Minimum level of Thai knowledge and language for long term residents

[PomPolo]

I am on a roll with starting controversial posts at the moment so thought I would keep up the momentum.

When I took my first wife (now divorced) back to the UK many years ago we obviously had to jump through many visa hoops and it was all kisses and roses until it went south.

To get her residency in the UK she had to learn English better than she actually spoke, luckily I spoke a reasonable amount of Thai so communication between us was never an issue.

In the UK in order to get residency (quite easy for us xpats in Thailand with a non-O, money in the bank and more than 180 days a year in the country) foreign nationals are required to take what is called a 'Life in the UK' test which means they need to know a lot about the country they are going to live in and a very reasonable grasp on the English language.

Do you think as guests in this country we should have to go through something similar or are the UK just too strict? For example show a level of proficiency in Thai language not necessarily read it or speak fluently that is difficult but be able to answer historical questions about the country that hosts us?

Anyone from the US or any other countries is there similar restrictions on Visas regarding foreign Thai nationals with regards to your home countries history and language awareness?  Without talking too much about Donald Trump!

I am thinking about doing it a second time taking a lady I love back to the UK, I will get the sarcasm out of the way before the replies I know I will never learn

EDITED TOPIC POST:
When I said for a foreigner living in Thailand, I didn't mean residency I just meant very long term renewable visa i.e. Non O etc. @OneMoreFarang good spot slightly alters the context of the topic I guess but still applicable I think
🙂

[OneMoreFarang]

As far as I know to get residency in Thailand people have to work here for at least 3 years in the same company, and some other condition. I don't know the details about married people.

 

If someone lives here for years, then he obviously survived here for years. In some areas and jobs people don't need Thai language skills, because enough Thais speak English. In other areas people have to learn Thai. And I experienced a few people who could speak Thai very well because they had no other option.

 

I think it's good to know Thai in Thailand. But in some areas, it is not necessary because enough people speak English.

Now looking at the UK, if immigrants don't speak English, how do they communicate? In Thai?

[PomPolo]

3 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

As far as I know to get residency in Thailand people have to work here for at least 3 years in the same company, and some other condition. I don't know the details about married people.

 

If someone lives here for years, then he obviously survived here for years. In some areas and jobs people don't need Thai language skills, because enough Thais speak English. In other areas people have to learn Thai. And I experienced a few people who could speak Thai very well because they had no other option.

 

I think it's good to know Thai in Thailand. But in some areas, it is not necessary because enough people speak English.

Now looking at the UK, if immigrants don't speak English, how do they communicate? In Thai?

Apologies @OneMoreFarang when I said residency in Thailand I probably didn't phrase that correctly I should have said long term visa status.

[OneMoreFarang]

Just now, PomPolo said:

Apologies @OneMoreFarang when I said residency in Thailand I probably didn't phrase that correctly I should have said long term visa status.

 

That sounds similar to me.

IMHO most people learn what they have to learn. Some learn even more.

My Thai is good enough to tell a taxi driver where to go. And I can order food, ask for the way, and things like that.

My Thai is not good enough to have a business conversation in Thai or to listen to Thai TV.

And all of this is because what I need. I need basic Thai to be able to get around and eat.

I don't need business Thai because people who I do business with speak better English than I speak Thai.

Some people need more language skills, some less. It depends. 

[NickyLouie]

If you have lived here 10 years and cant speak adequate Thai, you're dumb AF.

 

 

 

[simon43]

If our attitude is that we should not learn Thai, then why should immigrants to the UK learn English?

 

I speak/read Thai to a good level because I consider it 'good manners' to speak the language (at least to conversational level) of the country that one lives in.  So I speak/read Thai, speak/read Lao and speak/read Burmese, with Thai being my most fluent language because that's the country that I've resided in for the longest time.

 

[PomPolo]

1 minute ago, simon43 said:

If our attitude is that we should not learn Thai, then why should immigrants to the UK learn English?

 

I speak/read Thai to a good level because I consider it 'good manners' to speak the language (at least to conversational level) of the country that one lives in.  So I speak/read Thai, speak/read Lao and speak/read Burmese, with Thai being my most fluent language because that's the country that I've resided in for the longest time.

