2 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

The trick is to never want anything or anyone that much.

(and to be considered 'desirable' by all your woman's female friends)

Our OP appears to prostrate himself in front of women. Women are just people.

If one promulgates the myth of women being deservant of special attention, you end up creating the illusion of entitlement. A rod for your own back. Furthermore, if you believe in treating people as you treat yourself...how does worshipping another human fit into that?

If no one utilised the service of prostitutes, there would be no prostitution. What does that have to do with male domination?

Then there is the question of degree. You have suggested, in the past, that all women are prostitutes. I disagree with that premise, but there is definitely a wide spectrum of behaviour that can be covered by that umbrella.

Overall, better to stay away from people who don't have good intentions towards you.

1 hour ago, Cameroni said:

That's one of your mistakes. Prostitution is bad. Because men are the victims. Women are exploiting the in-built testosterone fuelled libido men are born with for financial gain. So this is a form of financial exploitation of men by women. Women are NOT the victims, they are the exploiters.

The second mistake is not to recognise that this model, resources for sexual access, is the basis for 98% of all male female relationships, including marriages, normal relationships and prostitution. Only true love and lust relationships, ie one night stands, are excluded.

But then it's no wonder your thinking on this is skewed since you quote Dworkin, an obvious fool.

It's not a mistake. it's just a fact that I respect women, and women are victims most of the time from men who should have been taught better as children. Men aren't victims in prostitution unless they're the ones selling their bodies to other men.

Calling making money for giving your body to men you would never have sex with otherwise a financial gain shows exactly what it is, although money is the only gain.

Low self esteem, ridicule, STD's, beatings and death are the outcome for those involved in prostitution, besides the few lucky ones who only do it a short time and end up with good husbands. ones that don't eventually also hurt them later.

Resources for sex might be one part of a relationship, but having it be in a rewarding relationship where no one isn't being taken advantage of and both are partners to each other is the true reward. Where they share their lives without any intentional hurt towards the other, looking at both as partners and not money and slavery.

My thinking on this matter is spot on, as well as the author of this topic and the hundreds of others who actually talked with the prostitutes and learned firsthand what went on in their lives. Going after these women, then leaving, without a word exchanged about their lives, has no one knowing what goes on in their lives after you leave.

Those authors, along with actually talking with them, is data that shows how they live, especially if they both match.

Edited Saturday at 04:54 AM3 days by fredwiggy

1 hour ago, ColeBOzbourne said:

Yet you have directly and indirectly claimed many times that anyone who does not read it must use prostitutes and disrespect women.

My responses have been directly about you, not the topic. From the beginning, you have claimed that if anyone refuses to read the article it can only be because they use prostitutes, and lack the high level of respect you claim to have for women. There are other reasons why someone might not read the article. My reasons are the length of the novel, and your condescending, righteous attitude. I have no problem with the topic itself.

I never said that at all. I said anyone who doesn't read it means they don't care to read it, which is their choice. I said those who comment without reading shows how they think, seeing the topic heading explains what it's about. How a person comments after reading it without skimming also shows how they think, which again has nothing to do with me as I haven't judged them.

Read again exactly what I said. Using prostitutes isn't what I commented about either. Many use them for sex without hurting them physically. That prostitution hurts them in other ways mentally is what's written here.

Male dominance means what it says here, and isn't my words but those of the author and many others who have written words on that subject. Basically if you don't read the whole topic, you cannot honestly comment on it, which makes sense in any topic.

That I agree with what she wrote, as well as all other writings of this sort on the subject, only shows I think the same way.

I'm not here to judge. What people say and how they comment speaks of how they feel about women, and has nothing to do with me.

21 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

Like i said, those who benefit will likely not read it.Those who have an obsession with prostitutes will be the ones after them.

21 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

It doesn't take that long to read, but those who won't are those who benefit from prostitution.

21 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

I've never lied on this forum, so my claims are real.

19 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

How people comment on this topic explains how they see women. You either are for or against women being demeaned

18 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

This is what I said, "How people comment on this topic explains how they see women. You either are for or against women being demeaned"

Delusional...

15 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

I never said that at all. I said anyone who doesn't read it means they don't care to read it, which is their choice.

Hmmm... that's not what you wrote. Now you are backpedalling and gaslighting.

1 hour ago, Cameroni said:

You are also making a mistake.

You are equating a liking for alcohol to sex. This is a fallacy, since a man is subject to testosterone he has a high sex drive and must have sex. This is not the case with alcohol, there is no hormone that impels a man to need alcohol, men like alcohol because it is a drug and provides a dopamine hit. With sex it is very different. Testosterone means a man must have sex, as his hormones compel him to.

Women exploit a testosterone fuelled sex drive. Bars do not do that.

