Honda Crf 250L

[taninthai]

Thanks great to see a fair unbiased comparison between the two

I was quite surprised about the plastic engine guard when I saw pictures thought it was metal then realised it was plastic when recieved Bike

They do have a metal guard on ap Honda website think I'll get that ordered

[RidersCorner]

order the swivel end foot levers while your at it too

Thanks great to see a fair unbiased comparison between the two

I was quite surprised about the plastic engine guard when I saw pictures thought it was metal then realised it was plastic when recieved Bike

They do have a metal guard on ap Honda website think I'll get that ordered

[Theboy]

Great comparison, thank you. Seems the tried and tested KLX wins by a short head after reading the full report

[pokerkid]

Great comparison, thank you. Seems the tried and tested KLX wins by a short head after reading the full report

I read the full article and did not get that impression . They said the handling of the honda was actually better because of the lower center of gravity. Power seemed to be the same. Interesting because the klx tested was not standard. First of all it must have been derestricted and also has modifications done to airbox, exhaust and ecu.

[taninthai]

Great comparison, thank you. Seems the tried and tested KLX wins by a short head after reading the full report

I read the full article and did not get that impression . They said the handling of the honda was actually better because of the lower center of gravity. Power seemed to be the same. Interesting because the klx tested was not standard. First of all it must have been derestricted and also has modifications done to airbox, exhaust and ecu.

Apparently the klx just had a 48t rear sprocket on it and was obviously derestricted I don't really think it was a test to see which one is better more to see if the new Honda is as capable as the klx and it seems it quite easly is,as I've said many times there is nothing to separate these two bikes if you taller and on the heavier side the klx might be better for you ,if your a little on the short side the crf may be better for you .

Of coarse price and dealer facilities for some will come into it as well but it does seem in general Honda have released a more than capable off road bike that pretty easily matches the klx at a cheaper price

[dave_boo]

Guess I read a different review than everybody else. Since we're not allowed to link to other forums, here's what I got from the Ride Asia head to head.

I was under the impression Alex's KLX was modified more than it was, it's actually quite standard apart from the 48T rear sprocket

The KLX was not modified beyond the rear sprocket! However, the owner of the KLX reported that the power between the two bikes felt similar. This could be indicative of two things. Either the CRF doesn't have as much power as I was thinking it would OR the 14% shorter gearing (going from 14/42 to 14/48) allowed the KLX to feel more powerful than it was. If the gearing has the bearing I assume it does, it jibes nicely with my thoughts that the CRF has a stock CBR driveline dropped in (23 HP compared to the stock 20 of the KLX...14% more ).

Front suspension is stiffer to begin with so it doesnt suffer from brake dive like the KLX.

Over some loose rocks I am quite happy on the klx but the Honda seemed more stable, I was surprised,

...I could probably adjust my forks to be the same as the honda, I normally run them soft

...Bobs just gave the Honda CRF 250 L a try and bounced up and down a few times and it didn't bottom out - good news!

The owner of the KLX likes his suspension more plush; however stock, non-adjustable (with the exception of rear preload), CRF suspension seemed quite alright for him. But that doesn't preclude the fact that one may be able to adjust the KLX even more stiff if one desired.

Still waiting on a current owner to see if the bike is 'restricted' as has been claimed in this thread.

So in recap:

• The CRF appears to be ~3 HP (14%) more powerful than the KLX.
  
• The stock suspension doesn't bottom out under really heavy farang (but is not adjustable and probably wouldn't hurt from revalving/respringing).
  
• The ~2 cm ground clearance difference seems to be a non-issue.
  
• The bike holds its weight well.
  
• The CRF is cheaper even with the price gouging that the local Honda dealers are becoming infamous for.
  

I would like to reiterate a couple of my concerns though.

• There is no data on engine reliability. Using the CBR 250 engine off-road is something I'm going to eagerly watch to see if the engine can cope with the added stresses.
  
• There is no aftermarket for it yet. The limited numbers released so far (many more CBR 250 bikes were released) does not bode well for a market developing. Are there even aftermarket sprockets for the bikes yet? The KLX definitely has it beat here even if you have to import most of the 'good' parts.
  
• It's not as cheap as I think it should be. Either I will have to get over that or wait until the prices reach the levels I think they should.
  

[canuckamuck]

I am waiting a year, price will go down a bit, and there will be plenty of time for issues to be addressed.

I really wish that the Rider's Corner shootout had been with a fully stock bike, but it was really good of them to do it regardless.

Low end torque is going to be very important in the comparison, so a non stock rear sprocket really muddies the water on that issue.

I like the fact that the bike seems very stable and maneuverable on trail. It is no fun fighting a bike when you are out to have fun.

Maybe in a year they will find a few more cans of paint so you can buy a CRF in a color other than fire engine red (yuck)

[dave_boo]

I am waiting a year, price will go down a bit, and there will be plenty of time for issues to be addressed.

