F1 2013

[Mosha]

Sad to see Lotus fighting financial issues now :

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/109230

I really hope Kimi stays with Lotus but it's looking more difficult ?

I think Ricciardo would be the ideal teammate for Vettel ?

b19bry.

I agree Ricciardo has been showing a lot of promise but would prefer Kimi if only to prove just how good Seb actually is to all the doubters, I get somewhat tired of hearing that he has the best car and that's the reason behind his success, of course it certainly helps having a good car but being in a top car has not ensured success for every driver.

Failing Kimi getting the seat I would plump for Fernando in the Red Bull, surely an unbeatable combination, that is of course if he had the time to drive rather than what some think he spends his time discarding his toys.

David.

David,

Red Bull is controlled by Mateschitz, Marko, Vettel..........notice anything about those three ?

I don't think Vettel is likely to be challenged as team leader anytime soon !

For Ricciardo it would be a great opportunity to showcase his talent, for Kimi he would likely be getting himself into a political dilemma with Vettel which is not his strength

Ferrari have really not given Alonso the car to win a championship in the same way they did for Schumi as yet but his best option is to stay given James Allison is joining now

b19bry.

I agree with what you say although Seb and Kimi are very good friends on and off the track but I do suspect Kimi does not like too many details to contend with so the politics might be a little too much for him.

Pity about Ferraris car over the last few seasons or certainly since Fernando joined in not having a truly competitive car although he has had a couple of runner ups to Sebs WDC.

David.

Best way to lose a best mate in F1, become his team mate.

[Basil B]

Well qualifying was edge of your seat stuff.

Lewis nearly lost in Q2, just held onto P10 by his fingernails, then it started to rain just as Q3 started, Paul Di Resta hit the ground running on inters, while the rest of the pack dived back in for a tyre change as he clocked the best time as the track conditions worsened, for most of Q3 it looked like the Scotsman was going to get his first pole.

Then just as the season was coming to a close the rain stopped and the track improved dramatically, Paul was beaten back before Lewis last to cross the line before the flag dropped and then pulled the rabbit from the hat, anyway nice to see Paul get 5th, a career best.

[Totster]

Awesome qualifying, very much enjoyed it.. felt a bit sorry for PDR, no one could have predicted what followed in the last two laps. Rosberg showed good pace when it was wet.

totster

[wackysleet]

Awesome qualifying, very much enjoyed it.. felt a bit sorry for PDR, no one could have predicted what followed in the last two laps. Rosberg showed good pace when it was wet.

totster

That area of Belgium can be very tricky with the weather conditions and perhaps pole really depends on luck and just when you choose to do your timed lap.

I think the crew should have/perhaps did inform PDR that the conditions can change in minutes and not to have come in so early, a bad decision I think, what's the saying "don't count your chickens before they're hatched".

Well done to Lewis though but we will see if Mercedes have really sorted their car and with Nico's stella performance it may well have.

David.

[Basil B]

Interesting to see Michelin popping up and looking to tender for next year.

I think they are just trying to put the wind up Perrelli unfortunately, Michelin have said they want rule changes though, and favour 18" tyres.

With all the design changes for next year which all teams are now well into development, a change in wheel spec is the last thing they want now...

[b19bry]

A truly dominant win from Vettel and in spite of an electric drive from 9th to 2nd it's looking like Alonso and everyone else's 'goose is cooked' as far as the WDC for this year goes.

The only one who came close to challenging was Alonso, but in truth even if he'd got close enough you always felt Vettel had something in reserve.

Kimi was unlucky with his brakes but in fairness a DNF was due at some point.

Ferrari, Lotus and Mercedes all seem to have a car that can challenge the Red Bull at times but do they have the consistency to be a serious threat for the championship ?

Maldonado and Perez again both showing driving skills well below what should be expected in F1

[Mosha]

Official - Ricciardo lands Red Bull seat

[b19bry]

Official - Ricciardo lands Red Bull seat

Worst kept secret of the past couple of weeks but great news nonetheless

The more intriguing question of where Kimi ends up remains unanswered

[jpinx]

....and what impact this will have on RedBull..

