Airport Scam Spreads To Skytrain

[samran]

Geeze Samran, Thats not so nice considering my initial post about this only said to use your common sense & use ur brain.

As for the need to go and research every posters prior post's before responding to them, I can only imagine I am the only one not doing so, so silly me.

I find it amusing that dipy tart can read thai, yet comes straight into thai visa and on one of her very first posts makes a comment about being on the wrong site because she thought thai visa was a site for people interested in Thailand.

I'd say thats exactly what youve got here, wouldnt you?

ps: never been fined or scammed in thailand.....had a couple of attempts but they were never successful. (naturally that comment excludes the 3 traffic fines Ive had in the last 20 years, where each time I committed the offence, 2 driving and one parking)

Sorry, I think I may have lost the plot on this one.

I don't really know what you are talking about re: dippy Thai, nor using common sense and brain. I'm using mine, and you appear to be using yours...so I am a bit lost with what you are getting at.

[Old Man River]

I must be on the wrong site - I thought 'ThaiVisa' was for people interested in Thailand.

No Mate sorry to disappoint you.

Thai visa is a site where there are many 'experienced' expats that actually live in Thailand. Theres thousands of years in a collective total cruising the threads here telling their account of how things go down in the land of smiles.

If you want glossy brochures, slide down to the travel agent....now doubt they will be able to sell you something

Don't get me wrong, Thailand is a wonderful place with many wonderful people and its truely worth the visit, however when you pack to come on holiday make sure you don't forget your brain & all your common sense, which seems to be not that common these days. Goodluck and enjoy.

If you notice my second post you'd have seen that I can read thai, so not sure what makes you think i'm a tourist - maybe because i don't agree with the gang of expats who live in farang -ivory towers mansion and whose 'thousands of years' of collective experience involves little more than commuting from their farang oasis via taxis to red-light districts for years on end. There's a whole lot more to thailand than meets their eyes.

For all you peeps who are caught up in this 'thais are all scammers' stereotyping, just imagine if a foreinger lived in a red-light district in your own country and never saw much of the rest of it. What would they think about your country?

To the guy who said 'here's another one that doesn't get it' and then moaned about how the police follow farangs till they drop a butt on the street, the easy answer is: DON"T DROP LITTER AND YOU WON'T GET FINED. Not hard if you just think about it a little.

As for the OP, who DIDN'T drop litter, I feel sorry for him, but like others have said here, i'm not sure all the details are accurate. Was this at MBK or the Skytrain? As anyone else had this experience INSIDE the BTS station? Haven't heard anyone back this up yet.

love

DippyTart (an expat with much less than a thousand years of experience, but still more - apparently - than a lot of others 'round here.)

Don’t worry. We live in what seems to be parallel universes to these guys.

I lived in Soi Kasemsan 1 for about 3 years, went over that bridge more times than I cared to remember on the way to work, on the way home, on the way to the gym. Not once was a pounced on by the coppers in question.

Do I deny the scam occurred to the OP? No.

At the same time, I’m not convinced that the coppers are pulling it on innocent tourists on a regular basis, and I’m convinced that given the level of confusion with the OP’s story, there is something not being told.

My general advice is like yours. Don’t break the law here and you won’t be hassled. I will add though, if you do think you are unfairly being targeted, make a scene, take their photo’s with a camera phone, take their details, or just insist on a written fine, with a receipt, to be paid down at the police station. They’ll soon shy away if they are trying to bust/scam you.

I await a schalacking by the usual suspects.

I have no clue about the security being used on the BTS. Are they police?

[neverdie]

Geeze Samran, Thats not so nice considering my initial post about this only said to use your common sense & use ur brain.

As for the need to go and research every posters prior post's before responding to them, I can only imagine I am the only one not doing so, so silly me.

I find it amusing that dipy tart can read thai, yet comes straight into thai visa and on one of her very first posts makes a comment about being on the wrong site because she thought thai visa was a site for people interested in Thailand.

I'd say thats exactly what youve got here, wouldnt you?

ps: never been fined or scammed in thailand.....had a couple of attempts but they were never successful. (naturally that comment excludes the 3 traffic fines Ive had in the last 20 years, where each time I committed the offence, 2 driving and one parking)

Sorry, I think I may have lost the plot on this one.

I don't really know what you are talking about re: dippy Thai, nor using common sense and brain. I'm using mine, and you appear to be using yours...so I am a bit lost with what you are getting at.

Crikey, now you've got me confused, I don't know what to say

Time to exit, stage right >>>>> or should I go left <<<<<<<

[Ijustwannateach]

Something does sound very strange about this story- but if completely true as told, then the real moral is probably not to look too much like a tourist unless you have locals who can vouch for you in case these situations come up.

