Belgian Cyclist Killed in Collision with Pickup Truck in Sattahip

[Patong2021]

16 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Not on the SkyLane (near the Airport)...  full on exercise bike lane.

 

Not on Pak-Kret...  and not on Bang Krachao...  but on these latter two, bike can't go fast either, its more a leisurely ride than exercise... 

 

But the other bike lanes...  they end up as car parks... 

Lovely, but impractical.  Not a practical option for residents of Chiang Mai, Udon Thani, etc. The lanes need to be accessible and practical. Or better yet, respected. They manage to do that in the UK, USA and Japan. It of course gets back to  driving skills and respect for others.

[GarryP]

15 hours ago, BangkokReady said:

 

Not much damage to the bike, apart from the saddle.  Does that suggest the chap's body took most of the impact?  Poor guy.

Interesting point. When I was in an accident, there was much more damage to my bike. Perhaps he was taken out by the door on the back of the pickup. But in any case, a terrible thing to happen. With the size of the road shoulder you would think it would be safe for cycling.  

[impulse]

Out of curiosity, I looked up the bicycle deaths back home in the USA.  In 2022, there were 1084 bicycle deaths from vehicular accidents. (iihs.org)

 

That's something to keep in mind before bashing Thailand for their bicycle safety stats.  With about 1/5 of the population of the US, I'd expect over 200 bicycle road deaths in Thailand to be on the same level of risk, assuming bicycle km per capita is about the same.

 

My best friend from high school just got killed in Phoenix last month when a lady opened her car door without looking and forced him to swerve into traffic where he was hit by another car.  So it's not just Thai drivers.

 

[BangkokReady]

1 hour ago, impulse said:

That's something to keep in mind before bashing Thailand for their bicycle safety stats.

 

I don't see where you quoted the bicycle deaths in Thailand, so your argument is pretty vague.

 

You don't need to focus on just bicycle deaths to know how dangerous it is to ride a bicycle in Thailand.  Thai roads are way more dangerous than US roads, so it is obviously going to be more dangerous to ride a bicycle on the road in Thailand than the US.

 

No "bashing" is needed.  You can just think rationally.  🤷‍♂️

[Ralf001]

21 hours ago, connda said:

Thai drivers have killed about a dozen animals within 200 meters from my home over the decade plus that I've lived here in rural Lamphun.  But agreed, cows and ox make bigger dents than dogs and cats, and the occasional human.

 

I'll swerve for a cow/ox but very little else.

[impulse]

23 minutes ago, BangkokReady said:

 

I don't see where you quoted the bicycle deaths in Thailand, so your argument is pretty vague.

 

You don't need to focus on just bicycle deaths to know how dangerous it is to ride a bicycle in Thailand.  Thai roads are way more dangerous than US roads, so it is obviously going to be more dangerous to ride a bicycle on the road in Thailand than the US.

 

No "bashing" is needed.  You can just think rationally.  

 

Do you have a statistic for deaths per km driven?  Either in a car, on a bicycle, or on a scooter?  Because I've never seen one published from Thailand.   And without that, any contention that Thai traffic and Thai bicycling is more dangerous is just a guess based on extremely limited experiences and a few stories cautionary tales in the media. 

 

Is it as comfortable as driving back home?  Absolutely not.  But Thai drivers are 10x as defensive as we are back in the nanny states, where we assume that right of way and rules (and zebra crossings) mean something.

 

I'm still waiting for someone to produce the deaths per million km driven to prove that it's more dangerous to drive in Thailand.  I suspect it may just be because so many Thais ride scooters which are 20-40x as dangerous as a 4 wheeler.

 

[impulse]

1 hour ago, impulse said:

I suspect it may just be because so many Thais ride scooters which are 20-40x as dangerous as a 4 wheeler.

 

To be clear, "suspect" wasn't a good choice of words.  I meant to say that I'm open to the possibility that the statistics may say something different than the tired old "most dangerous roads in the world".  Anyone who believes that hasn't been to a lot of much worse places.

 

[GarryP]

1 hour ago, impulse said:

 

Do you have a statistic for deaths per km driven?  Either in a car, on a bicycle, or on a scooter?  Because I've never seen one published from Thailand.   And without that, any contention that Thai traffic and Thai bicycling is more dangerous is just a guess based on extremely limited experiences and a few stories cautionary tales in the media. 

 

Is it as comfortable as driving back home?  Absolutely not.  But Thai drivers are 10x as defensive as we are back in the nanny states, where we assume that right of way and rules (and zebra crossings) mean something.

 

I'm still waiting for someone to produce the deaths per million km driven to prove that it's more dangerous to drive in Thailand.  I suspect it may just be because so many Thais ride scooters which are 20-40x as dangerous as a 4 wheeler.

