Despite being separated from the animals of the jungle by our intelligence and our cognitive powers, it seems we are the only species to have invented the concept of revenge.

Just imagine if we, like the rest of the animal kingdom, had no knowledge of this notion.

How many of the world’s problems could be easily and amicably solved?

How do you know that animals don't seek "animal revenge". How, for example can we equate Dolphin intelligence (When they are in a water medium) to ourselves.

Animals DO get revenge. A well documented film footage and report on discovery channel chronicled how a female adult lion ripped to shreds two hyenas after Mom had returned to find they had killed her cub in her absence. After mauling them unmercifully, she walked away.

You do realize that nature flicks are edited versions of hundreds and hundreds of hours of footage, and that the temptation for humans to interpret animal behaviour as close to human often makes them choose footage that confirms the notion that animals are like us.

I think it is quite well known know, that lions and Hyenas have a absolute dislike for each other.It is well documented that Lions will go well out of their way to kill Hyenas. It is not just a predator/predator thing either.

I think it is quite well known know, that lions and Hyenas have a absolute dislike for each other.It is well documented that Lions will go well out of their way to kill Hyenas. It is not just a predator/predator thing either.

It's a historical thing you see. About 1,300 years or so ago, Hyenas killed what would have been the next great Lion King.

The lions have never forgotten or forgiven the hyenas for that. Now they attack them at every opportunity, because they know that the next great Lion King won't come into this world until every hyena is dead !

(that and the fact that hyenas are one of the few species in Africa that will prey on the offspring of lions. The lions know this through years of conditioned response. Therefore, when they see hyenas, they expect that the hyenas will try to attack their offspring).

I think the Lion King theory would play better in the theatres though

I think animals do have a revenge factor....

Case in point when I was growing up as a wee lad, I had a german shepherd puppy, one day my dog was attacked by postman - think he was scared and felt threatened. The dog remembered him and always went mental when he came about. If the lad had the day off and there was a substitute the dog was fine. I have a feeling animals are much more similar to humans then we may think.

Revenge is purely due to ignorance.

How about revenge to prevent the aggressor from attacking again?

Think about the rest of the post and you'll be able to answer you're own question.

A bit of navel gazing, eh?

Elephants and apes are also known to act out of revenge...

Animals, on the other hand, understand their true nature whereas man does not. Given those important differences I believe that only man, lacking the knowledge of his true nature, is capable of having irrational thought. Revenge is irrational thought and would not occur in someone who understands their nature. Since the animals do I don't believe they are capable of lowering themselves to our standards.

I'm not sure I'd agree, although I'm far from being an expert. I would suggest that animals don't understand their true nature, they just never question it. They are egocentric in its strictest sense, in that everything in their world goes on around them. Actions tend to result from instinct, learned behaviour or socialisation.

Man, on the other hand, can place himself in an extrinsic context, which creates concepts such as empathy, but also enables him to visualise outcomes of actions in more than simply an "eye for an eye" manner. 'Rational' and 'irrational' merely indicate actions that are outside established norms of expected behaviour.

Such phrases as 'thinking outside the box' or 'if God did not exist then man would invent Him' illustrate the difference between man and animal.

Elephants and apes are also known to act out of revenge...

Quit it!

You are spoiling all the deep thoughts with the truth.

Despite being separated from the animals of the jungle by our intelligence and our cognitive powers, it seems we are the only species to have invented the concept of revenge.

Just imagine if we, like the rest of the animal kingdom, had no knowledge of this notion.

How many of the world’s problems could be easily and amicably solved?

How do you know that animals don't seek "animal revenge". How, for example can we equate Dolphin intelligence (When they are in a water medium) to ourselves.

Animals DO get revenge. A well documented film footage and report on discovery channel chronicled how a female adult lion ripped to shreds two hyenas after Mom had returned to find they had killed her cub in her absence. After mauling them unmercifully, she walked away.

You do realize that nature flicks are edited versions of hundreds and hundreds of hours of footage, and that the temptation for humans to interpret animal behaviour as close to human often makes them choose footage that confirms the notion that animals are like us.

Absolutely important point, Meadish. (I've gotta give our mods a lot of credit since much more often than not their viewpoints exhibit a great deal of sensibilities.) Humans tend to project human qualities onto everything. Including God, or whatever you want to call it.

I'll make the point again that humans by and large don't understand their own nature in the least. They don't know how they got here. They don't know where they came from. They don't know what the purpose of life is. They don't know where they're going. And with those highly important questions unanswered they attempt to understand the world around them. Rotsa Ruck. It isn't going to happen.

