Protests will continue until Thaksin regime is out

[benny1616]

hahaha, protest and protesters is a very good joke. the big majority of my thai friends and farangs call it: "terror and terrorists". may be they are not rich enough to join this terrorist opposition ideas or they are just people with a good heart for the poor people of thailand. anyhow the tourist industry is afectet allready and no wonder some people have lost their job in phuket allready.because farangs avoid making holidays in phuket and other parts of thailand.

[DGIE]

AllanB, on 29 Nov 2013 - 09:15, said:

Wake up lads. Politicians everywhere in the world are all corrupt, why do you think they work for peanuts? Taksin was clamping down on corruption and you can't do that, which is why they ousted him.

They have stable government in the west because the media fools enough of us, here the media isn't that influential, so they play ring-a-ring-a-roses instead.

This is helping make sterling stronger anyway....and those multinationals left will hasten their departure to cheaper countries.

Buying votes is a great idea, cuts down on hypocrisy.

Buying votes is a great idea?

[Jim walker]

Anything to create a bit more stability in Thailand and boost their international Statius as leading a 3^rd world democracy.

[lostmebike]

Thai at Heart said:

Posted Today, 06:06

Who the hell is this guy?

He is a gay!

Gay, straight, into beastiallity or whatever, what's that got to do with anything?

[LomSak27]

The idea is to kick them out and then change the whole process to make the system of politics more democratic and uncorruptable so the likes of Thaksin can not interfere with politics. To eradicate vote buying and populist policies, and install more rigorous checks and balances.

Amazing ! It sounds so great, what a dream! but that is what you have to tell the Expat faithful.

Of course it will never be accomplished and has never before been voiced by the worthy opposition until Thaksins ascendancy. After all the shouting and pie in the sky dreaming, The bottom line: we will use whatever means possible with no intention of ever doing what we say and of course NO ELECTIONS - cause we get stomped.

And if it doesn't work, we will give it a couple years and run it up the flagpole again. BUT NO ELECTIONS ... cause we lose those ooooopsy

[LomSak27]

The idea is to kick them out and then change the whole process to make the system of politics more democratic and uncorruptable so the likes of Thaksin can not interfere with politics. To eradicate vote buying and populist policies, and install more rigorous checks and balances.

Amazing ! It sounds so great, what a dream! but that is what you have to tell the Expat faithful.

Of course it will never be accomplished and has never before been voiced by the worthy opposition until Thaksins ascendancy. After all the shouting and pie in the sky dreaming, The bottom line: we will use whatever means possible with no intention of ever doing what we say and of course NO ELECTIONS - cause we get stomped.

And if it doesn't work, we will give it a couple years and run it up the flagpole again. BUT NO ELECTIONS ... cause we lose those ooooopsy

[DGIE]

As for the protest in front of the National Police Office by members of the so-called People’s Army to Overthrow Thaksin Regime who also cut off power supply to the office, Mr Aekkanit said the group was independent from the Ratchadamnoen protesters and could act whatever they deemed fit.

cut off power supply....deemed fit(?)

other demonstrators offer flowers to policemen

[tragickingdom]

And suddenly it becomes clear how mass murderers like Pol Pot and Mao git their way in Asia. You need just a few percent support within the countries population who are fanatic enough to push hard enough. Pol Pot, Mao and Suthep cs they all have one thing in common. They are undemocratic and are willing to kill millions in order to establish their own ideology. The first two were Maoists, Suthep a man who wants an appointed government and an absolute monarchy.

It is quite funny that the so called educated in Bangkok do not have internet at home and if they have it is just to watch their partner swinging, otherwise there is no explanation that they haven't figured out how dirty an crrupt mister Suthep is and how he sent Chuan packing after his land scandal.

Beware for anything that has the word Democrat(ic) in it in Thailand. It is seldom what it looks like.

[hellodolly]

what a load of b*llsh*t alt=bah.gif width=19 height=19>

when a party wins an election, what is it supposed to do then? Formulate its policies based on what the opposition wants? alt=blink.png width=20 height=20>

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/politics/Abhisit-Democrats-will-strive-to-oust-the-Thaksin--30220844.html

It is supposed to formulate it's policies for the good of ther country not for it's own financial gain.

The anti govt protestors have stated they do not want too much democracy want to revert to before 1932 with the King as the Head of the State.