I really wish that the Rider's Corner shootout had been with a fully stock bike, but it was really good of them to do it regardless.

Low end torque is going to be very important in the comparison, so a non stock rear sprocket really muddies the water on that issue.

I like the fact that the bike seems very stable and maneuverable on trail. It is no fun fighting a bike when you are out to have fun.

Maybe in a year they will find a few more cans of paint so you can buy a CRF in a color other than fire engine red (yuck)

I don't know if I can wait a year. The new motorcycle itch is hitting pretty hard. However as you stated, it would behoove one to wait until the prices go down.

[wana]

I am waiting a year, price will go down a bit, and there will be plenty of time for issues to be addressed.

I really wish that the Rider's Corner shootout had been with a fully stock bike, but it was really good of them to do it regardless.

Low end torque is going to be very important in the comparison, so a non stock rear sprocket really muddies the water on that issue.

I like the fact that the bike seems very stable and maneuverable on trail. It is no fun fighting a bike when you are out to have fun.

Maybe in a year they will find a few more cans of paint so you can buy a CRF in a color other than fire engine red (yuck)

theres a lovely white one outside the dealer on pattanakaran rd ,it looks goregous ,much nicer than the red IMO

BUT ..........the gougers want 145k for it

wait for the RRP because now is prime time to get overcharged ,the small dealers are only geting a 1-2 per month

so they can more or less play the customers against other and charge what they like

You may find out in a month or two that RRP is 115k and peple have been paying 30k too much

[Bung]

My concerns about the CRF are that it is actually too low for my liking and the shock is only adjustable for pre load. The fork is non adjustable. The KLX is better in this regard with adjustable pre load and rebound suspension front and rear meaning it can be tuned to different rider weights and preferences. I would have to spend money on new rear suspension and most likely the front as well to make it usable so there goes your price savings....

Some small details like thinner spokes grate, things like spring loaded shift lever can be changed easily but again added cost.

Also the CRF has only one radiator and it remains to be seen if it can handle hard off road work. especially if the engine gets modified. The KLX has 2 radiators.

There is a good possibility that the CRF's engine will be able to be modified for extra power as I believe they race CBR 250's and have developed performance parts for them already which will be able to be bolted right on. No idea if that incudes a big bore kit but with one radiator that will become an issue anyway.

You will want to open up the airbox and install a performance ECU for it. The local guys will make decent copies of aftermarket exhausts. These I imagine will be aviailable for it pretty soon. There are already these performance parts available for the KLX .

It will be interesting if the engine can be modified to make more power than the KLX can be modified to do.

A lot of people will be happy with it how it is but for guys who want to go offroad and tour it will be needed to be done

I am leaning towards the Kawa which is a shame as I have been eagerly awaiting this CRF but Honda have decided that the way forward was to undercut the KLX and it shows. You get what you pay for.

The cheaper price and lower height will make it very popular with the Thais and short Farangs. They will be more than happy pottering around town on it but for guys looking for a road registerable bike they can take offroad I think the KLX is still King.

It will be interesting to see if Kawasaki come out with an upgraded model to compete with the CRF soon. I just hope they don't get into a price war and down spec the KLX to suit.

[taninthai]

There seems to be alOt of talk about this single radiator,we are not dealing with lifan,tiger or any other cheap motor bike manufacturer here it's a Honda , no doubt Honda have run this engine in tests for extremely long times simulating many possible scenarios do people honestly think they are going to do a world wide release and offer 5&3 year warranty on a bike that would have over heating problems.

[Bung]

Of course but they didn't test it modified nor would they have considered to do it which is what a lot of guys will want to do with them. More power=more heat. Simple. It may be fine but I prefer KLX's 2 radiators. What size set up does a CBR 250 have?

[taninthai]

Well for me I wouldn't start doing any heavy engine modifications on a brand new bike you are gonna lose your warranty straight away.

I have had my crf up to 140 km/r and it isn't comfortable riding at them speeds so you don't really need any more power for the road and for off roading the gains can be made with simple mods exhaust ,air filter sprockets etc.

[BigBikeBKK]

My concerns about the CRF are that it is actually too low for my liking and the shock is only adjustable for pre load. The fork is non adjustable. The KLX is better in this regard with adjustable pre load and rebound suspension front and rear meaning it can be tuned to different rider weights and preferences. I would have to spend money on new rear suspension and most likely the front as well to make it usable so there goes your price savings....

Some small details like thinner spokes grate, things like spring loaded shift lever can be changed easily but again added cost.

Also the CRF has only one radiator and it remains to be seen if it can handle hard off road work. especially if the engine gets modified. The KLX has 2 radiators.

There is a good possibility that the CRF's engine will be able to be modified for extra power as I believe they race CBR 250's and have developed performance parts for them already which will be able to be bolted right on. No idea if that incudes a big bore kit but with one radiator that will become an issue anyway.