As far as I'm aware the security on the BTS are not real police and if you refused to cooperate they would have to summon the real police to deal with you- whether that would be a good thing or not is open to question.

[Jaydillon]

At National Stadium, outside on the overhead walks near the Tokyo department store entrance, police regularly set up a cigarette sting there. It is the police, it is not inside the BTS turnstyles. On the steps and the cross overs above Sukhumvit, there is no signage until you get to the central platform where no smoking is clearly posted, but no ashtrays available. Since I knew this scam, my friend and I stopped, put out the cigarettes and pocketed them. We were stopped in the same manner described by this article and 10,000 baht fine each for littering. When we produced the cigarette butts, there were grins all around and we were released.

From my experience, this story is entirely plausible. And thanks Thai Visa, it was here that I learned about this scam and how to protect myself.

Glad we could be of service to you. Please forward your payment to 'Neverdie' C/- Thai Visa, make sure you cross the cheque not negotiable, you know george . If payment isnt made with 14 days, you may be taken hostage at HQ and kept until a large ransom is met

Neverdie you Naughty boy

[dippytart]

I find it amusing that dipy tart can read thai, yet comes straight into thai visa and on one of her very first posts makes a comment about being on the wrong site because she thought thai visa was a site for people interested in Thailand.

Three cheers for you, neverdie, you got it. My post was intended to make a point by way of irony, which was that the forum seemed so full of negative remarks about thais and thailand its a mystery why some of you are here at all.

And there was I beginning to think no one had got it till neverdie saved the day.

Note to Mod: can we have an emoticon for "warning: irony approaching"...

Edited July 29, 2009 by dippytart

[spidermike007]

I think if I was approached by one of those scrawny little guards, and asked to follow them on a trumped up charge, I would just

walk out of the station. I do not think they could force me to go with them. But, the real issue is this:

Why is Thailand so disinterested in addressing it's staggering level of corruption? If this hooligan, who passes himself off as a

"security guard" was fired, heavily fined (100,00 baht and up), arrested, tried, convicted, and sent to the slammer for five years

on charges of extortion, do you think that news would not get around? The way Thais like to gossip. All of the country would hear

within 24 hours. People would start feeling like the days on immunity against corruption charges are over. Before you say that is not

possible here, take into account that Malaysia has set up a corruption commission, and is making DAILY arrests of top officials,

ministers, local politicians, and businessmen. Indonesia has set up a corruption commission, and so far their antigraft commission

has achieved a 100-percent conviction rate in 86 cases of bribery and graft related to government procurements and budgets. And

where is Thailand in all of this? Why aren't men like Newin, and others, who are coming up with expensive schemes to line their

pockets being arrested, and tried? Why is the CEO of King Power still employed? Why is the Police Captain in charge of the airport

still in his position? Does anyone really think there is even a chance that the King Power scheme is not real? That they are arresting

only guilty shoplifters? Does all King Power have to do is post one video on the internet, of a guilty party, for all of us to let them off

the hook? Is that all it takes? If Thailand wants to rid itself of what surely has to be it's single largest impediment to success, than it

has to start taking corruption seriously, and it has to start punishing the perpetrators heavily.

[Lost in LOS]

to the guys who say the tourist should recognize real police.......please...give me a break. i first came here in 68 and now live here 3+ years and still cant tell for sure. there are so many uniforms running around, the security guards uniform copies the police, just on walking street i can point out many different uniforms. I have no idea who is who so how can a tourist? just on the last influx of US military there was a fpv walking around. you could hardly find fpv but he had a vest on his uniform with big letters that said police. now is he or not. i say not but a tourist will definitely think he is. the western world is taught that someone wearing a uniform with all the trinkets is in charge. here the guys who sweeps the floor might be in full uniform

[FairwayJack]

Oh great...another thing to look out for..

dont stand near ciggy butts while on BTS..

maybe an announcement on speakers needed..

"please mind your butt while standing on platform"

Ha !! Loved that !!

[balo]

Why aren't men like Newin, and others, who are coming up with expensive schemes to line their

pockets being arrested, and tried? Why is the CEO of King Power still employed? Why is the Police Captain in charge of the airport

still in his position?

Maybe they are in charge because they are not corrupted ?

Yes we know its corruption in Thailand but how do you know that the CEO of King Power is involved?

[GungaDin]

Sounds more plausible that Mr Georgesen is scamming his local press - I don't buy this story at all.

You don't live in Thailand then.

I was fined only 200 bt 8 yrs ago, my fault, outside the Emporium, I had been warned by current g/f...... I scoffed.

No more.

A mate was walking home on Sukh at 0300 and was accosted by two cops demanding 10,000bt for a non-existant fag butt.... luckily he only had 2kb left on him..... he doesn't smoke! The soi was filthy with rubbish and fag ends....

I was issued with an official receipt by the cops for my trangression..... my m8 wasn't.