So if that much is clear then the military cannot interfere and we will have to wait to see what happens on the King's birthday.

However for Yingluck her patience must wear thin after December 5th and will have no recourse but to be firm as the PM as one would expect in any democratic country. The police are trained they have to enforce the law however this waiting game will push back Thailand in her recovery from the floods and the rice scam and this political mess.

Well you did have some good food for thought until you said

"The police are trained they have to enforce the law"

Suthep is a 'fire brand'

Speaking personally, Suthep's actions raise more questions than a marathon nosebleed tournament of 'Trivial Pursuits.'

He is doing more harm than good to the democratic massprotest movement. And it will come back to haunt those of us who are part of that movement. Just because you don't set fire to the buildings you occupy, doesn't mean that it is democratic to occupy buildings by force in the first place. Nor is it OK to spout the incendiary rhetoric and insulting personal comments against other members of the political sphere. Facts and figures speak far louder, and you don't need to break into buildings to deliver those facts and figures either. Democracy is about winning the argument by logical reasoning, not by kicking in doors.

Well there is in my opinion a fine line Suthep must walk. the occupying of buildings is not turning out as he had hoped it would but it is showing the nation that not every one in government is happy with the PTPredshirt government. Many of the employes are having there picture taken as they support Suthep and his efforts. These are the government employes that have a closer knowledge of the corruption than many non government bystanders.

Understandably they are taking a chance but they are showing their support for the ouster of the Shinawatra wannabe dynasty

[NanLaew]

Who the hell is this guy?

He is Suthep Thaugsuban's step-son. He studied at St. Gabriel's School in Bangkok, spent some time studying in Australia, and later studied at Oxford University. He has been directly involved with the democrats since about 2009.[/size]

There you go, the moneyed mouthpiece for the Thai-Chinese... or is that Chinese Thai? Hi-so by any other yardstick.

Or maybe easier to say he's probably NOT Thai at Heart?

[Thainy Tim]

So what happens when they kick them out. Then get voted back in? I just don't get it.

The idea is to kick them out and then change the whole process to make the system of politics more democratic and uncorruptable so the likes of Thaksin can not interfere with politics. To eradicate vote buying and populist policies, and install more rigorous checks and balances.

Then whoever gets voted in, it will be the democratic way.... They are trying to repair the laughable system of politics basically.

Don't be so sure about PTP getting back in that easily. With no vote buying or populist policies.

Surely, if that happens, none of the people who have previously held office of any kind will be involved in politics.

Do people really believe that Thaksin was the only corrupt politician in the history of Thailand?

And aren't 'populist policies' what all political parties in all democratic countries use?

Which party has been elected to government by announcing policies which are unpopular?

By the very definition of the word, it applies to all successful political campaigns and governments. Some policies provoke demonstrations, and resentment, but are usually still popular with the majority. If they're not, they don't get a second term.

Also, what will happen if this fella and his mates are still jumping up and down and blowing whistles on December the 5th?

Surely, if that happens, none of the people who have previously held office of any kind will be involved in politics.

I don't know how you work that one out, I don't even know what part of the post you are referring to.

Do people really believe that Thaksin was the only corrupt politician in the history of Thailand?

Again.... head firmly in the past, when this discussion is about moving forward... get your head out of the past. It's not about Thaksin versus the rest, it's about Thaksin 's meddling in Thai affairs.

And aren't 'populist policies' what all political parties in all democratic countries use?

No... My country (the UK) election campaigns are run on credibility. You won't see a party coming out with 'we will pay potato farmers way over the farm gate price, all the other farmers can go suck one, we want the potato vote'.... or 'we will give everyone on the dole a £20 a week rise in their benefits' they would be laughed at.

Which party has been elected to government by announcing policies which are unpopular?

That is an invention of your own mind.... No party comes out with policies that it knows are unpopular, some may be unpopular by some, such as the incredibly selfish with no thought to what is best for the country only what is best for me.

By the very definition of the word, it applies to all successful political campaigns and governments. Some policies provoke demonstrations, and resentment, but are usually still popular with the majority. If they're not, they don't get a second term.

You keep leaning towards the policy theory, and you have not yet mentioned once about the cash for vote problem which is way more undemocratic.

Also, what will happen if this fella and his mates are still jumping up and down and blowing whistles on December the 5th?