It's worth noting that the modified CB'r'250's that are being raced in the Thai Moto3 series blow up in shocking numbers. They average about 3-4 blown engines in every CB'r'250 race. And they are rebuilding these engines regularly. So yeah, you can certainly tune and mod them for more power, but they don't last long when you do...

You will want to open up the airbox and install a performance ECU for it. The local guys will make decent copies of aftermarket exhausts. These I imagine will be aviailable for it pretty soon. There are already these performance parts available for the KLX .

It will be interesting if the engine can be modified to make more power than the KLX can be modified to do.

A lot of people will be happy with it how it is but for guys who want to go offroad and tour it will be needed to be done

I am leaning towards the Kawa which is a shame as I have been eagerly awaiting this CRF but Honda have decided that the way forward was to undercut the KLX and it shows. You get what you pay for.

The cheaper price and lower height will make it very popular with the Thais and short Farangs. They will be more than happy pottering around town on it but for guys looking for a road registerable bike they can take offroad I think the KLX is still King.

It will be interesting to see if Kawasaki come out with an upgraded model to compete with the CRF soon. I just hope they don't get into a price war and down spec the KLX to suit.

[BigBikeBKK]

Of course but they didn't test it modified nor would they have considered to do it which is what a lot of guys will want to do with them. More power=more heat. Simple. It may be fine but I prefer KLX's 2 radiators. What size set up does a CBR 250 have?

FWIW, my KLX with 351cc Bill Blue Big Bore Kit and Pumper Carb has had no problems with heat, even on a recent 40 degrees in the shade day that sent ME to the hospital with heat stroke

It's got every mod I want and the fact that I paid a lot less for it than the cost of a new Honda CRF250L just makes it that much sweeter

Ride on!

Tony

[taninthai]

My concerns about the CRF are that it is actually too low for my liking and the shock is only adjustable for pre load. The fork is non adjustable. The KLX is better in this regard with adjustable pre load and rebound suspension front and rear meaning it can be tuned to different rider weights and preferences. I would have to spend money on new rear suspension and most likely the front as well to make it usable so there goes your price savings....

Some small details like thinner spokes grate, things like spring loaded shift lever can be changed easily but again added cost.

Also the CRF has only one radiator and it remains to be seen if it can handle hard off road work. especially if the engine gets modified. The KLX has 2 radiators.

There is a good possibility that the CRF's engine will be able to be modified for extra power as I believe they race CBR 250's and have developed performance parts for them already which will be able to be bolted right on. No idea if that incudes a big bore kit but with one radiator that will become an issue anyway.

It's worth noting that the modified CB'r'250's that are being raced in the Thai Moto3 series blow up in shocking numbers. They average about 3-4 blown engines in every CB'r'250 race. And they are rebuilding these engines regularly. So yeah, you can certainly tune and mod them for more power, but they don't last long when you do...

You will want to open up the airbox and install a performance ECU for it. The local guys will make decent copies of aftermarket exhausts. These I imagine will be aviailable for it pretty soon. There are already these performance parts available for the KLX .

It will be interesting if the engine can be modified to make more power than the KLX can be modified to do.

A lot of people will be happy with it how it is but for guys who want to go offroad and tour it will be needed to be done

I am leaning towards the Kawa which is a shame as I have been eagerly awaiting this CRF but Honda have decided that the way forward was to undercut the KLX and it shows. You get what you pay for.

The cheaper price and lower height will make it very popular with the Thais and short Farangs. They will be more than happy pottering around town on it but for guys looking for a road registerable bike they can take offroad I think the KLX is still King.

It will be interesting to see if Kawasaki come out with an upgraded model to compete with the CRF soon. I just hope they don't get into a price war and down spec the KLX to suit.

bigbikebkk im pretty sure when you was spouting off the same comments on adv rider forum someone replied that actually races them and claimed that your comments are incorrect and everyone he knows was happy with them,however i wouldnt expect a little 250 cc tuned to the max to race to last very long before a rebuild was needed any way which goes back to why i would never heavily mod a new engine under warrantty id rather just buy a more powerfull bike in the first place...

[wantan]

FWIW, my KLX with 351cc Bill Blue Big Bore Kit and Pumper Carb has had no problems with heat, even on a recent 40 degrees in the shade day that sent ME to the hospital with heat stroke

Old man should stay at home in such scorching heat. Next time try riding a bit faster, so the air flow can cool you down. But maybe this offroad thingy is just a bit to hard for you

[taninthai]

Of course but they didn't test it modified nor would they have considered to do it which is what a lot of guys will want to do with them. More power=more heat. Simple. It may be fine but I prefer KLX's 2 radiators. What size set up does a CBR 250 have?