And again, animals understand their natures much more so than humans do. They operate largely on built-in instincts whereas man has greater freedom to make choices using his thought and reasoning abilities. Animals don't reflect on their past in the way that humans do. Animals live to a greater extent in the present moment whereas humans have the ability to focus outside the present.

You may grant that what I say has validity to whatever degree, but I'll grant that you can ever and only guess as to what goes on in the experience of an animal. I'll also grant that people will believe whatever fancies them.

I'll make the point again that humans by and large don't understand their own nature in the least. They don't know how they got here. They don't know where they came from. They don't know what the purpose of life is. They don't know where they're going. And with those highly important questions unanswered they attempt to understand the world around them. Rotsa Ruck. It isn't going to happen.

And again, animals understand their natures much more so than humans do. They operate largely on built-in instincts whereas man has greater freedom to make choices using his thought and reasoning abilities. Animals don't reflect on their past in the way that humans do. Animals live to a greater extent in the present moment whereas humans have the ability to focus outside the present.

Didn't know that.

Thank you for explaining it all to us.

Elephants and apes are also known to act out of revenge...

Quit it!

You are spoiling all the deep thoughts with the truth.

Gee sorry.....

Despite being separated from the animals of the jungle by our intelligence and our cognitive powers, it seems we are the only species to have invented the concept of revenge.

Just imagine if we, like the rest of the animal kingdom, had no knowledge of this notion.

How many of the world’s problems could be easily and amicably solved?

How do you know that animals don't seek "animal revenge". How, for example can we equate Dolphin intelligence (When they are in a water medium) to ourselves.

Animals DO get revenge. A well documented film footage and report on discovery channel chronicled how a female adult lion ripped to shreds two hyenas after Mom had returned to find they had killed her cub in her absence. After mauling them unmercifully, she walked away.

You do realize that nature flicks are edited versions of hundreds and hundreds of hours of footage, and that the temptation for humans to interpret animal behaviour as close to human often makes them choose footage that confirms the notion that animals are like us.

Yes, I do realize that can happen.

Revenge is purely due to ignorance.

How about revenge to prevent the aggressor from attacking again?

Think about the rest of the post and you'll be able to answer you're own question.

A bit of navel gazing, eh?

A wee bit of childishness.

Once i saw a documentary about a mother wolf killing killing human children in india. After some investigations they found that the wolf killed human children because indian people have killed all her cubs...that´s why she only killed children...

Our planet earth has million of species so i think that revenge can be find within animal kingdom...taking into account that we belong to such kingdom i am not surprise that this kind of behaviour can be found in other species.

I have never had a dreadful experience as to want to seek revenge however i don´t know how i will behave if someone do something really terrible to any of my beloved ones...

I must add that I strongly believe that most animals are not as nasty as humans...and they will not treat so badly (as we do) members of their same species or other...i think we have many things to learn from them.

From what I've been reading here so far, it seems that the instances of revenge in the animal world are directed against other species.

How ever, man seems to be the only species that regularly seeks revenge against his fellow man.

Revenge is purely due to ignorance.

How about revenge to prevent the aggressor from attacking again?

Think about the rest of the post and you'll be able to answer you're own question.

A bit of navel gazing, eh?

A wee bit of childishness.

Yeah, that is a much better word for your naive post, but I was trying to be polite.

Revenge is purely due to ignorance.

How about revenge to prevent the aggressor from attacking again?

Think about the rest of the post and you'll be able to answer you're own question.

A bit of navel gazing, eh?

A wee bit of childishness.

Yeah, that is a much better word for your naive post, but I was trying to be polite.

Thank you, gentlemen - we appreciate your examples of revenge posting.

Could you continue with examples of adult argument?

This is a true story:

My neighbors have an adult St. Bernard. One morning, the wife gets a piece of meat out of the freezer and sets it on the kitchen island to thaw out. The dog was in the house at the same time.

When the wife returned to the kitchen, low and behold, the chunk of beef was missing and the beast was smacking his jowls with satisfaction. Whereupon, said wife laid into the dog with a newspaper (big mistake) and shoved him outside.

That afternoon, after doing the laundry and the clothes were drying on the line in the yard (rural area) she noticed that all her garments had been pulled off and were now lying in the grass but those of the husband's were still hanging as she left them.

Animals do take revenge.

This is a true story:

My neighbors have an adult St. Bernard. One morning, the wife gets a piece of meat out of the freezer and sets it on the kitchen island to thaw out. The dog was in the house at the same time.