This is easy to find, but AI explains it well..................

Biological Facts No survival risk: The human body can live a full, healthy life without sexual intercourse.Not a vital organ function: Unlike eating, drinking, or sleeping, sex is not required for the body to keep working.

Asexual individuals: Many men identify as asexual and do not experience sexual attraction, yet they live normal and fulfilling lives.

What Happens Without Sex?

No physical harm: Going without sex does not cause permanent physical damage or illness.

Health benefits exist: Regular sex can lower stress, improve sleep, and help the heart, but these benefits are optional for overall well-being.

Emotional feelings: Some men feel frustrated or miss the emotional closeness that comes with sex, but these feelings vary by person.

Personal ChoiceUp to the individual: Whether to have sex is a personal choice.

Abstinence is safe: Choosing not to have sex, for any reason, is completely safe and normal.

Testosterone doesn't mean a man must have sex. Hormone Stability During Abstinence

• Levels stay stable: Going without sexual intercourse or other sexual activities does not lower your body's baseline testosterone.

• No deficiency caused: Abstinence does not trigger medical testosterone deficiency or hypogonadism.

• Lifestyle matters more: Sleep, stress management, diet, and overall physical health have a much larger impact on your hormone levels than your sexual frequency. You can read more about what affects these levels through Harvard Health.

Short-Term Spikes vs. Long-Term Baselines

• Temporary changes: Sexual arousal and orgasm can cause a brief, short-lived spike in testosterone.

• Quick return: These elevated levels return to normal within minutes after ejaculation.

• Association vs. cause: Studies showing that sexually active men have stable or slightly higher average levels reflect correlation rather than direct causation. Higher desire or overall good health often drives sexual activity, rather than sex being the engine that creates the hormone.

What is true is that regular sex does help by lowering stress and increasing endorphins, much like exercise.. Not because a man has to.

Edited Saturday at 05:13 AM3 days by fredwiggy

This is what I wrote as far as how people might answer the topic.

This is a hot topic and likely some won't bother to read this, especially those who benefit from it, it being a long read, but it makes real sense regarding the protection of women and their safety..

Those who have an obsession with prostitutes will be the ones after them.

How people comment on this topic explains how they see women. You either are for or against women being demeaned. Nothing to do with me as I already have my thoughts.

Some will comment without reading the topic, which also shows how they think.No insulting whatsoever.

It's up to anyone if they want to read it. I just stated that how people comment on a topic they don't read shows how they think. It's easy to see what it's about by the title.

How they comment after reading it would also show how they think. It's nothing to do with me but about women as you saw by reading some of it. It's a valid read on the subject.

Remember one thing. You don't have to read anything anyone posts here. Looking at the title is all a man needs to understand what it means.

Some men think they can dominate over women so won't bother reading it, and that answers the question about their thinking. ( I can't judge anyone who doesn't comment, of course, and I haven't)

Responses to this topic aren't about me but other's thinking about the trade, and how it affects women.

I didn't post this for any approval but to point it out so others might think a bit.

If you don't read something, how can you comment on it's words? If you read what I said, I said this isn't about me. I do agree with what's written, as its factual.

Those that use the trade of course aren't going to agree with it, and many won't bother reading it at all for that reason alone.

I didn't write this, but I have made my points rather clearly. I did say this wasn't about me. I just support women.

I don't see judging but letting other members comment on the topic, after reading all of it, which will show how they think about the topic and women in general, which still has nothing to do with me as it will be their words.

The usual suspect here has spoke about this before and can't disagree with it, thinking most men here go after prostitutes or pay for their women anyway, while he never has, which is BS which everyone knows. but will be his usual anal self and try to pick this apart, saying i'm backpedalling and gaslighting when I've stayed with the same narrative all along. Nothing to do with delusional as all there is valid.

Edited Saturday at 05:37 AM3 days by fredwiggy

15 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

No physical harm: Going without sex does not cause permanent physical damage or illness.

It depends what question one asks of AI.

The risk of prostate cancer in men is inversely proportional to ejaculation frequency, and peaks with absolute celibacy.

Edited Saturday at 05:35 AM3 days by Lacessit

1 minute ago, Lacessit said:

It depends what question one asks of AI.

The risk of prostate cancer in men is inversely proportional to ejaculation frquency, and peaks with absolute celibacy.

Yes, and I was going to add that and a couple of other things that help, but masturbation helps with the prostate.I tried but it was past the time to edit more.

Edited Saturday at 05:35 AM3 days by fredwiggy

18 hours ago, TedG said:

She views prostitution as the “bottom” of male domination. Her broader feminist argument is that prostitution creates an especially visible example of a social hierarchy in which men have power over women. She argues that even men who never personally buy sex benefit indirectly from a society in which women occupy this subordinate position.