FWIW, my KLX with 351cc Bill Blue Big Bore Kit and Pumper Carb has had no problems with heat, even on a recent 40 degrees in the shade day that sent ME to the hospital with heat stroke

It's got every mod I want and the fact that I paid a lot less for it than the cost of a new Honda CRF250L just makes it that much sweeter

Ride on!

Tony

Out off interest what's the top speed youve seen on your klx

[BigBikeBKK]

My concerns about the CRF are that it is actually too low for my liking and the shock is only adjustable for pre load. The fork is non adjustable. The KLX is better in this regard with adjustable pre load and rebound suspension front and rear meaning it can be tuned to different rider weights and preferences. I would have to spend money on new rear suspension and most likely the front as well to make it usable so there goes your price savings....

Some small details like thinner spokes grate, things like spring loaded shift lever can be changed easily but again added cost.

Also the CRF has only one radiator and it remains to be seen if it can handle hard off road work. especially if the engine gets modified. The KLX has 2 radiators.

There is a good possibility that the CRF's engine will be able to be modified for extra power as I believe they race CBR 250's and have developed performance parts for them already which will be able to be bolted right on. No idea if that incudes a big bore kit but with one radiator that will become an issue anyway.

It's worth noting that the modified CB'r'250's that are being raced in the Thai Moto3 series blow up in shocking numbers. They average about 3-4 blown engines in every CB'r'250 race. And they are rebuilding these engines regularly. So yeah, you can certainly tune and mod them for more power, but they don't last long when you do...

You will want to open up the airbox and install a performance ECU for it. The local guys will make decent copies of aftermarket exhausts. These I imagine will be aviailable for it pretty soon. There are already these performance parts available for the KLX .

It will be interesting if the engine can be modified to make more power than the KLX can be modified to do.

A lot of people will be happy with it how it is but for guys who want to go offroad and tour it will be needed to be done

I am leaning towards the Kawa which is a shame as I have been eagerly awaiting this CRF but Honda have decided that the way forward was to undercut the KLX and it shows. You get what you pay for.

The cheaper price and lower height will make it very popular with the Thais and short Farangs. They will be more than happy pottering around town on it but for guys looking for a road registerable bike they can take offroad I think the KLX is still King.

It will be interesting to see if Kawasaki come out with an upgraded model to compete with the CRF soon. I just hope they don't get into a price war and down spec the KLX to suit.

bigbikebkk im pretty sure when you was spouting off the same comments on adv rider forum someone replied that actually races them and claimed that your comments are incorrect and everyone he knows was happy with them,however i wouldnt expect a little 250 cc tuned to the max to race to last very long before a rebuild was needed any way which goes back to why i would never heavily mod a new engine under warrantty id rather just buy a more powerfull bike in the first place...

Don't take my word for it- ask anyone who's been following the Thai Moto 3 series- they blow a ton of engines. In all the other classes, from the scooters to the superbikes you never see such a high percentage of DNF's than you do in the Thai Moto 3.

[BigBikeBKK]

Of course but they didn't test it modified nor would they have considered to do it which is what a lot of guys will want to do with them. More power=more heat. Simple. It may be fine but I prefer KLX's 2 radiators. What size set up does a CBR 250 have?

FWIW, my KLX with 351cc Bill Blue Big Bore Kit and Pumper Carb has had no problems with heat, even on a recent 40 degrees in the shade day that sent ME to the hospital with heat stroke

It's got every mod I want and the fact that I paid a lot less for it than the cost of a new Honda CRF250L just makes it that much sweeter

Ride on!

Tony

Out off interest what's the top speed youve seen on your klx

It's geared down quite a bit; -3 front and can power wheelie in 3rd

It get's pretty buzzy if I go over ~110-120 kph. The tires are not road legal and get really "floaty" at higher speeds...

I honestly don't know what the top speed is- it's set up for offroad and not for going fast. (I'll ride the Gixxer if I want to go fast)

I do plan to get a set of D-Tracker wheels and stock sprockets so that I can change it over to a road bike when I'm in the mood. Maybe even try to race it in some future Open Class D-Tracker races if they'll allow it.

Nothing wrong with the new Honda CRF250L, but for me it just doesn't check all the boxes the way this KLX351 does

[dave_boo]

My concerns about the CRF are that it is actually too low for my liking and the shock is only adjustable for pre load. The fork is non adjustable. The KLX is better in this regard with adjustable pre load and rebound suspension front and rear meaning it can be tuned to different rider weights and preferences. I would have to spend money on new rear suspension and most likely the front as well to make it usable so there goes your price savings....

Some small details like thinner spokes grate, things like spring loaded shift lever can be changed easily but again added cost.

Also the CRF has only one radiator and it remains to be seen if it can handle hard off road work. especially if the engine gets modified. The KLX has 2 radiators.

