Immigration Crackdown On Border Runners

[MJo]

I see there is three different scenarios discussed here and mixed...

First goup is the real illegals. One just need to look tv threads on "working on internet". Several tv members quite openly admid that they are working "on the internet" without work permit as they can not see the point of needing one as they work "on the internet" not in thailand. Even if they reside here permanently and perform their work in their rented apartments in Thailand. English teatchers i do not know but based on comments here there must be quite few of them without work permits or with fake degrees. I guess these are the illegals we are talking about and all pretty much agree that the new rules are to flush them out or get them to acquire proper visas ?

Second goup is those genuine cases that are under 50, not married, support themselfs here with money from savings, overseas income from property, stock markets or other legit income from overseas not requiring work permit in thailand. Basicly we are talking people who has enough money to retire before reaching 50. Are these guys loaded enough to get tourist visas (as it is cheaper than border running) or can acquire one year non-O from Us or from AUS etc ?

Third is under 50 retirees that do not have the funds. Not doing anything illegal, just wanting to stay here permanently but lack the funds. If you do not have the cash to spend every three months for a tourist visa trip and are forced to do border run every two weeks (more expensive in long run but requires less cash invested per every two weeks trip) how can you support yourself, your family etc etc mentioned in posts here if you can not fork out couple of thousand baht every three months ? I mean if you are not able to do tourist visas maybe you are better off somewhere else ? Or is it Thai government responsibility to support you so that you can stay ? I think not as thai government does not support it's own citizens i fail to see how they should support and make it easier for foreigners without necessary funds to stay here.

Personally i have said i fully agree that Thai government has the right to kick illegals out or force them to get legit. I also agree that they should make it easier for those legit under 50 retirees, age has nothing to do it in the end. Ask the same 600k regardless of age or lower the age to 30 or something. Then the last group is the sad one, IMHO if one really is not able to support himself with tourist visas it is time get back home or somewhere else to raise bit cash before "retiring" again.

[chiangrai]

I see there is three different scenarios discussed here and mixed...

First goup is the real illegals. One just need to look tv threads on "working on internet". Several tv members quite openly admid that they are working "on the internet" without work permit as they can not see the point of needing one as they work "on the internet" not in thailand. Even if they reside here permanently and perform their work in their rented apartments in Thailand. English teatchers i do not know but based on comments here there must be quite few of them without work permits or with fake degrees. I guess these are the illegals we are talking about and all pretty much agree that the new rules are to flush them out or get them to acquire proper visas ?

Second goup is those genuine cases that are under 50, not married, support themselfs here with money from savings, overseas income from property, stock markets or other legit income from overseas not requiring work permit in thailand. Basicly we are talking people who has enough money to retire before reaching 50. Are these guys loaded enough to get tourist visas (as it is cheaper than border running) or can acquire one year non-O from Us or from AUS etc ?

Third is under 50 retirees that do not have the funds. Not doing anything illegal, just wanting to stay here permanently but lack the funds. If you do not have the cash to spend every three months for a tourist visa trip and are forced to do border run every two weeks (more expensive in long run but requires less cash invested per every two weeks trip) how can you support yourself, your family etc etc mentioned in posts here if you can not fork out couple of thousand baht every three months ? I mean if you are not able to do tourist visas maybe you are better off somewhere else ? Or is it Thai government responsibility to support you so that you can stay ? I think not as thai government does not support it's own citizens i fail to see how they should support and make it easier for foreigners without necessary funds to stay here.

Personally i have said i fully agree that Thai government has the right to kick illegals out or force them to get legit. I also agree that they should make it easier for those legit under 50 retirees, age has nothing to do it in the end. Ask the same 600k regardless of age or lower the age to 30 or something. Then the last group is the sad one, IMHO if one really is not able to support himself with tourist visas it is time get back home or somewhere else to raise bit cash before "retiring" again.

just got the uasual 15 days in mae sai,wednesday,yesterday,

i presume that next time that will be finished,

so it's go to vientiane for a double entry,

right or wrong

[ozzydom]

Does it have an investment requirement? If so, then yes.

But at least the money you take into Oz can be used to purchase property IN YOUR OWN NAME and any capitol gains is not taxable .

Only if that property is your primary place of residence, I believe.

