Work Permit Requirement - Pictures Of 4X Employees At The Workplace/registered Office?

[frankold]

Hi Guys,

I have been advised by the company handling my work permit application that pictures of 4x employees at the workplace/registered office are required.

When I had a work permit with my previously owned company, this was not a requirement, also only 2x employees were required although this was a few years ago. Can someone in the know confirm this is now a requirement from the department of labour to issue a work permit for a new company?

This is a bkk registered company.

Thanks for any advice.

Edited May 4, 2013 by frankold

[innerspace]

If I recall correctly I needed this for my visa extension but not workpermit. Immigration came to the office and took photos themselves of me and the 4 staff on my application. (Pattaya)

If you are married then only 2 staff needed for your work permit.

[frankold]

ok, thx.. how recently was that? I remember something being mentioned about a rules shakeup at the end of last year?

[ubonjoe]

The only reports of photos of work place and employees has been for the extension of stay.

Unless company has been in business for at least a year you will not qualify for an extension of stay under the current immigration rules.

Edited May 5, 2013 by ubonjoe

[frankold]

Ok. Thx for the info guys!

[digitalchromakey]

Labour in my area (Phuket) do ask for photos of the office front/inside plus employees at work; they have also asked other applicants whom I know to actually identify the specific workers plus cite their job titles.

This may also well be the case if for some reason (nature of your work for example) they suspect that your employees are 'spurious'.

Edited May 5, 2013 by digitalchromakey

[samuibruno]

hi all

i renewed my work permit earlier this year and had the same problem [accountant asked by labour department for 4 employees]

as i dont employ 4 employees is asked the accountant to return to the labour department and ask them if they were requesting our company to break the law by registering false workers?

she did that and was told ok just 2 employees then

which i still dont have , so i asked the accountant to please ask again the question if this was actually a written law in thailand

and if so could the labour department give us a copy ?

still no joy , need 2 employees, so finally i asked the accountant to cancel the work permit [as im retirement age ]

she came back and listed our 1 [actual] employee [and only part time at that ]

will wait for next years debacle,and worry about it then

[shrimpythailand]

I did my WP pics in january... need 6-8 pics now one outside the building with the name and sign... a few inside - like at your work desk... couple of pics with other employees...i am the only falung so I guess they want to see 4 different people - but we just took some pics of me talking with 2-3 different people...would expect they want the same for a new company.. plus the x4 thai's for one falung - but better have your WP person check...I didn't know if you own campny and with thai wife you only need x2 thai's employed.

[SOTIRIOS]

....4x........2x........can you just explain something clearly if you are posting for everyone.....

[frankold]

SOTIRIOS: 4x employees required if your not married, only 2x if you are married.

So this staff pictures at the work place requirement is definitely for the initial work permit application and NOT for the 1yr entry extension with immigration?

1 person is saying its for the 1yr extension of stay, another that it is for the work permit...

Edited May 6, 2013 by frankold

[Baerboxer]

Interesting all the different takes on this. I was originally told 4 employees per farang. Then informed it was only 2 if married to a Thai. However, a farang I know set up and registered a new business last year. His lawyers were adamant only 1 Thai employee was required. They set him up with a "ghost" employee who resigned after a short period and has not been replaced. I've no idea how this stacks up with previous comments, or wether there will be problems when trying to extend the visa.

I don't have a business here, and quite frankly don't trust the constantly changing rules, so wouldn't start one.

[gemguy]

Thing is, here in Thailand when there are rules and regulations and laws there is someone or somehow to work around those rules and regulations and laws.

If there is some money to be made bending the laws or rules or regulations then sooner or later someone will be making a business out of accomodating and servicing people in need of ways and means to work around those many cumbersome ( and sometimes illogical and down right stupid )rules and regulations and laws.

I honeslty believe that many ( as in not all ) of the same officials that make up the various legal rules and regulations know full well that those rules and regulations and laws will be ignored and broken while there are various money making ways that manouver around those rules and regulations and laws.

Those same officials benefit , on the side, bending those same rules and regulations and laws that they themselves formulated and put in place.

More rules and regulations and laws ,sooner or later, simply create all the more opportunities for officials and or people with official connections to make money on the side.

That is what eventually evoles nearly all the time here in Thailand.

