How genuine, really, is the Thai smile? Has your view of this chance since you first arrived?

[baffledbaboon]

I have been living and loving this country since the past 10 years, but recently, perhaps naively, have come to question my adopted land of smiles. Third world countries I've had the pleasure of visiting have introduced me to varied forms of service and social interaction. Since when did the beautiful and pure Thai smile change, and become awkward and forced? Even so, do you believe it has changed at all?

[I Like Thai]

To you it was only what you thought it was. The Thai smile is the same now as it was the first time you came. You have lost the rose tinted glasses. But why are you getting so many bad smiles?

[David48]

Awesome first post ...

Living in Thailand 10 years ...

joined ThaiVisa one hour ago as the baffledbaboon ...

better late then never ...

.

[impulse]

Scratch the surface on any "paradise" and you'll find rot, decay and corruption.

Scratch a little deeper and you'll find parents who love their kids, and kind folks that help their neighbors.

A little deeper and you'll find scams and cheaters. Below that you'll find Godfather types that look after their communities.

All depends on how deep you're looking at this stage of your Thailand adventure.

Back home, I had a distant in-law they all called the "smiling barracuda". Not unique to Thailand at all.

Edited August 22, 2013 by impulse

[rijb]

No offense, but maybe your smile has changed. In my experience, the best way to get a nice smile is to give them one first.

[pattjock]

Something most foreigners do not understand is that a smile in Thailand, and in most asian countries, do NOT always meen that you are happy and friendly.

A smile in asia also meens that you are embarrased or afraid, that you have done something stupid or wrong. It's a defence mechanism to placate the other part to avoid a conflict.

[MrWorldwide]

To you it was only what you thought it was. The Thai smile is the same now as it was the first time you came. You have lost the rose tinted glasses. But why are you getting so many bad smiles?

Bingo. Even as a weekend warrior, I recognised it as the usual 'hospitality smile' from day one : the Thais simply do a better job of faking it than most Australians. Catch a Cathay Pacific or Singapore Airlines flight and you'll get some absolutely dazzling 'smile action' : get off a plane in HK or Sillypore and try to find those same smiling faces. Money breeds contempt.

That said, when the kids smile its usually genuine, but they are just kids - if I had to make a living on the streets of BKK or Pattaya, I doubt that I'd be doing too much smiling.

[dao16]

I find most of the smiling to be genuine. That said, I have had pretty heated "arguments" in Thai while both of us smiled profusely (of course, our "argument" was also skirting the subject, so nothing impolite was being said.....the argument was hanging in the air between us, and we both smiled at it, angrily).

So, yeah, there are all kinds of reasons for smiles here, but I still feel like most of them are genuine. if I weren't such a lazy POS I would make a list of the different types.

Ok, here is a half-arsed attempt, in no particular order:

1) Genuine smile. You can see in the eyes that they are happy or happy to be nice to you.

2) Tired smile-Still not a bad sign, but the person is fatigued for reasons that have nothing to do with you, but they are straining to be nice.

3) Embarrassed smile-Something embarrassing has happened, and the smile recognizes this and diverts the interaction away from whatever happened. NOTE: Not always a negative embarrassing thing, but something that would be best left behind.

4) The passive-aggressive revenge smile: Usually happens with people who are working who don't want to do something the way you want or at all. Usually, you can tell from the eyes that they don't want to do this and most likely won't, even though they are nodding, smiling and saying "yes."

5) The smile of authority: A slightly condescending smile where the lips just slightly move toward the smiling position and then stop. Immigration officials love this one. Enough of a smile to acknowledge you, but not enough of one to make anyone think that they actually care about you more than any of their other cases.

Ok, I could go on, but these are the basics. These go for a lot of places in Asia, and even the west, but I feel it more in Thailand. Add to the list. I am sure there are plenty more.

[kannot]

When they smile it means they are Bullshi**ing, that said the kids on the bus shout hello to me everyday as they sail past on the wrong side of the road driven by a moron and smile to me.