However, it seems like Thai women have power over men, especially men's ATM-cards...

6 hours ago, nick supreme said:

Referring to working women as "hoes" is disrespectful and harmful.

The article is about prostitutes, hoes, whores...
If that offends you or your wife I apologise.

1 hour ago, fredwiggy said:

This is easy to find, but AI explains it well..................

Biological Facts No survival risk: The human body can live a full, healthy life without sexual intercourse.Not a vital organ function: Unlike eating, drinking, or sleeping, sex is not required for the body to keep working.

Asexual individuals: Many men identify as asexual and do not experience sexual attraction, yet they live normal and fulfilling lives.

What Happens Without Sex?

No physical harm: Going without sex does not cause permanent physical damage or illness.

Health benefits exist: Regular sex can lower stress, improve sleep, and help the heart, but these benefits are optional for overall well-being.

Emotional feelings: Some men feel frustrated or miss the emotional closeness that comes with sex, but these feelings vary by person.

Personal ChoiceUp to the individual: Whether to have sex is a personal choice.

Abstinence is safe: Choosing not to have sex, for any reason, is completely safe and normal.

Testosterone doesn't mean a man must have sex. Hormone Stability During Abstinence

• Levels stay stable: Going without sexual intercourse or other sexual activities does not lower your body's baseline testosterone.

• No deficiency caused: Abstinence does not trigger medical testosterone deficiency or hypogonadism.

• Lifestyle matters more: Sleep, stress management, diet, and overall physical health have a much larger impact on your hormone levels than your sexual frequency. You can read more about what affects these levels through Harvard Health.

Short-Term Spikes vs. Long-Term Baselines

• Temporary changes: Sexual arousal and orgasm can cause a brief, short-lived spike in testosterone.

• Quick return: These elevated levels return to normal within minutes after ejaculation.

• Association vs. cause: Studies showing that sexually active men have stable or slightly higher average levels reflect correlation rather than direct causation. Higher desire or overall good health often drives sexual activity, rather than sex being the engine that creates the hormone.

What is true is that regular sex does help by lowering stress and increasing endorphins, much like exercise.. Not because a man has to.

Funny, my AI says this:

Yes, testosterone plays a foundational role in creating and maintaining a man's sex drive, but it does not act entirely alone. It essentially functions as the biological "engine" for libido.

How Testosterone Creates Sex Drive

Testosterone is the primary male sex hormone, produced mostly in the testicles. It drives sexual desire through several direct biological pathways:

• Brain Activation: Testosterone travels through the bloodstream, crosses the blood-brain barrier, and binds to receptors in the hypothalamus and limbic system—the areas of the brain responsible for motivation, emotion, and arousal.

• Neurotransmitter Release: It stimulates these brain receptors to increase the production of dopamine, the "reward" chemical associated with desire and pleasure.

• Physical Anatomy Support: Beyond desire, testosterone maintains the health of the penile tissues. It ensures the smooth muscle tissue remains flexible enough to expand and fill with blood, making physical arousal possible.

  Since men have far higher testosterone levels than women, their sex drive is much higher.

  Whilst Andrea Dworkin would be proud of your suggested solution, not to have sex, this lack of sexual activity can impact physical health, mental well-being, and romantic relationships.

Mental and Emotional Health Impacts

Sex releases a cascade of "happy hormones"—including oxytocin, endorphins, dopamine, and serotonin—which help regulate mood and sleep. A lack of these biological triggers can lead to several challenges:

• Increased Stress and Anxiety: Without the natural cortisol-lowering effects of oxytocin and endorphins, individuals may experience heightened stress levels.

• Lower Mood and Loneliness: Studies show a correlation between lower sexual frequency (when sex is desired) and higher rates of psychological distress, anxiety, and depression. Large-scale data also notes that lifelong involuntarily sexless individuals report feeling lonelier and unhappier on average.

• Disrupted Sleep: Sexual climax prompts the release of prolactin and oxytocin, which aid restful sleep. Without this, some individuals report poorer sleep quality or insomnia.

  
  Physical and Physiological Effects

  Regular sexual arousal and orgasm serve as a form of physical exercise and biological maintenance. Long-term cessation can alter bodily functions:

  • Cardiovascular Risks: Infrequent sexual activity (less than once a month) has been linked in some studies to a higher risk of cardiovascular disease.

  • Weakened Immune Function: Regular sex (1–2 times a week) boosts levels of immunoglobulin A (IgA), an antibody essential for fighting off common illnesses like colds.

  • Vaginal Tissue Changes: For women, particularly post-menopause, a lack of regular intercourse decreases local blood flow, which can cause the vaginal walls to thin, lose elasticity, dry out, and tighten.

