Thai Govt In Damage Control On Terror

[BudM]

Thai Gonernment to the Thai people " There is no terror plot, if there is one and the bomb goes off, it will only kill the American but not the Thais that happen to be around when the bomb goes off! Don't worry, we will protect you just like what we are doing in the south for decades"

[Foggy Bottom]

... intelligence organization ....

Didn't have to read beyond that in the 2nd line to recognise that you were an American flying your own flag.

zzzzzzzzzzz - the rest of the world uses an "s".

[BudM]

_{@ FOGGY BOTTOM}

_{Canadian also use 'Z', should I fly my flag?}

[cdnski12]

Use Thai Logic ... probably the crafty Lebanese/Hezbollah guy just wanted to get a free air Fare back to Lebanon?

[wxyz]

My riposte is as follows:

#1... I don't see an issue. The Embassy can issue a warning. Why do keep re-stating it? It's not a point of contention.

You obviously have not been reading the posts on this thread. Many. many posters have been complaining that the US Embassy was wrong to issue its threat warning. My point was in response to these posters.

#2.... Wait? So you think that the Thai government acted only after the US Embassy issued the warning? Just because the Thai government publicly responded to the issue doesn't mean that they weren't doing anything before the warning. They produced info about the guy within a couple hours of the US warning... the Thai government obviously had been working on this for a long time but felt the need to be more public about it because of image issues.

Yeah, nothing happened. No deaths, no bombing. An arrest was made... plenty of arrests are made for all sorts of things without our knowledge. I'm sure not every single "terror"-related arrest in the US is made public, either. No harm, no foul... the only thing different is that you/we know about the event. Events in the world don't only start to happen once you are aware of them.

And saving lives/saving face is the same issue... the Thai government doesn't want an event here. There hasn't been any major international terrorist event in Thailand in almost 40 years. I doubt that this was the first attempt or operation that the Thai government has been involved with.

Have I ever said that the Thai government was not taking any action? No, I have not. However, the fact that the Thai government only complained about the US Embassy alert and not providing an alert itself, does indicate that it was only concerned about the issuance of the alert by the embassy. It is patently obvious to the US Embassy that the Thais were not going to issue an alert so that did it themselves. That us why they tool the action they did. I do not know how long you have been here so I am unsure of how much you know of the Thai propensity to hide the facts and not admit there is a problem.

#3... I don't understand. Why would I or anyone have complained to the US embassy if there was a terrorist event in Thailand?

I was only using the US Embassy as an illustration. If you have another nationality, then I would expect that you would complain to that embassy had no warning been issued and you had been caught in the blast - assuming that you survived. If not, then your surviving relatives would certainly have.

#4... You asked why no answers to you post, so I answered.

Are you not aware that rhetorical answers do not require an answer? The question speaks for itself.

#1 We can skip this one... I'm only going to answer for what I think.

#2 Yes, the Thai government won't always be open. But in this case, there is no problem. No bombs, no deaths, nothing. Nothing to talk about. I'm sure there have been other arrests and supposed plots broken up in Thailand and elsewhere that never get reported.

#3 I'm American. But I still wouldn't complain to the US Embassy about an attack in Thailand. Are they planting the bombs?

#4 I took your question about "mobs" to be some sort of statement or commentary about the Thai government but not sure exactly who.

Well, I am not an American but I can see why the US Embassy did what it did. The fact that there was no bomb could well have been due to the fact that the Thais were forced to get off their rear ends and be seen to do something about it. Furthermore, had you been caught in the blast and not survived, your American relatives in the US, if you have any, would be complaining to the US Government about the lack or warning.

I rest my case.

Rest what case? That the warning was OK... yeah, I already agreed with you. I probably shouldn't have replied to your post since I thought your term "anti-American" related to views on foreign policy... but for you "anit-American" meant grievances toward the US Embassy, which I don't have.

However, you're wrong to think that the Thais did nothing until the US warning. They just didn't do anything publicly. Not sure why you think that nothing occurs unless you know about it.

I still don't get the complaining to the embassy part LOL... why would anyone complain to the US Embassy for a terrorist action in another country by a group from another country. I guess you and I think differently... I don't look for scapegoats whenever something goes wrong.

there was a bomb

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/526532-thai-police-find-explosive-chemicals-linked-to-terror-plot/page__fromsearch__1

[wxyz]

I note, the above news report doesn't mention what country the arrested supposed bomber was deported to....