When the wife returned to the kitchen, low and behold, the chunk of beef was missing and the beast was smacking his jowls with satisfaction. Whereupon, said wife laid into the dog with a newspaper (big mistake) and shoved him outside.

That afternoon, after doing the laundry and the clothes were drying on the line in the yard (rural area) she noticed that all her garments had been pulled off and were now lying in the grass but those of the husband's were still hanging as she left them.

Animals do take revenge.

The story, if true, as is asserted, is somewhat amusing.

The conclusion, however, is poppycock.

The conclusion is based solely on the observers' valued judgements.

He (or she) is assuming the dog's action with the laundry is vindictive and is connected to the punishment in the kitchen.

Whereas, there is nothing more natural for a dog than to want to play with flapping, moving objects, especially as they may have traces of the smell of the person with whom he spends most of his day (and leaves him juicy chunks of beef!).

This is a true story:

My neighbors have an adult St. Bernard. One morning, the wife gets a piece of meat out of the freezer and sets it on the kitchen island to thaw out. The dog was in the house at the same time.

When the wife returned to the kitchen, low and behold, the chunk of beef was missing and the beast was smacking his jowls with satisfaction. Whereupon, said wife laid into the dog with a newspaper (big mistake) and shoved him outside.

That afternoon, after doing the laundry and the clothes were drying on the line in the yard (rural area) she noticed that all her garments had been pulled off and were now lying in the grass but those of the husband's were still hanging as she left them.

Animals do take revenge.

The story, if true, as is asserted, is somewhat amusing.

The conclusion, however, is poppycock.

The conclusion is based solely on the observers' valued judgements.

He (or she) is assuming the dog's action with the laundry is vindictive and is connected to the punishment in the kitchen.

Whereas, there is nothing more natural for a dog than to want to play with flapping, moving objects, especially as they may have traces of the smell of the person with whom he spends most of his day (and leaves him juicy chunks of beef!).

It's true Thomas, & the conclusion(s) are not 'poppycock'!

If said dog wanted to play with flapping objects hanging on the line, why would he leave his master's alone and only go for those he associated with punishment?

This is a true story:

My neighbors have an adult St. Bernard. One morning, the wife gets a piece of meat out of the freezer and sets it on the kitchen island to thaw out. The dog was in the house at the same time.

When the wife returned to the kitchen, low and behold, the chunk of beef was missing and the beast was smacking his jowls with satisfaction. Whereupon, said wife laid into the dog with a newspaper (big mistake) and shoved him outside.

That afternoon, after doing the laundry and the clothes were drying on the line in the yard (rural area) she noticed that all her garments had been pulled off and were now lying in the grass but those of the husband's were still hanging as she left them.

Animals do take revenge.

The story, if true, as is asserted, is somewhat amusing.

The conclusion, however, is poppycock.

The conclusion is based solely on the observers' valued judgements.

He (or she) is assuming the dog's action with the laundry is vindictive and is connected to the punishment in the kitchen.

Whereas, there is nothing more natural for a dog than to want to play with flapping, moving objects, especially as they may have traces of the smell of the person with whom he spends most of his day (and leaves him juicy chunks of beef!).

It's true Thomas, & the conclusion(s) are not 'poppycock'!

If said dog wanted to play with flapping objects hanging on the line, why would he leave his master's alone and only go for those he associated with punishment?

Master of the house, perhaps, but not the person he spends all day with.

To say "he associated with punishment" is clearly a judgment based on you own values.

I doubt very much if he could even remember the chunk of beef, never mind the punishment.

But the smell of a mistress - now there's a thing

Maybe sarongs and dresses hang lower than grundies, shorts and navy blue singlets.....

It's simply Boon Mee's "revised version of logic and reason", nothing more.

It's true Thomas, & the conclusion(s) are not 'poppycock'!

If said dog wanted to play with flapping objects hanging on the line, why would he leave his master's alone and only go for those he associated with punishment?

I say BULL !

I doubt the dog could differentiate between his and her clothes, after they had been through the laundry, and ALL hung on the line by HER !

The only scent would be hers. It is remotely possible he recognized some of the clothing as having been worn by her, but dogs primarily rely on scent, not sight, to distinguish items.

Animals do have emotions though. Many instances of people leaving a pet at home and finding that the pet has used their shoes (or dirty laundry) as a toilet. Supposedly this is the pet's reaction to feeling abandoned by it's master.