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/665341-red-bull-heir-vorayuth-boss-yoovidhya-pleads-illness-evades-prosecutor/

[Basil B]

Official - Ricciardo lands Red Bull seat

Worst kept secret of the past couple of weeks but great news nonetheless

The more intriguing question of where Kimi ends up remains unanswered

Looks like Alonso's options are out the window too, looks like for next season he will have to sleep in the bed he has just pissed in.

[wackysleet]

Basil B.

So what makes you think Fernando was even looking for a seat elsewhere, it was never stated and it was only conjecture that he was reported to be looking at Red Bull.

Red Bull are shrewd in as much as any young potential driver goes through their second team and is brought up with the intention of replacing the existing 1 and 2 drivers when the time is right and that is why they run 2 teams and after all they already have possibly a driver in the top 3 best on the grid and as long as he keeps the momentum going and the number 2 plays his part by adding the points as Mark has done then they will achieve their aims. No need to pay out huge amounts of cash for either the other top 2 drivers in Fernando and Kimi.

David.

[jpinx]

All that, plus factor in Webber's known preferences to promote a fellow-aussie and the close association between Webber and Maestrich (spelling?). If the new boy starts to score points regularly it's going to make RedBull very hard to dislodge from the top of both championships.

Meantime the new engines, rules, possibly tyres too, is going to mix things up nicely. It's going to be a development race in 2014, rather than a drivers race.

[b19bry]

Official - Ricciardo lands Red Bull seat

Worst kept secret of the past couple of weeks but great news nonetheless

The more intriguing question of where Kimi ends up remains unanswered

Looks like Alonso's options are out the window too, looks like for next season he will have to sleep in the bed he has just pissed in.

Mmm, yeah right out the window. His only option seems limited to being in the highest profile, best funded team on the grid (a.k.a.'the bed he's just pissed in') for next year unless Kimi does him a favour and frees up a slot for him at Lotus

Edited September 4, 2013 by b19bry

[Basil B]

As I said no smoke without fire:

Red Bull insiders have told BBC Sport Alonso pushed hard this summer to join them and the idea was taken seriously before they chose Daniel Ricciardo.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/23976453

Interesting the quote said insiders meaning more than one person.

Edited September 5, 2013 by Basil B

[wackysleet]

Basil B.

Rumours from Red Bull insiders who wish to remain anonymous, heard that befor, are all part of Horners mind games to upset the likes of Fernando and Kimi at their respective teams with his statements that anything was possible as far as new drivers for 2014 were concerned when it was already stated by Mark Webber that Daniel Ricciardo had already been chosen.

Why don't these rumour mongers stand up to be counted? so the likes of Fernando and Kimi get the chance to repudiate face to face, as I said, mind games.

When a seat such as Red Bulls becomes available then it's fairly obvious that the top drivers will be in the frame, Red Bull are not going to offer the seat to Max Chilton but then this is the silly season.

David.

[b19bry]

As I said no smoke without fire:

Red Bull insiders have told BBC Sport Alonso pushed hard this summer to join them and the idea was taken seriously before they chose Daniel Ricciardo.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/23976453

Interesting the quote said insiders meaning more than one person.

There is a reason it's called 'the silly season' I think wackysleet's intelligent post sheds some light on this !

[Basil B]

If it is not true why are Alonso's lawyers not threatening the BBC and Red Bull with litigation?

Remember Lance Armstrong perjured himself while suing the Times and other media, in view of this there is no question the BBC would have indisputable evidence should Alonso sue, When Christian Horner said "Any conversations with any driver remain confidential. Of course, there has been quite a few drivers expressing interest in the seat," he could have said "no, Alonso has not approached us", I am sure any confidentiality agreement would not extend to a person having to perjure themselves

The only thing I would question as not being true was that Red Bull actually seriously considered Alonso, I put it Red Bull are shit stirring as unrest in the Ferrari camp can only weaken their performance, but again I would put it that Alonso made it be known he was unhappy at Ferrari and would consider any offer from Red Bull and maybe even other teams.