[SoftWater]

Sounds more plausible that Mr Georgesen is scamming his local press - I don't buy this story at all.

You don't live in Thailand then.

Yes I do. Why don't you read the thread before posting inane comments?

To repeat:

I live in Thailand

I never said people don't get scammed in Thailand.

I DID say I don't believe this guy's story that he got scammed INSIDE the BTS station the way it says in the article.

I know people who'be been scammed by police for chucking fag ends. It happened to a mate of mine the other day on Nana. He told the cop to handcuff him and take him to the tourist police booth or police station. The cop didn't want to do that, and eventually took off without a baht.

I was also stopped years ago in Siam Sq when I chucked a fag end in a concrete 'plant pot' full of a thousand others butts. The cop told me 'this is like singapore - no throw away' - he didn't try to fine me at all, and believe me, was I surprised at that So they're NOT all corrupt. And, more importantly, I learned my lesson. I don't drop fag buts anywhere now, and indeed, nor should I (or you if you are concerned about where you live. Lead by example).

Even so, I've had cops take 100 baht off me for non-existing traffic violations ('Farang driving a car' seems to be an offence even if you have a thai driving licence).

NONE of this is the point that I am making when I say I don't believe Mr Sorensen's story. READ it properly - it doesn't add up, and as someone else said above, of all the people who've chimed in here about their personal experiences of being scammed, NOT ONE has said they were also scammed INSIDE the BTS station.

Are we CLEAR now about what the issue is?

Edited July 29, 2009 by SoftWater

[hughben]

This guy should be fined for wearing sandals and socks.

I know a woman who had a REAL massage parlour that did not offer 'extras' and the cops demanded she provided them with tea money monthly.

She had to sell up in the end as it was biting into any profits she was making.

She sold it to a woman who had a Cop boyfriend.

Of course she didn't have to make monthly payments to the tea fund.

[stumonster]

She sold it to a woman who had a Cop boyfriend.

Of course she didn't have to make monthly payments to the tea fund.

she just had to accept deposits ?

[SoftWater]

This guy should be fined for wearing sandals and socks.

Thanks for that one!!

[hhgz]

"I had an incident 6 years ago at Siam Discovery where a Thai female walked into me... and I kicked her"

You are one classy guy.

[GungaDin]

Sounds more plausible that Mr Georgesen is scamming his local press - I don't buy this story at all.

You don't live in Thailand then.

Yes I do. Why don't you read the thread before posting inane comments?

To repeat:

I live in Thailand

Are we CLEAR now about what the issue is?

Dick

Here's a 2nd inane comment for you......

No believe!

[neverdie]

Sounds more plausible that Mr Georgesen is scamming his local press - I don't buy this story at all.

You don't live in Thailand then.

I was fined only 200 bt 8 yrs ago, my fault, outside the Emporium, I had been warned by current g/f...... I scoffed.

No more.

A mate was walking home on Sukh at 0300 and was accosted by two cops demanding 10,000bt for a non-existant fag butt.... luckily he only had 2kb left on him..... he doesn't smoke! The soi was filthy with rubbish and fag ends....

I was issued with an official receipt by the cops for my trangression..... my m8 wasn't.

At the rate you chain smoke, chances are that fines are going to be the least of your worries. Shame on you for throwing ur dirty filthy butts on the ground ...200 baht you got off lightly.

[jtp]

Sounds more plausible that Mr Georgesen is scamming his local press - I don't buy this story at all.

You don't live in Thailand then.

I was fined only 200 bt 8 yrs ago, my fault, outside the Emporium, I had been warned by current g/f...... I scoffed.

No more.

A mate was walking home on Sukh at 0300 and was accosted by two cops demanding 10,000bt for a non-existant fag butt.... luckily he only had 2kb left on him..... he doesn't smoke! The soi was filthy with rubbish and fag ends....

I was issued with an official receipt by the cops for my trangression..... my m8 wasn't.

At the rate you chain smoke, chances are that fines are going to be the least of your worries. Shame on you for throwing ur dirty filthy butts on the ground ...200 baht you got off lightly.

A public beating is far more appropriate.....give it to him,neverdead!!

[GungaDin]

Your Honour, I've been straight for 8 years now, please take that into consideration before ordering any gentle beatings.

thank you.

PS, I to carry a small phial with one or 2 butts in, just to piss the BIB off when accosted.

[SoftWater]

Dick

Here's a 2nd inane comment for you......

No believe!

Glad we agree. Like I said, I don't believe it too.

Edited July 29, 2009 by SoftWater

[LomSak27]

Interesting ... on other travel forums numerous individuals have reported getting fined for throwing cigarette butts. 2000 baht for Siam square walkover cig butt toss was frequently mentioned as the going rate. This 'shakedowns' have been reported for at least three years, if not longer. I don't find it in any way unbelievable that the skytrain people are doing this.