That is for Australian citizens ,as a second or third property is judged to be investment income.

Overseas investors do not pay tax on capitol gains made on properties, in fact they dont even have to live in them. If they rented these properties out ,then of course income tax rears its ugly head.

[wefearourdespot]

I think you people should be happy that Thailand accept long term tourists in the first place.

I think Thailand should be happy there are still people who bother to stay long term, instead.

[monekyface]

Chiangrai- did they mark your stamp with a "1"?

[rlp1938]

I know of no other country in the world where you can run to the border and get another stamp therefore allowing you to stay in the country practically indefinitely.

The authorities are only doing what they should have done years ago.

Strange that you never heard of Malaysia

[quinp]

it's obvious you have never lived or worked in Thailand

[andy778]

Hi

I'm sorry but I havent been paying attention lately and I'm sure this is well covered here somewhere, but I'll ask again: What happened to the 3x30 visa-exempt days...(180 days in a year or something) ?

Cheers

[CRUNCHER]

All the Thai Government has demanded is that farang staying here have a visa appropriate to their stay.

People staying here, year after year, on back to back visa runs was legal, but an abuse of the system. Visa exempt entries were intended for tourists, not de facto permanent residents. So they have been tightening up the rules to try and curb the abuse and in so doing have caused problems for many genuine cases. It has not been well handled, but I have some sympathy for the authorities.

Another abuse was the practice of borrowing money for a few days to support extensions for marriage or retirement. This was not illegal, but was an abuse. You were supposed to have the money yourself, to support your living here, not just borrowing it for a few days. Now we have a requirement that money has to be in bank accounts for a certain period. You cannot blame the authorities, but it has caused a lot of problems for many genuine cases.

Thailand has a right to have the immigration laws and procedures it wishes. Every country does. Thailand’s are far from perfect and cause some problems, especially for those under 50 and single, but, taken as a whole, they are not unreasonable.

[Jingthing]

People staying here, year after year, on back to back visa runs was legal, but an abuse of the system. Visa exempt entries were intended for tourists, not de facto permanent residents. So they have been tightening up the rules to try and curb the abuse and in so doing have caused problems for many genuine cases.

As of today, you can still stay here indefinitely on 30 day stamps. Just fly in and out and you can stay here doing that until they change the rules again. And then loosen them again. And so it goes. This is legal, not was legal. Where is the abuse? If they want to restrict that, they will, as they did in the past with the day counting (currently abolished). I find it hilarious when people act like they understand the internal motivations and fickle moves of Thai immigration.

All the Thai Government has demanded is that farang staying here have a visa appropriate to their stay.

Not really. Why do you say that? Currently if you don't want to fly in and out every 30 days you can get UNLIMITED double entry tourist visas and stay here that way indefinitely. Do you actually believe Thai immigration believes people staying here for years that way are tourists? Come on now!

Edited June 4, 2009 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

Hi

I'm sorry but I havent been paying attention lately and I'm sure this is well covered here somewhere, but I'll ask again: What happened to the 3x30 visa-exempt days...(180 days in a year or something) ?

Cheers

It's abolished! Things are easy now. Stay as long as you like, 30 day airport stamps, tourist visas, ED visas, etc. The current change only impacts 15 day land border runners.

[CRUNCHER]

People staying here, year after year, on back to back visa runs was legal, but an abuse of the system. Visa exempt entries were intended for tourists, not de facto permanent residents. So they have been tightening up the rules to try and curb the abuse and in so doing have caused problems for many genuine cases.

As of today, you can still stay here indefinitely on 30 day stamps. Just fly in and out and you can stay here doing that until they change the rules again. And then loosen them again. And so it goes. This is legal, not was legal. Where is the abuse? If they want to restrict that, they will, as they did in the past with the day counting (currently abolished). I find it hilarious when people act like they understand the internal motivations and fickle moves of Thai immigration.

All the Thai Government has demanded is that farang staying here have a visa appropriate to their stay.

Not really. Why do you say that? Currently if you don't want to fly in and out every 30 days you can get UNLIMITED double entry tourist visas and stay here that way indefinitely. Do you actually believe Thai immigration believes people staying here for years that way are tourists? Come on now!

The commennt about visas appropriate to stay was in a Goverment statement in 2006 when they started tightening up on visa runs. Nothing I have seen so far really contradicts this, although as I said it has not been well handled.