  • Erectile Dysfunction: For men, infrequent sex (less than once a week) is associated with a higher likelihood of developing erectile dysfunction over time compared to those who have sex multiple times a week.

  • Prostate Health Concerns: Regular ejaculation (whether through partnered sex or masturbation) is linked to a lower risk of prostate cancer. Men who ejaculate less frequently may lose this protective benefit.

  • Weakened Pelvic Floor: Sexual activity naturally engages and strengthens the pelvic floor muscles. Inactivity can cause these muscles to weaken, which may eventually impact bladder control.

  Relationship and Interpersonal Friction

  In the context of a romantic partnership, sex is often a primary vehicle for bonding and intimacy:

  • Mismatched Libidos: If one partner desires sex and the other does not, it can breed resentment, rejection, and insecurity. (ie the woman can become unhappy if she's not getting sex)

  • Reduced Closeness: Sex fosters physical trust and emotional vulnerability. Eliminating it can diminish the "buffer" that helps couples navigate daily conflicts smoothly, potentially lowering overall relationship satisfaction.

Not having sex is unnatural, unhealthy and anti-social, in other words. It's a solution an unattractive Pariah like Andrea Dworkin would approve of, but normal people do not subscribe this.

1 hour ago, fredwiggy said:

The usual suspect here has spoke about this before and can't disagree with it, thinking most men here go after prostitutes or pay for their women anyway, while he never has, which is BS which everyone knows. but will be his usual anal self and try to pick this apart, saying i'm backpedalling and gaslighting when I've stayed with the same narrative all along. Nothing to do with delusional as all there is valid.

If you are referring to me, but are too weak to communicate man to man, it's okay. Perhaps some women allow you to 'lord it' over them, for a price.

Here, it's supposedly a level playing field, wherein you need to stand by what you write or concede. That's how men behave.

It's clear to all that you wrote negatively about people who don't swallow the nonsense that you post. Instead of conceding that you did in fact write that the people who don't read it, benefit from it, you lied

2 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

I never said that at all. I said anyone who doesn't read it means they don't care to read it, which is their choice.

Then lie again in stating that I can't disagree with it and again when suggesting that you have "stayed with the same narrative"

Are you lacking for when it comes to self awareness?

To my mind, it was usually women who 'moved the goalposts' in a discussion. No wonder you appear to identify with them.

You claim to be equal, but yet you need to protect and provide for them. In that case, they should do the same for you, should they not?

Mine do...and I don't need to pay them to perform. That's the truth, however hard it is for you to swallow. Envy is a deadly sin.

2 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

I never said that at all. I said anyone who doesn't read it means they don't care to read it, which is their choice. I said those who comment without reading shows how they think, seeing the topic heading explains what it's about. How a person comments after reading it without skimming also shows how they think, which again has nothing to do with me as I haven't judged them.

Read again exactly what I said. Using prostitutes isn't what I commented about either. Many use them for sex without hurting them physically. That prostitution hurts them in other ways mentally is what's written here.

Male dominance means what it says here, and isn't my words but those of the author and many others who have written words on that subject. Basically if you don't read the whole topic, you cannot honestly comment on it, which makes sense in any topic.

That I agree with what she wrote, as well as all other writings of this sort on the subject, only shows I think the same way.

I'm not here to judge. What people say and how they comment speaks of how they feel about women, and has nothing to do with me.

The fact is that you are simply projecting. You have become Andrea Dworkin. But she died twenty years ago. Things have changed somewhat since then. Have you met OnlyFans?

5 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

Funny, my AI says this:

Yes, testosterone plays a foundational role in creating and maintaining a man's sex drive, but it does not act entirely alone. It essentially functions as the biological "engine" for libido.

How Testosterone Creates Sex Drive

Testosterone is the primary male sex hormone, produced mostly in the testicles. It drives sexual desire through several direct biological pathways:

• Brain Activation: Testosterone travels through the bloodstream, crosses the blood-brain barrier, and binds to receptors in the hypothalamus and limbic system—the areas of the brain responsible for motivation, emotion, and arousal.

• Neurotransmitter Release: It stimulates these brain receptors to increase the production of dopamine, the "reward" chemical associated with desire and pleasure.

• Physical Anatomy Support: Beyond desire, testosterone maintains the health of the penile tissues. It ensures the smooth muscle tissue remains flexible enough to expand and fill with blood, making physical arousal possible.

  Since men have far higher testosterone levels than women, their sex drive is much higher.

  Whilst Andrea Dworkin would be proud of your suggested solution, not to have sex, this lack of sexual activity can impact physical health, mental well-being, and romantic relationships.

