Racism or Am I Just too Sensitive.

[Somsrisonphimai]

OMG! I thought you are writing a novel. Anyway, I guess you have not seen how they treat the isaan girls at the fancy places.

So who the <deleted>> are THEY ?, (how THEY treat the Isaan girls at fancy places) Do you mean Thais ?

Don't be silly, you know who they are. Go ask your isaan girlfriend.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Edited February 20, 2014 by Somsrisonphimai

[oiboy]

How does the Indian Caste System deal with discrimination ?

I'm not sure as I'm Christian and don't believe in the caste system, nor did I grow up around it.

Not sure what relevance the Indian caste system has in relationship with my post.

OK then maybe I'll ask a similar question.

how does the KKK deal with discrimination?

Are you saying because one country has a class based system it is OK for another country to have another discriminatory system? I don't really see the logic in this argument. I think both are equally bad and if it happens in my presence I will not condone nor support it.

[Munger]

OMG! I thought you are writing a novel. Anyway, I guess you have not seen how they treat the isaan girls at the fancy places.

So who the <deleted>> are THEY ?, (how THEY treat the Isaan girls at fancy places) Do you mean Thais ?

Don't be silly, you know who they are.

Do you mean Thais or Indians ?

[oiboy]

OMG! I thought you are writing a novel. Anyway, I guess you have not seen how they treat the isaan girls at the fancy places.

So who the <deleted>> are THEY ?, (how THEY treat the Isaan girls at fancy places) Do you mean Thais ?

Do you tolerate when your gf is treated like crap at "fancy places"?

[rott]

As somebody more or less said earlier, Thais have a perception (frequently based on personal experience) of Indians as over-haggling, pestering nuisances and tend to instinctively behave negatively towards them.

Racism? by a western definition yes.

But then expecting Thais to treat foreigners as equals before the law as the west does, would be enough to have you declared insane here.

[wym]

Yes the Thais that work in high-end hospitality jobs are often very snobby toward Isaan mia farang, sometimes even publicly so. Particularly if you're old and she's a young stunner.

However if the man takes charge and calls them on it, escalates to management things get corrected pretty quickly, at least at the genuine quality establishments.

But your girl would rather die and sink deep below the ground than let you make a fuss.

[wym]

Do you tolerate when your gf is treated like crap at "fancy places"?

As above, most wouldn't have it any other way, making a scene is just over the top.

Fact is the Thais generally know and accept their assigned place in the caste system here, not even aware it shouldn't be that way.

It usually takes many months if not years of training before one of my newer SOs will dare to set foot inside a place like Siam Paragon or a fancy hotel.

She honestly feels she doesn't deserve to, she's going to get into trouble, is in fact causing trouble as a she's a poor rural dark-skinned intruder.

Edited February 20, 2014 by wym

[dao16]

OMG! I thought you are writing a novel. Anyway, I guess you have not seen how they treat the isaan girls at the fancy places.

I would think that's less so when the couple are roughly the same age, and check in together?

Not really, they still wonder why is that hansum man with that not so pretty girl.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Nope....still happens with Isaan women of the same age. My wife and I are 6 months apart in age. No just in Thailand, either. It is perception and jealousy, in my opinion. You walk up and the dumb hotel workers who are clinging to the best job they can ever hope for look down on you because, in their little worlds, they should be checking in and you should be working. Had this in Malaysia as well with an Indian woman glaring at us (we stayed in some nice hotels but we just had backpacks and walked in--clean and all, but not dressing up or wearing jewelry or anything).

As for the Indian stuff, I would assume it is based on where you are going. Out here in the Isaan sticks they would notice you, but they wouldn't really have anything to say about it all since they just don't see Indians much (some are around).

For OP, yes, I totally believe what you are saying and it sucks. Just try to use your Thai to good effect--if they make negative or racist remarks, just ask politely but with a nice enough sentence to show you REALLY speak Thai what it was that was just said (for example "I'm sorry, I was just looking at the invoice here and I missed what the last thing you said. Could you repeat that?) That will shut most people right up.

Besides that, try to have a good time here and ignore those people as much as you can. After all, no matter how much they hate you, you are living your life and that won't change as much as they sit there bitterly imagining themselves in your place.

[oiboy]

OMG! I thought you are writing a novel. Anyway, I guess you have not seen how they treat the isaan girls at the fancy places.

I would think that's less so when the couple are roughly the same age, and check in together?