Those who go to their home countries every year seem to have little or no trouble getting visas. Embassies/Consulates in SE Asia have been gradually tightening up on tourist visas to prevent the boarder runners from using tourist visas to stay here permanently. You watch - Laos will be next. Non-immigant visas are also becoming more problematic in SE Asia.

They have obviously been trying to make visa exempt entries unprofitable for "permanent residents". Going to a land boarder every 15 days or flying in and out every 30 days is not cost effective.

I get a little fed up reading some posters who, in one sentence say how much they contribute to the Thai ecconomy and in the next say they can't afford to go to their homer country to get a visa. They can't have it both ways.

I think they need to look at financial requirements for extensions based on marriage (does not affect me) and perhaps retirement, but generally in most cases these are not too problematic.

If you are financially sound you are welcome. The problem immigration has is in establishing financial soundness. Presumably one test is if you can afford to go back to your own country once a year. Another is income or money in the bank. Of course these are not fool proof, but they are an indication.

There is room for improvement without compromising the principle of visa appropriate to stay. This does not, however justify the wild critical comments in some posts in this thread.

Edited June 4, 2009 by CRUNCHER

[Jungian]

@Jungian

You simply draw the wrong conclusion by saying "everyone who doesn't have a visa is doing something illegal". This is NOT the case! You could as well say "everyone who owns a car that can go faster than 60 km/h is speeding". Which is BS.

Thailand previously allowed back-to-back border runs indefinitely, so doing those border runs indefinitely was 100% perfectly legal. If the authorities now calling it "abuse" when people used the chances given to them by these same authorities, then what do you call that? Hypocrisy? Sorry i am no native English speaker and that special word manages to escape me right now.

Imagine i would be offering you 1,000 Baht per day for doing nothing. You'll take it. And after some time i would then complain that you are "abusing" my generousity? And someone else would even say "you are stealing from me"..?? Sorry sir, it doesn't work that way. If the authorities generate a possibility and people use it then it is no more than LEGAL.

And again, just because YOU are invited by and working for the government does not mean that everyone else gets that same chance. If that were the case i'd ask you right now to please get me such a job. However i come from a country where the general population does not attend university, instead is educated to become skilled professionals - so i don't have a degree, which is the first thing employers in Thailand ask for. Degree above all else, qualifications? Don't matter. I have two diplomas however, making me a professional in two entirely different fields - still i won't get a job here (at least none that would yield a WP), and as i can't marry my boyfriend i don't have THAT possibility either. At 34 i'm too young to retire, so you as obvious "know-it-all" please feel free to tell me what i can do.

And no, i can't afford a lawyer.

And i am NOT the only one in that situation in Thailand. There are many many people like me, without any possibility to "get legal" as you call it but responsible for a family in Thailand and trying to make ends meet.

Think about people a few steps further down from your position and try to understand them instead of calling them all "illegal".

Regards

Thanh

Not even almost. That is not at all what I said. I said people doing border runs and working or taking up residency are doing something illegal. People here on a 30 day exemption that decide to extend their stay because they are truly tourists more power to them and that goes for tourist visas as well, people who have been here for more than a year on a tourist visa or exemption are playing against the system and not many countries would stand for that. You know d*mn well what I mean and now people are just playing semantics games and reading to much in to it.

You are playing the game and accepting the official line.........all tourists are doing is dealing with the system that is in place. If border runs are legal......THEY ARE LEGAL!

The govt. has created a problem out of a non problem by playing with semantics and tagging these tourists as "border runners" or "perpetual tourists" or whatever.......it is all nonsense.

The Philippines is a good example of a country that will "stand for it." The encourage tourists to stay as long as they want and don't tag them in negative terms.

As long as they are not violating any laws........let them stay........they just spend money. Some are bad but not all of them. The security check at the border should take care of that.

Bottom line is it is coming to an end and the Thai government doesn't owe anyone anything and Thailand is not befitting from this the way everyone seems to think, in many cases it hurts them more than it helps them. Perhaps some individuals in the tourist industry profit from this but it doesn't generate any real capitol for Thailand. I am quite curious how these people live I mean by what standard, no car, no home and if they do have, it is illegal or in someone else's name at which point, where is the security.