[SoftWater]

Interesting ... on other travel forums numerous individuals have reported getting fined for throwing cigarette butts. 2000 baht for Siam square walkover cig butt toss was frequently mentioned as the going rate. This 'shakedowns' have been reported for at least three years, if not longer. I don't find it in any way unbelievable that the skytrain people are doing this.

I don't find it unbelievable either - if you throw a cigarette butt on the platform you will surely get fined. There are signs as you walk up the stairs to enter BTS that say no smoking, no eating/drinking - i'm sure that ignoring these rules will make you liable for a penalty - as it does on London's Underground and other metros all round the world. Nobody thinks these are a scam or a 'shakedown'. The point is the article in the OP said Mr Sorenesen didn't commit such an offence and that the guards just singled him out for a scam. Again, I'm forced to wonder, don't people ever read the threads before they start banging away on their keyboards to butt in with a reply? (pun intended...)

[MrJohnson]

Sounds more plausible that Mr Georgesen is scamming his local press - I don't buy this story at all.

I have to agree with SoftWater here. I've been taking the Skytrain regularly since it was built and have always found the securtity guards to be polite, professional and helpful, nothing like the local police. I have no proof that Mr. Georgesen is stretching the truth but it certainly seems out of character from what I have seen of these security guards in the past.

Me too. This is a beat up or just complete Bullsh$%T. Been taking the BTS since it opened and can't imagine any of those guards having the nerve to try this on. I'm not saying there aren't plenty of scams going on here in Thailand but this ain't one of them.

[MrJohnson]

The Police rent the footpaths to vendors selling porn, copyright material, bars etc.

These vendors use the pathway for trash bins but a foreigner will pay up to 10,000 baht if they flick a but onto this filthy footpath.

They are defrauding hundreds of tourists a day.

Been doing it for years.

So are we to believe that all of these photos posted here are of tourists being 'scammed' by the Tourist Police of Thailand? I don't quite get it? Is that what you are saying?

[PaulHamon]

Sounds more plausible that Mr Georgesen is scamming his local press - I don't buy this story at all.

I have to agree with SoftWater here. I've been taking the Skytrain regularly since it was built and have always found the securtity guards to be polite, professional and helpful, nothing like the local police. I have no proof that Mr. Georgesen is stretching the truth but it certainly seems out of character from what I have seen of these security guards in the past.

Yeah, sounds little out of place for them, I've always found there staff 2 be great. BUT then I guess it only takes one dude with a big bill to pay and he looks (up) to the policemans example.

[laocowboy2]

"I have no backbone"

This is precisely the crux of the issue and just what a lot of TV posters recommend. When faced with such a situation be nice, cooperate, or things could get a lot worse. The truth is these issues are more likely to occur with people who are seen- and act- like soft targets. Thai people know who they are, and can spot them with ease.

There is a saying among those who teach personal security for a living which is "never go to location number two." In any situation like this, you should do all that you can to appear to be a hard target and to look like the last thing you will do is go to the basement/hotel near the airport/car/van etc.

The same goes for tourists who are regularly short-changed. Grow some intestinal fortitude. Don't get violent but take an agressive stance and be firm but polite. Make statements like "I will not go with you" and "You have no authority to detain me". The reason that these things happen so often is that tourists here, by and large, are cowards. Thais know this and they prey on it.

When a taxi driver suddenly charges you double what do you do? I walk away. He looks awfully stupid then. We have people here on this board that say "Oh, just pay it. It isn't worth the hassle." That is ridiculous advice, and preaching this sermon is creating more and more victims in Thailand with every passing day. Stand up for yourselves.

I understand the spirit behind your advice but it can have (dangerous) drawbacks. An expat friend resident in Thailand did that on Silom one night. As he walked away, the taxi driver stabbed him. Hospital bills etc rather higher than taxi fare.

[Jimjim]

Like most businesses - we need stability, safety and good transport links .... and if we don't get all three. we'll move.

What the h*ll made you set up in BKK then... ...Unless you consider changing goverments every 2 years, stable......Safety....dont you read the news papers ?.....good transport...with the exception of the skytrain and underground...transport links suck....

To get the 3 you require...should have set up in Singapore

He forgot to mention he wanted a city with several read light areas, plenty of massage parlors and go go bars, and wanted a dirt cheap place to live.

[robbiecia]

There is no way this happened in the actual station.

Those BTS security guys are way too timid to try a ciggy scam.

I am sure it was the Thesakit boys lurking behind the support columns between the discovery center and MBK.

[Arkady]

Granted the story is not corroborated but I find it entirely plausible. The police have been doing the cigarette butt scam for many years. So why shouldn't BTS security guards try in on too?