2009 Formula One Season

[rixalex]

Give the Finns this, they keep their sense of humour well hidden behind that stoic exterior!

[wackysleet]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/motorsport...one/8286418.stm

"All of what happened was robbery. Regarding the race nothing has happened, the result stays the same. That's not right," said Massa.

I agree. That the results of this race are left as they are is bizarre. I appreciate that short of re-running the enitre race, it's difficult to undo the wrong, but a start would be taking back the Winner's Trophy and scratching the points that Renault scored that weekend. I would have thought that would go without saying.

"It changed the championship. I lost by one point."

I agree. It did change the championship. Whether or not it caused Massa to lose the title however is something we'll never know until the day of time travel.

Anyway, i think for Alonso's first day at work he should pencil in an after-hours drink with Massa so he can buy the lad a beer and apologise for wittingly/unwittingly (you chose) being at the centre of it all!

I couldn't open the link for some reason but assume it was about the race fixing against Renault and Co. my sentiments are that Renault should have been disqualified for this year and all points removed from the record, as for Alonso, in the absence of any evidence relating to his involvement the very least the FIA should have done is made the race null and void, of course if evidence does subsequently come to light he should be penalised in some way, fining him money is probably not the answer.

It would appear whatever the FIA has said the reality is that Renault have gotten away with this very lightly and Ecclestone has openly said that Briatorre was dealt with very harshly and advised him to appeal. The benefit to the sport of removing the points that Renault have scored this season would have an impact on how much cash they get towards expenses next year possibly making teams think twice about walking a straight line.

[wackysleet]

he's (Kimi) just being a finn

That's being a bit harsh on Finnish people.

Not really, we have two three million of them. Some are even better drivers than him but never made it to F1. I personally know one retired taxi driver from Helsinki that drove his merc almost 3 million clicks and never blew an engine. Kimi had a habit of destroying several of them in one season...

The taxi driver was probably faster too. .

[Mosha]

Massa you are wanke_r.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/for...icle6857588.ece

[rixalex]

^^ Yes he is.

And a sore loser. Can understand why though. He'll never get that close to winning the title ever - put my house on it. He's an average driver, and average drivers don't (or should i say "shouldn't"?) win titles - this year might be an exception to that rule though!

Edited October 2, 2009 by rixalex

[Mosha]

Oh this is wonderful. He wants Lewis stripped of a title because his new team mate won a race, that resulted from a cheat that Alonso may have been party to. Oh boy but that's rich. That smack on the head was worse than first thought.

[rixalex]

That smack on the head was worse than first thought.

He needs a smack on the bottom.

How can he presume to know what the outcome of the race would have been?

And why does his presumption conveniently leave out his mechanics leaving a donkey knob attached to his car?

If anyone should be moaning about this, it's Rosberg.

Edited October 2, 2009 by rixalex

[TBWG]

Well I'll stick my neck out and predict Hamilton win plus Rosberg and Alonso doing well I also expect Button to feature well towards the end with that heavy fuel load, however everything could go 'tits up' in the event of safety car and or Rain...not sure of weather but at the moment F1 site says it is dry.

TBWG

Well not a bad prediction ... but where did Glock come from

However I feel for Nico.

Realistically Red Bull out of picture now and Jenson needs serious bad luck to throw the championship away... so it's on to Suzuka, does it rain a lot there?

TBWG

IIRC Suzaka is nowhere as bad as Fuji for the weather. I like a wet race as long as the safety car doesn't win.

Are you sure!

TBWG

[Mosha]

Looks like a dry race.

http://weather.msn.com/local.aspx?wealocations=wc:JAXX0112

[Donnyboy]

Alguersuari & Glock crash in Q2 both cars wrecked

gravel trap in both cases didnt work, gee hope nothing worse happens

Buemi crashed in Q1 but didnt break any thing apart from the rear wing,

edit and again at the end of Q2

drama~ Button and Barrichello qualified under yellow flag.....

never seen so much drama in Quals

Edited October 3, 2009 by Donnyboy

[Donnyboy]

Q3 guess what? Kovalainen crashes

[ignis]

drama~ Button and Barrichello qualified under yellow flag.....

I think that would be fine....... The yellow flag = drivers must lift off, if they both did then it is fine, wonder when they would have been without the yellow flag. As I see it if they did not lift off the Button would move down 1 place and Barrichello 2 places.