You didn't answer my question about the Mexicans. That's ok I know how we all feel about it, the census bureau says by 2050, yes in our life time the USA will be primarily Hispanic as they have 50 babies to our 1, black, white, Native American and loud shades of green will all be the minority and Spanish will mostly likely replace English.

You mentioned you would not get a job that would yield a work permit and you don't have a visa, then you are breaking the law and furthermore probably taking a job away from a qualified Thai person.

You say many people doing border runs can not afford an attorney WOW that means they can't afford to go back to their country for sure, do you see the problem starting to build? If you can not afford an attorney it means you are working in Thailand to survive (eat) at which point YOU ARE BREAKING THE LAW which was my point and you just helped me prove it. If you are working and you do not have a work permit you are just as illegal as that Mexican running across the border but I know there is no way you can compare yourself to him/her but at least if they get caught they have enough money to go home and for a lawyer.

Your argument is based on personal bias and denial of the truth.

[Thanh-BKK]

Yeah.

And you turn words and arguments around to fit your needs. I never said "many people doing border runs can't afford a lawyer", that's out of your fantasy. I said that i myself can't afford a lawyer - but also i said that i do NOT do border runs (except every three months, as i have a non-B visa).

WP or not, it makes no difference in me "taking a job away from a qualified Thai", i'd do exactly the same with a WP. However it might be difficult to find a Thai fluent in German and English with extensive electrical, mechanical and IT skills. Which is why i got my current job. Yes, the company is too small to warrant the required registered capital or Thai-to-Farang ratio, hence no WP. And my salary, while enough to live somewhat comfortably, is not enough to pay the sky-high fees for an attorney. And yes, at present i couldn't afford to go back home either because that ticket cost more than living here for three months, all expenses paid and a movie every weekend. Apart from that, Germany is no longer "home" for me. Thailand is.

About the US becoming hispanic, what on earth does that have to do with me? Or you are asking someone else? Anyway, what's the problem? Are you too lazy or feel too "hi-so" to learn a bit of Spanish? Habla espanol? I learned it in secondary school, but only for half a year because after that i was the only one who wanted to continue the course...... Borders should be abolished entirely, everyone should have the right to live where ever they please, everything else is stupid nationalism. It's not my fault being born in Germany, i could just as well have been born in Mexico, Thailand or Uganda. This is one planet, some day it's gonna be full and then? Still worry about the dangerous illegal immigrants?

By the way you make a few good points, too, namely what you mentioned somewhere earlier "illegally working on the internet". Now for something to be "illegal" there has to be a "legal" alternative. You can't have one without the other. Now can YOU tell me how to LEGALLY work on the internet..??? If you tell me how to get a WP for working on the internet, heck i'll even pay you for it. Because for what i know, i can't have a one-man-company (only myself) and hence can't have an online-shop either. And it kind of defeats the purpose when you need to hire four Thais at 20,000 Baht per month to legally run a business that makes maybe 15,000 Baht a month. If you suggest something, please also show how it's done. Because i can "only suggest" too - how about migrating to Mars? I heard you can own land in your own name there and the immigration rules are VERY relaxed.

Regards......

Thanh

[ubonjoe]

WP or not, it makes no difference in me "taking a job away from a qualified Thai", i'd do exactly the same with a WP. However it might be difficult to find a Thai fluent in German and English with extensive electrical, mechanical and IT skills. Which is why i got my current job. Yes, the company is too small to warrant the required registered capital or Thai-to-Farang ratio, hence no WP. And my salary, while enough to live somewhat comfortably, is not enough to pay the sky-high fees for an attorney. And yes, at present i couldn't afford to go back home either because that ticket cost more than living here for three months, all expenses paid and a movie every weekend. Apart from that, Germany is no longer "home" for me. Thailand is.

If you don't have a work permit you are working ilegally. It does not matter if you have a B visa or not.

I think you need to do a little research on getting a work permit.

The requrements are not near as high as you mentioned. A lot of the problem with what you stated is that you are mixing up WP requirements and getting an extension of stay at immigration. The requirements at immigration are a lot higher.

There is no requrement that a the Thai emplyees be paid 20,000 baht to get a work permit or even an extension.

[Jungian]

Thanh it was to JR Texas and had nothing to do with you.

