No motivation needs to be given, it's glaringly obvious to all but terrorist apologists, liars and government and Police spokespeople wanting to cover it up. The motivation is jihad, fulled by the hate in the Quran for unbeliever's and the violent killer called Muhammad.

[Chomper Higgot]

3 minutes ago, proton said:

 

No motivation needs to be given, it's glaringly obvious to all but terrorist apologists, liars and government and Police spokespeople wanting to cover it up. The motivation is jihad, fulled by the hate in the Quran for unbeliever's and the violent killer called Muhammad.

So no motive has been given, the police have cautioned against speculating on the motive but you think you know the motive and rant at me for pointing out you do not.

 

Fact Proton, no motive had been confirmed.

Edited October 30 by Chomper Higgot

[John Drake]

21 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

 

It's absolutely shocking. I really don't know how he can survive this politically. Surely there are some people within the Labour Party with an ounce of decency to start the process to remove him? 

 

Johnson was removed for Partygate for goodness sake. This is several levels beyond that. That's without the whole scandal over hundreds of thousands of pounds worth of gifts. The freezing of pensioners etc. And all of it within a few months. Unreal.  

 

It seems to me, looking from afar, that you folks have even bigger problems than Starmer. This jailing of political opponents couldn't have happened unless you had willing judges eager to act like Roland Freisler and a compliant police force busy applying laws to native peoples differently than to their colonizers based solely on political interests.

[Bday Prang]

20 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

What a disgrace Labour have become

They have always been a disgrace,  

[proton]

8 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

So no motive has been given, the police have cautioned against speculating on the motive but you think you know the motive and rant at me for pointing out you do not.

 

Fact Proton, no motive had been confirmed.

 

Which means they just don't want to admit it, there is no need to confirm, it's obvious, fact.

[mokwit]

37 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

 An you please provide evidence that the information was deliberately withheld.

It has been 3 months now, and they only comes out with the charges after they moved the court date until after the London patriots march, or did the police only find this evidence yesterday.

 

What are you expecting? That the Home Office has a web page I can link to  saying they deliberately withheld this information? Laughable.

 

They released his name even though he was underage IMO in the hope that a non muslim name would allay fears that this was a jihadist attack, so why wouldn't they withhold the information that it was. In circumstances like this you have to use judgement and my judgement is that it was deliberately withheld.

 

BTW Chomper I misremembered something last time - the ISIS magazine gives the instruction that POST pubescent children are acceptable terrorist targets, they state that very young children (and women) are to be taken as slaves. Sorry, I mixed up murdering pre pubescent with post pubescent. my bad.

Edited October 30 by mokwit

[Chomper Higgot]

Just now, mokwit said:

It has been 3 months now, and they only comes out with the charges after they moved the court date until after the London patriots march, or did the police only find this evidence yesterday.

 

What are you expecting? That the Home Office has a web page I can link to  saying they deliberately withheld this information? Laughable.

 

They released his name even though he was underage IMO in the hope that a non muslim name would allay fears that this was a jihadist attack, so why wouldn't they withhold the information that it was. In circumstances like this you have to use judgement and my judgement is that it was deliberately withheld.

What are you expecting, minute by minute reports?

 

You join others in making allegations for which you provide zero evidence, your judgement is without basis.

 

I recommend you read the actual police statement in its entirety:

 

https://www.merseyside.police.uk/news/merseyside/news/2024/october/statement-from-chief-constable-serena-kennedy-and-partners-following-further-charges-for-axel-rudakubana/

 

 

[Bday Prang]

22 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

So no motive has been given, the police have cautioned against speculating on the motive but you think you know the motive and rant at me for pointing out you do not.

 

Fact Proton, no motive had been confirmed.

well now that a few more details have been released regarding his motivation and activities, would you like to take this opportunity to condemn the actions of this Islamic  fundamentalist nutter ?  I think it would be appropriate.  don't you?

[JonnyF]

26 minutes ago, John Drake said:

It seems to me, looking from afar, that you folks have even bigger problems than Starmer.

 

True.

 

We also have Sadiq Khan, Angela Rayner, Yvette Cooper and Lammy.

 

There is a theme that runs through them.  

[Bday Prang]

2 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

What are you expecting, minute by minute reports?

 

You join others in making allegations for which you provide zero evidence, your judgement is without basis.

 

I recommend you read the actual police statement in its entirety:

 

https://www.merseyside.police.uk/news/merseyside/news/2024/october/statement-from-chief-constable-serena-kennedy-and-partners-following-further-charges-for-axel-rudakubana/

 

 

from your link....

""We have been given extensive guidance by the CPS in relation to what we can say publicly to ensure the integrity of the court proceedings are protected, and therefore we are restricted in what we can share with you now, whilst the proceedings are live."

 

and who tells the CPS what to do ?   Two tier himself, who else

 

“We would strongly advise caution against anyone speculating as to motivation in this case. The criminal proceedings against Axel Rudakubana are live and he has a right to a fair trial.

 

he killed 3 kids, or is that in dispute now ?  thats enough to put him inside for life, 

 

don’t believe everything you read on social media.

or indeed anything the authorities may tell you as and when they feel fit

 

The criminal proceedings against Axel Rudakubana are live and he has a right to a fair trial

 

he lost any rights when he was caught red handed stabbing children in my opinion, in America he would have been shot dead there and then

 

I read the entire statement , can't say I was particularly impressed

[James105]

41 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

So no motive has been given, the police have cautioned against speculating on the motive but you think you know the motive and rant at me for pointing out you do not.