The "less than convincing" Interview where Alonso categorically denied putting his name in the hat at Red Bull and then his "someone elses car" coment I certainly see this as making his relationship at Ferrari being very frosty.

Will be interesting to see his attitude towards the press media this weekend particularly the BBC...

[b19bry]

Just struck me……43yrs ago today

[b19bry]

Yet another dominant win from Vettel and probably the least interesting race this year. At least one of his rivals needed to finish ahead of him to keep any interest in the WDC alive.

Red Bull has utterly dominated the last 2 races on tracks where their car was supposedly more vulnerable to the competition. The season now moves to circuits previously shown to be more suited to the Red Bull

The interesting story over the next week or so will be around the second seat at Ferrari

[wackysleet]

b19bry.

Have to agree about the race but they are all there to try and win so should we blame Seb or blame the other teams for failing yet again to offer any real competition to Red Bull.

In regards to this little ongoing spat between Fernando and Montezumas revenge saying he ticked his driver off for making what I would have said was a tongue in cheek joke about wanting another car for his birthday and yet he has frequently passed public opinion stating that Fernando needs to try harder during practice, to me he appears as head of Ferrari racing to be responsible for providing a top car and since 2010 when Fernando joined he has had to race a pig but yet still finished as runner up twice and probably a third time this year so my view is this is nothing but a ruse to divert attention away from his yearly failings of producing a decent car. The old saying springs to mind "Attack is the best form of defence".

David.

[b19bry]

b19bry.

Have to agree about the race but they are all there to try and win so should we blame Seb or blame the other teams for failing yet again to offer any real competition to Red Bull.

In regards to this little ongoing spat between Fernando and Montezumas revenge saying he ticked his driver off for making what I would have said was a tongue in cheek joke about wanting another car for his birthday and yet he has frequently passed public opinion stating that Fernando needs to try harder during practice, to me he appears as head of Ferrari racing to be responsible for providing a top car and since 2010 when Fernando joined he has had to race a pig but yet still finished as runner up twice and probably a third time this year so my view is this is nothing but a ruse to divert attention away from his yearly failings of producing a decent car. The old saying springs to mind "Attack is the best form of defence".

David.

I guess considering the start to the season I expected it to be a bit closer at the front this season. Not blaming Red Bull at all and Vettel has done a great job, just hope the other teams can put up more of a fight at least for next season.

As far as Alonso and Ferrari go, I think the stories of a rift is getting blown out of proportion. Alonso needs Ferrari and Ferrari need Alonso. If one party hasn't delivered over the course of the last couple of years it's not been Alonso. He's driven well, never had the best car on the grid at Ferrari yet consistently finished on the podium, missing a couple of championships by the smallest of margins.

It will be interesting if Kimi moves to Ferrari, and that's looking more likely, though I rather hope he stays with Lotus where he can be the main focus for the team.

[rixalex]

Have to agree about the race but they are all there to try and win so should we blame Seb or blame the other teams for failing yet again to offer any real competition to Red Bull.

I do sympathise with Red Bull and Seb on this one. When one team and one driver start to dominate the sport, at first everyone says how amazing it is, and then, as time goes on, people stop finding it amazing and start to find it boring. Human nature i guess. As you rightly say though, it's certainly not the fault of Red Bull or Seb. Congrats to them.

In regards to this little ongoing spat between Fernando and Montezumas revenge saying he ticked his driver off for making what I would have said was a tongue in cheek joke about wanting another car for his birthday and yet he has frequently passed public opinion stating that Fernando needs to try harder during practice, to me he appears as head of Ferrari racing to be responsible for providing a top car and since 2010 when Fernando joined he has had to race a pig but yet still finished as runner up twice and probably a third time this year so my view is this is nothing but a ruse to divert attention away from his yearly failings of producing a decent car. The old saying springs to mind "Attack is the best form of defence".

David.