Kids are great ,adults are just gits.

[kannot]

No offense, but maybe your smile has changed. In my experience, the best way to get a nice smile is to give them one first.

Hmmmmm that could easily be misconstrued "give them one first"

[balo]

Thai smiles has never been 100% genuine , it is just something that westerners believe.

A Thai smile can mean a lot of things , I am happy, I am sad, I am angry, I hate you, I want to kill you etc....

Edited August 23, 2013 by balo

[andrewrooney]

A smile from a Thai person can be genuine or phony.

It depends on the circumstances...

Just like anywhere else in the world

[Berkshire]

Awesome first post ...

Living in Thailand 10 years ...

joined ThaiVisa one hour ago as the baffledbaboon ...

better late then never ...

.

Unless he's been here under a different name all this time. As for the thread question, it seems the baboon dude is one of those guys who really believed the bargirls when they called him "hansum man" and that the big smile on their faces must mean that they like him. It only took him 10 years to figure out that he's really not that handsome and the smile may not be genuine afterall.

[MrWorldwide]

I still find it hard t accept that anyone who makes it to 40+ actually believes the 'hansum man' spiel. I know many who get off the plane aren't Rhodes Scholars, but every hotel room I've ever been in has had a mirror ..... Perhaps they manage to find one without same ?

[mca]

In my experience, the best way to get a nice smile is to give them one first.

In honour of Michael Scott of "The Office" fame.

"That's what she said."

[Kommiekat]

In Japanese culture, there is something called HONNE and TATEMAE.

Honne means to be truthful.

Tatemae is to give face. To NOT reveal your true thinking, though you fake otherwise.

Can be very frustrating at times when they give you tatemae. Especially when you KNOW they are doing it.

It's just part of the culture.

In the case with Japanese, you can call them out on it. They may deny it, but at least they won't get upset over it.

I'd accept a fake Thai smile any day to NO smile at all.

[pomchop]

No more genuine smile that a Thai kid who is amused by something the falang says or does. Wild eyed stare followed by smile followed by bursting into giggles.

Enough to make my day most any day.

[Beetlejuice]

The Thai smile has nothing to do with being genuine or fake.

It is just part of a cultural form of displaying politeness or could be described as a sort of social etiquette. After doing this for many years, the smiling part becomes automatic, almost a habit without thinking.

I even smile at other farangs and at most times I don`t realise I`m doing it, the face muscles just move. This is what happens to us if we stay in Thailand for too long. I dread to think what would happen if I had to return to Farangland? Probably either be considered as a grinning pervert, get beaten up or become arrested.

The best way to deal with the smiles, is to not look into this too deeply. Just smile back and go with the flow.

Edited August 23, 2013 by Beetlejuice

[Kommiekat]

This is what happens to us if we stay in Thailand for too long.

Does that mean I'll be taking my shoes off before entering my house and eating with chopsticks most of the time?

OH.....MY....GOD!

[somtampet]

No offense, but maybe your smile has changed. In my experience, the best way to get a nice smile is to give them one first.

Very very true,I love Thailand and Thailand loves me,the only way to go,smile smile smile

[somtampet]

The Thai smile has nothing to do with being genuine or fake.

It is just part of a cultural form of displaying politeness or could be described as a sort of social etiquette. After doing this for many years, the smiling part becomes automatic, almost a habit without thinking.

I even smile at other farangs and at most times I don`t realise I`m doing it, the face muscles just move. This is what happens to us if we stay in Thailand for too long. I dread to think what would happen if I had to return to Farangland? Probably either be considered as a grinning pervert, get beaten up or become arrested.

The best way to deal with the smiles, is to not look into this too deeply. Just smile back and go with the flow.

A man of experience,good post

[chrisinth]

Thai smiles has never been 100% genuine , it is just something that westerners believe.

A Thai smile can mean a lot of things , I am happy, I am sad, I am angry, I hate you, I want to kill you etc....

To me your second line contradicts your first balo.

