Anyway, it seems that Hegseth has been cleared, by the New York Times of all media outlets!

 

 Headline: "Hegseth Ordered a Lethal Attack,but not the Killing of Survivors, Officials Say"

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/12/01/us/hegseth-drug-boat-strike-order-venezuela.html

 

Briefly, Hegseth made the first order only- to destroy the drug boat. When it was not fully destroyed, Adm Bradley ordered a second strike.  Nothing about killing any survivors was mentioned. 

NYTimes follow-up

 

The public comments of the president, Mr. Hegseth and Ms. Leavitt all leave Admiral Bradley exposed.

 

“For the top two civilians in the Pentagon and the White House to effectively wash their hands of it and claim no responsibility, while simultaneously saying that they stand by the decision, goes against any kind of ideas of responsible command,” said Carrie A. Lee, the former chair of the department of national security and strategy at the Army War College.

 

“Trying to walk this middle line where you are saying, ‘Well, I agree with his decisions, but if they violated the law, then we’re going to leave him swinging,” added Ms. Lee, who is now a senior fellow at the German Marshall Fund.

1 hour ago, FritsSikkink said:

What group, people in boats at sea?

Excataly,  and who are They,Trump and co,just because the grifter said they are a terrorisst group does not make it so. Trump is a village idiot and would know what itime of the day it was until McDonalds opened up.

Reporter: Did you have anything to do with blowing up that boat with 11 people on board?

 

Secretary of War Hegseth: What boat?

2 hours ago, Slowhand225 said:

 

So just how often do prosecutors show you evidence ? I'm impressed

Prosecutors show evidence during a trial. Where's the trial?

White House says admiral ordered follow-up strike on alleged drug boat, insists attack was lawful

 

Updated 9:06 AM GMT+7, December 2, 2025

 

After the Post’s report, Hegseth said Friday on X that “fake news is delivering more fabricated, inflammatory, and derogatory reporting to discredit our incredible warriors fighting to protect the homeland.”

 

“Our current operations in the Caribbean are lawful under both U.S. and international law, with all actions in compliance with the law of armed conflict — and approved by the best military and civilian lawyers * , up and down the chain of command,” Hegseth wrote.

 

https://apnews.com/article/trump-venezuela-hegseth-maduro-512c66b99b2a13e9d1a3ed2699e78228

 

* Meaning the ones we haven't fired for disagreeing with our mission.

1 hour ago, Purdey said:

Prosecutors show evidence during a trial. Where's the trial?

Do try and keep up.

What an amazing coincidence- the MSM tries to drum up a "war crime" narrative just a week after 6 members of Congress embarrass themselves pontificating on the same subject.

 

And the story turns out to be nothing. A boat was legitimately targeted, hit, and then targeted again because it hadn't sunk and there was the possibility it could be salvaged.  Ho hum. 

18 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

A boat was legitimately targeted,

According to what law?

10 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

According to what law?

Presidential discretion as to what is an 'armed conflict' as in the above:

 

“Our current operations in the Caribbean are lawful under both U.S. and international law, with all actions in compliance with the law of armed conflict — and approved by the best military and civilian lawyers * , up and down the chain of command,” Hegseth wrote.

 

 

57 minutes ago, jerrymahoney said:

Presidential discretion as to what is an 'armed conflict' as in the above:

 

“Our current operations in the Caribbean are lawful under both U.S. and international law, with all actions in compliance with the law of armed conflict — and approved by the best military and civilian lawyers * , up and down the chain of command,” Hegseth wrote.

 

 

Show me the international law, as it all BS

3 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

Show me the international law, as it all BS

"International law" is an oxymoron.

best defense is to attack, Trump cronies know that very well, they follow their leader instructions

 

Donald Trump’s “Four Ds”: Deny, Deflect, Delay, and Don’t Write — A Playbook for Erosion of Accountability

 

1st=The Teflon Armor of Denial - First comes “Deny,” 

2nd= The Art of Deflection - Then there’s “Deflect,”

3rd= The Slow March of Delay - “Delay” is another cog in this complex machine. 

and then 4th= The Phantom Evidence - The last D, “Don’t put anything into writing,”

 

 

Clever.......puts Bradley in the frame straight from the off.

 

A true leader would have said "I took the decision" not "he took the decision, but I'll defend him".

9 hours ago, mikeymike100 said:

 

No, the actions are not proven illegal—the statement assumes illegality based on unverified allegations from anonymous leaks (e.g., Hegseth's purported "kill everybody" order leading to a second strike on survivors). As of December 3, 2025:

No indictments, charges, or convictions have been issued; bipartisan congressional probes (Senate/House Armed Services Committees) are ongoing, demanding full video/audio evidence but have not concluded.

