Organic Fruits And Vegetables In Koh Samui

[dbrisinda]

Could anyone direct me to where can I find organic fruits and vegetables in Koh Samui?

I have some Thai friends that have told me that many farmers are using pesticides these days in Thailand for increased yield. Apart from an organic produce store (are there any?), how can I tell if produce has been treated with pesticides?

Thanks for any info.

[ydraw]

Flame removed.

Thailand is a developing country where a lot of people still don't have enough to eat. Without pesticides and fertilisers millions of Thais would starve to death every year.

Edited May 8, 2012 by Rooo
Flame removed.

[BangrakBob]

that's a bit harsh, the guy was only asking a question for personal choice, not condemning a country for using techniques to ensure people are feed

[phetphet]

Have a look here: http://thaiorganiclife.com/index.php?page_ID=3&pages_name=Services

Or perhaps try Google.

I think that there is a hygroponics place near Big C, but I don't know if it is organic.

[itishothere]

I think that there is a hygroponics place near Big C, but I don't know if it is organic.

Been past there a couple of times recently, and it has never been open ...... unless it is one of these early market type things when you have to get there at the crack of sparrow f#rt.

Tescos and BigC have vegetables with the word 'organic' on their plastic wrappers. But I am always suspicious of words like 'real, genuine, authentic' etc anywhere in this country. To you, the word organic means natural, pesticide free etc, to others it means it has carbon in it.

Your best bet might be to chat to someone in the kitchens at the larger hotels, or more up-market restaurants?

[ydraw]

that's a bit harsh, the guy was only asking a question for personal choice

It's not harsh at all, it's a personal choice that results in the world producing less food, and as a result causing people to go hungrier than they need to be. Organic food has absolutely no benefits over regular food, it's just a waste of resources to satisfy the noble savage delusions of wealthy western hippies.

[jamesbrock]

It's not harsh at all, it's a personal choice that results in the world producing less food, and as a result causing people to go hungrier than they need to be. Organic food has absolutely no benefits over regular food, it's just a waste of resources to satisfy the noble savage delusions of wealthy western hippies.

Wow, so it's delusional western hippies that want to eat healthier that are causing the many third world famines?

And here I was thinking the personal choice to ingest far more food than a human needs resulted in the world having less food, and as a result causing people to go hungrier than they need to be. In addition to morbid obesity putting one at greater risk of illness (including diabetes, high blood pressure, sleep apnea, gastroesophageal reflux disease (GERD), gallstones, osteoarthritis, heart disease, and cancer) than eating regular amounts of food, it's just a waste of resources to satisfy the ignoble savage gluttony of wealthy western fatties.

[Rooo]

A simple question. Do you know where it's sold Not a world health debate.

There used to be a shop on the ring road in Lamai. Once you pass the the Temple, turn left. A few hundred metres on the right.

As for the hydroponic shop that is always open , they might look shut but someone always there.

[samuijimmy]

My two bits worth:

Technically the hydroponic produce is not "organic", because the vegetables are grown in liquid fertilizer solution... and it ain't cow poo......

I can only base an answer on the Hydroponic farm near me, because I know him. He does not use pesticides of any kind.... I would suspect the other hydroponic farms on the island are the same.... (or probably around Thailand for that matter).... So it's a bit hard to say these hydroponic veggies are truly "organic" ...

Pesticide free, yes...but lets not pretend it is only Thailand, all first world countries do, too, to increase yields... (except for the organic farms where ever they are) .....

[ydraw]

Wow, so it's delusional western hippies that want to eat healthier that are causing the many third world famines?

Like I said, there's no health benefit at all to organic food. The only benefit is the warm fuzzy feeling that hippies get from knowing that they are more "environmentally aware" the the proles who eat regular food.

If anything, organic food is far less healthy, because it is grown in manure which contains e.coli bacteria, highly dangerous to humans.