 

Hear you on that one - same as me but all UK immigrants seem to know is I don't have a passport I am 15 years old (even though I am 40) and my boat is sinking so please pass me on to Social Services give me food, money, a house and regular handouts as its OK PomPolo has paid his taxes for 30 years so that should cover it

[KannikaP]

15 minutes ago, NickyLouie said:

If you have lived here 10 years and cant speak adequate Thai, you're dumb AF.

 

 

 

It can't be that difficult, my 3 year old grandson can speak and understand very well!

[PomPolo]

36 minutes ago, NickyLouie said:

If you have lived here 10 years and cant speak adequate Thai, you're dumb AF.

 

 

 

 

20 minutes ago, KannikaP said:

It can't be that difficult, my 3 year old grandson can speak and understand very well!

Hahaha very true both, the only reason I started learning Thai was when my x wife was talking about my money to her family and I didn't have a clue what they were on about.

So the first thing I learned were the numbers and I can count from nueng to lan now , that saved me a few quid 🙂

[Gottfrid]

46 minutes ago, NickyLouie said:

If you have lived here 10 years and cant speak adequate Thai, you're dumb AF.

 

 

 

Yeah, you gave a sorry, but not at all necessary. You are 100% right! It´s really dumb to relocate to other country and culture, and not care about learning the language. it´s ignorant beyond belief!

[KannikaP]

7 minutes ago, PomPolo said:

 

Hahaha very true both, the only reason I started learning Thai was when my x wife was talking about my money to her family and I didn't have a clue what they were on about.

So the first thing I learned were the numbers and I can count from nueng to lan now , that saved me a few quid 🙂

My little un was heard to say What the 4..k yesterday when a tree was felled.

His English is coming on very well.

[jayboy]

42 minutes ago, NickyLouie said:

If you have lived here 10 years and cant speak adequate Thai, you're dumb AF.

 

 

 

 

Sounds plausible but on scrutiny isn't really true.Bill Heinecke's Thai language capability is rudimentary (though in interviews he claims to be fluent.) He really isn't, and he's one of the smartest people around.

[PomPolo]

1 minute ago, KannikaP said:

My little un was heard to say What the 4..k yesterday when a tree was felled.

His English is coming on very well.

Hahaha classic, I took the misses family to a resort over the new year and said exactly the same and the availability of mobile phones her daughter, niece and nephew translated it!!!
I am not even allowed to say what the hell now!
Was hoping none of the babies had have gone back to school and said this farang said 'what the 4..k' 🙂

[sungod]

1 hour ago, NickyLouie said:

If you have lived here 10 years and cant speak adequate Thai, you're dumb AF.

 

 

 

 Or ignorant AF

[Ben Zioner]

I think Thailand would have everything to gain by establishing English as an alternative official language. Therefore applicants for long term visa should have a good command of either one or the other.

 

I find it amusing to read that French posters on a Income Tax Facebook group are having issues in filling in an English tax form.

[OneMoreFarang]

I understand why some people don't learn Thai.

I knew and know a couple of managers in a luxury hotel in Bangkok. They have those jobs for a few years and then they move to another country with another language. And they work and live in an environment where almost everybody speaks English.

They don't need Thai.

 

That doesn't mean that maybe it would be nice if they would learn a little Thai. But realistically, if you never use it, why learn it?

[OneMoreFarang]

15 minutes ago, Ben Zioner said:

I think Thailand would have everything to gain by establishing English as an alternative official language. Therefore applicants for long term visa should have a good command of either one or the other.

 

I find it amusing to read that French posters on a Income Tax Facebook group are having issues in filling in an English tax form.

And would you expect that all officials in Thailand would be perfect in reading, writing and talking in English? When +90% of their work is with Thais and in Thai language?

And then all documents would have to be in Thai and English and all that. Lots of work for what? A few farangs?

And if they have a second language why not Mandarin Chinese?

[Ben Zioner]

Just now, OneMoreFarang said:

And would you expect that all officials in Thailand would be perfect in reading, writing and talking in English? When +90% of their work is with Thais and in Thai language?

And then all documents would have to be in Thai and English and all that. Lots of work for what? A few farangs?

And if they have a second language why not Mandarin Chinese?

Once more, Malaysia is the shining light. 

[OneMoreFarang]

1 minute ago, Ben Zioner said:

Once more, Malaysia is the shining light. 

 

From www.perplexity.ai

 

As of recent estimates, approximately 200,000 Western expatriates reside in Malaysia, primarily concentrated in Kuala Lumpur.