As far as the tongue in cheek joke goes, i wonder how Alonso would have reacted to Montezemolo joking that what he wanted for his birthday was another pair of drivers? Of course Montezemolo would have no justification in making a joke like that - well perhaps he would in the case of Massa, but certainly not in the case of Alonso - but that is not the point. The point is team managers shouldn't publicly make slights or jokes about their driver, and drivers shouldn't publicly make slights or jokes about their cars or their team. Doesn't do much for team spirit or harmony. So i therefore understand why Montezemolo was unhappy with Alonso's "joke". I don't however understand why Montezemolo decided to deal with his grievance so publicly. That was as damaging and Alonso's "joke", if not more damaging!

Bizarre things are happening at Ferrari for sure, and i suspect a front is being put on at times to hide a degree of behind the scenes chaos. This weekend over qualifying i think was a good example. They make a hash of trying to get Massa give Alonso a toe, Alonso angrily berates on the radio and calls the team idiots, and then after the race when questioned about it, Alonso says it all went really well, and that he wasn't angry, and that he didn't call his team idiots, but in fact called them "geniuses". Whether idiots or geniuses was the term he used, he wasn't complimenting the team was he, so i don't think it makes much difference either way. I really don't think that trick of trying to give a team mate a toe during qualifying is ever going to be that successful if the gesture is not reciprocated. How is Massa really expected to go out of his way for Alonso like that when he knows Alonso is not going to return the favour? Yes the world and his dog knows that Massa is the second fiddle, but even second fiddles need to have preserved some of their pride.

One more point, you say the Ferrari has been "a pig" since 2010. I think there are times when it has been something close to that, like the start of last season, but other times, when it has been far from "a pig". Seasons in which Ferrari have started of badly, they have invariably managed to finish quite strongly, thanks to some good mid season development. And to have finished runner up with Alonso as frequently as they have - one year missing out on the title simply thanks to bad race strategy - i think must be testament to not only what a great driver Alonso is, but what a decent job they have done with tweaking and honing the car throughout the seasons. Of course the whole business of how good or bad a car is, versus how good or bad a driver is, is never totally understood until you have two team mates of similar capabilities. If Kimi makes the move to Ferrari i think we'll have a much better idea race by race of how much of Alonso's performance is down to him, and how much is down to the car... providing Kimi doesn't let his head drop, which is always a possibility knowing him. Either way, it will be good to not have a highly sought after seat going to relative waste, in the way i think it has in the last few years.

Edited September 10, 2013 by rixalex

[wackysleet]

I have always been a fan of Sebs long before he won at Monsa in the Torro Rosso but unfortunately since joining the all conquering Red Bull team it's really impossible to judge just how good he actually is, my own view which I'm sure will be disputed is that there is not much to choose between Seb, Kimi and Fernando, based on their performances/results, what about Lewis I hear posters shout, well in my opinion Lewis shows signs of brilliance AT TIMES but is not consistant as he seems to be affected by outside influences {personal?} as an example, was Maclarens car really only good enough for him to get 4th and 5th places in the last 3yrs of his contract with the team whilst Jenson was 2nd one yr and one place behind Lewis the other 2 yrs and accumulated a higher number of points, I believe Lewis is a faster driver than Jenson but lacks the technical skills of Jenson.

I have to say that the "I would like another car" attributed on Fernandos birthday when asked what present he would like, while probably under the circumstances not very prudent certainly was not as scathing as Montezumas personal attacks especially when he appears to accept no responsibility for an under performing car. Perhaps that's why Fillipe is still the driver, difficult to sack a driver who is not performing so well in a car incapable of winning, perhaps Ferrari should sack Montezuma.

rixalex, I am sure your right about the chaos/panic behind the scenes at Ferrari with the kind of investment they're making and no championship so people are apportioning blame to everyone but themselves although ultimately the buck has to stop with Montezuma.

This post of course is my personal view and is intended {hopefully} to stimulate some reaction to debate as this topic aka Formula 1 seems to be lacking in input this season even more so than other years and is in danger of disappearing all together, hence a possible controversial post. Here's hoping.

David.