Mental and Emotional Health Impacts

Sex releases a cascade of "happy hormones"—including oxytocin, endorphins, dopamine, and serotonin—which help regulate mood and sleep. A lack of these biological triggers can lead to several challenges:

• Increased Stress and Anxiety: Without the natural cortisol-lowering effects of oxytocin and endorphins, individuals may experience heightened stress levels.

• Lower Mood and Loneliness: Studies show a correlation between lower sexual frequency (when sex is desired) and higher rates of psychological distress, anxiety, and depression. Large-scale data also notes that lifelong involuntarily sexless individuals report feeling lonelier and unhappier on average.

• Disrupted Sleep: Sexual climax prompts the release of prolactin and oxytocin, which aid restful sleep. Without this, some individuals report poorer sleep quality or insomnia.

  
  Physical and Physiological Effects

  Regular sexual arousal and orgasm serve as a form of physical exercise and biological maintenance. Long-term cessation can alter bodily functions:

  • Cardiovascular Risks: Infrequent sexual activity (less than once a month) has been linked in some studies to a higher risk of cardiovascular disease.

  • Weakened Immune Function: Regular sex (1–2 times a week) boosts levels of immunoglobulin A (IgA), an antibody essential for fighting off common illnesses like colds.

  • Vaginal Tissue Changes: For women, particularly post-menopause, a lack of regular intercourse decreases local blood flow, which can cause the vaginal walls to thin, lose elasticity, dry out, and tighten.

  • Erectile Dysfunction: For men, infrequent sex (less than once a week) is associated with a higher likelihood of developing erectile dysfunction over time compared to those who have sex multiple times a week.

  • Prostate Health Concerns: Regular ejaculation (whether through partnered sex or masturbation) is linked to a lower risk of prostate cancer. Men who ejaculate less frequently may lose this protective benefit.

  • Weakened Pelvic Floor: Sexual activity naturally engages and strengthens the pelvic floor muscles. Inactivity can cause these muscles to weaken, which may eventually impact bladder control.

  Relationship and Interpersonal Friction

  In the context of a romantic partnership, sex is often a primary vehicle for bonding and intimacy:

  • Mismatched Libidos: If one partner desires sex and the other does not, it can breed resentment, rejection, and insecurity. (ie the woman can become unhappy if she's not getting sex)

  • Reduced Closeness: Sex fosters physical trust and emotional vulnerability. Eliminating it can diminish the "buffer" that helps couples navigate daily conflicts smoothly, potentially lowering overall relationship satisfaction.

Not having sex is unnatural, unhealthy and anti-social, in other words. It's a solution an unattractive Pariah like Andrea Dworkin would approve of, but normal people do not subscribe this.

Testosterone does that, but again, a man doesn't need to have sex to be healthy as it explained. That it's a positive addition is a no brainer. It has nothing to do with being anti social. Since you like AI, there's this.............Whether abstaining from sex is "unnatural, unhealthy, or anti-social" depends entirely on an individual's context, personal choice, and biological orientation. While sex is a fundamental biological drive for many people, celibacy, abstinence, and asexuality are recognized as normal variations of human behavior that do not inherently cause harm..

7 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

Nothing new, besides the fact it continues and many suffer from it. What is written is what's going on now even more. Easy to research the negatives about the trade on women and their lives. I'm not judging anyone, as it's on them to be either good or bad to women in their lives. Just another topic to read and reflect on, like all others here.

So you haven't got a point to make yourself...despite the quotation.

5 minutes ago, kwilco said:

So you haven't got a point to make yourself...despite the quotation.

How dare you, sir?! He's had a couple of blow jobs and now understands everything about the game. Not unlike his deep knowledge of just about any subject that he cares to name. A very modest chap IMHO.

10 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Testosterone does that, but again, a man doesn't need to have sex to be healthy as it explained. That it's a positive addition is a no brainer. It has nothing to do with being anti social. Since you like AI, there's this.............Whether abstaining from sex is "unnatural, unhealthy, or anti-social" depends entirely on an individual's context, personal choice, and biological orientation. While sex is a fundamental biological drive for many people, celibacy, abstinence, and asexuality are recognized as normal variations of human behavior that do not inherently cause harm..

For any healthy person, sex is important to feel many things, connection, attraction, closeness, confidence, desire, intimacy, being wanted, motivation and also mental wellbeing, not to mention being a reason to stay disciplined and motivated.

But using or abusing prostitutes might not be the solution. That can also lead to guilt, shame, regret, emptiness, loneliness, anxiety, secrecy, conflict with your own values, feeling disconnected afterwards, fear of being judged or exposed, and for some a need to rationalize or defend it in a very polarized direction.

Again, you, as many others, one way or the other, are painting with too broad a brush.