And yes, demand for organic food increases the cost of food to everyone. There is a finite amount of land on earth suitable for growing food. The portion of that which is deliberately underutilised because of superstitious opposition to scientific advances results in higher food prices on average.

If every farm in the world went "organic" tomorrow, over 5 billion people would starve to death within 2 years.

I can only base an answer on the Hydroponic farm near me, because I know him. He does not use pesticides of any kind....

Organic doesn't just mean the lack of pesticides. Organic produce also precludes the use of chemical fertilisers.

Edited May 8, 2012 by ydraw

[jamesbrock]

Like I said, there's no health benefit at all to organic food. The only benefit is the warm fuzzy feeling that hippies get from knowing that they are more "environmentally aware" the the proles who eat regular food.

If anything, organic food is far less healthy, because it is grown in manure which contains e.coli bacteria, highly dangerous to humans.

And yes, demand for organic food increases the cost of food to everyone. There is a finite amount of land on earth suitable for growing food. The portion of that which is deliberately underutilised because of superstitious opposition to scientific advances results in higher food prices on average.

If every farm in the world went "organic" tomorrow, over 5 billion people would starve to death within 2 years.

Wow, your ignorance is staggering! As Rooo quite correctly pointed out, however, this is not the topic of this thread...

[ydraw]

Wow, your ignorance is staggering! As Rooo quite correctly pointed out, however, this is not the topic of this thread...

How convenient for you! That means you can call me ignorant and then hide behind a mod so you don't have to explain why or back up your view.

I am a farmer, I am not ignorant on the subject of organic food at all.

Here's a tip mate: If you disagree with me but don't have the knowledge or debating skills to explain why, it's fine to just say "I disagree" and leave it at that. Calling me ignorant and pretending you can't elaborate because of the topic is gutless.

Edited May 9, 2012 by ydraw

[dbrisinda]

Wow, so it's delusional western hippies that want to eat healthier that are causing the many third world famines?

Like I said, there's no health benefit at all to organic food. The only benefit is the warm fuzzy feeling that hippies get from knowing that they are more "environmentally aware" the the proles who eat regular food.

If anything, organic food is far less healthy, because it is grown in manure which contains e.coli bacteria, highly dangerous to humans.

And yes, demand for organic food increases the cost of food to everyone. There is a finite amount of land on earth suitable for growing food. The portion of that which is deliberately underutilised because of superstitious opposition to scientific advances results in higher food prices on average.

If every farm in the world went "organic" tomorrow, over 5 billion people would starve to death within 2 years.

I can only base an answer on the Hydroponic farm near me, because I know him. He does not use pesticides of any kind....

Organic doesn't just mean the lack of pesticides. Organic produce also precludes the use of chemical fertilisers.

Umm. You aren't going to convince me (or anyone else it seems) of anything. I've done my own homework. So you may as well just stop.

Incidentally, you have a rather bizarre world-view on the source of many of our world's ills. I could debate you on this (and I'm certain you would lose), but, as others have already pointed out, this is not the time nor the place.

A little free advice for the future: if you are planning to debate this issue in a more appropriate forum, you might want to consider providing independent references for your data points. Just because you say it, doesn't make it so. (And citing data from experiments that were conducted and/or funded by chemical fertilizer or pesticide companies doesn't qualify as corroborating evidence. Nor does citing an opinion piece by someone who just happens to be on a chemical fertilizer/pesticide companies' payroll. As in all things, follow the money.)

If you want to eat pesticide-laden produce, that's your decision. I respect your right to do so. But it's wholly my prerogative to choose not to, and seek out alternatives.

In any case, thanks to all those who have provided some organic produce options.

[dbrisinda]

Flame removed.

Thailand is a developing country where a lot of people still don't have enough to eat. Without pesticides and fertilisers millions of Thais would starve to death every year.

That doesn't answer my question. Where can I find them?