There is a good possibility that the CRF's engine will be able to be modified for extra power as I believe they race CBR 250's and have developed performance parts for them already which will be able to be bolted right on. No idea if that incudes a big bore kit but with one radiator that will become an issue anyway.

You will want to open up the airbox and install a performance ECU for it. The local guys will make decent copies of aftermarket exhausts. These I imagine will be aviailable for it pretty soon. There are already these performance parts available for the KLX .

It will be interesting if the engine can be modified to make more power than the KLX can be modified to do.

A lot of people will be happy with it how it is but for guys who want to go offroad and tour it will be needed to be done

I am leaning towards the Kawa which is a shame as I have been eagerly awaiting this CRF but Honda have decided that the way forward was to undercut the KLX and it shows. You get what you pay for.

The cheaper price and lower height will make it very popular with the Thais and short Farangs. They will be more than happy pottering around town on it but for guys looking for a road registerable bike they can take offroad I think the KLX is still King.

It will be interesting to see if Kawasaki come out with an upgraded model to compete with the CRF soon. I just hope they don't get into a price war and down spec the KLX to suit.

I do not know how much you would have to spend on suspension, but getting my Ninja 250 how I wanted it was really as easy as purchasing 3000 THB worth of uprated springs from RaceTech and installing them. While it's not race ready by any stretch of the imagination, how many people need their bike that finely tuned in? How much are YSS shocks? 9000 THB max? Going with those two options allows one to still have some 5-10 000 THB balance to play around with; plus they'd be in the middle of the range of adjustment rather than at the end of the range for heavier riders.

From an engineering standpoint, two is not always better.packaging issues aside, that's twice the places for problems (leaks, fatigued/failed metal,etc.). It also doesn't imply it's twice as good (the GM 8L engine is nowhere near as good as Ferrari's 4L). Having said that I have stated my concerns about it previously, and to comment on what another poster said, Honda (and every manufacturer) does not meet the extremes or they would not be able to move product because people would balk at the price. So they shoot for a 'good enough'. Is the good enough alright for the projected use of this bike? Time will tell.

Make more power than the KLX does? Mate, you're joking right? Even with a 300cc upbore, the KLX only makes a three more HP. With a PowerCommander, exhaust, snorkel, yadda-yadda, you can break even with a stock CRF...

I do not understand the offroad/touring comment. Do people not do that with D-Trackers/KLX? And aren't those two bikes down in power compared to the CRF?

My take on the KLX is that it is an emminently useful bike for the n00bs. Kawasaki does not even trust the buyers of the bike with the (less than CRF) 20 HP but restricts them in the top 4 gears down to CBR 150 power levels. Guess that pointing to a 2cm height advantage (which real off-road riders have confirmed is not significant), a 5kg weight advantage (which real off-road riders....I hate repeating myself but would also like to state means that the power to weight ratio is still in CRF's favour), and an adjustable suspension is worth the 15-20 000 THB extra that Kawasaki mandates the bike sells at rather than letting market forces (i.e. the plebes who are purchasing bikes) decide the actual price.

[BigBikeBKK]

My concerns about the CRF are that it is actually too low for my liking and the shock is only adjustable for pre load. The fork is non adjustable. The KLX is better in this regard with adjustable pre load and rebound suspension front and rear meaning it can be tuned to different rider weights and preferences. I would have to spend money on new rear suspension and most likely the front as well to make it usable so there goes your price savings....

Some small details like thinner spokes grate, things like spring loaded shift lever can be changed easily but again added cost.

Also the CRF has only one radiator and it remains to be seen if it can handle hard off road work. especially if the engine gets modified. The KLX has 2 radiators.

There is a good possibility that the CRF's engine will be able to be modified for extra power as I believe they race CBR 250's and have developed performance parts for them already which will be able to be bolted right on. No idea if that incudes a big bore kit but with one radiator that will become an issue anyway.

You will want to open up the airbox and install a performance ECU for it. The local guys will make decent copies of aftermarket exhausts. These I imagine will be aviailable for it pretty soon. There are already these performance parts available for the KLX .

It will be interesting if the engine can be modified to make more power than the KLX can be modified to do.

A lot of people will be happy with it how it is but for guys who want to go offroad and tour it will be needed to be done

I am leaning towards the Kawa which is a shame as I have been eagerly awaiting this CRF but Honda have decided that the way forward was to undercut the KLX and it shows. You get what you pay for.

The cheaper price and lower height will make it very popular with the Thais and short Farangs. They will be more than happy pottering around town on it but for guys looking for a road registerable bike they can take offroad I think the KLX is still King.

It will be interesting to see if Kawasaki come out with an upgraded model to compete with the CRF soon. I just hope they don't get into a price war and down spec the KLX to suit.