Also I never mentioned anything about working on the internet actually the thought never entered my mind but if I had an opinion on that, which I don't I would say only if your internet business to targeting actual clients coming to Thailand to make transactions that it might require a work permit. And for what it is worth I speak fluent Spanish to the point Spanish speaking people think I am Colombian including Colombians so, no I'm not lazy, I learn the language of the country I am in I don't expect the country to learn my language my point about that was we speak English in the USA how would you feel if you were forced to speak French in Germany or be unemployable.

Within reason I agree borders should be abolished and I am all for "global citizens" the problem is security and we don't all have the same morals, values or ideology therefore it is and would be a difficult undertaking and who gets the dregs of society...

And as far as you getting a work permit, it sounds like you have a lot to offer and an education thus chances are you probably would qualify as a "consultant" and get the visa for 1,900B and a work permit for 3,500B pay social security 750B per month and get health care and all the other social services offered to us by our hosts.

In any event this topic is getting old everyone knows what they are supposed to do and if you are doing the wrong thing you know it so don't complain when they change the law and inconvenience you for breaking it. I will mention I saw an immigration truck close to the airport about 3 months ago and there were quite a few Western looking people in the cage end of the truck.

[Thanh-BKK]

Hi.

Yeah that's why i am asking that guy... as he seems to know quite a lot. Last time i asked i was told that a company needs a registered capital of 2 Million Baht per WP, alternative a ratio of 4 Thai employees per Farang. If it was my own company i'd need to have 4 Thai employees who would need a minimum salary of 20,000 Baht/month. And of course to register my own company i'd need to have several (seven?) Thai shareholders as well, that cost money, too.

By the way that was a lawyer who told me so.

But the funny thing is, everyone always suggests "get legal" etc but nobody is able or willing to explain how to do that. "Do research" is an answer i get often - how to do research if everyone i ask also says "do research"..? And employing a law firm at 10k Baht per question answered is out of my abilities.

Ideally i'd have my own "company" (internet/E-Bay shop) and take it from there. Hence i asked Jungian if he can explain how to get that done. I am curious if he answers that question. Selling stuff online (buying it in Thailand and sending it abroad, hence "importing money" in return) can't be bad for the Thai economy and certainly can't be illegal.

Kind regards.....

Thanh

[Thanh-BKK]

Sorry Jungian, i was typing while you posted.

And i have to apologise as well for a mixup - it was MJo who was talking about the "working on the internet" thing. This topic gets a little confusing with all the quotes and stuff, so please accept my apology.

Regarding myself, without bragging, i'd say i have a few things to offer, abilities that is. However i do NOT have the ONE thing everyone asks for - a degree. Which is the sole reason i am doing what i'm doing.... working without WP. At least i admit it, i know a ton of people (also on this forum) that act as if everything was fine when in fact they are just like me. I won't expose anyone, it's not my business. Others "earn" a degree on Khao Sarn road. I'd beg in the street before doing that (yes i've been a hooker a long time ago - better a low but honest job that one based on a faked piece of paper).

I don't want to hijack this topic which is about the crackdown on border hops, if you like we can stay in touch via PM (or e-mail), i do always appreciate information and assistance on "getting legal" if there is such a thing for a degree-less non-native English speaker who has no other skills than being able to learn what he doesn't know yet..... and who prefers to work with his hands rather than his mouth (no teaching, please, not even German).

Best regards.....

Thanh

[marvelgodmond]

Luck im a 3 year overstayer

How are you coping with a 3 year overstay? I switched jobs recently and did not report at the labour department. One guy told me I will be fined 20.000box for overstay (2 months). How can I handle this?

Kind regards,

Marvel.

[ubonjoe]

Hi.

Yeah that's why i am asking that guy... as he seems to know quite a lot. Last time i asked i was told that a company needs a registered capital of 2 Million Baht per WP, alternative a ratio of 4 Thai employees per Farang. If it was my own company i'd need to have 4 Thai employees who would need a minimum salary of 20,000 Baht/month. And of course to register my own company i'd need to have several (seven?) Thai shareholders as well, that cost money, too.

By the way that was a lawyer who told me so.