I believe the smile is 100% genuine, but can mean all the things in line two......................

[chrisinth]

To the OP...............

Not sure if it has ever happened to you, but I have lost count of the number of times I have been in the situation where I have smiled and asked "Really?" where I know I should have said "What a dick-head."

I am not normally a spiteful person, and for that reason go with smile and the "Really?" reply most of the time.

Never, ever judge a book by it's cover, especially when it comes to smiles.....................

Edited August 24, 2013 by chrisinth

[Beetlejuice]

Here is another classic example of a type of meaningless social etiquette:

Many times when us Westerners meet or talk to someone we haven’t seen for a long time or even introduced to a stranger for the first time, we ask; Hello, How Are You?

The expected answer is, I’m Fine Thank You. But try this reply back as an experiment as I have done on occasions: You are asked; How Are You? You respond; I’m still alive. Then stand back and enjoy the confused expression on their faces, or in other words they don`t actually care if you’re well or not, it`s just another form of fake politeness that cannot be taken seriously and could be equated with the Thai smile.

[NanLaew]

The OP should have given us a 'for instance' rather than thrown out this rather vague, "...how about you?"

Otherwise, he leaves himself wide open to muppets venerable TV sages to unnecessarily introduce bar girls to this perpetual debate.

[transam]

When they smile it means they are Bullshi**ing, that said the kids on the bus shout hello to me everyday as they sail past on the wrong side of the road driven by a moron and smile to me.

Kids are great ,adults are just gits.

Bit harsh don't you think.

[JSixpack]

The Thai smile has nothing to do with being genuine or fake.

It is just part of a cultural form of displaying politeness or could be described as a sort of social etiquette. After doing this for many years, the smiling part becomes automatic, almost a habit without thinking.

I even smile at other farangs and at most times I don`t realise I`m doing it, the face muscles just move. This is what happens to us if we stay in Thailand for too long. I dread to think what would happen if I had to return to Farangland? Probably either be considered as a grinning pervert, get beaten up or become arrested.

The best way to deal with the smiles, is to not look into this too deeply. Just smile back and go with the flow.

Very true.

The Thai smile looks really nice. But you can't pay much attention to it.

[Neeranam]

I'd say it has changed due to the huge increase in farang living here.

Thai attitudes toward us has changed. 20 years ago, we were still welcome but now we are too many and a threat.

Last night when at a restaurant I took my youngest daughter to the toilet at the back and near someone's house. When leaving the toilets, the little kids, about 4-8, started shouting "farang auk pai". My daughter was upset and I was surprised. Never heard this directed at myself in 20 years.

It also has to do with my attitudes to Thais - but there's only so many years that one can be the "smiling, ignorant, "sabai dee mai" farang

[tingtong]

Thai smiles as genuine as handsome man in Pattaya...

both exist, but lot fewer than we led to believe

[Beetlejuice]

I'd say it has changed due to the huge increase in farang living here.

Thai attitudes toward us has changed. 20 years ago, we were still welcome but now we are too many and a threat.

Last night when at a restaurant I took my youngest daughter to the toilet at the back and near someone's house. When leaving the toilets, the little kids, about 4-8, started shouting "farang auk pai". My daughter was upset and I was surprised. Never heard this directed at myself in 20 years.

It also has to do with my attitudes to Thais - but there's only so many years that one can be the "smiling, ignorant, "sabai dee mai" farang

Isn`t this sort of scenario the same as in all countries?

Back in the Jurassic period when I was in my teens, the first South Asians began arriving into England. At first they were regarded as a novelty, mostly owners and workers in Indian restaurants, and quite respected. Then during the 1970s after the Asians were thrown out of Uganda, the Indians began coming in on mass and suddenly the whole perception of them changed for the worse and the rest is history.

This is unfortunately human nature, and why i cannot see any benefits of large scale exodus of Westerners of little wealth from Farangland into Thailand to the expats already living here.

Edited August 25, 2013 by Beetlejuice