Lebanon? Sweden? Dubai?? Israel? USA??? Disneyland??? Hmmm.... I wonder.....

I would assume he would be sent back to Sweden, but it is odd that they do not say exactly.

why, he hasn't lived there for 7 years

[waza]

Governments in most countries including US do not inform the public of Terrorists plots. Why?

To avoid mass panic just like what happened in Thailand.

P.s. when was the last terrorist attack in Thailand aimed at foreign tourists?

That's true. But then most civilised governments don't have an incompentant bunch of ministers running the country nor a useless police force to deal with the terrorist threat.

Oh and before Bali was bombed, I can't seem to remember when the last terrorist attack was aimed at foreign tourists there either.

Remember this...............

A Thai bomb squad unit inspects the damage at a bus stop struck by one of several bombs that exploded in the capital on New Year's eve, killing three people and injuring 38

AFP / GETTY IMAGES

inShare0

New Year's Eve got off to an unexpected bang in the Thai capital, Bangkok, when a series of bombs detonated across town, killing at least three people and injuring dozens, including several foreign tourists..........

Many dispersed, but plenty of celebrants were still milling around when a second wave of bombs detonated around midnight. Two explosions erupted near Central World, one at a flyover and another at a seafood restaurant frequented by tourists. Several foreigners were injured in the midnight attacks.

Read more: http://www.time.com/...l#ixzz1jfDzZZnb

I bet those Thai's and tourist's families wished they had a warning

Edited January 16, 2012 by waza

[BudM]

WAZA, I also remember after 911, Thailand also declared that there sre no terrorist groups in Thiland.

[chooka]

If it was not for the Yanks, you would probably not be speaking English, possibly German or Japanese.

As for the warning, better to get it out there than no warning at all.

These sort of insulting and disrespectful remarks are what incite American bashing.

[OZEMADE]

If it was not for the Yanks, you would probably not be speaking English, possibly German or Japanese.

As for the warning, better to get it out there than no warning at all.

These sort of insulting and disrespectful remarks are what incite American bashing.

Well chooka, I dont know what you are on about. Obviously you have nothing else to write or complain about.

I stand by what I have stated re speaking english, dont know how this incites American bashing.

Also glad they did warn us along with the OZ embassy warning. If you have a problem with the truth, bad luck.

[jackr]

If it was not for the Yanks, you would probably not be speaking English, possibly German or Japanese.

Surely you not speaking Japanese is down to your own mettle... after all, didn't you lot stave them off with peashooters?

[LomSak27]

Good to see the cheap seats fussing and a feuding about amerikka on a Tuesday morning! Good to see posters here have something to do.

So the US issued a terror warning big deal - if it gets the thai goverment doing something, more power to them. If not it gives you something to talk about instead of how viscous and greasy that meat pie is.

hmm now was that the earthquake and Tsunami center in Hawaii, that WAS NOT linked with Thailand who called up with a warning about a strong earthquake off the sumatra coast that might produce a tsunami .... out of the goodness of their heart .... but somehow that warning was never transimitted on to the Andaman coats resorts?! Yep I'm sure I remember something like that happening.

Oh don't worry about looking that up - all records of it had to be squashed because of govermental fears of western lawsuits hehe.

Now time for coffee

[NanLaew]

"The detained man told police about the Hezbollah plot."

If there was a Hezbollah plot, involving Thailand, how does that make a statement that Bangkok is a POTENTIAL target alarmist non-sense scare tactics.

What WAS the plot?

Moreover, why was the 'detained man' released? He told the police about "the plot" but police and government reasoning is that since the event didn't come to pass, then he cannot be charged with anything.

I think I will pop into the local police station and tell them I am planning to "off" the mother-in-law. Maybe I will get lucky and get a cup of tea while I am there.

[Lifer]

How many times have you gone to a restaurant like McDonalds or Food court in paragon (for example), and seen someone place a bag on a table to reserve it and walk away, what would happen if that bag contained a bomb.

People need to be educated about terrorism, maybe things like this will help educate them, but I very much doubt it.

Agree. If Thai college students can't think critically, they wouldn't do very good job of watching for unusual actions like leaving bombs left unattended and think anythingt of it. As for the poster who seems to dislike everything the US does to try and protrect them when host countries don't, let them put in earplugs and put on blinders. One wonders what country they were raised. Most likely they are not old enough to have experienced much world history.