 

Experts (e.g., Geoffrey Corn, Michael Schmitt) say if survivors were targeted, it would violate DoD Law of War Manual (§5.4.7 on denial of quarter) and Geneva Conventions (AP I Art. 41 on hors de combat protections)—but emphasize it's conditional on facts proving intent

 

White House/DoD deny targeting survivors, calling the leak "fabricated"; they frame the second strike as sinking a "navigation hazard" for cargo denial, not willful killing—potentially legal under NIAC rules if no incapacitated persons were visible.

Potentially nothing ! Drone footage shows survivors .

Are you an operative?

43 minutes ago, 0ffshore360 said:

Potentially nothing ! Drone footage shows survivors .

Are you an operative?

 

Not an operative, but maybe try State Department.

 

“Drone footage shows survivors” is the entire WaPo story, CNN, and NYT story — and it’s still just anonymous leaks.

 

As of right now, zero seconds of that alleged footage has been released to the public or even shown to Congress.

The only thing we’ve seen is the 38-second DoD clip Hegseth posted on Sept 2: missile hits boat, massive explosion, boat engulfed in flames and smoke — end of clip.

No lingering shots, no zoom on “two guys clinging to wreckage,” no second missile on screen.Every single “survivors in the water” detail comes from unnamed “people familiar with the matter” — the same playbook used for every failed Trump smears for nine years.

Hegseth and the White House say flatly:

There was no second strike on swimmers

The second missile sank the burning hulk to eliminate the navigation hazard and deny the fentanyl cargo

 

No order was ever given to “kill survivors” because none were positively identified after the first hit

 

Until someone actually releases the classified feed instead of leaking bedtime stories to the Post, this is allegation, not evidence. And allegations from anonymous Obama-holdover spooks aren’t proof — they’re politics.

So no, “drone footage shows survivors” is not a fact. It’s the claim.

The footage itself is still locked up, and the probes haven’t seen it yet either. Come back when there’s video, not vibes.

17 hours ago, jerrymahoney said:

 

 

“Our current operations in the Caribbean are lawful under both U.S. and international law, with all actions in compliance with the law of armed conflict — and approved by the best military and civilian lawyers * , up and down the chain of command,” Hegseth wrote.

 

https://apnews.com/article/trump-venezuela-hegseth-maduro-512c66b99b2a13e9d1a3ed2699e78228

 

* Meaning the ones we haven't fired for disagreeing with our mission.

Military lawyers fear firings will enable Hegseth to bend law
The Pentagon chief said he doesn’t want lawyers who are “roadblocks” to decisions he or military commanders make.

 

02/25/2025

 

https://subscriber.politicopro.com/article/2025/02/military-lawyers-fear-firings-will-enable-hegseth-to-bend-law-00206069

 

48 minutes ago, mikeymike100 said:

 

Not an operative, but maybe try State Department.

 

“Drone footage shows survivors” is the entire WaPo story, CNN, and NYT story — and it’s still just anonymous leaks.

 

As of right now, zero seconds of that alleged footage has been released to the public or even shown to Congress.

The only thing we’ve seen is the 38-second DoD clip Hegseth posted on Sept 2: missile hits boat, massive explosion, boat engulfed in flames and smoke — end of clip.

No lingering shots, no zoom on “two guys clinging to wreckage,” no second missile on screen.Every single “survivors in the water” detail comes from unnamed “people familiar with the matter” — the same playbook used for every failed Trump smears for nine years.

Hegseth and the White House say flatly:

There was no second strike on swimmers

The second missile sank the burning hulk to eliminate the navigation hazard and deny the fentanyl cargo

 

No order was ever given to “kill survivors” because none were positively identified after the first hit

 

Until someone actually releases the classified feed instead of leaking bedtime stories to the Post, this is allegation, not evidence. And allegations from anonymous Obama-holdover spooks aren’t proof — they’re politics.

So no, “drone footage shows survivors” is not a fact. It’s the claim.

The footage itself is still locked up, and the probes haven’t seen it yet either. Come back when there’s video, not vibes.

State Department you say ! It went from no second strike to ok a second strike to clean up the ocean and sink scattered  floating parcels of (fentanyl?) 

Quite an entertaining reply.

8 minutes ago, 0ffshore360 said:

State Department you say ! It went from no second strike to ok a second strike to clean up the ocean and sink scattered  floating parcels of (fentanyl?) 

Quite an entertaining reply.

 

I said..."maybe try State Department"

 

No I said..."There was no second strike on swimmers" devil is in the detail!

 

 

15 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

"International law" is an oxymoron.

Useless comment.

Senators introduce War Powers Resolution over Trump's Venezuela actions