Starting to understand Thaksin now actually.

Who in their right mind would seriously want to try running this country, without having a pay-off of a few billion at the end of it?

Gotta admit you could be onto something there.

Why is it impossible to hold an Internationally monitored election now?

Many Thais from all sides would disagree with that.

Foolish! You seriously think an election now forced by an angry violent anarchic red mob will solve this crisis. Shockingly naive.

A huge section of the Thai people believe that Abhisit is a stooge of the Elite and the Military. They also believe that they have been cheated out of the Government that they want. You can believe that is true or not - it doesn't matter because you are not Thai.

They have now reached the point that they believe that their only hope of getting a truly Democratic Government is to take to the streets, which they have done, and I think that they have won.

I think that it is true that they are angry. Anarchic. I don't know why you use that word. Violent. I don't know of anybody that they have hurt.

So why are you opposed to an election supervised/monitored by International Observers? I know why Abhisit is. It's because he knows that he would lose which in itself proves that he doesn't have the mandate of the people. Would you rather a civil war?

So the news from the reds is 'Do as we want or we'll start a civil war'?

Why is it impossible to hold an Internationally monitored election now?

Many Thais from all sides would disagree with that.

You underestimate Thais and in any case what is your basis for making that statement.

Why is it impossible to hold an Internationally monitored election now?

Many Thais from all sides would disagree with that.

Given that the democrats and all of their coalition partners are against immediate house dissolution, and that they represent over 50% of the population, it is fair to state that over 50% of country is against house dissolution at the present time.

More than fair, but everyone paying attention knows the red/Thaksinistas don't really care about democracy. Any foreigners who actually believe a new Thaksin takeover is going to bring Thailand closer to democracy are going to be totally disappointed.

Why is it impossible to hold an Internationally monitored election now?

Many Thais from all sides would disagree with that.

You underestimate Thais and in any case what is your basis for making that statement.

Can you seriously see them letting in UN observers up north?

I don't "underestimate Thais" - there's a prevalently independent attitude amongst them.

Foolish! You seriously think an election now forced by an angry violent anarchic red mob will solve this crisis. Shockingly naive.

A huge section of the Thai people believe that Abhisit is a stooge of the Elite and the Military. They also believe that they have been cheated out of the Government that they want. You can believe that is true or not - it doesn't matter because you are not Thai.

They have now reached the point that they believe that their only hope of getting a truly Democratic Government is to take to the streets, which they have done, and I think that they have won.

I think that it is true that they are angry. Anarchic. I don't know why you use that word. Violent. I don't know of anybody that they have hurt.

So why are you opposed to an election supervised/monitored by International Observers? I know why Abhisit is. It's because he knows that he would lose which in itself proves that he doesn't have the mandate of the people. Would you rather a civil war?

"A Huge section" ... you could say that 100% of Thais didn't get the government they wanted.

40% wanted the PPP. 35% wanted the Democrats. The rest didn't want either. (+/- a couple of %)

At the moment, a huge section of section of the Thai people have the government they want.

Certainly, a MAJORITY of the elected MPs (who represent the people) have the government they want.

And a MINORITY of the MPs (ie a minority of the representatives of the people) do not have the government they want.

Foolish! You seriously think an election now forced by an angry violent anarchic red mob will solve this crisis. Shockingly naive.

A huge section of the Thai people believe that Abhisit is a stooge of the Elite and the Military. They also believe that they have been cheated out of the Government that they want. You can believe that is true or not - it doesn't matter because you are not Thai.

They have now reached the point that they believe that their only hope of getting a truly Democratic Government is to take to the streets, which they have done, and I think that they have won.

I think that it is true that they are angry. Anarchic. I don't know why you use that word. Violent. I don't know of anybody that they have hurt.

So why are you opposed to an election supervised/monitored by International Observers? I know why Abhisit is. It's because he knows that he would lose which in itself proves that he doesn't have the mandate of the people. Would you rather a civil war?

So the news from the reds is 'Do as we want or we'll start a civil war'?

Try to play word games if you like. The Reds have never said, "do as we want or we'll start a civil war" and I never said that they had. What I believe however, is the fact that every day that Abhisit stays in power the rift in Thai society grows wider and he will be the cause of a civil war if his Military/Elite masters don't back down and tell Abhisit to go.

More like every day Thaksin foments civil war and anarchy Thailand's rift grows deeper. If Thaksin has just retired peacefully when the time came, we wouldn't have any of these problems with red criminal riots.

If only the red shirts could see the real truth

They are now collective and strong and no longer need Taskin

all they need is some good thinkers and now is time for THAT Change

If only the red shirts could see the real truth

They are now collective and strong and no longer need Taskin

all they need is some good thinkers and now is time for THAT Change

Hope springs eternal. Not a group that is very interested in intellectual thinkers and reason.

If only the red shirts could see the real truth

They are now collective and strong and no longer need Taskin

all they need is some good thinkers and now is time for THAT Change

The protestors are following their leaders. The leaders are following Dear Leader.

If only the red shirts could see the real truth

They are now collective and strong and no longer need Taskin

all they need is some good thinkers and now is time for THAT Change

Who knows what is the "real truth" ?

If only the red shirts could see the real truth

They are now collective and strong and no longer need Taskin

all they need is some good thinkers and now is time for THAT Change

Hope springs eternal. Not a group that is very interested in intellectual thinkers and reason.

Let's have a Farang Government in Thailand. Seems like the only way to run the country. Plenty of prospective Ministers and MP's on this Forum

If only the red shirts could see the real truth

They are now collective and strong and no longer need Taskin

all they need is some good thinkers and now is time for THAT Change

Who knows what is the "real truth" ?

At least if they could get a view of more than just what they spout on the stages and what they see on reds Peoples TV.

Foolish! You seriously think an election now forced by an angry violent anarchic red mob will solve this crisis. Shockingly naive.

A huge section of the Thai people believe that Abhisit is a stooge of the Elite and the Military. They also believe that they have been cheated out of the Government that they want. You can believe that is true or not - it doesn't matter because you are not Thai.

They have now reached the point that they believe that their only hope of getting a truly Democratic Government is to take to the streets, which they have done, and I think that they have won.

I think that it is true that they are angry. Anarchic. I don't know why you use that word. Violent. I don't know of anybody that they have hurt.

So why are you opposed to an election supervised/monitored by International Observers? I know why Abhisit is. It's because he knows that he would lose which in itself proves that he doesn't have the mandate of the people. Would you rather a civil war?

"A Huge section" ... you could say that 100% of Thais didn't get the government they wanted.

40% wanted the PPP. 35% wanted the Democrats. The rest didn't want either. (+/- a couple of %)

At the moment, a huge section of section of the Thai people have the government they want.

Certainly, a MAJORITY of the elected MPs (who represent the people) have the government they want.

And a MINORITY of the MPs (ie a minority of the representatives of the people) do not have the government they want.

Every time you post you put forward the same banal arguement. You then reply to people who agree with you but ignore the people who have proved you wrong.

The majority of electors voted against the Democrats. The Military/Elite then bought Newin Chidbob and the forty Phue Thai MPs friends of Newin. Do you really believe that in any democracy around the world that the people who voted for those forty Phue Thai MPs would not be considered to have genuine grounds for complaint. Also please adjust your percentages to take into account the millions of Phue Thai votes that those forty MPs represented.

Now please don't come back with your usual silly request and ask for proof that Newin and his friends were bought and Abhisit was installed because it is common knowledge. In any case why are you still bothering as your hero, (who now lives in one of four luxurious villas that were built by the Coup generals on an army base) is most probably about to depart. What will be his place in history? The do-nothing PM who, whether he goes or not, will still have to answer for the huge corruption charges against his coalition government.

The gov't hasn't rolled over and played dead yet. With the Information Ministry ordered to shut down the "People Channel" (the Red's 18 hr/day propaganda/incitement vehicle), and now arrest warrants to be issued for the intrusion into parliament, maybe there is still hope after all. Plus consideration of enforcing the Emergency Decree....That press conference in 10 minutes will be VERY interesting, and important.

More like every day Thaksin foments civil war and anarchy Thailand's rift grows deeper. If Thaksin has just retired peacefully when the time came, we wouldn't have any of these problems with red criminal riots.

He wasn't allowed to retire peacefully he was overthrown by a Military Coup which is why Thailand is in the mess it's in now.

Arrest warrants? They've been flung around like confetti but no-one does anything. Perhaps the red leaders already paid their tea money?

Now please don't come back with your usual silly request and ask for proof that Newin and his friends were bought and Abhisit was installed because it is common knowledge.

It's only a "silly" request because you can't provide it.

Foolish! You seriously think an election now forced by an angry violent anarchic red mob will solve this crisis. Shockingly naive.

A huge section of the Thai people believe that Abhisit is a stooge of the Elite and the Military. They also believe that they have been cheated out of the Government that they want. You can believe that is true or not - it doesn't matter because you are not Thai.

They have now reached the point that they believe that their only hope of getting a truly Democratic Government is to take to the streets, which they have done, and I think that they have won.

I think that it is true that they are angry. Anarchic. I don't know why you use that word. Violent. I don't know of anybody that they have hurt.

So why are you opposed to an election supervised/monitored by International Observers? I know why Abhisit is. It's because he knows that he would lose which in itself proves that he doesn't have the mandate of the people. Would you rather a civil war?

"A Huge section" ... you could say that 100% of Thais didn't get the government they wanted.

40% wanted the PPP. 35% wanted the Democrats. The rest didn't want either. (+/- a couple of %)

At the moment, a huge section of section of the Thai people have the government they want.

Certainly, a MAJORITY of the elected MPs (who represent the people) have the government they want.

And a MINORITY of the MPs (ie a minority of the representatives of the people) do not have the government they want.

Every time you post you put forward the same banal arguement. You then reply to people who agree with you but ignore the people who have proved you wrong.

The majority of electors voted against the Democrats. The Military/Elite then bought Newin Chidbob and the forty Phue Thai MPs friends of Newin. Do you really believe that in any democracy around the world that the people who voted for those forty Phue Thai MPs would not be considered to have genuine grounds for complaint. Also please adjust your percentages to take into account the millions of Phue Thai votes that those forty MPs represented.

Now please don't come back with your usual silly request and ask for proof that Newin and his friends were bought and Abhisit was installed because it is common knowledge. In any case why are you still bothering as your hero, (who now lives in one of four luxurious villas that were built by the Coup generals on an army base) is most probably about to depart. What will be his place in history? The do-nothing PM who, whether he goes or not, will still have to answer for the huge corruption charges against his coalition government.

Well it's nice to see that your so against corruption... I applaud you. Now what was the name of that PM that was removed in the coup?

Sorry I had to edit my last post ... I was reading biographies and mistakenly put Charlem's name in instead of Banharm

Well Mr. Banharm has spoken and it seems he is supporting the Govt .... hmmm ..... I don't think he would do that if it was apparent that the Military had wothdrawn support or if the Govt would fail. As someone said, he usually tries to be on the winning side. Wonder if he knows something that we don't ?

"A Huge section" ... you could say that 100% of Thais didn't get the government they wanted.

40% wanted the PPP. 35% wanted the Democrats. The rest didn't want either. (+/- a couple of %)

At the moment, a huge section of section of the Thai people have the government they want.

Certainly, a MAJORITY of the elected MPs (who represent the people) have the government they want.

And a MINORITY of the MPs (ie a minority of the representatives of the people) do not have the government they want.

Every time you post you put forward the same banal arguement. You then reply to people who agree with you but ignore the people who have proved you wrong.

The majority of electors voted against the Democrats. The Military/Elite then bought Newin Chidbob and the forty Phue Thai MPs friends of Newin. Do you really believe that in any democracy around the world that the people who voted for those forty Phue Thai MPs would not be considered to have genuine grounds for complaint. Also please adjust your percentages to take into account the millions of Phue Thai votes that those forty MPs represented.

Now please don't come back with your usual silly request and ask for proof that Newin and his friends were bought and Abhisit was installed because it is common knowledge. In any case why are you still bothering as your hero, (who now lives in one of four luxurious villas that were built by the Coup generals on an army base) is most probably about to depart. What will be his place in history? The do-nothing PM who, whether he goes or not, will still have to answer for the huge corruption charges against his coalition government.

A majority of electors also voted against the PPP. Those numbers are from the election, not from after when MPs changed allegiance.

Were the 40 MPs actually Peau Thai MPs? Weren't Peau Thai created just prior to the PPP disbanding for the ex-PPP MPs to go to? Actually, I was wondering whether you could point me to somewhere I can find out more about these MPs.

In any case, they represent their electorate, and they decided for whatever reason that they didn't want to support the new Thaksin puppet party. There is no law against changing support, and it doesn't require an election if it happens.

edit: it was actually 36% PPP, 30% Dem

Banharn has just put is weight behind Abhisit and made an reference to force:

Banharn said he would be worried if govt wanted to use force to disperse reds.

Banharn: "govt and reds must take one step back each."

Banharn: "If it will have to come to use of force, let's pray it won't be the same as Oct 7, 2008."

Padding for the govt announcement to come?

More like every day Thaksin foments civil war and anarchy Thailand's rift grows deeper. If Thaksin has just retired peacefully when the time came, we wouldn't have any of these problems with red criminal riots.

He wasn't allowed to retire peacefully he was overthrown by a Military Coup which is why Thailand is in the mess it's in now.

He was given the chance to resign... he protested his innocence a bit too loudly and for too long.

THE NATION: Weng on the Reds raid Parliament "It is Arisman's own act and decision without consent of other leaders."

So let's see some good faith and good citizenship by the other Red Shirt leaders. Turn him over to authorities for arrest. Yeah, when Bangkok freezes over..

Nice to see Banharn maintaining the course, which definitely seems to support Abhisit. Places doubts on those rumours of the Army ultimatum...

That system is our enemy. But when you're inside, you look around, what do you see? Businessmen, teachers, lawyers, carpenters. The very minds of the people we are trying to save. But until we do, these people are still a part of that system, and that makes them our enemy. You have to understand, most of these people are not ready and many of them are so inured, so hopelessly dependent on the system, that they will fight to protect it.

The struggle continues....

Banharn rarely, if ever, backs dead horse in any race.