Who cares... I think the current situation is way more important to the country than a birthday celebration that can still happen somewhere else with just as much respect. You may well be surprised at the people on the streets come the 5th.

[hellodolly]

hahaha, protest and protesters is a very good joke. the big majority of my thai friends and farangs call it: "terror and terrorists". may be they are not rich enough to join this terrorist opposition ideas or they are just people with a good heart for the poor people of thailand. anyhow the tourist industry is afectet allready and no wonder some people have lost their job in phuket allready.because farangs avoid making holidays in phuket and other parts of thailand.

You are on the wrong thread this is not the thread where they are trying to stop corruption in Phuket as it is starting to have an affect on their tourism.

[Jasun]

Yes, they are trying to change the voting system. If you remember last time around, the Dems suggestion was that only percentage of parliamentarians would be elected by popular vote, with the balance being appointed by a 'special committee'. The committee being made predominantly of members from the elite ruling class. Hardly a fair or democratic process.

Incorrect Jasun

You are confusing the PAD idea (floated briefly) with the Democrats who never spoke out for that model.

Your statement of the make-up of the "committee" as you call it that the PAD floated as an idea is also incorrect. It was to include people from all groups of society, from labour unions to farmer to academics etc ...

it was a particularly poor idea that never gained any favor amongst other groups and not even within the PAD itself which is why they splintered shortly thereafter.

Yes, it was the PAD. Lets not forget it that institution was backed by card-carrying Dems at all levels, including members of the PAD central and management committees, through to a large portion of the supporter base as a whole. The least not of whom was the serving foreign minster in the Abhisit government.

The idea was a bit more than 'floated briefly', it was drafted externally as a constitutional amendment and discussed in parliament. The only thing the PAD backed away from was their initial proposal to amend the constitution to elect 70% of MPs by appointed, reducing it to 50% with the balance being voted by geographical area. These appointments were to be made by occupational representatives, referred to as ‘professional groups’. I don't remember farmers being one of those occupational groups, perhaps they were.

As you say, it was a poor idea and about as thinly veiled and stupid as the recent amnesty bill.

[NanLaew]

So what happens when they kick them out. Then get voted back in? I just don't get it.

If the Thaksin cabal are eliminated and the Courts freed of political influence then a start has been made towards a brighter future for the lower classes.

OMG... another one subscribing to the weird notion that the PAD/yellow/royalist/elitist/monarchist/Dems are doing this all for the greater good of their ignorant, lower-class brothers and sisters?

If you can, cast your mind back to the pre-Thaksin times. When the hi-so city folks had their God-given right of accession to just about any gravy train going. They never gave a sh!t about the impoverished north and northeast although their sphincters puckered a bit with the Communist stirrings in the 70's.

Feudal patronage is the only path they collectively seek. The right to do as they please, when they please with accountability to absolutely nobody... and get filthy rich doing it. Thaksin merely displaced those at the trough and that upset a large amount of 'old Thai money' that wanted to be 'huge old Thai money'. Odious as Thaksin and his kin may be, they probably have no qualms looking at their faces in the mirror, unlike the opposition.

Screw thinking about a Thai democracy in any shape or form that the non- Thai's amongst us are familiar with.

[phitsanulokjohn]

Yawn yawn.If and when the Thaksin regime gets toppled,we'll have all the red shirts protesters back on the street in a repetetive cycle of boredom and disruptions.For Everyone's sake why doesn't Thai society grow up and learn to accept the voters opinion at the ballot box,and allow their country to move forward.They appear just like little kids,and cry their eyes out when they don't get their own way.

[oldsailor35]

Who the hell is this guy?

He is Suthep Thaugsuban's step-son. He studied at St. Gabriel's School in Bangkok, spent some time studying in Australia, and later studied at Oxford University. He has been directly involved with the democrats since about 2009.

mmmmmmmmm! did'nt learn much about democracy , did he !

[oldsailor35]

So what happens when they kick them out. Then get voted back in? I just don't get it.

The idea is to kick them out and then change the whole process to make the system of politics more democratic and uncorruptable so the likes of Thaksin can not interfere with politics. To eradicate vote buying and populist policies, and install more rigorous checks and balances.

Then whoever gets voted in, it will be the democratic way.... They are trying to repair the laughable system of politics basically.