Not really, they still wonder why is that hansum man with that not so pretty girl.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Nope....still happens with Isaan women of the same age. My wife and I are 6 months apart in age. No just in Thailand, either. It is perception and jealousy, in my opinion. You walk up and the dumb hotel workers who are clinging to the best job they can ever hope for look down on you because, in their little worlds, they should be checking in and you should be working. Had this in Malaysia as well with an Indian woman glaring at us (we stayed in some nice hotels but we just had backpacks and walked in--clean and all, but not dressing up or wearing jewelry or anything).

As for the Indian stuff, I would assume it is based on where you are going. Out here in the Isaan sticks they would notice you, but they wouldn't really have anything to say about it all since they just don't see Indians much (some are around).

For OP, yes, I totally believe what you are saying and it sucks. Just try to use your Thai to good effect--if they make negative or racist remarks, just ask politely but with a nice enough sentence to show you REALLY speak Thai what it was that was just said (for example "I'm sorry, I was just looking at the invoice here and I missed what the last thing you said. Could you repeat that?) That will shut most people right up.

Besides that, try to have a good time here and ignore those people as much as you can. After all, no matter how much they hate you, you are living your life and that won't change as much as they sit there bitterly imagining themselves in your place.

I have to agree. When I was in Issan I found people pretty friendly and pleasant. I always thought that travel and education would dispel racist behaviour but it seems like the opposite is true. The poorer rural folk are far less judgemental or racist than the middle class here. If I ever come here for pleasure again I may stick to Issan as the people and the food are awesome. I would rather have some decent som tam, laab moo, and some khao niao, then over sweetened Bangkok style Thai food.

[angrybird]

quote "I'm not sure as I'm Christian and don't believe in the caste system, nor did I grow up around it."

Although strongly identified with Hindus, the caste systems has been carried over to other religions on the Indian subcontinent, including Buddhists, Christians, Muslims,^] Sikhs.

Maybe not, but you don't have a label telling the world that, so you should not be surprised that you will be lumped in with

the majority. and again not be surprised that I and many find persons bewailing personal discrimination, a little ironic, when the whole continent of India is what it is.

The KKK ? not sure of the relevance.

Edited February 20, 2014 by angrybird

[ayayay]

Yes, unfortunately, Thais are incredibly racist.

[merijn]

Interesting and good written experience.

But unfortunately not a surprise and almost normal behavior for most Thai people.

I noticed this myself that most Thai people ( i live in the south ) don't like Indian (looking) people.

My experience is that they class them the same as Arabs, Africans etc.

If you live here for a while you should notice that.

Is it correct? off-course not but it is how it is and not much will change.

[oiboy]

quote "I'm not sure as I'm Christian and don't believe in the caste system, nor did I grow up around it."

Although strongly identified with Hindus, the caste systems has been carried over to other religions on the Indian subcontinent, including Buddhists, Christians, Muslims,^] Sikhs.

Maybe not, but you don't have a label telling the world that, so you should not be surprised that you will be lumped in with

the majority. and again not be surprised that I and many find persons bewailing personal discrimination, a little ironic, when the whole continent of India is what it is.

The KKK ? not sure of the relevance.

The relevance is the caste system has the same relevance the KKK or White Supremicist organizations have to most people. It's you and not Thai folk who even brought up the caste system.

The caste system bears as much relevance to me as the KKK does to you. My family immigrated to Canada several generations ago. How does what is happening in India bear any relevance with thai racism? Are they somehow saying to themselves, indians are used to being treated bad as they have a caste system in their home countries?

[oiboy]

Wonder if any Thai members of this forum would like to chime in. Would be interesting to know their. POV.

[ayayay]

But may I also please ask OP, to not refer to us as "Farang", as this only consolidate the Thai notion and importance of skin color, rather than individuality, and nationality.

[DavidMavec]

I have spent significant time in Latin America, Europe, and the U.S. before coming to Thailand. In my opinion, Thailand is the most xenophobic and discriminatory countries where I have lived. And I speak and read Thai to a fairly decent level.

[Suradit69]

On this last trip I felt as if I was treated like a second class citizen.

"...like a second class citizen."

Are you a Thai citizen?

Sort of ironic that you're raising issues of racism here on TV. Have you read any of the extensive Indian, Chinese, Russian, Thai (and recently French) bashing on Thai Visa?

[ford8]

Wonder if any Thai members of this forum would like to chime in. Would be interesting to know their. POV.

Interesting yes, but I doubt to your liking.

[Berkshire]

I have spent significant time in Latin America, Europe, and the U.S. before coming to Thailand. In my opinion, Thailand is the most xenophobic and discriminatory countries where I have lived. And I speak and read Thai to a fairly decent level.