I do not know how much you would have to spend on suspension, but getting my Ninja 250 how I wanted it was really as easy as purchasing 3000 THB worth of uprated springs from RaceTech and installing them. While it's not race ready by any stretch of the imagination, how many people need their bike that finely tuned in? How much are YSS shocks? 9000 THB max? Going with those two options allows one to still have some 5-10 000 THB balance to play around with; plus they'd be in the middle of the range of adjustment rather than at the end of the range for heavier riders.

From an engineering standpoint, two is not always better.packaging issues aside, that's twice the places for problems (leaks, fatigued/failed metal,etc.). It also doesn't imply it's twice as good (the GM 8L engine is nowhere near as good as Ferrari's 4L). Having said that I have stated my concerns about it previously, and to comment on what another poster said, Honda (and every manufacturer) does not meet the extremes or they would not be able to move product because people would balk at the price. So they shoot for a 'good enough'. Is the good enough alright for the projected use of this bike? Time will tell.

Make more power than the KLX does? Mate, you're joking right? Even with a 300cc upbore, the KLX only makes a three more HP. With a PowerCommander, exhaust, snorkel, yadda-yadda, you can break even with a stock CRF...

I do not understand the offroad/touring comment. Do people not do that with D-Trackers/KLX? And aren't those two bikes down in power compared to the CRF?

My take on the KLX is that it is an emminently useful bike for the n00bs. Kawasaki does not even trust the buyers of the bike with the (less than CRF) 20 HP but restricts them in the top 4 gears down to CBR 150 power levels. Guess that pointing to a 2cm height advantage (which real off-road riders have confirmed is not significant), a 5kg weight advantage (which real off-road riders....I hate repeating myself but would also like to state means that the power to weight ratio is still in CRF's favour), and an adjustable suspension is worth the 15-20 000 THB extra that Kawasaki mandates the bike sells at rather than letting market forces (i.e. the plebes who are purchasing bikes) decide the actual price.

I trust you do realize that the restriction on the KLX250 is in order for it to pass emissions and noise regulations and has nothing to do with Kawasaki "trusting" noob buyers...

[dave_boo]

I trust you do realize that the restriction on the KLX250 is in order for it to pass emissions and noise regulations and has nothing to do with Kawasaki "trusting" noob buyers...

Yeah, ok. Because the KLX will not pollute in the first two gears at greater than 7 000 RPM. And as shown, even with the PowerCommander, exhaust, etc. the KLX makes the same as the CBR 250 engine...

Do you have a link to back up your apparent pulled out of the butt statement?

I've also put some thought in it. Since the KLX is so dumbed down, perhaps it would be a better bike for me to get since I'll be getting into lite off-road riding. I mean, Kawasaki's already helpfully put the power way down compared to the competition, its suspension can be adjusted for my fat ass, and when I've gained enough skills I can always sell the bike to some Kawasaki sucke^^lover for nearly the price of the the upgrade to the CRF.

[BigBikeBKK]

I trust you do realize that the restriction on the KLX250 is in order for it to pass emissions and noise regulations and has nothing to do with Kawasaki "trusting" noob buyers...

Yeah, ok. Because the KLX will not pollute in the first two gears at greater than 7 000 RPM. And as shown, even with the PowerCommander, exhaust, etc. the KLX makes the same as the CBR 250 engine...

Do you have a link to back up your apparent pulled out of the butt statement?

I've also put some thought in it. Since the KLX is so dumbed down, perhaps it would be a better bike for me to get since I'll be getting into lite off-road riding. I mean, Kawasaki's already helpfully put the power way down compared to the competition, its suspension can be adjusted for my fat ass, and when I've gained enough skills I can always sell the bike to some Kawasaki sucke^^lover for nearly the price of the the upgrade to the CRF.

Not sure where you're getting your power figures. Link would be nice. I remember you got it all wrong when you were copying KLX dyno charts off a spanish site a while back and thought "deslimitada" meant aftermarket ecu...

The ZX10R that Kawasaki sold in Thailand was restricted in similar fashion as the KLX/D-Tracker in that it's rev restricted in certain gears and I was told it was in order for the bike to pass the Thai noise and emissions regulations. Were they pulling that out of their butts? I don't know. I can't think of any other reason to restrict a bike in such an odd fashion... Can you? Honestly if it's not for noise / emissions, what other reason would there be to rev-restrict a bike?

I sure hope you'll get along better with a new CRF250L than you have with your Ninjette.

Happy Trails!

T

Edited May 10, 2012 by BigBikeBKK

[dave_boo]

Not sure where you're getting your power figures. Link would be nice. I remember you got it all wrong when you were copying KLX dyno charts off a spanish site a while back and thought "deslimitada" meant aftermarket ecu...

The ZX10R that Kawasaki sold in Thailand was restricted in similar fashion as the KLX/D-Tracker in that it's rev restricted in certain gears and I was told it was in order for the bike to pass the Thai noise and emissions regulations. Were they pulling that out of their butts? I don't know. I can't think of any other reason to restrict a bike in such an odd fashion... Can you? Honestly if it's not for noise / emissions, what other reason would there be to rev-restrict a bike?