[OZEMADE]

I see where Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra asked the American Embassy to lift its terrorist threat warning for Bangkok. Their answer is it will remain as long as there is a Terrorist threat. Yingluck is worried that it will damage Thailand’s image.

Is tourism and Thailand’s image more important than the possible death of Thai and other nationalities? Is this a save face thing.

[chrisinth]

Are there any countries in the world that are not under threat of Terrorist action? It is a "Fact of Life" in today's world. Civilisation is an extremely thin veneer.

Yes, I think there are some countries with very low chances of hosting terrorist attacks, either internal or external. Costa Rica comes to mind.

JT.

I lived in Costa Rica for many years. car bombings, assinations you name it. I suppose it depends on you definition of what constitutes a terroist action. I can tell you many many people live in terror there. I can think of no country that is exempt.

What you mentioned, targeted assassinations for specific cause directed at specific individuals, obviously aren't terrorism.

Still scares the crap out of you when one of those car bombs goes off, terrifying!!

[chrisinth]

Perhaps if the terrorist were threatening Thai people in Bangkok they would see things differently.

Let off a bomb potentially as big as they describe, and the victims would be predominantly Thai.

Correct, so much for the alleged targeted attack........

[SanSaiExPat]

How far away does one have to get to truly get away from the American non-sense that constantly flows out of the government? Sorry, but meaningless scare tactics don't impress me. Furthermore, if two people can stimulate a panic without even doing anything, then the so-called bad guys win, period.

In addition, this 'cry wolf' crap is really getting old. Here's an idea America: try minding your own business and stop pissing on the rest of the world. See how that works instead of the normal gospel-spreading course, please.

Here's an idea for you, Gramps.... Let America take care of its own people and stay of our business. As an American living abroad, if my country issues a warning of something imminent, I'm listening. AMERICA WARNING AMERICANS IS HER BUSINESS. When sh*t hit the fan, you'll be whining, "Why didn't the US do something????? Where was the US???? " Maybe a terrorist's bullet shot at you or a terrorist's bomb exploding in front of your face would impress you....

Gramps? Wow, that's deep. Now I can see the type of scholarly mind that buys this fear mongering tripe.

Here's a better idea: stop assuming you know what I'd do! I don't need nor want big brother's help. I am tired of my country trying to run the world and impacting how other non-aggressive countries have to constantly defend themselves against US foreign policy.

Thailand is minding her own business. The US should give that a try. It actually works!

And now you have taken on the title as "Spokesperson for all the realists". I'm impressed. You've claimed title to the realist camp which of course leaves the rest of us who don't agree with you out in the cold. Actually, from your previous pronouncements on this board it strikes me that your a misguided self hating American with an ax to grind. These threats are real and the US Government's warning to it's citizens (Even it's unappreciative and misguided one's ) was the right course of action.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I see where Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra asked the American Embassy to lift its terrorist threat warning for Bangkok. Their answer is it will remain as long as there is a Terrorist threat. Yingluck is worried that it will damage Thailand’s image.

Is tourism and Thailand’s image more important than the possible death of Thai and other nationalities? Is this a save face thing.

Do you really need to ask that question? Of course, the answer is YES!

But seriously, probably, it more a question of the certain problem -- tourism definitely will suffer as long as there's a well publicized terror threat.... vs. the potential problem -- a bunch of people could die IF the terrorists manage to set off a big bomb somewhere...

Add in the dynamic that making money/profit tops everything else here..... and the answer in Thai officials' mindset is clear.

Edited January 17, 2012 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Orac]

I see where Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra asked the American Embassy to lift its terrorist threat warning for Bangkok. Their answer is it will remain as long as there is a Terrorist threat. Yingluck is worried that it will damage Thailand’s image.

Is tourism and Thailand’s image more important than the possible death of Thai and other nationalities? Is this a save face thing.

This is Thailand so the 'face' part will play a big part in this. The confrontational approach does not go down well here and it has created a diplomatic incident which could have far reaching consequences.

I have no objection to the US embassy issuing a warning to its citizens here as that is their job, however, such a warning must be coordinated with the host country which is what seems to have failed here - the Thai authorities look like they were working on breaking a terrorist cell and the US embassy went public on it before they wanted them to. I doubt we will ever know the 'truth' about what happenned here or what is really going on much the same as I am pretty confident that what we hear about terrorism plots and incidents in the UK/USA is the tip of the iceberg and there is a lot of detail kept from us.