Edited May 9, 2012 by dbrisinda

[ydraw]

A little free advice for the future: if you are planning to debate this issue in a more appropriate forum, you might want to consider providing independent references for your data points. Just because you say it, doesn't make it so. (And citing data from experiments that were conducted and/or funded by chemical fertilizer or pesticide companies doesn't qualify as corroborating evidence. Nor does citing an opinion piece by someone who just happens to be on a chemical fertilizer/pesticide companies' payroll. As in all things, follow the money.)

Like most hippies, it's pretty obvious from this paragraph that your opposition to modern agriculture is based primarily on your opposition to capitalism. It would probably shatter your worldview to discover that most organic produce comes from the same corporate farm enterprises that produce non-organic food.

There is absolutely no difference between organic food and non-organic food, except that organic food results in much lower yields per hectare.

I'm not even sure what you are asking me to cite. Do you want proof that organic food is no healthier, or do you want proof that it results in lower yields? Either way I can provide sources to demonstrate either, not that it will make any difference, since as you have already said you will not be convinced even if I did provide evidence.

Anyway, I'm sure if you look hard enough you could probably convince yourself that the US National Library of Medicine and the UK Food Standard Agency are in the payroll of Monsanto, but the fact is that you won't find any scientist claiming there is any health benefit to organic food.

Another fact I think you are missing is that "organic" is not the same thing as "pesticide free". Organic production still uses pesticides. They just use naturally occurring pesticides like Strychnine and Arsenic, rather than chemically produced pesticides like Roundup. And I shouldn't need to point out that Strychnine is no better for you than any other kind of chemical. Just because something occurs in nature doesn't make it healthier than something produced in a lab.

Edited May 9, 2012 by ydraw

[jamesbrock]

How convenient for you! That means you can call me ignorant and then hide behind a mod so you don't have to explain why or back up your view.

No, not hiding behind a mod at all; just trying to respect the rules of the forum.

I am a farmer, I am not ignorant on the subject of organic food at all.

So, you're not ignorant, just biased.

Here's a tip mate: If you disagree with me but don't have the knowledge or debating skills to explain why, it's fine to just say "I disagree" and leave it at that. Calling me ignorant and pretending you can't elaborate because of the topic is gutless.

You see, I know how this is going to go: you're going to make a stupid baseless statement (e.g. "If every farm in the world went "organic" tomorrow, over 5 billion people would starve to death within 2 years.", I'd probably counter by referencing a Cambridge University study that disproves said baseless statement, and therefore your argument; you would, if you hadn't already, reference the very prestigious Skeptoid, and you might also commit a logical fallacy by referencing a UK Department of Epidemiology Population Health study that states that there is insufficient data to conclude either way - as though this proves your point - which, by the way, does not.

We will both cherry pick data that proves our argument, until Rooo puts a stop to it, and, ultimately, change nobody's mind.

In the end, I really couldn't be bothered. Have a good afternoon.

[ydraw]

James, the abstract of the study you cited assumes that the entire world would change their diet to eat more leguminous crops (eg chickpeas, soybeans) in lieu of cereals (wheat, corn, rice), since that is the only organic way to achieve nitrogen levels in the soil that we currently get from fertiliser.

Doesn't sound very realistic to me.

Edited May 9, 2012 by ydraw

[Rooo]

Half time. Please keep it civil.

[PoorSucker]

Half time. Please keep it civil.

come on Roo.

It's interesting and fun, but keep it civil boys/girls.

3.6 of 5 so far goes to Ydraw.

\

because he's a farmer boy.....

Edited May 9, 2012 by PoorSucker

[tenna]

that's a bit harsh, the guy was only asking a question for personal choice

It's not harsh at all, it's a personal choice that results in the world producing less food, and as a result causing people to go hungrier than they need to be. Organic food has absolutely no benefits over regular food, it's just a waste of resources to satisfy the noble savage delusions of wealthy western hippies.

That is a pretty miaopic view and truly shows you dont know what you are talking about.