I sure hope you'll get along better with a new CRF250L than you have with your Ninjette.

Happy Trails!

T

Not a problem dude. In fact if you look at the link I had posted earlier (don't know why you would think that kawasakiforums is a Spanish site; perhaps you can't keep facts straight that the poster was from a Spanish speaking island), you'd see that what I've stated are truthful and honest (with the exception of incorrectly translating deslimitada) unlike the fanciful proclamations being thrown around. I had also apologised for getting my terms muddled; I had forgotten that Kawasaki engineers had made it easy to bypass their *stringent emissions & sound controls* plus was thinking about the PowerCommander that the poster was also showing dynos for.

Once again I'm going to ask you for a link stating that Kawasaki put restrictions on the KLX in order to pass emissions/sound testing. If you can not, it just reinforces the pattern that all have seen from you. I.E. make stuff up, denigrate fellow boardmembers, and act as a general troll. You can not even reasonably discuss the facts! I've made several requests for you to respond to my comments about your earlier claims and the best you can come up with is "I was told". You state that you don't know if they are pulling it out of their butts, but are happy to repeat it as facts? Bravo bigbikebkk for making this forum such a better place! There's lots of reasons to restrict a bike; you have previously stated that you lived in Japan; why were/are beginner bikes restricted there to 160(?) km/h (or the big bikes to whatever gentleman's agreement the manufacturers have)? Hint, it isn't/wasn't for emissions and noise testing.

Now for anyone who cares, here are the stock and the upgraded KLX numbers. If bigbikebkk is right and the Thai one is even more restricted due to emissions, than you can move the curves further down. First pic is "KLX250 EFI Stock: 19´62cv, torque: 1´996kgm". Second is "KLX250 EFI+UNI+Snorkel KDX+LeoVinci+PowerCommander: 22´16cv; torque:2.285kgm" which is obviously an error as he listed the non-PowerCommander graph (both are on there).

**edit**

That's 180 km/h limit..sorry folks.

Edited May 10, 2012 by dave_boo

[dave_boo]

Tony ---ive ridden with this green bike, with the previous owner many times in Chiang Mai on trails -- the weight/ power/ FUEL CONSUMPTION ratio of "this" modified green bike is horrendous! No one wanted it in Chiang Mai,! just needed someone who didnt know the bike to walk into the buzz-saw and buy it..... the guy that sold it, bought a KTM 300 EXC - tha same as I have and loves it. تبریک می گویم

Be fair; it's an excellent starter bike. While I'm sure that you and your friends are way beyond it, for beginners it seems to be an excellent bike at a great price. It weighs approximately the same as the less heavy of the KLX/CRF competition, it has more power than the two others, plus it has the aftermarket parts available.

Basically, don't slag the bike for what it is, go after the owner for being too weak to be able to handle a 5kg heavier bike (getting heat stroke in 40C...with the lighter bike...that's a nice day here!) and in general being a less than stellar example of humanity.

[BigBikeBKK]

Not sure where you're getting your power figures. Link would be nice. I remember you got it all wrong when you were copying KLX dyno charts off a spanish site a while back and thought "deslimitada" meant aftermarket ecu...

The ZX10R that Kawasaki sold in Thailand was restricted in similar fashion as the KLX/D-Tracker in that it's rev restricted in certain gears and I was told it was in order for the bike to pass the Thai noise and emissions regulations. Were they pulling that out of their butts? I don't know. I can't think of any other reason to restrict a bike in such an odd fashion... Can you? Honestly if it's not for noise / emissions, what other reason would there be to rev-restrict a bike?

I sure hope you'll get along better with a new CRF250L than you have with your Ninjette.

Happy Trails!

T

Not a problem dude. In fact if you look at the link I had posted earlier (don't know why you would think that kawasakiforums is a Spanish site; perhaps you can't keep facts straight that the poster was from a Spanish speaking island), you'd see that what I've stated are truthful and honest (with the exception of incorrectly translating deslimitada) unlike the fanciful proclamations being thrown around. I had also apologised for getting my terms muddled; I had forgotten that Kawasaki engineers had made it easy to bypass their *stringent emissions & sound controls* plus was thinking about the PowerCommander that the poster was also showing dynos for.

Once again I'm going to ask you for a link stating that Kawasaki put restrictions on the KLX in order to pass emissions/sound testing. If you can not, it just reinforces the pattern that all have seen from you. I.E. make stuff up, denigrate fellow boardmembers, and act as a general troll. You can not even reasonably discuss the facts! I've made several requests for you to respond to my comments about your earlier claims and the best you can come up with is "I was told". You state that you don't know if they are pulling it out of their butts, but are happy to repeat it as facts? Bravo bigbikebkk for making this forum such a better place! There's lots of reasons to restrict a bike; you have previously stated that you lived in Japan; why were/are beginner bikes restricted there to 160(?) km/h (or the big bikes to whatever gentleman's agreement the manufacturers have)? Hint, it isn't/wasn't for emissions and noise testing.