But the funny thing is, everyone always suggests "get legal" etc but nobody is able or willing to explain how to do that. "Do research" is an answer i get often - how to do research if everyone i ask also says "do research"..? And employing a law firm at 10k Baht per question answered is out of my abilities.

Ideally i'd have my own "company" (internet/E-Bay shop) and take it from there. Hence i asked Jungian if he can explain how to get that done. I am curious if he answers that question. Selling stuff online (buying it in Thailand and sending it abroad, hence "importing money" in return) can't be bad for the Thai economy and certainly can't be illegal.

Kind regards.....

Thanh

Have a look at this topic that has the department of employment regulations. It is dated 2004 but I don't think it has changed much if any since then. Have a look at article 6 it will tell you that it can be a business and does not have to be a company with registered capital.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Department-E...0/#entry188450/

I have little faith in what lawyers often say because many times they are acting as salesmen more so than lawyers.

You don't need a degree to get a work permit.

[Lite Beer]

Luck im a 3 year overstayer

How are you coping with a 3 year overstay? I switched jobs recently and did not report at the labour department. One guy told me I will be fined 20.000box for overstay (2 months). How can I handle this?

Kind regards,

Marvel.

Leave Thailand from the airport. Pay the 20,000 Baht fine at Immigration. Get a Visa in a neighbouring country and come back if you wish.

[lopburi3]

Luck im a 3 year overstayer

How are you coping with a 3 year overstay? I switched jobs recently and did not report at the labour department. One guy told me I will be fined 20.000box for overstay (2 months). How can I handle this?

Kind regards,

Marvel.

Leave Thailand from the airport. Pay the 20,000 Baht fine at Immigration. Get a Visa in a neighbouring country and come back if you wish.

Why are you overstay? That is an immigration matter and has nothing to do with Labor. If you were on a one year extension of stay and your work ended that extension of stay also ended on that date so unless you depart and return with a new visa entry you are on overstay (although nobody may be aware of it). I suspect you do not have a valid work permit for the new job in that case.

If you are here on a 90 day visa entry you are not overstay and could have changed jobs and have obtained a valid work permit. So without the details it is hard to be sure of your status.

[TVmonitor]

I think you'll find when it comes to finding out who the "visa runners" are - is that no-one has bothered to find out before introducing worthless snippets of legislation on a haphazard basis.

If they really went into it they might - though it's not a certainty - bring in some relevent regulations.

But first - is it a problem? Probably not

Second I would suggest that it will become apparent that most "visa-RUNNERS" are in fact long term tourists who are taking a year or two out travelling around Asia......they probably are not organised enough to get visas everytime they leave - or want to save cash - what they are doing is totally within the law - until now -

If it's criminals and teachers - (do these 2 go together? judging by some comments they do!) they want tio flush out, it would probably be simpler just to check schools and places of work.

It's difficult to hide when you have to stand in front of 20 or 30 people and make them listen to you. Also someone has to pay them - and pay tax???

[stub]

By the way you make a few good points, too, namely what you mentioned somewhere earlier "illegally working on the internet". Now for something to be "illegal" there has to be a "legal" alternative. You can't have one without the other. Now can YOU tell me how to LEGALLY work on the internet..??? If you tell me how to get a WP for working on the internet, heck i'll even pay you for it. Because for what i know, i can't have a one-man-company (only myself) and hence can't have an online-shop either. And it kind of defeats the purpose when you need to hire four Thais at 20,000 Baht per month to legally run a business that makes maybe 15,000 Baht a month. If you suggest something, please also show how it's done. Because i can "only suggest" too - how about migrating to Mars? I heard you can own land in your own name there and the immigration rules are VERY relaxed.

Having now talked to accountants without a vested interest in taking my money to setup a local company, it turns out that the opinion that telecommuting like this is illegal only exists on Internet forums.

If you explain your work situation to a vaguely helpful consulate, you will get a 1 year Type-O (Other) or maybe Type-B Visa. You cannot get a work permit as you are not employed by a Thai company, and not working here as as far as the definitions used by Dept. of Labor are concerned. You don't need to submit tax forms because you have no taxable income. Your just another long term tourist as far as the Thai government is concerned. As far as I can tell, it makes no difference if you declare yourself as a a tourist or on business or both on your arrival card, and nobody will blink an eye at your Thailand residential address.