 

Maybe be a bit off topic, but here goes. I remember reading a road death comparison between Thailand and the US, and it was found that driving a car in the US was proportionately more dangerous than in Thailand.  For 2021, Thailand had a road traffic death rate of 25.4 per 100,000 population.  As motorcyclists account for 83.8% of all road deaths here, that would mean that the death rate would be 21.3 per 100,000. Leaving 4.1 per 100,000 for cars, trucks, buses, pedestrians, cyclists etc. In the US for the same year, the death rate was 13.4 per 100,000 for all vehicles (unfortunately no percentage for motorcycle deaths was provided). However, there are only 8.6 million motorcycles used in the US with a population of 340.1 million (2024) (one in every 39.5 people has a motorcycle), while for Thailand there are 21.6 million motorcycles and the population is 71.6 million (one in every 3.3 people has a motorcycle). So it is very likely that the proportion of car, truck, bus etc. deaths is actually higher than Thailand, whereas Thailand takes the biscuit for motorcycle deaths). The problem with all this though is there are so many different factors involved.  

 

In Thailand we also have the issue of a very poorly planned road system which was not developed with driver/rider safety in mind.  

[GarryP]

38 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

To be clear, "suspect" wasn't a good choice of words.  I meant to say that I'm open to the possibility that the statistics may say something different than the tired old "most dangerous roads in the world".  Anyone who believes that hasn't been to a lot of much worse places.

 

Totally agree. 

[richard_smith237]

2 hours ago, impulse said:

 

Do you have a statistic for deaths per km driven?  Either in a car, on a bicycle, or on a scooter?  Because I've never seen one published from Thailand.   And without that, any contention that Thai traffic and Thai bicycling is more dangerous is just a guess based on extremely limited experiences and a few stories cautionary tales in the media. 

 

Is it as comfortable as driving back home?  Absolutely not.  But Thai drivers are 10x as defensive as we are back in the nanny states, where we assume that right of way and rules (and zebra crossings) mean something.

 

I'm still waiting for someone to produce the deaths per million km driven to prove that it's more dangerous to drive in Thailand.  I suspect it may just be because so many Thais ride scooters which are 20-40x as dangerous as a 4 wheeler.

 

 

On a 'per capita basis' - (i.e. deaths per 100,000 people) the road fatalities in the USA are higher than Thailand for 4 wheeled vehicle usage (i.e. Motorcycles removed)... 

 

But... that does not account for distance travelled. 

 

The issue with attempting to compare stats between developing nations and developed nations are these details where full statistics are are collected, yet in Thailand, we get the raw end stat which doesn't really help when attempting such nuanced comparisons. 

 

 

 

[balo]

Foreigners with bicycles never learn do they ?  First of all they need to understand the Thai roads before try this very risky ride. 

Helmets  and other protections will not save you. 

Stay away from the main roads how hard can it be? Why take the chance?  





 

[scubascuba3]

I was riding down the 332 about that time, mostly a safe road, but if you have some bad luck and encounter a drunk driver / driver using the phone, maybe game over.

 

Safety in numbers 

[radiochaser]

On 3/10/2025 at 10:22 PM, madone said:

 

yup, that is off-topic,

 

Thanks for letting us all know bikes are bad.

 

 Not all bikes are bad.  You should know that.   

Just the bad bike riders are bad.   You should know that. 

 

P.S.  I have found the moderators don't seem to mind off topic posts, if they are labeled as off topic posts.  Otherwise, off topic posts seem to disappear into internet space, never to be read again.   

Just in case you didn't know that. 

[madone]

6 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

if you have some bad luck and encounter a drunk driver / driver using the phone, maybe game over.

 

which is the case on any road anywhere, in a car, on a motorcycle, or on foot. 

What is odd to me is the people who ride motorcycles or use motorcyclycle taxis daily that announce riding a bike in Thailand is suicide.

it just doesn't compute  -- I'm not saying they are the same, but they certainly are similar activities    

[madone]

20 hours ago, impulse said:

Out of curiosity, I looked up the bicycle deaths back home in the USA.  In 2022, there were 1084 bicycle deaths from vehicular accidents. (iihs.org)

 

That's something to keep in mind before bashing Thailand for their bicycle safety stats.  With about 1/5 of the population of the US, I'd expect over 200 bicycle road deaths in Thailand to be on the same level of risk, assuming bicycle km per capita is about the same.

 

My best friend from high school just got killed in Phoenix last month when a lady opened her car door without looking and forced him to swerve into traffic where he was hit by another car.  So it's not just Thai drivers.

 

 logic or personal experience doesn't play here. "Cycling in thailand is stupid," is the refrain and folks just sing it.

i reckon the majority of them are couch-bound and would not cycle anywhere, but still they contribute an opinion.  