Now for anyone who cares, here are the stock and the upgraded KLX numbers. If bigbikebkk is right and the Thai one is even more restricted due to emissions, than you can move the curves further down. First pic is "KLX250 EFI Stock: 19´62cv, torque: 1´996kgm". Second is "KLX250 EFI+UNI+Snorkel KDX+LeoVinci+PowerCommander: 22´16cv; torque:2.285kgm" which is obviously an error as he listed the non-PowerCommander graph (both are on there).

Sorry, I should have said Spanish chart, not Spanish site. My bad

You admitted your mistake back in post #395

I did make a mistake. In my haste to post I got the parts of the other thread mixed up.

As far as the REASON why some of the Kwackers are rev-limited in certain gears, I don't have a link to the answer to that question, that's why I asked you if you have any idea WHY Kawasaki puts gear specific rev limiters in some of their bikes. I'm just passing on what I've been told. If that bothers you, or you think I'm lying to you, you can ask Kawasaki the same question and see if you get the same answer. Simple, no? Honest question. No trolling or denigration intended. Sorry you're so sensitive Dave

Green is stock and Red is with derestricted API ecu

Yeah, I lived in Japan for 7 years, but my Honda CBR600F2 was US spec and not speed restricted like the Japanese model. Even de-restricted I don't think a stock Kawasaki KLX is ever going to hit 160kph, so again, the restriction must be for some other reason... With regards to both the KLX250 and the Ninja ZX10R the sales staff told me they are restricted in order to pass the Thai noise and emissions regulations. I don't know if this is true and accurate or not, but can't think of any other reason to restrict the bikes in such a fashion.

Happy Trails!

T

Edited May 10, 2012 by BigBikeBKK

[taninthai]

Lol that explains why he was talking about getting a bigger fuel tank after he had been on his first ride,did you ever get the larger tank bigbike if so when you've got a full tank of fuel in there it probably weighs more than the crf never mind let's get back on topic I have seen some renthal mx bars for 3000 bht anyone know if this a good price or not

Thanks

[taninthai]

Sorry double post

Edited May 10, 2012 by taninthai

[dave_boo]

As far as the REASON why some of the Kwackers are rev-limited in certain gears, I don't have a link to the answer to that question, that's why I asked you if you have any idea WHY Kawasaki puts gear specific rev limiters in some of their bikes. I'm just passing on what I've been told. If that bothers you, or you think I'm lying to you, you can ask Kawasaki the same question and see if you get the same answer. Simple, no? Honest question. No trolling or denigration intended. Sorry you're so sensitive Dave

Green is stock and Red is with derestricted API ecu

Yeah, I lived in Japan for 7 years, but my Honda CBR600F2 was US spec and not speed restricted like the Japanese model. Even de-restricted I don't think a stock Kawasaki KLX is ever going to hit 160kph, so again, the restriction must be for some other reason... With regards to both the KLX250 and the Ninja ZX10R the sales staff told me they are restricted in order to pass the Thai noise and emissions regulations. I don't know if this is true and accurate or not, but can't think of any other reason to restrict the bikes in such a fashion.

Happy Trails!

T

I love doing the leg work to disprove your wild claims.

Firstly, Thai emissions do not require a certain 'road' speed as far as I know (unlike in the States). They simply require an idle test for the CO and HC and a 3/4 max RPM test for white smoke/noise.

I'm not quite sure what the "3/4 or 1/2" indicates unless its the same as the civilised world in that it must be at least ~5000 RPM whether that's 1/2 or 3/4. Guess that pretty much destroys the claims of it being related to emissions.

I can not explain why Kawasaki has restricted the bike in the upper gears any more than why Honda didn't retune the CBR engine for more torque lower down. However, the only thing that makes sense is they wanted a 'softer' bike for new riders with the upgrade path to the 300/450 being available elsewhere. If you can not comprehend that, I'll say it slowly "Kawasaki...restricts...the...KLX 250S...to...encourage...new...owners...when...they...outgrow...it...to...buy...a...bigger...Kawasaki...dual...sport. It's also a guilty pleasure watching you wiggle and squirm when tasting your own medicine.

I'm sensitive? You're the one crying as if they're butt hurt that Kawasaki has a product that loses out powerwise to Honda and are grasping at straws to try and explain it away (while ignoring the elephant in the room that the CRF/CBR/Ninja don't have problems putting out much more power without restrictions!).

Thank you for the dyno chart and putting my mind to ease about Kawasaki's offering in LOS being more restricted than the international FI model.