3 minutes ago, kwilco said:

So you haven't got a point to make yourself...despite the quotation.

I've already stated my thoughts on the subject. I quoted on something I believe in, so that's my point.Have you not been here long enough to see it's also you that does this, post things and shared your thoughts?The post speaks for itself and doesn't even need my thoughts on it. I plainly stated simply that what others say about it, IF they read it through, will show how THEY feel about it, which is all about them and not myself, as I agree with the post. This is hardly the only one written on the subject, which can be easily researched and not up to how men feel about what a woman goes through but them

1 minute ago, Hummin said:

For any healthy person, sex is important to feel many things, connection, attraction, closeness, confidence, desire, intimacy, being wanted, motivation and also mental wellbeing, not to mention being a reason to stay disciplined and motivated.

But using or abusing prostitutes might not be the solution. That can also lead to guilt, shame, regret, emptiness, loneliness, anxiety, secrecy, conflict with your own values, feeling disconnected afterwards, fear of being judged or exposed, and for some a need to rationalize or defend it in a very polarized direction.

Again, you, as many others, one way or the other, are painting with too broad a brush.

All I did was post a topic, and tell how I feel about it. I agree with it, as it has merit, and it mirrors all others who have actually interviewed thousands of prostitutes through the years. Their words matter. while the men who go with these women don't. Yes, sex does those things, and all I said is that people can go without it and still live healthy lives, as long as the men masturbate. I never said it was supposed to be or necessarily a better thing, as sex is always a good thing if both parties are getting something positive from it, which leaves prostitution out, as it always puts a dent in the women involved. This is what that women and all those who have spoken to them has said all along. Addition: Prostitution causes severe physical, psychological, and systemic harm to women, frequently resulting in trauma levels comparable to combat veterans or torture survivors. [1, 2]

Psychological Trauma

• Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder (PTSD): Studies show that roughly 55% to 68% of women in prostitution experience clinical symptoms of PTSD.

• Depression and Anxiety: High rates of generalized anxiety, severe depression, and panic attacks stem from constant threat and societal stigma.

• Dissociation: Many women mentally detach or dissociate from their bodies as a coping mechanism to endure repeated sexual assault and physical abuse.

• Substance Abuse: High rates of alcohol and drug addiction frequently develop as tools to numb physical pain or escape psychological distress.

Physical and Health Damage

• Physical Violence: Women in the sex trade face extreme rates of routine physical assault, rape, battering, and captivity by buyers and pimps.

• Chronic Illness: Constant high stress leads to premature aging, chronic pelvic floor damage, gastrointestinal disorders, and sleep disturbances.

• Infections: Women face elevated risks of sexually transmitted infections (STIs) and chronic reproductive tract issues. [1]

Systemic and Social Factors

• Economic Coercion: The vast majority of women enter and remain in prostitution due to extreme poverty, lack of alternative survival options, or trafficking.

• Marginalization: The system disproportionately preys upon women from economically disadvantaged, racialized, or otherwise marginalized backgrounds. [1, 2]

• Human Rights Violations: Major international bodies, such as the UN Human Rights Council, classify prostitution as a systemic form of violence and exploitation rather than legitimate work.

• Are these legitimate or not? Who would disagree?

Edited Saturday at 07:31 AM3 days by fredwiggy

16 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Testosterone does that, but again, a man doesn't need to have sex to be healthy as it explained. That it's a positive addition is a no brainer. It has nothing to do with being anti social. Since you like AI, there's this.............Whether abstaining from sex is "unnatural, unhealthy, or anti-social" depends entirely on an individual's context, personal choice, and biological orientation. While sex is a fundamental biological drive for many people, celibacy, abstinence, and asexuality are recognized as normal variations of human behavior that do not inherently cause harm..

Sex is indeed a fundamental biological drive, and not having sex is negative for a variety of reasons.

Celibacy is not a realistic option for those outside of monkhood, and we all know how healthy that abstinence tends to be. I have no interest in becoming a pedophile.

Edited Saturday at 07:28 AM3 days by Cameroni

4 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

All I did was post a topic, and tell how I feel about it

This is not true @fredwiggy You also denounced anyone who refused to read it and pre-judged the comments.

Backpedalling and gaslighting...

It's doesn't work here, because it's in writing.

One can only imagine how people close to you who didn't have the benefit of having your words in writing, would suffer.

I reckon Thais would be mocking us for this thread, guys.

Could we be any whiter?

8 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

which leaves prostitution out, as it always puts a dent in the women involved.

Men too @fredwiggy Men too.

They exploit each other.