[Mosha]

7 drivers to visit the stewards

Alonso

Heidfeld

Kubica

Barrichello

Sutil

Buemi

[Mosha]

Grid after penalties

1. Vettel Red Bull-Renault

2. Trulli Toyota

3. Hamilton McLaren-Mercedes

4. Heidfeld BMW-Sauber

5. Raikkonen Ferrari

6. Rosberg Williams-Toyota

7. Kubica BMW-Sauber

8. Sutil Force India-Mercedes *

9. Barrichello Brawn-Mercedes *

10. Alguersuari Toro Rosso-Ferrari

11. Button Brawn-Mercedes *

12. Fisichella Ferrari

13. Kovalainen McLaren-Mercedes **

14. Buemi Toro Rosso-Ferrari *

15. Nakajima Williams-Toyota

16. Grosjean Renault

17. Alonso Renault *

18. Liuzzi Force India-Mercedes **

19. Glock Toyota ***

20. Webber Red Bull-Renault ***

Fuel

01 McLaren Mercedes Lewis Hamilton 656.0

02 McLaren Mercedes Heikki Kovalainen 675.0

03 Ferrari Giancarlo Fisichella 661.5*

04 Ferrari Kimi Räikkönen 661.0

05 BMW Sauber Robert Kubica 686.0*

06 BMW Sauber Nick Heidfeld 660.0

07 Renault Fernando Alonso 689.5*

08 Renault Romain Grosjean 691.8*

09 Toyota Jarno Trulli 655.5

11 STR Ferrari Jaime Alguersuari 682.5*

12 STR Ferrari Sébastien Buemi 665.4*

15 RBR Renault Sebastian Vettel 658.5

16 Williams Toyota Nico Rosberg 684.5*

17 Williams Toyota Kazuki Nakajima 695.7*

20 Force India Mercedes Adrian Sutil 650.0

21 Force India Mercedes Vitantonio Liuzzi 682.5*

22 Brawn Mercedes Jenson Button 658.5

23 Brawn Mercedes Rubens Barrichello 660.5

[TBWG]

Singha Beer Powers to pole at Suzuka!

Think this calls for a few large ones to celebrate!

TBWG

[TBWG]

Grid after penalties

1. Vettel Red Bull-Renault

2. Trulli Toyota

3. Hamilton McLaren-Mercedes

4. Heidfeld BMW-Sauber

5. Raikkonen Ferrari

6. Rosberg Williams-Toyota

7. Kubica BMW-Sauber

8. Sutil Force India-Mercedes *

9. Barrichello Brawn-Mercedes *

10. Alguersuari Toro Rosso-Ferrari

11. Button Brawn-Mercedes *

12. Fisichella Ferrari

13. Kovalainen McLaren-Mercedes **

14. Buemi Toro Rosso-Ferrari *

15. Nakajima Williams-Toyota

16. Grosjean Renault

17. Alonso Renault *

18. Liuzzi Force India-Mercedes **

19. Glock Toyota ***

20. Webber Red Bull-Renault ***

Fuel

01 McLaren Mercedes Lewis Hamilton 656.0

02 McLaren Mercedes Heikki Kovalainen 675.0

03 Ferrari Giancarlo Fisichella 661.5*

04 Ferrari Kimi Räikkönen 661.0

05 BMW Sauber Robert Kubica 686.0*

06 BMW Sauber Nick Heidfeld 660.0

07 Renault Fernando Alonso 689.5*

08 Renault Romain Grosjean 691.8*

09 Toyota Jarno Trulli 655.5

11 STR Ferrari Jaime Alguersuari 682.5*

12 STR Ferrari Sébastien Buemi 665.4*

15 RBR Renault Sebastian Vettel 658.5

16 Williams Toyota Nico Rosberg 684.5*

17 Williams Toyota Kazuki Nakajima 695.7*

20 Force India Mercedes Adrian Sutil 650.0

21 Force India Mercedes Vitantonio Liuzzi 682.5*

22 Brawn Mercedes Jenson Button 658.5

23 Brawn Mercedes Rubens Barrichello 660.5

Surely Rosberg and Kubica look in good shape with their fuel loads? Although If and it's a big if there are no safety car periods then its anybodies guess!

TBWG.

edit spelling!

Edited October 3, 2009 by TBWG

[dabest]

a real sport is using your own body to do something and prove ones self

not polluting the environment and wasting gas

shame on such activity in todays world

go green and wake up

my 2 baht

[Donnyboy]

a real sport is using your own body to do something and prove ones self

not polluting the environment and wasting gas

shame on such activity in todays world

go green and wake up

my 2 baht

yup agree. Was goin to watch the synchronised swimming this weekend, but it wasnt on, so F1 it is.

[rixalex]

a real sport is using your own body to do something and prove ones self

not polluting the environment and wasting gas

shame on such activity in todays world

go green and wake up

my 2 baht

But just think of all the electricity you wasted to compose that message.

[rixalex]

On a serious note, that qualifying session highlighted to me the drawbacks of the current qualifying system.

Despite all the tweaks they have given it over the last ten years of so, i can't help feeling that the way it was before - a 1 hour session with drivers given 12 laps - was better.