Beyond that...I have to ask, why would you bother writing a response so negative and spews harsh critisisms at a group of people that just might be a little wiser than you...or at minimum have a different opinion? How do you survive living abroad with such a low tolerance for different lifestyles? Have these "western hippies" threatend you? do something that harmed you? what scientific basis do you have for your comments? What credentials?

If it is an off the cuff statement, you are eitherXXX orXXX, if its based on research you have done, I would love to see it and who sponsored the research.

Edited May 9, 2012 by Rooo
Flame removed.

[dbrisinda]

For those who are interested, I've set up a separate topic in organic gardening forum for continuing the debate of organic vs. conventional farming in Thailand here.

[ydraw]

Have these "western hippies" threatend you? do something that harmed you?

Funny you should ask.

Yes, these hippies have not only threatened the livelihood of farmers, but taken direct action to cost us money and valuable research hundreds of times in the last few years. They are involved in an all-out war with the people who grow your food. They are opposed to modern science and believe that the world should be depopulated - which necessarily means the forced starvation of billions.

You asked.

what scientific basis do you have for your comments?

I have provided numerous links to back up my argument. You have provided nothing except evidence of your inability to spell.

miaopic

Edited May 9, 2012 by ydraw

[katyb]

Er... anyway, at some point I think some one was asking a question about where to buy organic fruit and veg.

I can't help with the fruit and veg but I have found there is a new venture that's just started at Maenam Walking Street on Thursday nights selling 'natural, organic superfoods" .

Here is a link to their Facebook page.

https://www.facebook.com/goodnhealthy

As you enter from the traffic lights, the stall should be past Jomar Bar on the left and just before the Pizza place.

It's called Nature Home. I don't know any more about it than this link, but it maybe worth popping along and having a chat with them to see if they can help you.

Good luck.

(Just noticed there's a phone number on the info page as well)

[Tropicalevo]

Well done katyb. Some sense at last.

You (overgrown) children out there, stop your bickering and please help the OP to find organic food.

[Rooo]

There used to be a shop on the ring road in Lamai. Once you pass the the Temple, turn left. A few hundred metres on the right.

I already posted the whereabouts of an organic shop lol.

[dbrisinda]

A little free advice for the future: if you are planning to debate this issue in a more appropriate forum, you might want to consider providing independent references for your data points. Just because you say it, doesn't make it so. (And citing data from experiments that were conducted and/or funded by chemical fertilizer or pesticide companies doesn't qualify as corroborating evidence. Nor does citing an opinion piece by someone who just happens to be on a chemical fertilizer/pesticide companies' payroll. As in all things, follow the money.)

Like most hippies, it's pretty obvious from this paragraph that your opposition to modern agriculture is based primarily on your opposition to capitalism. It would probably shatter your worldview to discover that most organic produce comes from the same corporate farm enterprises that produce non-organic food.

There is absolutely no difference between organic food and non-organic food, except that organic food results in much lower yields per hectare.

I'm not even sure what you are asking me to cite. Do you want proof that organic food is no healthier, or do you want proof that it results in lower yields? Either way I can provide sources to demonstrate either, not that it will make any difference, since as you have already said you will not be convinced even if I did provide evidence.

Anyway, I'm sure if you look hard enough you could probably convince yourself that the US National Library of Medicine and the UK Food Standard Agency are in the payroll of Monsanto, but the fact is that you won't find any scientist claiming there is any health benefit to organic food.

Another fact I think you are missing is that "organic" is not the same thing as "pesticide free". Organic production still uses pesticides. They just use naturally occurring pesticides like Strychnine and Arsenic, rather than chemically produced pesticides like Roundup. And I shouldn't need to point out that Strychnine is no better for you than any other kind of chemical. Just because something occurs in nature doesn't make it healthier than something produced in a lab.