[deesquared]

Every quarter I have have to turn in photos for my work permit. Shots of our office and me at work in different situations.

[Khun Robert]

The rules are simple, but hard to understand for those who want to bend the rules.

You can apply for a work permit, with papers from a company who want to hire you.

If you have a work permit you can apply for an extension of stay on your visa with Immigration.

Immigration will ask for:

Paying tax and social security for the 4 Thai Staff or 2 Thai staff if married.

They will also ask for proof of marriage, proof of office, which many times can be done by pictures.

Labor Office can ask for proof of teaching Thai Staff by personal interview with staff or just except the letter of education.

To extend your working permit you deal with Labor office,

To extend your visa you deal with Immigration office

Both offices have their own rules, do not mix them up and tell on a forum that the rules are not clear if you even use the rules set by an other office.

As a non-European I can not work in Europe without a work permit, during my last years in the Netherlands we got raided once a year by Immigration and Police for check up on work permits for foreigners.

Each year people got arrested on the fact that they did not have their passport in their pocket while working.

Working and living in Thailand is easy if you learn a little about the rules and want to obey the rules.

4 or 2 employees depends on profession and marriage, it could also be 7 or 4, 200 or 100.

[Keesters]

I fail to see what being married has to do with anything work permit related.

4 Thai employees if you're not married only 2 if you are! Is your wife expected to do the work of 2 employees or just given the salary of 2?

[lopburi3]

I suspect it is a humanitarian rule as a person married to a local national would have a valid reason to live here and should have more opportunity to support the family?

[Keesters]

Staff are a burden and as a married farang we'll burden you less.

Edited May 7, 2013 by Keesters

[Arkady]

I am very keen to know on what basis several posters say only 2 Thai employees needed for a WP if you have a Thai spouse - I am not interested in Immigration's rules for visa extensions, just the Labour Ministry's (Dept of Employment) rules for WPs.

Can anyone show this in writing from any source, or at least confirm they have been able to obtain or renew a WP with 2 Thai employees due to having a Thai spouse?

Also can your Thai wife be counted as one of the Thai employees for WP purposes? The problem I see here is that the Labour Ministry's list of documents required from the employer lists the monthly record of Social Tax payments for staff but not the monthly PND 1 filing to the Revenue Dept of withholding tax for staff which is on the other hand required by Immigration for NON-IMM B extensions. Since most people's Thai wives are directors and/or shareholders of their companies they are ineligible for registration for Social Tax as the SSO bars both directors and shareholders. That would appear to mean that there is no evidence that they are employees of the company in the documents required by the Labour Ministry.

[digitalchromakey]

I am very keen to know on what basis several posters say only 2 Thai employees needed for a WP if you have a Thai spouse - I am not interested in Immigration's rules for visa extensions, just the Labour Ministry's (Dept of Employment) rules for WPs.

Can anyone show this in writing from any source, or at least confirm they have been able to obtain or renew a WP with 2 Thai employees due to having a Thai spouse?

Also can your Thai wife be counted as one of the Thai employees for WP purposes? The problem I see here is that the Labour Ministry's list of documents required from the employer lists the monthly record of Social Tax payments for staff but not the monthly PND 1 filing to the Revenue Dept of withholding tax for staff which is on the other hand required by Immigration for NON-IMM B extensions. Since most people's Thai wives are directors and/or shareholders of their companies they are ineligible for registration for Social Tax as the SSO bars both directors and shareholders. That would appear to mean that there is no evidence that they are employees of the company in the documents required by the Labour Ministry.

Can confirm issue of a WP in Phuket a couple of years ago with only 2x Thai Employees, where one was a Director/Shareholder/Wife, but showed as one of two Company Signatories on the Company Registration Papers from the Commerce Department (DBD), with no SSO Registration for the wife.

Renewal last year for the same WP was accepted with 1x foreign and 3x Thai Employees, where one was the same wife as above.

Btw, no 'extra payments' were asked for or made.

[frankold]

In answer to my first question.

It turned out that the photos were offcially 'required' but it didn't take a kickback or too much of a story for them not to be required. ;-)

[harrry]

Staff are a burden and as a married farang we'll burden you less.

Or is that that being married is a burden and they will burden you less.

[frankold]

Its a lot easier to sack an employee than a wife.. I'd tend to go the employees route personally