[stub]

Luck im a 3 year overstayer

How are you coping with a 3 year overstay? I switched jobs recently and did not report at the labour department. One guy told me I will be fined 20.000box for overstay (2 months). How can I handle this?

Kind regards,

Marvel.

Leave Thailand from the airport. Pay the 20,000 Baht fine at Immigration. Get a Visa in a neighbouring country and come back if you wish.

And do it quickly. No hassles as far as immigration is concerned - just pay your fine and on your way. If a police officer checks your passport before you get to immigration though, it is jail time.

[ajarnmark]

As usual they are completely ignoring the real problem.

For many people there are no real alternative or very poor alternatives to visa runs. I am one of the lucky ones that got my investment visa in place before they were terminated, but if you are below 50 and wish to stay in Thailand your options are limited.

'Give us your money and get the hel_l out!!', seems to be all they really want.

So if an Afghani guy doing the same thing in your country, how would you feel about him?

[fabianfred]

I just had an interesting talk with a friend who also lives in Fang and is Swiss and has been living here for 20 years. He went to the border at MaeSai three days ago and said he had a long chat with an officer at immigration there. He goes to Vientiane to get a Non-immigrant 'O' visa and follows this up with regular trips to the border at MaeSai. He said that the immigration officer said that with a Non 'O' visa in his passport...even though its three months had expired...he could get unlimited 14 day extensions at the border. The four trips only was for those who entered Thailand on a visa-on-arrival (without a visa) via land entry.

[ubonjoe]

I just had an interesting talk with a friend who also lives in Fang and is Swiss and has been living here for 20 years. He went to the border at MaeSai three days ago and said he had a long chat with an officer at immigration there. He goes to Vientiane to get a Non-immigrant 'O' visa and follows this up with regular trips to the border at MaeSai. He said that the immigration officer said that with a Non 'O' visa in his passport...even though its three months had expired...he could get unlimited 14 day extensions at the border. The four trips only was for those who entered Thailand on a visa-on-arrival (without a visa) via land entry.

I don't think the word as spread to all the border crossing yet.

I don't that is correct about the VOA's because those can only be obtained at very few border crossings and cost 1000 baht each. I think it was a bit of confusion in terminology. A lot people refer to visa exempt entries as VOA's and that of course is incorrect.

[fabianfred]

I just had an interesting talk with a friend who also lives in Fang and is Swiss and has been living here for 20 years. He went to the border at MaeSai three days ago and said he had a long chat with an officer at immigration there. He goes to Vientiane to get a Non-immigrant 'O' visa and follows this up with regular trips to the border at MaeSai. He said that the immigration officer said that with a Non 'O' visa in his passport...even though its three months had expired...he could get unlimited 14 day extensions at the border. The four trips only was for those who entered Thailand on a visa-on-arrival (without a visa) via land entry.

I don't think the word as spread to all the border crossing yet.

I don't that is correct about the VOA's because those can only be obtained at very few border crossings and cost 1000 baht each. I think it was a bit of confusion in terminology. A lot people refer to visa exempt entries as VOA's and that of course is incorrect.

that's what i meant...visa exempt entries

[chiangrai]

I just had an interesting talk with a friend who also lives in Fang and is Swiss and has been living here for 20 years. He went to the border at MaeSai three days ago and said he had a long chat with an officer at immigration there. He goes to Vientiane to get a Non-immigrant 'O' visa and follows this up with regular trips to the border at MaeSai. He said that the immigration officer said that with a Non 'O' visa in his passport...even though its three months had expired...he could get unlimited 14 day extensions at the border. The four trips only was for those who entered Thailand on a visa-on-arrival (without a visa) via land entry.

I don't think the word as spread to all the border crossing yet.

I don't that is correct about the VOA's because those can only be obtained at very few border crossings and cost 1000 baht each. I think it was a bit of confusion in terminology. A lot people refer to visa exempt entries as VOA's and that of course is incorrect.

that's what i meant...visa exempt entries

as i said before,

got a 15 day stamp on wednesday at mai sai,

i have many on my passport allready,

nobody told me not to come back,

they didn't mark a number on it with a pen like when there was a limit before,

so what's happening,

are they actualy going to enforce this rule,

in 13 days i must decide wheather to go back to mai sai or all the way to vientiane.

i've seen this movie before,a short few months ago