15 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

I've already stated my thoughts on the subject. I quoted on something I believe in, so that's my point.Have you not been here long enough to see it's also you that does this, post things and shared your thoughts?The post speaks for itself and doesn't even need my thoughts on it. I plainly stated simply that what others say about it, IF they read it through, will show how THEY feel about it, which is all about them and not myself, as I agree with the post. This is hardly the only one written on the subject, which can be easily researched and not up to how men feel about what a woman goes through but them

Fred, that is exactly the problem. You say the post speaks for itself, but then you also say how people respond shows how they feel about women.

That makes disagreement with the article into something personal about the men disagreeing with it, instead of allowing that parts of the article itself can be questioned.

I do not doubt many women are abused, trapped or exploited. But women are not one group with one experience, and neither are prostitutes in New York, Thailand, Europe or anywhere else.

If you say we should listen to women themselves, then we also have to listen to the women who do not describe themselves as victims.

Do you deny there are women who actually take advantage of men, and use their skills as women as best they can? Do you deny some women can enjoy the feeling of having power over men, using both their body and their intellect to find the weak points in men, and that some specialize in certain types of men?

That does not excuse the men who knowingly use and abuse women because they can, or who look away from the fact that what they are doing can hurt women who are not in a position of power and have few or no real options in life. Many of these women also struggle to handle a normal day to day job or stay consistent, and some carry trauma or mental health challenges that make them even more vulnerable.

There is also something about those who spend time, or even years, in red light districts, then find themselves a partner and suddenly overnight become more holy than the Pope. You see the difference between how some behave in tourist districts and how they behave once they go home or settle down. Some never change at all and do not know when their time is over, but in general there is a lot of selective morality going on.

2 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

Sex is indeed a fundamental biological drive, and not having sex is negative for a variety of reasons.

Celibacy is not a realistic option for those outside of monkhood, and we all know how healthy that abstinence tends to be. I have no interest in becoming a pedophile.

Abstinence doesn't make people into pedophiles. This is from Academic Psychology Is it true that celibacy, abstinence and sexual repression can cause deviances in sexuality?

This seems intuitive enough, but I would seriously caution against invoking a "deviance" that isn't well-defined, as deviance is always in relation to a specific cultural context. In other words, the same actions carry different psychological significance depending if they represent a deviance from a cultural norm or not. If celibacy is a cultural norm, being celibate isn't going to carry the same significance as celibacy in a culture that doesn't have that norm. For this reason, I think this situation is far more nuanced than "celibacy=repression => paraphilia and child abuse".

I am asking this because I wonder if the cases of sexual abuse (especially to children) being common in religious institutions has something to do with repressive sexual ethic or asceticism of organised religion

This is why I brought up a more social psychological and sociological sense of "deviance". Being fixated on celibacy as a repressive sexual ethic (because I assume it isn't a cultural norm in your context) does nothing to explain why the Boy Scouts of America went bankrupt due to the largest sexual abuse settlement in US history. In these cases, like abuse in general, I wonder if it's more an issue of power with a lack of oversight than sexuality that explains the rates of child abuse in both the Catholic Church and the Boy Scouts.

Can repression cause paraphilias?

I think this is a simplistic understanding of human sexuality. There isn't a normal sexuality that somehow gets "abnormal" due to bad events, all sexuality reflects the unique development of the individual person. From a behavioral point of view, this can be just a matter of accidental conditioning, not "putting a cork" in a "natural" sexuality. Like the question of deviance above, Lehmiller's The Psychology of Human Sexuality shows sexuality and sexual arousal as taking place within a social context and an individual learning history.This link explains more...........https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4492978/

Just now, Hummin said:

Fred, that is exactly the problem. You say the post speaks for itself, but then you also say how people respond shows how they feel about women.

That makes disagreement with the article into something personal about the men disagreeing with it, instead of allowing that parts of the article itself can be questioned.

I do not doubt many women are abused, trapped or exploited. But women are not one group with one experience, and neither are prostitutes in New York, Thailand, Europe or anywhere else.

If you say we should listen to women themselves, then we also have to listen to the women who do not describe themselves as victims.

Do you deny there are women who actually take advantage of men, and use their skills as women as best they can? Do you deny some women can enjoy the feeling of having power over men, using both their body and their intellect to find the weak points in men, and that some specialize in certain types of men?

That does not excuse the men who knowingly use and abuse women because they can, or who look away from the fact that what they are doing can hurt women who are not in a position of power and have few or no real options in life. Many of these women also struggle to handle a normal day to day job or stay consistent, and some carry trauma or mental health challenges that make them even more vulnerable.

There is also something about those who spend time, or even years, in red light districts, then find themselves a partner and suddenly overnight become more holy than the Pope. You see the difference between how some behave in tourist districts and how they behave once they go home or settle down. Some never change at all and do not know when their time is over, but in general there is a lot of selective morality going on.