I would guess that Thai authorities are worried about the effect this will have on tourism from their key markets in asia - the Chinese are notoriously risk averse when it comes to threats such as this - especially when they are trying to rehabilitate Bangkok following previous problems. Lets not forget that in the last few years this 'soft target' has been underwater, burnt down, a 'life' fire zone, swarming with green mambas not to mention frequently bombed by its own home grown terrorists - it was only a few weeks ago that several bombs were found.

One has to wonder how the government is going to react to this diplomatic breakdown between them and the US embassy - for the embassy to effectively say no to the Thai PM when she has asked them to remove the warning is a huge embarrassment - especially when one bears in mind that, unlike previous incidents in the recent past for Bangkok, this will not be seen as a home grown problem but is instead a threat by foreign terrorists to foreigners in Thailand about foreign problems.

I can see why Thailand wants no part in this but I cannot see how they can stay out of it though I can see them making a knee jerk reaction against the western foreigners that they will point the finger at possibly tightening up on immigration controls which would effect most of us - don't forget these were technically swedish men as far as immigration would be concerned targetting Israelis.

[wxyz]

apparently he is a 'red shirt' supporter, notice his shirt in the pic,

that explains a lot on the govts fuming at the American embassy for the terror warning and down playing the incident

"Suspect's confession led to finding of bomb ingredients"

http://www.nationmul...i-30173823.html

[LomSak27]

Orac Posted

"have no objection to the US embassy issuing a warning to its citizens here as that is their job, however, such a warning must be coordinated with the host country which is what seems to have failed here "

Not at all, and I wonder where you came up with that absurd statement " must be coordinated with the host country "

This is a warning to US citizens, Thailand can ignore and say its fluff. In actual fact the only reason that Thailand is concerned is that it might hurt their tourist industry

"One has to wonder how the government is going to react to this diplomatic breakdown between them and the US embassy - for the embassy to effectively say no to the Thai PM when she has asked them to remove the warning is a huge embarrassment"

Again this is a warning to US citizens ... US citizens being of a litigious nature you have to get these things out - why this concerns the Thai government or Brits, Aussies, Canadians, etc. is interesting from a sociological aspect BUT has no bearing on the US Government warnings.

[BudM]

When the Bali style bombing happens in Phuket or Bangkok, it is just a matter of when it will happen, you know whom the Thai government will blame for not giving out to warning.

[Tywais]

Off topic posts re: WWII have been removed.

[rogera]

I see where Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra asked the American Embassy to lift its terrorist threat warning for Bangkok. Their answer is it will remain as long as there is a Terrorist threat. Yingluck is worried that it will damage Thailand’s image.

Is tourism and Thailand’s image more important than the possible death of Thai and other nationalities? Is this a save face thing.

This is Thailand so the 'face' part will play a big part in this. The confrontational approach does not go down well here and it has created a diplomatic incident which could have far reaching consequences.

Why? Thailand needs the US much more than the US needs Thailand. It will be a storm in a teacup.

I have no objection to the US embassy issuing a warning to its citizens here as that is their job, however, such a warning must be coordinated with the host country which is what seems to have failed here - the Thai authorities look like they were working on breaking a terrorist cell and the US embassy went public on it before they wanted them to. I doubt we will ever know the 'truth' about what happenned here or what is really going on much the same as I am pretty confident that what we hear about terrorism plots and incidents in the UK/USA is the tip of the iceberg and there is a lot of detail kept from us.

It was pretty obvious to the US Embassy that the Thais we not, ever, going to announce the terror threat. That is why they issued it themselves.

I would guess that Thai authorities are worried about the effect this will have on tourism from their key markets in asia - the Chinese are notoriously risk averse when it comes to threats such as this - especially when they are trying to rehabilitate Bangkok following previous problems. Lets not forget that in the last few years this 'soft target' has been underwater, burnt down, a 'life' fire zone, swarming with green mambas not to mention frequently bombed by its own home grown terrorists - it was only a few weeks ago that several bombs were found.

Of course. The Thais are only worried about three things

1. Saving face

2. Protecting the tourist trade

3. Protecting their economic interests

The last two I fully understand but saving face is no excuse for not issuing an alert themselves. They don't care a whit for the safety of their own people, much less the foreigners who live here and who pay taxes, bring in FI etc etc

One has to wonder how the government is going to react to this diplomatic breakdown between them and the US embassy - for the embassy to effectively say no to the Thai PM when she has asked them to remove the warning is a huge embarrassment - especially when one bears in mind that, unlike previous incidents in the recent past for Bangkok, this will not be seen as a home grown problem but is instead a threat by foreign terrorists to foreigners in Thailand about foreign problems.