It's pretty easy to see other emotions as well, such as fear, anger, joy, sadness.

Revenge ? I don't know.

Been doing some googling on this.

Separation Anxiety in Dogs

"It’s important to realize, however, that the destruction and house soiling that often occur with separation anxiety are not the dog’s attempt to punish or seek revenge on his owner for leaving him alone, but are actually part of a panic response."

"MANHATTAN -- For the most part, Kasey is a wonderful pet. But during tax season -- the busiest time of year for her owner, Karen -- the 2-year old beagle's behavior takes a nose-dive. The long hours Karen is away and the reduction in attention Kasey receives makes the pet excruciatingly anxious, causing her to urinate on furniture in the house.

Kasey's problem may be deeper than revenge. She may be suffering from a disorder the canine world is beginning to take seriously -- separation anxiety. The malady is one of the most common reasons owners euthanize pets."

So, a dog's actions may be more a result of mental disorder than a desire for revenge. I even saw a site that recomended drug therapy for your dog !

Been doing some googling on this.

Separation Anxiety in Dogs

"It’s important to realize, however, that the destruction and house soiling that often occur with separation anxiety are not the dog’s attempt to punish or seek revenge on his owner for leaving him alone, but are actually part of a panic response."

"MANHATTAN -- For the most part, Kasey is a wonderful pet. But during tax season -- the busiest time of year for her owner, Karen -- the 2-year old beagle's behavior takes a nose-dive. The long hours Karen is away and the reduction in attention Kasey receives makes the pet excruciatingly anxious, causing her to urinate on furniture in the house.

Kasey's problem may be deeper than revenge. She may be suffering from a disorder the canine world is beginning to take seriously -- separation anxiety. The malady is one of the most common reasons owners euthanize pets."

So, a dog's actions may be more a result of mental disorder than a desire for revenge. I even saw a site that recomended drug therapy for your dog !

The type of thing that makes me lose respect for science. Mental disorders for dogs. What a bunch of <deleted>.

And when a dog pisses down your leg, what is going through his head then?

Been doing some googling on this.

Separation Anxiety in Dogs

"It’s important to realize, however, that the destruction and house soiling that often occur with separation anxiety are not the dog’s attempt to punish or seek revenge on his owner for leaving him alone, but are actually part of a panic response."

"MANHATTAN -- For the most part, Kasey is a wonderful pet. But during tax season -- the busiest time of year for her owner, Karen -- the 2-year old beagle's behavior takes a nose-dive. The long hours Karen is away and the reduction in attention Kasey receives makes the pet excruciatingly anxious, causing her to urinate on furniture in the house.

Kasey's problem may be deeper than revenge. She may be suffering from a disorder the canine world is beginning to take seriously -- separation anxiety. The malady is one of the most common reasons owners euthanize pets."

So, a dog's actions may be more a result of mental disorder than a desire for revenge. I even saw a site that recomended drug therapy for your dog !

The type of thing that makes me lose respect for science. Mental disorders for dogs. What a bunch of <deleted>.

And when a dog pisses down your leg, what is going through his head then?

He doesn't like your shoes?

And when a dog pisses down your leg, what is going through his head then?

He doesn't like your shoes?

What about when a dog dry-humps your leg ? Is he trying to tell you he thinks you are a bitch ?

Or is he trying to tell you he's gay, and thinks you are too ?

And when a dog pisses down your leg, what is going through his head then?

He doesn't like your shoes?

What about when a dog dry-humps your leg ? Is he trying to tell you he thinks you are a bitch ?

Or is he trying to tell you he's gay, and thinks you are too ?

You smell good, you are now his bitch gay or not. It's animal prison sex.

And when a dog pisses down your leg, what is going through his head then?

He doesn't like your shoes?

What about when a dog dry-humps your leg ? Is he trying to tell you he thinks you are a bitch ?

Or is he trying to tell you he's gay, and thinks you are too ?

You smell good, you are now his bitch gay or not. It's animal prison sex.

I think it was like when I used to hump the bed. I didn't care if the bed was willing or not.

And when a dog pisses down your leg, what is going through his head then?

He doesn't like your shoes?

What about when a dog dry-humps your leg ? Is he trying to tell you he thinks you are a bitch ?

Or is he trying to tell you he's gay, and thinks you are too ?

You smell good, you are now his bitch gay or not. It's animal prison sex.

I think it was like when I used to hump the bed. I didn't care if the bed was willing or not.

I hope you had a soft bed, you mattress rapist, you.