I've stated what I feel about this, and that I'm well aware of predator women who are evil minded. This isn't about them but the women who are in this trade.

I think some here aren't understanding what I stated, which I've done numerous times.

There isn't any judgement as other's words are what describes them and how they feel about things, which has nothing to do with me.

There are definite misogynists on this forum as many have stated, some with their own words what women are to them,and of course they will tell how they feel about women in general, let alone women who are paid for in this trade.

Question: Do some males dominate over females. Of course they do.

This topic explained how prostitution is one way they do, and if it's FULLY read, it speaks for itself. it doesn't matter who wrote it, as it mirrors many other articles and studies done by those who actually interviewed those thousands of prostitutes from all over, and not just Thailand.

Edited Saturday at 07:46 AM3 days by fredwiggy

Abstinence doesn't make people into pedophiles. This is from Academic Psychology Is it true that celibacy, abstinence and sexual repression can cause deviances in sexuality?

This seems intuitive enough, but I would seriously caution against invoking a "deviance" that isn't well-defined, as deviance is always in relation to a specific cultural context. In other words, the same actions carry different psychological significance depending if they represent a deviance from a cultural norm or not. If celibacy is a cultural norm, being celibate isn't going to carry the same significance as celibacy in a culture that doesn't have that norm. For this reason, I think this situation is far more nuanced than "celibacy=repression => paraphilia and child abuse".

That's wrong. Celibacy does turn men into pedophiles. We saw it with priests, who lack the opportunity for sex but have a lot of opportunity to interact with boys. We saw it with arab sheep herders who end up getting jiggy with their sheep, because of lack of opportunity.

Lack of sex seriously effs people up. It does create deviants and crazy people.

6 minutes ago, IsmeUno said:

which leaves prostitution out, as it always puts a dent in the women involved.

I should bloody hope so. Otherwise, they aint doing it right, lol.

All jokes aside, they know where the 300 baht a day jobs are.

What is a short time now, 2-4k or something?

Up to them. Hell mend 'em.

19 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

All I did was post a topic, and tell how I feel about it. I agree with it, as it has merit, and it mirrors all others who have actually interviewed thousands of prostitutes through the years. Their words matter. while the men who go with these women don't. Yes, sex does those things, and all I said is that people can go without it and still live healthy lives, as long as the men masturbate. I never said it was supposed to be or necessarily a better thing, as sex is always a good thing if both parties are getting something positive from it, which leaves prostitution out, as it always puts a dent in the women involved. This is what that women and all those who have spoken to them has said all along. Addition: Prostitution causes severe physical, psychological, and systemic harm to women, frequently resulting in trauma levels comparable to combat veterans or torture survivors. [1, 2]

Psychological Trauma

• Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder (PTSD): Studies show that roughly 55% to 68% of women in prostitution experience clinical symptoms of PTSD.

• Depression and Anxiety: High rates of generalized anxiety, severe depression, and panic attacks stem from constant threat and societal stigma.

• Dissociation: Many women mentally detach or dissociate from their bodies as a coping mechanism to endure repeated sexual assault and physical abuse.

• Substance Abuse: High rates of alcohol and drug addiction frequently develop as tools to numb physical pain or escape psychological distress.

Physical and Health Damage

• Physical Violence: Women in the sex trade face extreme rates of routine physical assault, rape, battering, and captivity by buyers and pimps.

• Chronic Illness: Constant high stress leads to premature aging, chronic pelvic floor damage, gastrointestinal disorders, and sleep disturbances.

• Infections: Women face elevated risks of sexually transmitted infections (STIs) and chronic reproductive tract issues. [1]

Systemic and Social Factors

• Economic Coercion: The vast majority of women enter and remain in prostitution due to extreme poverty, lack of alternative survival options, or trafficking.

• Marginalization: The system disproportionately preys upon women from economically disadvantaged, racialized, or otherwise marginalized backgrounds. [1, 2]

• Human Rights Violations: Major international bodies, such as the

  , classify prostitution as a systemic form of violence and exploitation rather than legitimate work.

• Are these legitimate or not? Who would disagree?

Again, you show statistics and research coming from western women in New York, Baltimore and Europe, and the funny thing is, sex workers themselves disagree with this polarized debate.

There are also studies where prostitutes do not see themselves as victims, and where much of the damage comes from the stigma around the work, especially when articles and people keep telling them what they are, what they should feel, and what their life supposedly means.

And honestly, many Asian girls and women working in tourist districts who go with men do not see themselves as prostitutes at all. They see what they do in a completely different way, unless they are trapped, controlled or have no real free will.

That is why you cannot take one western definition, one group of women, and one victim model and apply it everywhere.