Edited September 10, 2013 by wackysleet

[ignis]

Nest year 1.6 Turbo..........with Ferrari that sounds funny together ? In the Group is there a Fiat 1.6 Turbo ?

1.6 Turbo and Renault sure used for years, just maybe Kimi would be better off staying put..

[wackysleet]

Nest year 1.6 Turbo..........with Ferrari that sounds funny together ? In the Group is there a Fiat 1.6 Turbo ?

1.6 Turbo and Renault sure used for years, just maybe Kimi would be better off staying put..

I really hope Kimi stays with Lotus and am sure he will if they are properly financed.

David.

[jmccarty]

Nest year 1.6 Turbo..........with Ferrari that sounds funny together ? In the Group is there a Fiat 1.6 Turbo ?

1.6 Turbo and Renault sure used for years, just maybe Kimi would be better off staying put..

Mercedes, Ferari, Renault and Honda for sure, little known PURE has also developed an engine but do not see any interested teams opting in for it.

[wackysleet]

Nest year 1.6 Turbo..........with Ferrari that sounds funny together ? In the Group is there a Fiat 1.6 Turbo ?

1.6 Turbo and Renault sure used for years, just maybe Kimi would be better off staying put..

Mercedes, Ferari, Renault and Honda for sure, little known PURE has also developed an engine but do not see any interested teams opting in for it.

Never heard of Pure before but Hondas engine will not be available until 2015 season and for next season Maclaren will be using Mercedes engine.

Would like some more info on the Pure engine if you have it or a link but as you said probably not a lot of interest and Cosworth don't appear to be doing any development work either.

David.

[jmccarty]

Nest year 1.6 Turbo..........with Ferrari that sounds funny together ? In the Group is there a Fiat 1.6 Turbo ?

1.6 Turbo and Renault sure used for years, just maybe Kimi would be better off staying put..

Mercedes, Ferari, Renault and Honda for sure, little known PURE has also developed an engine but do not see any interested teams opting in for it.

Never heard of Pure before but Hondas engine will not be available until 2015 season and for next season Maclaren will be using Mercedes engine.

Would like some more info on the Pure engine if you have it or a link but as you said probably not a lot of interest and Cosworth don't appear to be doing any development work either.

David.

Had some out of date info about Honda and see Mercedes will power Maclaren. Right you are.

Did some research and PURE is out of money it appears from March 2012 but is/was headed up by Craig Pollock and Gilles Simon. They still have a website http://www.purecorp.org/ and expect if they can get the funding, may see interest. Two guys have talent.

I was also really hoping to see Cosworth offer an engine.

[wackysleet]

Nest year 1.6 Turbo..........with Ferrari that sounds funny together ? In the Group is there a Fiat 1.6 Turbo ?

1.6 Turbo and Renault sure used for years, just maybe Kimi would be better off staying put..

Mercedes, Ferari, Renault and Honda for sure, little known PURE has also developed an engine but do not see any interested teams opting in for it.

Never heard of Pure before but Hondas engine will not be available until 2015 season and for next season Maclaren will be using Mercedes engine.

Would like some more info on the Pure engine if you have it or a link but as you said probably not a lot of interest and Cosworth don't appear to be doing any development work either.

David.

Had some out of date info about Honda and see Mercedes will power Maclaren. Right you are.

Did some research and PURE is out of money it appears from March 2012 but is/was headed up by Craig Pollock and Gilles Simon. They still have a website http://www.purecorp.org/ and expect if they can get the funding, may see interest. Two guys have talent.

I was also really hoping to see Cosworth offer an engine.

I think after Bernie allowed some teams in and insisted that they used Cosworth engines made the development work a viable proposition for Cosworth at the time but then old Bernie allowed some to swap engine suppliers thus not worth Cosworths time and money and I suspect they caught a cold on the deal.

Will check out that Pure company out of interest, thanks for the info.

David.

[ignis]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/108731

Honda for 2015 to power Maclaren

http://sidepodcast.com/post/the-balance-of-power Not a lot of options for 2014

Edited September 10, 2013 by ignis