That's amusing. However, you are incorrect in your obvious assessment. I’m not a hippie. And I’m not opposed to anything for which there is a genuine demand, provided the natural rights of all those involved are protected and preserved (yes, including the protection of private property, which synthetic pesticide/fertilizer advocates will have a hard time justifying due to the nature of chemical runoff effects on soil and water supplies and un-contained environmental damage).

You are overstating the case. Only 14% of total agricultural food production comes from corporations or other non-family entities in the United States. Data for countries in Europe is likely to be even less favourable for large corporate farms. [Source: USDA's "U.S. Farms: Numbers, Size, and Ownership"] Organic fruits and vegetables represented over 11 percent of all U.S. fruit and vegetable sales. [source: Organic Trade Association’s 2011 Organic Industry Survey]

Quick math: 11% of total U.S. fruit and vegetable sales are organic. And 14% of total agricultural food production is from corporate farms and enterprises. If we assume a roughly even distribution, that means corporate farms are producing roughly .11 x .14 = 1.54% of total U.S. organic fruit and vegetable sales. Even if the data is off by a bit, due to corporate farms weighting their production more in favour of organic produce due to higher profit margins, it is still quite a stretch to say “most” organic production is by large corporate farms. Actually, far more than a stretch.

In any event, even if what you say were true, which it obviously isn't, it wouldn't shatter my worldview because, whenever possible, I try to buy organic products from small local operators and farmer's markets. I tend to support the people and communities where I live, since that money will get recirculated into the local economy where it will benefit the community and therefore myself. In contrast to large corporate multinationals, where it generally doesn't. Not that I have anything against large corporations—provided they come to their s/excesses in an honest sustainable way, which preserves intact the rights of others. Spending money is like voting: when we spend money we effectively vote for the kind of world we want to see.

[For the rest of my reply, posted in a more appropriate forum, please follow this link.]

[spidermike007]

Perhaps prefacing a ridiculous statement like that with: "in my opinion organic food has no merits at all", might have been more convincing. Instead you have convinced everyone on this forum that you are a simple minded man, with nearly no knowledge of agriculture, medicine, health, or the environment.

[spidermike007]

A simple question. Do you know where it's sold Not a world health debate.

There used to be a shop on the ring road in Lamai. Once you pass the the Temple, turn left. A few hundred metres on the right.

As for the hydroponic shop that is always open , they might look shut but someone always there.

A simple question. Do you know where it's sold Not a world health debate.

There used to be a shop on the ring road in Lamai. Once you pass the the Temple, turn left. A few hundred metres on the right.

As for the hydroponic shop that is always open , they might look shut but someone always there.

I believe that shop is closed. Hydro heads uses little of no chemicals, as all the produce is grown above ground. Near the south junction in Lamai. Look for sign on right side, while proceeding south. They do various lettuce, rocket, basil, and more. Great operation, run by a very charming woman. I support them as much as I can. They are an asset to the island.

[oldsailor35]

As a kid growing up in rural Dorset England, during and just after WW2, we had a large garden where all our vegetables were grown (no super markets or green grocers then) as they had been for past generations in farmyard manure and human manure, the toilet bucket would be emptied in a certain area and would eventually become black earth which was dug into the garden at planting time. And the farmyard manure would be dug into the garden every year a couple of months before planting. The results would be beautiful fresh vegetables far above the "factory" grown stuff we get today. We all seemed to be much healthier than today and the old people seemed to last longer. My dad used to grow enough things like potatoes and onions to last till next season.

So i do not believe in all this e coli nonsense , its all guesswork for mine ! When i was in Hong Kong in the armed forces back in the 50's all the "night soil" buckets were collected and taken over to the New Territories for the market gardeners to use, there was always an abundance of fresh healthy green vegetables in the markets and no E coli caused epidemics

[oldsailor35]

Sitting on Maenam beach today, i got talking with a Thai guy from Bang Por, he told me that there is a hydroponic and organic nursery there at Bang Por, so am going to have a look tomorrow, if i find it i will put a report here.