Thailand hosts a larger expatriate community, with estimates indicating around over 400,000 Western foreigners living in the country.

[MalcolmB]

It would mean that the quality of the average expat would rise and it would be better for the Thais also.

Bring it on. 

[MangoKorat]

2 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

As far as I know to get residency in Thailand people have to work here for at least 3 years in the same company, and some other condition. I don't know the details about married people.

There is another very important component of the application - a large 'donation'. Two of my mates gave up when they were told that an envelope containing at least 100,000 baht in addtion to the other fees would be needed for the application path to be a smooth one.

[MangoKorat]

16 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

And if they have a second language why not Mandarin Chinese?

Because English is the international language.

[ukrules]

1 hour ago, simon43 said:

If our attitude is that we should not learn Thai, then why should immigrants to the UK learn English?

 

Indeed, nobody cares. But if you want a passport then it's much the same in both countries.

Having to speak the lingo for a long term visa is nonsense - the reason those visas are available is because they want to allow people into the country - not find reasons to prevent them coming 🙄

[PomPolo]

1 minute ago, MangoKorat said:

Because English is the international language.

This is true with the caveat I watched one of those Mayday air-crash investigation documentaries last night where the pilot couldn't speak English so relied on his first officer to translate they were trying land and got put in a holding pattern and crashed after they ran out of fuel.  Air Transat if anyone has 50 minutes to waste 🙂

 

[NoDisplayName]

2 hours ago, PomPolo said:

Apologies @OneMoreFarang when I said residency in Thailand I probably didn't phrase that correctly I should have said long term visa status.

 

I consider my non-O (for retirement) nothing but an annual tourist visa.

 

Accordingly, I don't bother learning the language.  On a good day, I can recite 6 of the numerals in Thai.  As to writing, I can draw a fishhook.  The End.

 

If the locals want to speak with me, they can speak English.  Or German.  Or Mandarin.

[PomPolo]

1 minute ago, NoDisplayName said:

 

I consider my non-O (for retirement) nothing but an annual tourist visa.

 

Accordingly, I don't bother learning the language.  On a good day, I can recite 6 of the numerals in Thai.  As to writing, I can draw a fishhook.  The End.

 

If the locals want to speak with me, they can speak English.  Or German.  Or Mandarin.

You are way ahead of me on the numerals and mandarin 🙂 German I could maybe keep up with a little bit mostly on numbers but only from school knowledge!
Annual tourist Visa you took the words right out of my mouth 🙂

[LosLobo]

41 minutes ago, Ben Zioner said:

I think Thailand would have everything to gain by establishing English as an alternative official language. Therefore applicants for long term visa should have a good command of either one or the other.

 

I find it amusing to read that French posters on a Income Tax Facebook group are having issues in filling in an English tax form.

I'm playing the devil's advocate here:

If you haven’t yet adopted Thai as an alternative language, wouldn’t you have everything to gain?
 

Your 'Therefore' is a non sequitur and doesn’t make sense. Is English your first language?

There’s no logical connection between Thailand adopting English as an alternative official language and requiring long-term visa applicants to be fluent in either Thai or English.
 

And if you aren’t fluent in both French and English, I’d find that equally amusing.

[Ben Zioner]

Just now, LosLobo said:

And if you aren’t fluent in both French and English, I’d find that equally amusing.

Add Hebrew, German and Spanish  mate..

[BangkokReady]

5 hours ago, simon43 said:

If our attitude is that we should not learn Thai, then why should immigrants to the UK learn English?

 

Because there is not the same level of Thai ability in the UK.  You can live in Thailand and get by speaking very little Thai.  You cannot live in the UK and get by without speaking a reasonable level of English.

 

Pretty simple...  🤷‍♂️

[OneMoreFarang]

11 hours ago, MangoKorat said:

There is another very important component of the application - a large 'donation'. Two of my mates gave up when they were told that an envelope containing at least 100,000 baht in addtion to the other fees would be needed for the application path to be a smooth one.

But how true is that?

I know from one guy who successfully did this that he paid a lot of money. I contacted the lawyer who did that for him, and he also spoke about a 6-digit amount.

On the other hand, a good friend did this maybe 10 years ago and he didn't pay any extras apart from the lawyer.

 

Is it necessary to pay extra? Maybe. Who really knows?

I think many of us who live here since a long time are not surprised that some officials want money. But it is difficult to estimate how necessary these payments are.