[impulse]

13 minutes ago, madone said:

 logic or personal experience doesn't play here. "Cycling in thailand is stupid," is the refrain and folks just sing it.

i reckon the majority of them are couch-bound and would not cycle anywhere, but still they contribute an opinion.  

 

I cycled the busy streets of Bangkok for about 6 years when I worked there.  On a recumbent after my bypass surgery and I needed the exercise but couldn't risk a fall.  I thoroughly enjoyed it, especially the visits to the Elephant Ear via the Khlong Toei crossing.  I found Thai city drivers (in general) to be pretty good about not running me over. 

 

But I don't have a lot of road miles in the boondocks of Thailand.  In the past 5 years, I've lost 2 friends in the USA to bike/vehicle accidents.  I guess it's down to risk tolerance, though some valid statistics would be helpful. 

 

[Liverpool Lou]

On 3/10/2025 at 6:27 PM, mikebell said:

Another victim of RTP's inaction.

What "inaction by the police" caused this cyclist's death, a death for which the blame has not yet been attributed?

[Liverpool Lou]

On 3/10/2025 at 6:56 PM, richard_smith237 said:

I hope 'authorities' checked the woman's phone usage and also for booze and drugs.

I hope that they also do the same checks on the cyclist and investigate how he was riding.  That would be fair, wouldn't it?

[Liverpool Lou]

On 3/10/2025 at 7:37 PM, richard_smith237 said:

but in the UK, for distance covered per person it shows that cycling is just as dangerous as riding a bicicycle... 

"Cycling is just as dangerous as riding a bicycle"...wow, who'da thought.

[Liverpool Lou]

22 hours ago, GarryP said:

With the size of the road shoulder you would think it would be safe for cycling.  

Begs the question, "Where was he positioned and what was he doing when he was struck?"

[richard_smith237]

13 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

On 3/10/2025 at 7:37 PM, richard_smith237 said:

but in the UK, for distance covered per person it shows that cycling is just as dangerous as riding a bicicycle... 

"Cycling is just as dangerous as riding a bicycle"...wow, who'da thought.

haha….   Surely you wee’d a little when you saw that error !!

 

Correction: “Cycling just as dangerous as being a pedestrian”….

 

(just Incase you overlooked the numbers) 

[madone]

32 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

I cycled the busy streets of Bangkok for about 6 years when I worked there.  On a recumbent after my bypass surgery and I needed the exercise but couldn't risk a fall.  I thoroughly enjoyed it, especially the visits to the Elephant Ear via the Khlong Toei crossing.  I found Thai city drivers (in general) to be pretty good about not running me over. 

 

But I don't have a lot of road miles in the boondocks of Thailand.  In the past 5 years, I've lost 2 friends in the USA to bike/vehicle accidents.  I guess it's down to risk tolerance, though some valid statistics would be helpful. 

 

wow. even i take pause at the thought of the recumbent, probably because I'm not familiar with riding one, but they seem very low! 

I am in bagkrachao several time per week, but i only return via klong toei. i head out there on Rama 3/Ratuburana. it is a good 40km loop, and easy to double it once you are on the "island."

[madone]

2 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

haha….   Surely you wee’d a little when you saw that error !!

 

Correction: “Cycling just as dangerous as being a pedestrian”….

 

(just Incase you overlooked the numbers) 

 i chuckled then moved on 

[lordgrinz]

The last thing I want to be doing in Thailand is riding a bicycle in traffic, I barely feel safe in my car.

[phetphet]

Do the Police here breathalyse drivers after accidents as a matter of course?

[BritManToo]

39 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

I cycled the busy streets of Bangkok for about 6 years when I worked there.  On a recumbent after my bypass surgery and I needed the exercise but couldn't risk a fall.  I thoroughly enjoyed it, especially the visits to the Elephant Ear via the Khlong Toei crossing.  I found Thai city drivers (in general) to be pretty good about not running me over. 

 

But I don't have a lot of road miles in the boondocks of Thailand.  In the past 5 years, I've lost 2 friends in the USA to bike/vehicle accidents.  I guess it's down to risk tolerance, though some valid statistics would be helpful. 

 

I've been cycling 25km/day or more for 10 years in Thailand.

Car got me when on my big m/c though.

[scubascuba3]

1 hour ago, madone said:

 

which is the case on any road anywhere, in a car, on a motorcycle, or on foot. 

What is odd to me is the people who ride motorcycles or use motorcyclycle taxis daily that announce riding a bike in Thailand is suicide.

it just doesn't compute  -- I'm not saying they are the same, but they certainly are similar activities    

Yep, cycling is safer than motorbikes due to the speed difference, i use both alot