I can see why Thailand wants no part in this but I cannot see how they can stay out of it though I can see them making a knee jerk reaction against the western foreigners that they will point the finger at possibly tightening up on immigration controls which would effect most of us - don't forget these were technically swedish men as far as immigration would be concerned targetting Israelis.

So can everyone else. The Thai government (and all others before this one) are like ostriches with their head in the sand. They also treat their own people like idiots. That's why we have the social divide that will tear the Kingdom apart is a few years. It will be like Cambodia was during the Khmer Rouge time but hopefully not quite as bad. With regard to tightening up on immigration controls, they are already doing that so whats new?

[Orac]

Orac Posted

"have no objection to the US embassy issuing a warning to its citizens here as that is their job, however, such a warning must be coordinated with the host country which is what seems to have failed here "

Not at all, and I wonder where you came up with that absurd statement " must be coordinated with the host country "

This is a warning to US citizens, Thailand can ignore and say its fluff. In actual fact the only reason that Thailand is concerned is that it might hurt their tourist industry

"One has to wonder how the government is going to react to this diplomatic breakdown between them and the US embassy - for the embassy to effectively say no to the Thai PM when she has asked them to remove the warning is a huge embarrassment"

Again this is a warning to US citizens ... US citizens being of a litigious nature you have to get these things out - why this concerns the Thai government or Brits, Aussies, Canadians, etc. is interesting from a sociological aspect BUT has no bearing on the US Government warnings.

You may think that the US embassy warning US citizens about specific terrorist threats in Thailand should not concern the Thai government, a country that classes itself as a tourist destination, but I choose to disagree.

[OZEMADE]

As far as Thailand not being given prior warning of other countries informing their Embasies of a Terror Alert. Below gives dates well before Christmas.

Thai sources said that during his questioning, the detained Hezbollah operative confessed that a terror squad was intending to launch an attack on Israeli targets, including places where Israelis stay.

"The Thai authorities have stationed heavy security at all potential targets," a securing source added.

According to the Thai media, Israel first informed the Thai authorities on December 22 that three Hezbollah operatives had entered the country in order to perpetrate terror attacks. On January 8, Israel received additional information pinpointing this weekend as the time of the attack.

The Americans had also informed the Thai authorities before Christmas that they had received information from Israel about a planned terror attack against Western and American targets in Bangkok.

[LomSak27]

Orac Posted:

may think that the US embassy warning US citizens about specific terrorist threats in Thailand should not concern the Thai government, a country that classes itself as a tourist destination, but I choose to disagree.

The Thai government can be concerned or not concerned, that is their right. Brits, Aussies, Albanians, Athabascan’s and Ainu, can be concerned, and flap their mouths so hard they bust a tongue, that is their right and business. However the US government is issuing this as a service to their citizens and that most definitely is their business and they are not going to consult with somebody regarding how it affects tourism and international PR.

Maybe in a kinder gentler world they might, or might have, but not today and not now.

[metisdead]

Off topic posts have been removed.

[Orac]

Orac Posted:

may think that the US embassy warning US citizens about specific terrorist threats in Thailand should not concern the Thai government, a country that classes itself as a tourist destination, but I choose to disagree.

The Thai government can be concerned or not concerned, that is their right. Brits, Aussies, Albanians, Athabascan’s and Ainu, can be concerned, and flap their mouths so hard they bust a tongue, that is their right and business. However the US government is issuing this as a service to their citizens and that most definitely is their business and they are not going to consult with somebody regarding how it affects tourism and international PR.

Maybe in a kinder gentler world they might, or might have, but not today and not now.

I partially agree with you regarding the effects on tourism and international PR, however, my concern about the assumed lack of consultation is in the context of an international 'war on terrorism' and the cooperation between international law enforcement agencies that is vital to it.

According to the information released so far there were at least three lebanese/swedish terrorists at large in Thailand and there was a significant amount of planning and preparation that had gone on - the warehouse that was searched was rented over 2 years ago. The quick arrest of one of the terrorists suggest that the Thai authorities were making some headway into shutting down this terrorist cell but I would assume that in the light of the warning the remaining terrorists have now gone to ground to strike another day or indeed moved on to plan B since the warning is still in place.

Edited January 17, 2012 by Orac