Don't be so sure about PTP getting back in that easily. With no vote buying or populist policies.

Until they start locking up dodgy politicians and those associated with them, this cycle is crap will continue.

Could not agree more.

That goes for all politicians.

Process all 666 NACC cases involving politicians as a priority. and reform the constitution to make it concrete, final and devoid of any elements that make it vulnerable to manipulation and misinterpretation. Reform the election commission systems to make elections more policed with party dismissals for any vote buying, to also include scrutiny of policies so that they conform as being within the national interest rather than a targeted vote buying exercise.

I do believe that this is exactly what the Dems want..

Up to now, the demands of Suthep and the Dems seem to be to targeted to a specific single focus... To remove the House of Thaksin from politics... Which is all well and good, and something that I totally agree with. But it is now time for them to explain to the people exactly what happens after.

If they came out with much more detailed information on their ultimate goals for the reform of the country's political scene and then sell it to the people, they may just get a massive thumbs up from the all round populous.

But at the moment, just shouting demands, even though I agree with them as a first step to reform, their strategy continues to promote division rather than a coming together for a fair and non-corrupt democracy.

I think Suthep's idea of a 'people's committee' will work, so long as it is in keeping with un-bias fairness, and it is appointed by the a combination of the NACC and constitutional court perhaps and sanctioned by the head of state. I say the NACC because they are currently in the role of monitoring corruption, whereas I think prevention is better than cure, so they should have a say in setting up the mechanisms to be uncorruptable from the outset.

I will not accept that the people of Thailand want corruption in politics and I doubt that many will be bothered about not earning 500 baht every few years.

All governments should be voted for because of their own merit, and their ability to deliver policies that are realistic and serve the entire country, of all classes with a fair and even hand.

Massive jail sentences for those who attempt to corrupt the new system.

RUBBISH! Having observed Thai politicians and their habits, although it might work in other countries, it could "never" have a chance of working in Thailand at least not within the next 50 years until all these selfish, rich powerful old men have long gone. Suthep has got to be up there as one of the worst.

[NanLaew]

I thought all the yellow shirts were the smart educated people, how can they spend all day loitering the streets, shouldn't thy have jobs to go to?

They are a richer segment of society and many of them own businesses so they don't necessarily have to go to work. They are more likely to be a employer than an employee, at least of those that are demonstrating.

Some employers will let their employees go to the protests if they want to.

Indeed, some of the more benevolent employers may even give their staff some 'pocket money' for attending the protests.

OMG!... that could be seen by some as... THAKSINISM!!!

[FangFerang]

I cannot see a way out of this dilemna that does not create hardship for Thais.

[jpeg]

Talking to Thais they tell me they're sick of the lot of them (with the exception of the terminally ignorant with their hands out) and you'd be surprised to learn that even amongst them, there are some professing to be 'glang' - in the middle. I know of at least one Dem poli standing as an Independent. He tells me there are many more like him. They're not all wealthy elitist you know.

[indyuk]

I find this press report offensive. Thaksin is not a Monarch and will never be so.

Thailand doesn't have a regime it has a widely respected Government.

[NanLaew]

Talking to Thais they tell me they're sick of the lot of them (with the exception of the terminally ignorant with their hands out) and you'd be surprised to learn that even amongst them, there are some professing to be 'glang' - in the middle. I know of at least one Dem poli standing as an Independent. He tells me there are many more like him. They're not all wealthy elitist you know.

But I wonder just how deep the people's 'sickness' is when confronted with the realities of eschewing the current Thai political model of always having to be in someone elses pocket? The reality of having to work harder for less, being more honest, paying your taxes, being more benevolent, being more open-minded, being less petty, growing up, forgoing the path of least resistance and standing by your principles rather than selling them to the highest bidder, be it a politician who wants your vote or a cop who wants 200 baht, both for not doing their job.

There's a much better chance of an independent politician getting a seat at the higher table rather than waiting for any crumbs that may fall from it. Apart from the possibly the first Thaksin government, most elected governments of whatever color, never had an outright people's mandate to govern. They had to cobble together a 'coalition' of those that best fit their grand scheme of things and wide open to abuse by well-heeled special interests. Put it this way, the Dems haven't won at bat for over 20 (?) years so not a big surprise that some of them would take a shot at being 'independent' only as a means to very predictable end.

