Thai Drivers

[midas]

I know there have probably been huge numbers of threads discussing driving habits in Thailand as to whether Thais are considerate or inconsiderate drivers.I should say these observations are about city drivers and I would hope that people show a far more tolerance and patience in rural communities.

The other day I watched an ambulance driver anxiously trying to get through traffic with his horns blaring away and desperately trying to squeeze past a tuk tuk driver who didn't budge an inch. I believe not pulling over for emergency vehicles in USA for example is an offence . I have also watched ambulances trying to cross the flow of traffic which has the green light and again very rarely does anyone give way.

Then there is the subject of Monks who are so highly revered and meant to be such an important part of society. And yet you never seem to see anyone stopping to offer to give a ride to a solitary Monk who happens to be walking along the roadside. They don't even seem to stop to allow a group of Monks to cross the road and I've often seen a group of novice Monks look very anxiously and wait for ages until it is safe for them to cross. Can't drivers make an exception in this one case involving people that are so important to their society?

And then of course there is the motorists who want to turn left before an intersection and move over to the extreme side of the left lane thereby blocking off access to motorbikes.

Is this attitude by many drivers here yet again a symptom of poor driver training in Thailand?

Edited August 16, 2011 by midas

[Atmos]

solitary Monk who happens to be walking along the roadside

Isn't that 'walking meditation'?

There's a thread on that topic here recently.

Maybe he is not in a hurry . . . just out walking.

Edited August 16, 2011 by Atmos

[Galong]

In a nutshell, this unfortunately captures the essence of driving here

It's not only the driving, it's also the parking. I've got two driveways leading to my house. Both have red and white curbs (no parking) and BIG polite signs asking people not to block my driveway. As I look out my window, both driveways are blocked by motorbikes in spite of their being parking places nearby.

My favorite driving habit here in Phuket is when locals drive straight to the front of any line, block traffic, then force everyone else to wait until they make the turn... so utterly polite and safe. I've seen this happen plenty of times right in front of traffic cops too.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Yes, I think Thai drivers are VERY considerate, borderline perplexing. I could jump a huge queue, then try to merge back in at the very end, and people ACTUALLY LET ME IN!

If I do that at home I'd end up in a tree.

That's not saying Thai drivers can't improve of course, quite a few of them should learn to look a little further ahead than the first 5 meters in front of their car. And others shoudl learn that if they're merging into a main road, wanting to merge over to the very right for a U-turn, that it's OKAY to just merge into on the left, gain speed, and THEN merge to the right, not wait for a gap in traffic you can sail the Queen Mary through and accomplish it in one jump. Duh.

But I'm nitpicking. Thai drivers are great.

[richard_smith237]

In Thailand drivers show a general level of poor manners that often astounds me considering the image the nation attempts to project.

Simply put: in a car, drivers in Thailand appear to turn on a "F#$k You switch"... I have long suspected that society in general is frustrated to such a point that once in a car and isolated from contact (kraeng-jai, face etc) daily frustrations are permitted to surface and the minor battles are there for the taking....

Everyone knows the general rules of giving way and driving considerately (everyone I've spoken to anyway). However, many or most deliberately ignore them.

I was once told 'the difference between developing nations and developed nations is the awareness of 'greater good''... i.e. when applied to traffic - giving way to a few cars will make the traffic better for a number of others, however blocking them will block up the traffic for many...

That said – other countries such as Indonesia are 10 times worse and as a result, so is the traffic.

Regarding pulling over to the extreme left when turning left. I have learnt that I have to do this while driving in Thailand. It's a defensive driving maneuver to block and prevent motorbikes from undertaking me when I make the turn (as they rarely take notice of my indicator).

Over the last decade I’ve observed the ambulance situation improve, albeit slowly. The worst thing for an ambulance is stationary traffic.

The traffic design in Bangkok is one of created gridlock. With traffic lights on red for so long traffic is often backed up significantly enough to detrimentally effect the flow of other junctions.

If traffic lights were to change more frequently and maintain a general flow then perhaps the traffic conditions would improve. It would certainly reduce gridlock and blocked junctions as the paranoia of beating the lights or risk a 150 second delay is removed to perhaps a 60 second delay. The numbers are small but the effect they have on the capitals gridlock could be significant.

With the amount of money Bangkok looses to traffic jams – modeling the traffic could be a great improvement, however Policemen who’s job it is to control the traffic would be out of a job, or instead of reading the paper and flicking a switch they would have to get out and about and do some work fining those who block box junctions etc…

I don’t give way to monks any more or less than any other pedestrian – One thing I have learnt is that if I slow down to let a pedestrian cross in front of me they are normally so surprised their hesitation is painfully slow. In addition to this by stopping I have placed them in danger as the car behind me will try and over take, or pass in the next lane and risk running them over….

As a consequence in some situations I myself have learnt that I have to drive a bit inconsiderately to protect pedestrians – this sounds daft but I suspect many other long term drivers will attest to this.

[Thaddeus]

I should say these observations are about city drivers and I would hope that people show a far more tolerance and patience in rural communities.

Nope, far from it.

[Soutpeel]

The average Thai driver seems to have a death wish IMHO after driving here for nearly 1O years....

Edited August 16, 2011 by Soutpeel

[Colin Yai]

The average Thai driver seems a death wish IMHO after driving here for nearly 1O years....

Yeah I have to agree,hardly a day goes by when I do not have to take avoiding action so has to not have a "head onner" especially when turning left only to have some grinning maniac turning right ON YOUR SIDE of the road!!.

[cowslip]

"poor manners" - isn't that a rather occidento-centric concept in itself?

\I feel that there are no more bad drivers in Thailand than any other country.

The standard of roads and safety may be poor but this seems to be used by many posters to imply some form of inherent national inferiority on behalf of Thais in relation to "farangs" who all seem to be such "perfect" drivers in every way????

[Axpat]

"poor manners" - isn't that a rather occidento-centric concept in itself?

\I feel that there are no more bad drivers in Thailand than any other country.

The standard of roads and safety may be poor but this seems to be used by many posters to imply some form of inherent national inferiority on behalf of Thais in relation to "farangs" who all seem to be such "perfect" drivers in every way????

Nobody is saying 'farangs' from whichever country or continent you are referring to are all perfect drivers, however there is most definitely less road safety awareness in Thailand than in Western countreis and rules are not enforced as well either. Speeding, tailgating, jumping red lights, letting children bounce around unrestrained and drink driving are all par for the course on Thailand's roads. Add a touch of superstitious belief and you end up with the carnage you see every day.

Road deaths per capita in Thailand compared to Western countries proves this.

[andrewbkk]

In Thailand drivers show a general level of poor manners that often astounds me considering the image the nation attempts to project.

Simply put: in a car, drivers in Thailand appear to turn on a "F#$k You switch"... I have long suspected that society in general is frustrated to such a point that once in a car and isolated from contact (kraeng-jai, face etc) daily frustrations are permitted to surface and the minor battles are there for the taking....

Yes and no.

Truth is, Thai people in general are incredibly selfish.

You can see if often when they're not driving.

But when they get in their cars, it becomes all too obvious what these people are really like.

[Kwasaki]

Yes there have been many threads on Thai driving standards on the Thai motor forum.

I find Thai drivers in cities are on the whole safe and OK no worse than say drivers in London.

Out in the rural sticks there not so use to much trafic so of course there driving stardards are not so good.

Many rural Thais don't like or want to drive in Bangkok, that's if they ever get to go there.

As for the Ambulance's that's way it is here, unless there is a policeman there to intervene.

The same goes for stopping for pedestrians to cross the road Monk or anyone your probably get hit up the rear.

Attitude !! Well my attitude towards it is, you say about poor driving training, so yes that said, I think you have to say most Thai drivers are good.

Edited August 16, 2011 by Kwasaki

[englishinsiam]

Thai's and cars/bikes do not mix well......

It's the no licence Culture that gets me the majority only get a licence when the Police have been habitually on thier road so after 5 or 6 fines they finally get a licence.

The test is far too easy to pass they don't generally have road safety lessons, watched their parents drive with no licence and no training.

Is it any wonder the roads are so dangerous?

This problem will take a generation to sort out if the govt act radically and change it now.

And the Police need to do people for all offences.

If they are on Junction line duty then they ignore Helmets - If they are on Helmet duty they ignore licences. In the UK your pulled by Dibble and you get all offences noted. I have never been asked to show my insurance in Thailand that should be a pre requisite.

[carmine]

It really depends on what country/nationality you compare them to.

In England they would most certainly be very inconsiderate by our standards but compare them to Beruitis in the Lebanon and they would be angelic in comparison.

[thaiIand]

OP you do understand that letting space for motorbikes to go up front if what causes 50% of the thai traffic?

Motorbikes are so EFFIN slow, having to pass them at every light and then them coming back up and blocking your way is what makes everyone miss every green light.

Keeping them in the back would make the traffic better and SAFER.

Its inconsiderate to let them pass.

[tomallison]

solitary Monk who happens to be walking along the roadside

Isn't that 'walking meditation'?

There's a thread on that topic here recently.

Maybe he is not in a hurry . . . just out walking.

Absolutely correct. Maybe the poster thinks no one wants to walk. Not everyone needs, or has to have, wheels to get from A to B. As for Thai drivers. I have seen many countries with worse drivers.

[WarpSpeed]

Yes, I think Thai drivers are VERY considerate, borderline perplexing. I could jump a huge queue, then try to merge back in at the very end, and people ACTUALLY LET ME IN!

If I do that at home I'd end up in a tree.

That's not saying Thai drivers can't improve of course, quite a few of them should learn to look a little further ahead than the first 5 meters in front of their car. And others shoudl learn that if they're merging into a main road, wanting to merge over to the very right for a U-turn, that it's OKAY to just merge into on the left, gain speed, and THEN merge to the right, not wait for a gap in traffic you can sail the Queen Mary through and accomplish it in one jump. Duh.

But I'm nitpicking. Thai drivers are great.

I agree... It runs in streaks but for the most part it borders on over-consideration which has the opposite effect and can cause traffic to move slower as everyone is too busy letting the other guy in or tolerating the queue cutting..

[tlcwaterfall]

<br />Yes, I think Thai drivers are VERY considerate, borderline perplexing.  I could jump a huge queue, then try to merge back in at the very end, and people ACTUALLY LET ME IN!  <br /><br />If I do that at home I'd end up in a tree. <br /><br />That's not saying Thai drivers can't improve of course, quite a few of them should learn to look a little further ahead than the first 5 meters in front of their car.  And others shoudl learn that if they're merging into a main road, wanting to merge over to the very right for a U-turn, that it's OKAY to just merge into on the left, gain speed, and THEN merge to the right, not wait for a gap in traffic you can sail the Queen Mary through and accomplish it in one jump.  Duh. <br /><br />But I'm nitpicking.  Thai drivers are great.<br />

<br /><br /><br />

Not sure where you drive in Thailand but really! The majority of Thai drivers are very ignorant, rude and downright dangerous.

Not to say some are not good but in general I have found them lacking in common sense as well as really having little idea of basic road sense. In addition to this they simply cannot drive a car properly. How many times do you see them drifting from lane to lane, consistently staying in the right lane etc. etc.?

My wife(Thai) and friends just shake their head in bewilderment at the stupidity of the Thai driving habits.

Courtesy is great when it happens but the majority of Thais do have a "me" "me" (read selfish) attitude which only leads to dangerous situations on the roads!

[PattayaParent]

<snip>

Regarding pulling over to the extreme left when turning left. I have learnt that I have to do this while driving in Thailand. It's a defensive driving maneuver to block and prevent motorbikes from undertaking me when I make the turn (as they rarely take notice of my indicator).

<snip>

IME they do the opposite, they turn left from the right hand lane, or half way over in the right hand lane which blocks traffic from overtaking them while they slow down to take the corner at a painfully slow speed.

The odd occassion someone might actually keep in the left lane to turn left they end up in the opposite lane once round the corner.

Edit: but I can see the logic in blocking the motocy as they always try to overtake a turning vehicle on the side it's turning.

When I first came here from Saudi I thought the Thai drivers were polite, it was always possible to get out of side sois onto Sukhumvit as someone would let you out. There seemed to be an 'unwritten rule' of alternate cars allowing space.

16 years on I don't know if they're not so polite any more or there's just too much traffic or they just don't have the road sense but there's definitely no consideration to other road users.

And while we're generalising that it's Thai drivers as they are likely the majority of road users I have seen Farangs behaving just as badly (and am guility myself on rare occassions)

Edited August 16, 2011 by PattayaParent

[yermanee]

It's simple really, if traffic laws and their implementation were not so draconian in the west it would be exactly the same or worse.

Just my humble opinion.

Yermanee :jap:

[Eff1n2ret]

Thai drivers seem to me to lack consideration and anticipation, but, as Winnie the Kwai said, they dont make a fuss about things like queue-jumping. A lot of their shortcomings are made up for by a sort of mai pen rai tolerance, which to me feels preferable to the self-righteous aggression of the majority of drivers in the UK.

[Richard4849]

Not the best in the world, and by no means the worst. As with most things.

[Berkshire]

It really depends on what country/nationality you compare them to.

In England they would most certainly be very inconsiderate by our standards but compare them to Beruitis in the Lebanon and they would be angelic in comparison.

Good point. Pretty relative, really.

[midas]

solitary Monk who happens to be walking along the roadside

Isn't that 'walking meditation'?

There's a thread on that topic here recently.

Maybe he is not in a hurry . . . just out walking.

Absolutely correct. Maybe the poster thinks no one wants to walk. Not everyone needs, or has to have, wheels to get from A to B. As for Thai drivers. I have seen many countries with worse drivers.

absolutely incorrect

I'm talking about a solitary Thai monk who looked absolutely dishevelled in the heat

while walking along the road turning to look back every 30 seconds and stopping

every songtheaw that came along and even they for some reason wouldn't take him?

Blind Freddie could have seen he wasn't " meditating " .

Over to you

Edited August 16, 2011 by midas

[midas]

Simply put: in a car, drivers in Thailand appear to turn on a "F#$k You switch"... I have long suspected that society in general is frustrated to such a point that once in a car and isolated from contact (kraeng-jai, face etc) daily frustrations are permitted to surface and the minor battles are there for the taking....

Everyone knows the general rules of giving way and driving considerately (everyone I've spoken to anyway). However, many or most deliberately ignore them.

Yes Richard I have thought a lot about exactly what you have written here. I think the frustration part certainly applies to some taxi drivers and songthaew drivers even judging from their facial expressions. But could flicking the "F#$k You switch" also have something to do with the privacy aspect ? For example many Thais grew up in crowded conditions with hardly any appreciation of "privacy " as we are so used to in the West. I mean how many of them

grew up as kids with their own bedrooms compared to Westerners? add into that the fact that family members were always popping in and out of the house so in fact they were hardly ever on their own and as such couldn't really get away from people if they wanted to? So all of a sudden they get this device in which they can close the door

and for once be their own with unlimited freedom?

Edited August 16, 2011 by midas

[midas]

OP you do understand that letting space for motorbikes to go up front if what causes 50% of the thai traffic?

Motorbikes are so EFFIN slow, having to pass them at every light and then them coming back up and blocking your way is what makes everyone miss every green light.

Keeping them in the back would make the traffic better and SAFER.

Its inconsiderate to let them pass.

this is an interesting comment. I was in Shanghai last December and was amazed that there are hardly any

motorbikes as we see them in Thailand. you will only see cars or devices that looks like bicycles but sometimes with

a small engine. and even these are not in huge volumes. And in any case when people ride these kind of motorised pushbikes ,they occupy proper bike lanes which run alongside the main roads.so you don't see this kind of conflict between cars and motorbikes as you do in Thailand.

Edited August 16, 2011 by midas

[Kilgore Trout]

"poor manners" - isn't that a rather occidento-centric concept in itself?

\I feel that there are no more bad drivers in Thailand than any other country.

The standard of roads and safety may be poor but this seems to be used by many posters to imply some form of inherent national inferiority on behalf of Thais in relation to "farangs" who all seem to be such "perfect" drivers in every way????

You seem confused; I will help you understand...

Its all about accountability; in the west a minor traffic violation will cost you around 400USD (at least where I am from) and you will have to take off a day of work to go to court and deal with it. In addition, your insurance rates will rise, depending on the amount of violationsyou have you may not be able afford to drive or an insurance carrier may refuse to insure you.

Failure to deal with these situations and pay the money and time is quite dangerous as if you are caught driving with an invalid or suspended license you may permanently lose your licence and may in fact see jail time.

Compare that to here where losing your license is not an issue (I drove here for 10 years w/out a licence, been stopped many times by police and have never once had a problem), even if you kill someone and what do you think?

Do you think people will give a flying f*#k about traffic violations or driving safely?

Dont be so naive

[F1fanatic]

OP you do understand that letting space for motorbikes to go up front if what causes 50% of the thai traffic?

Motorbikes are so EFFIN slow, having to pass them at every light and then them coming back up and blocking your way is what makes everyone miss every green light.

Keeping them in the back would make the traffic better and SAFER.

Its inconsiderate to let them pass.

Absolute rubbish! I always move in front of the cars at red lights because the acceleration on my motorbike is FAR greater than theirs. I've never yet had a car come close to catching up with me until I decide to slow down.

Getting back on topic - obviously Thais are inconsiderate drivers but funnily enough I prefer this. I know exactly where I stand, whereas back in the UK it was always 'will he/won't he' !

[robblok]

OP you do understand that letting space for motorbikes to go up front if what causes 50% of the thai traffic?

Motorbikes are so EFFIN slow, having to pass them at every light and then them coming back up and blocking your way is what makes everyone miss every green light.

Keeping them in the back would make the traffic better and SAFER.

Its inconsiderate to let them pass.

Strange its really not what i see in Thailand. The motorbikes are off faster and accelerate faster. I drive both a motorbike and a car so i guess i know what im talking about. In heavy traffic i always want to use a motorbike much better.

[jimbeam1]

Yes there have been many threads on Thai driving standards on the Thai motor forum.

I find Thai drivers in cities are on the whole safe and OK no worse than say drivers in London.

Out in the rural sticks there not so use to much trafic so of course there driving stardards are not so good.

Many rural Thais don't like or want to drive in Bangkok, that's if they ever get to go there.

As for the Ambulance's that's way it is here, unless there is a policeman there to intervene.

The same goes for stopping for pedestrians to cross the road Monk or anyone your probably get hit up the rear.

Attitude !! Well my attitude towards it is, you say about poor driving training, so yes that said, I think you have to say most Thai drivers are good.

The majority of taxi drivers are from the sticks?

lb1