I think the most disappointing aspect for me of the current set-up is the final Q3 session which always seems far too short and all a bit anticlimatic.

Does anyone know if they are looking at any changes to qualifying for next year?

P.S. Congrats to Vettel - great lap he did. He'll have to watch himself going through the first corner as i wouldn't mind betting Lewis will be doing his upmost to dive past late on the brakes.

[TBWG]

7 drivers to visit the stewards

Alonso

Heidfeld

Kubica

Barrichello

Sutil

Buemi

Mosha

Nought out of ten for maths!

TBWG

[TBWG]

On a serious note, that qualifying session highlighted to me the drawbacks of the current qualifying system.

Despite all the tweaks they have given it over the last ten years of so, i can't help feeling that the way it was before - a 1 hour session with drivers given 12 laps - was better.

I think the most disappointing aspect for me of the current set-up is the final Q3 session which always seems far too short and all a bit anticlimatic.

Does anyone know if they are looking at any changes to qualifying for next year?

P.S. Congrats to Vettel - great lap he did. He'll have to watch himself going through the first corner as i wouldn't mind betting Lewis will be doing his upmost to dive past late on the brakes.

Hi

Think I have read somewhere that qualifying next year is more of the same but with the numbers eliminated each cession juggled with to reflect the enlarged grid!

I believe the idea of Q3 being short is to create a climax BUT when you get a situation like today it has the opposite effect. Also this weekend has not been helped by the tyre or lack of them situation, where the teams are reluctant to do any running consequently all the mistakes are made in qualy.

Perhaps it is the tyre allocation that needs looking at?

IMHO Whatever you do the teams will seek an advantage if you gave them free rein for an hour they would do bugger all for the first 55 minutes or if you give them each a timed run then track conditions would change for each competitor. I think we have the current system because it is seen as the most fair and entertaining for the spectators.

TBWG

[TBWG]

Grid after penalties

1. Vettel Red Bull-Renault

2. Trulli Toyota

3. Hamilton McLaren-Mercedes

4. Heidfeld BMW-Sauber

5. Raikkonen Ferrari

6. Rosberg Williams-Toyota

7. Kubica BMW-Sauber

8. Sutil Force India-Mercedes *

9. Barrichello Brawn-Mercedes *

10. Alguersuari Toro Rosso-Ferrari

11. Button Brawn-Mercedes *

12. Fisichella Ferrari

13. Kovalainen McLaren-Mercedes **

14. Buemi Toro Rosso-Ferrari *

15. Nakajima Williams-Toyota

16. Grosjean Renault

17. Alonso Renault *

18. Liuzzi Force India-Mercedes **

19. Glock Toyota ***

20. Webber Red Bull-Renault ***

Fuel

01 McLaren Mercedes Lewis Hamilton 656.0

02 McLaren Mercedes Heikki Kovalainen 675.0

03 Ferrari Giancarlo Fisichella 661.5*

04 Ferrari Kimi Räikkönen 661.0

05 BMW Sauber Robert Kubica 686.0*

06 BMW Sauber Nick Heidfeld 660.0

07 Renault Fernando Alonso 689.5*

08 Renault Romain Grosjean 691.8*

09 Toyota Jarno Trulli 655.5

11 STR Ferrari Jaime Alguersuari 682.5*

12 STR Ferrari Sébastien Buemi 665.4*

15 RBR Renault Sebastian Vettel 658.5

16 Williams Toyota Nico Rosberg 684.5*

17 Williams Toyota Kazuki Nakajima 695.7*

20 Force India Mercedes Adrian Sutil 650.0

21 Force India Mercedes Vitantonio Liuzzi 682.5*

22 Brawn Mercedes Jenson Button 658.5

23 Brawn Mercedes Rubens Barrichello 660.5

Gawd this is getting complicated~~~ see below and I doubt thats the end of it!

3 October 2009 by Keith Collantine

The FIA has said the final grid will be announced on Sunday morning in Japan. There is some confusing as to what order penalties were issued in, which could alter the starting order. In the meantime this is the expected grid:

1. Sebastian Vettel, Red Bull-Renault – 1′32.160

2. Jarno Trulli, Toyota – 1′32.220

3. Lewis Hamilton, McLaren-Mercedes – 1′32.396

4. Nick Heidfeld, BMW – 1′32.945

5. Kimi Raikkonen, Ferrari – 1′32.980

6. Rubens Barrichello, Brawn-Mercedes – 1′32.660***

7. Adrian Sutil, Force India-Mercedes – 1′32.466***

8. Nico Rosberg, Williams-Toyota – 1′31.482

9. Jenson Button, Brawn-Mercedes – 1′32.962***

10. Heikki Kovalainen, McLaren-Mercedes – no time*

11. Sebastien Buemi, Toro Rosso-Ferrari – no time****

12. Robert Kubica, BMW – 1′32.341

13. Jaime Alguersuari, Toro Rosso-Ferrari – no time

14. Giancarlo Fisichella, Ferrari – 1′31.704

15. Kazuki Nakajima, Williams-Toyota – 1′31.718

16. Romain Grosjean, Renault – 1′32.073

17. Fernando Alonso, Renault – 1′31.638***

18. Vitantonio Liuzzi, Force India-Mercedes – 1′32.087*

19. Mark Webber, Red Bull-Renault – no time**

Penalties

*five-place penalty for a gearbox change

**will start from pit lane

***five-place penalty for failing to slow down sufficiently under yellow flags

****five-place penalty for driving an unsafe car back to the pits

The penalties were applied in the following order:

17:52: Alonso (drops to 17th)

18:05: Barrichello (drops to tenth, Button sixth, Kovalainen eighth, Buemi ninth)

18:07: Button (drops to 11th, Barrichello ninth, Kovalainen seventh, Buemi eighth)

18:08: Sutil (drops to ninth, Barrichello eighth, Kovalainen sixth, Buemi seventh)

18:54: Kovalainen (drops to 11th, Sutil eighth, Barrichello seventh, Button tenth, Buemi sixth)

19:18: Buemi (drops to 11th, Sutil seventh, Barrichello sixth, Button ninth, Kovalainen tenth)

Not starting:

Timo Glock, Toyota

Time will tell

TBWG

[Mosha]

7 drivers to visit the stewards

Alonso

Heidfeld

Kubica

Barrichello

Sutil

Buemi

Mosha

Nought out of ten for maths!

TBWG

Oops I missed Button.

[Mosha]

To me that tyre rule is just another example of the FIA interfering in team tactics. They should stick to concentrating on safety and cheating as in crashgate. Actually I'm surprised the EU hasn't protested the single tyre manufacturer as anti competition laws are surely being broken.

[rixalex]

I believe the idea of Q3 being short is to create a climax BUT when you get a situation like today it has the opposite effect.

Even without yesterday's crashes and red flags, the final Q3 is just a ten minute session. The first four minutes nothing happens. Then cars are on their out laps. That leaves us with about 4 or 5 minutes of action, with the cameras unable to pick up on all of the important flying laps.

For me, although it throws in an element of chance i think it would be better value for money if they did allocate time slots for each car to individually do their flying lap. They can time it so that it is back to back, with one car on a flier whilst another one is coming round on their out lap. Not sure how it would work out on time if they were given 3 time slots - guess that depends on how many cars their are in the field, but if necessary i wouldn't have a problem with them making a longer overall session - an hour and a half or even two hours.

P.S. Did anyone else find a few things to chuckle about yesterday? I had to when Lewis asked his race engineeer on the state of Heikki after his crash. He said, "yes Lewis, he's ok..... he's ok for now" For now???!!! What did that mean? Were they going to give him a good pasting over when he got back to the pits?

Then there was all that business with Slater telling us the 130R was so named because that was the maximum speed cars could take it when the track was built! Did he just make that up? Surely he wouldn't have just guessed? Does the man not do any research?

One more comment about the commentating - how many times do you notice something that seems obvious that they (the commentators) don't pick up on? I was bemused in Q2 as they were waving the yellows and drivers were coming round on their final flying laps in the dying seconds - bemused because i thought surely they would have to abort their laps, what with the fact that they have to lift off the throttle. Didn't seem to occur to Alex or Slater, as they didn't mention it. Weird....

[Mosha]

Their was Dawson's Slaterism commenting on Lewis's former team mate Heikki.

[Donnyboy]

I got the Supersport coverage so didnt have Slater commentating. Dont know who is commentating on SS, but I heard them say something on the 2 qualifiers, Button & Barra at the time

Murry Walkers in the making?

Looking forward to the Race, should be a ripper. The first lap's gonna be interesting.

Edited October 4, 2009 by Donnyboy

[Donnyboy]

Singha Beer Powers to pole at Suzuka!

Think this calls for a few large ones to celebrate!

TBWG

hehe Singha wins!!!!!!!

Red Bull, 7-11 the Thais will claim this as their win

I love Fuji TV, see all the girls in Pink...waahaay!!!

[TBWG]

Well a reasonably eventful weekend, roll on Brazil!

It occurred to me that these days with the grid so tightly packed and usually the majority covered by less than 2 secs. That back markers are a thing of the past, gone are the days when they would be lapped several times.

Today for example (ignoring Webber who was going for the all time pit stop record) only Grosjean was lapped and only near the end of the race and after the odd excursion.

It really is tough out there!

TBWG