[Jawnie]

Until the Thaksin regime is out??? Er...uh, there isn't any Thaksin regime in!!! I mean, Thaksin haters have been saying PMYL is his puppet, but actually she is the elected PM and Thaksin himself is outside of the country.

So, in an ABSOLUTELY REAL sense, there is no Thaksin regime. With regard to the Red Shirts and all the Thais that support Thaksin, sorry to say, but they have the right to support whomever they wish...you can't just take over a country, its streets and roads and offices until everyone else agrees with you. Grow up...move on.

[fasteddie]

So what happens when they kick them out. Then get voted back in? I just don't get it.

The idea is to kick them out and then change the whole process to make the system of politics more democratic and uncorruptable so the likes of Thaksin can not interfere with politics. To eradicate vote buying and populist policies, and install more rigorous checks and balances.

Then whoever gets voted in, it will be the democratic way.... They are trying to repair the laughable system of politics basically.

Don't be so sure about PTP getting back in that easily. With no vote buying or populist policies.

"The idea is"

No! that's just your idea. Their idea is to abandon democracy altogether as it never produces the right result for these reactionary elitists.

[Rob8891]

Until the Thaksin regime is out??? Er...uh, there isn't any Thaksin regime in!!! I mean, Thaksin haters have been saying PMYL is his puppet, but actually she is the elected PM and Thaksin himself is outside of the country.

So, in an ABSOLUTELY REAL sense, there is no Thaksin regime. With regard to the Red Shirts and all the Thais that support Thaksin, sorry to say, but they have the right to support whomever they wish...you can't just take over a country, its streets and roads and offices until everyone else agrees with you. Grow up...move on.

Were you born after 2010?

[Costas2008]

Prbkk, on 29 Nov 2013 - 06:28, said:

They can " act whatever they deemed fit"( sic). So a faction not controlled by the centre...these people are out of control already and cutting electricity to essential services is beyond the pale.

Yes, I agree with you.....cutting the electricity from the police head courters is unthinkable!!!!!

How are these poor darlings going to survive in there without aircondition??????????????

How can they enjoy their beauty sleep for the whole of 8 hours of their shift???????????

These protesters are very hard to the BEST police force money can buy!!!!!!!!

[Halion]

Graft, corruption,nepotism and a drastically failed educational and legal system are major contributors to the political instability of this country. While serving ministers can claim immunity from prosecution there is little chance that things can or will improve improve. If this or any other successive government has sincerity in truly wanting to improve the deteriorating state of this nation then this immunity has to be removed so that public officials can be immediately arrested for any and all abuse of authority and power and tried in within an impartial just legal system and if found guilty given serious deterrent sentences without special privilege for their personal abuse of public office.

The current government(PTP) has been totally disingenuous in their puerile claims to be dedicated to the removal of corruption, graft and nepotism in all aspects of public service. It is their stock in trade , their bread and butter and the personal benefits of public office is their driving mantra. They have little or no use for serving public interest or the interests of this nation unless it contains a significant financial benefit for themselves.

Regardless of what political party is in charge very little will change unless there is an overhaul in the judicial, legal and administrative protocols of this nation and that public office or the position of your perceived place in society or the size of your bank account have nothing to due with privileged against violation of law. Those in public office who abuse their positions should be most severely punished which will make all the other little greedy Somchai's think twice.. To steal from public coffers is akin to treason.

[lostmebike]

Prbkk, on 29 Nov 2013 - 06:28, said:

They can " act whatever they deemed fit"( sic). So a faction not controlled by the centre...these people are out of control already and cutting electricity to essential services is beyond the pale.

Yes, I agree with you.....cutting the electricity from the police head courters is unthinkable!!!!!

How are these poor darlings going to survive in there without aircondition??????????????

How can they enjoy their beauty sleep for the whole of 8 hours of their shift???????????

These protesters are very hard to the BEST police force money can buy!!!!!!!!

Ahh bless.

No aircon, no TV and no fridge to keep their nibbles cool.

[tonneke breda]

Free your mind and the rest will follow!!!

[patjem]

Protests will continue until Thaksin regime is out....... just wonder and asking what happens if they continue with this next week ? The 5th is only a few days away.

I didn't notice that there was any disiturbances down in HuaHin.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/685346-army-to-move-troops-to-hua-hin-for-monarchs-birthday-celebration/