 

Fact Proton, no motive had been confirmed.

 

This whatsapp message was doing the rounds shortly after the attack.  It sounded plausible at the time but with all the misinformation being spread by Starmer, the home secretary, the police and people like you it was largely ignored.  I have little doubt in my mind (especially after the recent revelations) that it is most likely credible.  It's certainly more plausible than he was a Christian with mental problems now that they have reluctantly revealed (part of) the truth isn't it?   

 

 

[mokwit]

'.....What we do know, from bitter experience, is that any crime which may or may not turn out to have an Islamist or jihadist component is treated with extreme defensiveness and secrecy by the police, government, security services and Left-wing commentators.
The pattern goes something like this:

a. Suppress information on the identity and ethnicity of the suspect (most likely revealed by the media).

b. Criticise perfectly understandable public speculation and anger about the alleged attacker.

c. Deny the attack is related to terrorism. Also deny the alleged attacker was ever on the radar of the security services.

d. Once alleged attacker’s identity is revealed, release sweet, angelic childhood photo. Also emphasise good character of alleged attacker – he wanted to be an architect, helped old ladies cross the road, neighbours said what a lovely chap, etc - and don’t mention any previous criminal record or negative comments.

e. Police issue stern warning about online “misinformation”. Narrative shifts as fast as possible to disgusting “hate speech” on social media and away from truly disgusting killings.

f. Prominent Left-wing commentators fret about “disinformation” and “Islamophobia” and don’t mention names of victims who are quickly forgotten.

g. Politicians avoid awkward conversations about failures of multiculturalism, mass immigration and lack of integration and suggest the solution may be more online censorship. (After the murder of Sir David Amess, MPs in the Commons actually said the lesson of his killing by a young, knife-wielding jihadist was that politicians needed to be nicer to each other. Yes, really.)

h. Public encouraged to participate in touching displays of peaceful commemoration and reconciliation. (Don’t Look Back in Anger is what crowds sang after the mass murder of young people and their parents by a suicide bomber at an Ariana Grande concert at Manchester Arena.)

i. Cancel all of the above if attacker turns out to be far-Right and white. Phew! Huge relief all round.

j. News cycle moves on past horrific crime and postpones any further discussion of the causes until a trial and/or public inquiry makes such embarrassing disclosures hard to avoid.'

....

'Tory leadership contender Robert Jenrick issued a hard-hitting video on Tuesday saying that, while the legal process needs to be respected, he was seriously concerned that the facts may have been withheld from the public. “The Government and authorities told us for months that they were not treating this as a terrorist incident,” Jenrick said. “This atrocity was of immense public concern. The public had the right to know the truth right away. Any suggestion of a cover-up will permanently damage trust in whether we are being told the truth about crime in our country.”

He called on Keir Starmer to urgently reveal to the country what he knew about the Southport attack and when. “Across the board, the hard reality of mass migration is being covered up. The public can see with their own eyes that they are being gaslit by the liberal elite.” '

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/10/29/the-southport-child-victims-deserve-better/

 

Edited October 30 by mokwit

[brewsterbudgen]

Shameful of Jenrick to play party politics with a tragedy.  

[mokwit]

5 minutes ago, brewsterbudgen said:

Shameful of Jenrick to play party politics with a tragedy.  

Rubbish. The Government has to give an explanation. Everybody should be demanding it from them. People are sick and tired of the withholding and misrepresentation of information with a political agenda.

[James105]

1 minute ago, brewsterbudgen said:

Shameful of Jenrick to play party politics with a tragedy.  

 

So the fact that Starmer lied to the public and in doing so incited more civil unrest,  the fact the government and police covered up the true nature of this crime and accused others of misinformation when they were saying facts, the fact that ricin was found in his home and it appears nothing was done to address the safety of the neighbourhood, the fact that people are in jail right now for crimes that would not have been crimes had the truth been revealed immediately.   All of that and your hot take is to accuse Jenrick of playing politics instead of lambasting Starmer for his lies?   

 

If your comment was parody (which I actually assume it must be) then I take the above back and would say your comment was amusing.   

[Chomper Higgot]

21 minutes ago, Bday Prang said:

well now that a few more details have been released regarding his motivation and activities, would you like to take this opportunity to condemn the actions of this Islamic  fundamentalist nutter ?  I think it would be appropriate.  don't you?

No details have been released regarding his motivation.

 

The police have cautioned against speculating on the matter.

 

Not only do I condemn the piece filth that committed these heinous crimes, I want to see him tried, found guilty and rot in prison for the rest of his putrid life.

 

But I also understand that the best way to ensure his trial is beyond any successful appeal is to follow the advice the police are giving and not engage in speculation and spreading online rumors.

 

 

 

 

[Kinnock]

32 minutes ago, James105 said:

 

This whatsapp message was doing the rounds shortly after the attack.  It sounded plausible at the time but with all the misinformation being spread by Starmer, the home secretary, the police and people like you it was largely ignored.  I have little doubt in my mind (especially after the recent revelations) that it is most likely credible.  It's certainly more plausible than he was a Christian with mental problems now that they have reluctantly revealed (part of) the truth isn't it?   

 

 

Looks like UK has a 1984 style propaganda department.  And the official 'Newspeak' language will replace words like 'Islamic terrorist' or 'radicalised' with 'mentally ill' and 'abused'.

 

"Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered".