Jump to content

Gold Seller Beware


Raindancer

Recommended Posts

Just tried to sell some gold ...priced at 25100 baht per baht to buy and the 25200 baht to sell. Let me explain the variety of excuses for their price reductions to renege on the full offer price as advertised at the "buy price'..

EXCUSES FROM GOLD DEALERS AS FOLLOWS:

1. We have to reduce price to buy by 6 % because of the art work that you paid when you bought the gold originally. Which incidentally they will charge the new buyer at an extra 6%, which means a profit of 12% in total ...not bad eh!

2. The full price to buy is only for Gold Bars and not Jewellery.

3. Oh by the way your gold has lost 0.1 Gramm in weight because of heat since you purchased it which has reduced it's weight..

I leave you to make your own minds up about gold dealers or indeed unethical Thai business practices in general.

Luckily my wife declined the offer of such a reduced price of 22000 baht per baht of weight from the advertised price of 25100 baht per baht. That is an amazing 6% calculation. Perhaps a Thai calculator with faulty batteries.

Amazing Thailand so called business men.

Edited by Raindancer
Link to comment
Share on other sites

From what I've been told by other Thais when casually discussing current gold prices, #2 is actually true.

I could see where #3 could be true. Not necessarily heat, so much as normal wear and tear on jewelry.. One tenth of a gram is not much at all.

Perhaps with #1, something was lost in translation?

-Mestizo

Edited by Mestizo
Link to comment
Share on other sites

From what I've been told by other Thais when casually discussing current gold prices, #2 is actually true.

I could see where #3 could be true. Not necessarily heat, so much as normal wear and tear on jewelry.. One tenth of a gram is not much at all.

Perhaps with #1, something was lost in translation?

-Mestizo

Considering that it was never worn and was kept in an airtight safe, i doubt that number 3 is a valid excuse..

I accept no 2 could be factual.

Number1..Nothing was lost in translation, having visited three dealers in Sansai market and also Ruamchok Meechok Plaza, who gave the same sales rhetoric.

Having now returned to the original gold dealers from whom my wife purchased the gold...NO such excuses regarding Number 1 and number 3 as made by other gold dealers that I have highlighted..

A decent and responsible price was offered. Gold is just a commodity for investment if used at the appropriate time after some years of rising prices, providing you purchase sufficient quantities.. Better than bank saving rates on any good given day.

Edited by Raindancer
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, posted buy price is for bullion/bars and yes you lose some value on the "artistry" on the gold. Never heard of the heat issue though. Wouldn't that mean that all the gold in Thailand has and is slowly fading away???

Unless you are planning to exchange for bullion or really need the funds, hold on to your gold for a while....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, posted buy price is for bullion/bars and yes you lose some value on the "artistry" on the gold. Never heard of the heat issue though. Wouldn't that mean that all the gold in Thailand has and is slowly fading away???

Unless you are planning to exchange for bullion or really need the funds, hold on to your gold for a while....

Thanks CM Steve. We just looked at the investment side which was better than the bank rates of our current investments. No funds needed, just a pragmatic look at the market. I don't think that Gold can hold it's value considering the total world economic turmoil and some countries in Europe considering reverting to their original currencies, away from the euro mistake of some years ago. Gold purchased at 900 dollars an ounce.....Just being cautious and looking at the markets.

I think that the "heat issue " is just another sales / buy tactic against the uninformed Thai investor for the gold merchants profit margin.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, posted buy price is for bullion/bars and yes you lose some value on the "artistry" on the gold. Never heard of the heat issue though. Wouldn't that mean that all the gold in Thailand has and is slowly fading away???

Keep it in the fridge. Bring it in an icebox.

:P

Edit: The artwork thing is normal, just buy bars if you don't plan on wearing it around your neck.

Edited by nikster
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Bars are the way to go.

Indeed,

I was once quoted a price per baht bars of 600 baht lower than the board price,after the shop owner made a phone call,

I declined and went literally next door,and got the full board price.

The price of gold is set in the mornings opening for business,but late in the afternoon after close of trading they know the price of the next day opening price,

which could ? account for the discrepency with some unscrupulous gold shops,after all if one knew the price of the next day opening,why sell at a loss?

considering there is only a 100 baht spread price / profit margin.

In my experience most Gold Shops are genuine fair traders.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Bars are the way to go.

Indeed,

I was once quoted a price per baht bars of 600 baht lower than the board price,after the shop owner made a phone call,

I declined and went literally next door,and got the full board price.

The price of gold is set in the mornings opening for business,but late in the afternoon after close of trading they know the price of the next day opening price,

which could ? account for the discrepency with some unscrupulous gold shops,after all if one knew the price of the next day opening,why sell at a loss?

considering there is only a 100 baht spread price / profit margin.

In my experience most Gold Shops are genuine fair traders.

Thanks Majic

Good sensible reasoning...Appreciate your thoughts and experience. I agree that most gold traders are reasonable...Just need to shop around!!

Edited by Raindancer
Link to comment
Share on other sites

OP.

Have you ever tried to sell a car to a second hand car dealer? Talk about excuses for not paying what you want. :D

Thanks for your input..But there is no comparison. The subject is Gold buying/ selling. Cars always lose money but not as much as the same quantative value as gold or silver on the open market.

A little bit of a red herring in comparing two different commodities. Car selling and pricing in Thailand is no different to any other country in the world. Except that in Thailand second cars are vastly overpriced because there is no competitive pricing and many thai people cannot get bank loans and so they are at the mercy of the dealers who offer their own form of financing!!!!

Not all of us require financing and thus the overpricing of second hand car dealers will continue because of the majority of car buyers being Thai people.

Let us return to the original post.

Edited by Raindancer
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, it is true that the full price to buy is only for Gold Bars and not Jewellery, or in other words, the actual weight and gold worth it`s self.

We do pay more for the work involved in making of jewellery, this not included if we decide to sell.

Also gold jewellery does wear over time if frequently worn and cleaned.

This is the same the world over and not just pertaining to Thailand.

Jewellery is not always a good investment.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Is gold bullion in the form of coins such as Krugerrands bought at gold shops? I'm aware that .9999 gold Krugerrands have a higher gold content than Thai gold.

Is there a market for this kind of bullion in Thailand.

A friend has 2 one ounce gold coins and wants to sell to finance a family vacation in LOS.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The Op is anti business the dealer is only trying to maximize his profit. Its do here in the states as well there is a fee for them to except the coins and all of that and forget about getting full price for gold jewelry. Remember if they cannot sale the jewelry they have to melt it down creating more expense.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, it is true that the full price to buy is only for Gold Bars and not Jewellery, or in other words, the actual weight and gold worth it`s self.

We do pay more for the work involved in making of jewellery, this not included if we decide to sell.

Also gold jewellery does wear over time if frequently worn and cleaned.

This is the same the world over and not just pertaining to Thailand.

Jewellery is not always a good investment.

This is right, the only good point is that the cost of manufacture of gold jewellery is a fraction of what is charged in the west . The only good investment is gold bars not jewellery .

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, it's quite true, the thing about heat.  Why, I had a 100 ounce bar, and accidentally left it on my sunny windowsill, and sadly it evaporated away, and now I have no gold at all...    

I was amazingly impressed with the tight buy/sell rates on chains in Chinatown, and found a shop that I liked just along the river.  The sellback rate seemed to be about 3-4% based upon the actual gold value with the jewelry being 96.5%.  That is amazing compared to what one gets in the U.S.  

I did bring two American quarters with me and at each of many stores asked that they weigh them, knowing the exact gram weight already, a few scales were not accurate (one oddly reading more than the actual weight) but most were right on.  

True the bars will have the tightest buy/sell spread, but if a person tries to bring a bar to the US there will be duty on it and you can't wear it.  I  believe that if you try to bring a bar into some of the European/Great Britain countries you get charged a VAT tax...ouch.  

You can find the morning Thai gold price each day on Kito.com, you can also find the up to the 15 minute price.  If you want tighter prices follow Oilbull.com's gold price graphs, one runs as fast as a ten second update for spot gold price.  

As far as Raindancer's "I don't think that Gold can hold it's value considering the total world economic turmoil and some countries in Europe considering reverting to their original currencies, away from the euro mistake of some years ago. Gold purchased at 900 dollars an ounce.....Just being cautious and looking at the markets."  

I'll assume that he meant $1900 an ounce, and I'd agree, for a month or three, and would not be surprised to see gold drop to $1640 tomorrow, (or breaking a new high) depending upon Helicopter Ben's speech.  But it is the very fear that the turmoil about the European/American/Western debt that is pushing people into buying gold.  History is replete with episodes of pumping money into the system and the inevitable end is the cheapening of the fiat currency and the concurrent decrease in purchasing power since there are now many more dollars/Euros/Pounds chasing the same goods.  Fiat currencies can be manipulated, press some buttons, *kazaam* one new billion dollars or Euros, turn up the printing press, another billion, but show me one button or manipulation that can actually produce one new ounce of real gold. In a world full of dishonesty and manipulation there is only one thing that remains honest and that is "things".  The things can be rice, copper, silver, oil or gold and when currencies are devalued by new money creation, those things demand more and more of the fiat currency to buy, be it a pound of rice, or an ounce of gold.  In a single word gold is "honesty," within a sea of dishonesty (currency manipulation).  In a year or two I suspect that $1900/ounce gold will seem to be a bargain. It is not that gold is really rising, it is that the purchasing power, or the perceived purchasing power of the underlying currencies are becoming devalued.

People do not see it though it is there in front of you. In 2009 a $100US bill would buy $160 Australian. The exchange rate was so favorable that wine merchants had sales and rebates to move more goods. I purchased 400 bottles of SE Australia wines at an average of $3.75US (I drink one 8.5 ounce glass of wine a day with dinner, that equals about 2.3 bottles a week, or 115 bottles of wine/year, thus I purchased 3.5 years of wine. Today a US$100 bill buys 95 Australian dollars, and today the bottles that I paid $3.75 for are now either $12.99 or $13.99.

The whole world is sinking into economic oblivion, and since we are sinking together, it's hard to notice. European banks are in horrid shape, and so are American banks. There are still one quadrillion dollars worth of derivatives and NOT marked to market, meaning that banks say that they are worth whatever they say they are worth. I'd say that "when the SHTF" but it already is...I haven't a clue as how we'll get out of this mess, but the sun will still shine. Sorry about the rant.....now if I had a job, I'd go and buy some gold seeing it's down almost $100.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks CM Steve. We just looked at the investment side which was better than the bank rates of our current investments. No funds needed, just a pragmatic look at the market. I don't think that Gold can hold it's value considering the total world economic turmoil and some countries in Europe considering reverting to their original currencies, away from the euro mistake of some years ago. Gold purchased at 900 dollars an ounce.....Just being cautious and looking at the markets.

I'm certainly glad that you are not my financial adviser!

Those that are complaining about the fees involved in buying/selling gold in Thailand...the dealers are in business to make money; not to lose money. The price charged here is a fraction of what it costs to trade gold elsewhere. For example when you buy gold in Switzerland you must pay commissions as well as safekeeping and other fees. Nothing is free here. They are providing a service.

Edited by elektrified
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Those that are complaining about the fees involved in buying/selling gold in Thailand...the dealers are in business to make money; not to lose money. The price charged here is a fraction of what it costs to trade gold elsewhere.

Well said - anyone thinking that they get ripped off here, can always take it abroad and get a better deal....biggrin.gif

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, it is true that the full price to buy is only for Gold Bars and not Jewellery, or in other words, the actual weight and gold worth it`s self.

We do pay more for the work involved in making of jewellery, this not included if we decide to sell.

Also gold jewellery does wear over time if frequently worn and cleaned.

This is the same the world over and not just pertaining to Thailand.

Jewellery is not always a good investment.

[/quoteJewellery is not always a good investment quote]

Sometimes it's better than invest in a wife.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks CM Steve. We just looked at the investment side which was better than the bank rates of our current investments. No funds needed, just a pragmatic look at the market. I don't think that Gold can hold it's value considering the total world economic turmoil and some countries in Europe considering reverting to their original currencies, away from the euro mistake of some years ago. Gold purchased at 900 dollars an ounce.....Just being cautious and looking at the markets.

I'm certainly glad that you are not my financial adviser!

Those that are complaining about the fees involved in buying/selling gold in Thailand...the dealers are in business to make money; not to lose money. The price charged here is a fraction of what it costs to trade gold elsewhere. For example when you buy gold in Switzerland you must pay commissions as well as safekeeping and other fees. Nothing is free here. They are providing a service.

Post edited and removed by Raindancer.

Edited by Raindancer
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.








×
×
  • Create New...