Of all the places I've been, America and Australia are by far more racist than Thailand.

[fishbrando]

As an Asian, I've had situations in Bangkok where white customers were pretty blatantly served before me, and I've been ignored while the staff chats with the white customers. I vote with my feet and go elsewhere.

[travelman]

My suggestion to all foreigners residing in Thailand.

"DO AS THE ROMAN'S DO"

The best solution to counter racism in Thailand.

[gopis108]

I am alco Canadian and in Canada East Indians are not a welcome crowd either,when it comes to business.They have established a REPUTATION FOR THEMSELVES AS BEING RUDE AND arrogant at times,almost always ABSURDLY niggardly,and criminal.My wife and I often vended our wares and the markets in and around Vancouver and it came to the point that whenever an east Indian approached our stand we would turn our backs to discourage them from coming over and handling all the merchandise and leaving it the display area in a mess after offering us an offer well below the cost of the goods.What is with these people-do their parents beat them if they dont obtain everything below cost.They seem to enjoy some superior social status amongst each other if they can beat down the price on something.So my friend in my opinion your reputuation seems to have spread beyond Canada.On another note-anyone who has ever frequently travelled abroad on business I am certain would agree with me that Indians are positively the worst loud and obnoxious people that one could ever have the misfortune of being allocated a room next to (always a huge group),what to speak of living next door or even in the area...In general they have zero regard for the privacy and quietude of anyone else and they richly deserve the results of the reputation that they have built for themselves.Cheers

[outstripp11]

When i first came to Thailand in 1979 one of the first things I learned was that Thais don't like Indians.

[sirchai]

Really sorry to read your experiences in this country. Honestly, Thais are racist.

A good example that happened already back in 2005 at a well- known primary school in Sisaket. An Indian guy with a Turban walked in the at his time almost new EP classroom, where an older Thai woman was trying to teach the kids.

When the Indian guy wanted to ask her a question, she'd sent him out immediately. Same guy's one of the wealthiest guys in Sisaket now and well respected by all.

Unfortunately, some people seem to hibernate all their lives and never wake up. Ignorance and stupidity is always a bad mixture. -

[sealion55]

I am a French lady, an indologist and as such I have lived in India about 6 months per year since 1975. Recently, or not so recently, about 10 years ago, I have started to spend the winter months in Bangkok.

I have been appalled at the racism directed to Indians there. I do NOT spend time in red light districts. In fact I was staying in a predominantly Indian owned area near sukhumvit soi 20.

I know of the important Indian presence in that area because I used to sing classical Indian music at sunrise on my balcony and I would see unknown people switching on their lights and opening their windows to listen to me. A discreet and welcoming thread of belonging.

The few Indian people I met in Bangkok were incredibly racist (I should say I never ever felt that racism in India and I understand at least 6 local languages extremely well). To me at least. Maybe to Thai people too. Most probably because they felt under siege.

Out of touch with India, unhappy where they were.

As time went by, I realized that that Thais are really afraid of Indians. Indians have in the Thai's mind a hold on all secret knowledge. Buddhism is for the masses and the kings are Hindu with Hindu brahmins to help them keep their place.

They are just as afraid of Khmers for that same reason.

Magic. The Indians know more. No secular wealth, no amount of money is protection against this.

Thais hate Indians (and Khmer, and Lao etc) because they fear them.

No amount of US influence can help them with this. They are now starting to see the wane of Western rule, and the rise of something (including India) they thought they had escaped.

Good luck and enjoy the surge of the waves, Canadian-born! History is happening and you are a part of it.

[anthobkk]

Feel sorry for you this is really outrageous ! But I think every country are the same.

When I was back in France, I went to the swimming pool with a friend who have his family from Algeria. They asked for a "random search" on him and didn't allow us to use the same locker room as the other customers inside......We just said <deleted> off and left this place !

[HardenedSoul]

Respect to the OP for standing his ground on these issues and for batting back a few of the baiting remarks made by the usual douches who can't resist the urge to slip in a sly dig.

As I've said many times on this forum, as a black guy who's lived here for nigh on 6 years, in general I've not found Thais to give me worse service than they've given to whites or others but I accept that the OP's experiences have simply been different.

I do see Indians receiving pretty shitty treatment but then again, I've seen them dish it out to the Thais to the point where I've had to speak up and tell them to stop being so freakin' ignorant and he's probably being lumped in with them.

[thecynic]

Oh get over it. I am an Indian and have been living and working in Bangkok for about a year now. Yes, some Thai people are racist and I have faced my share of it. For instance, being ignored while they serve the "white guy" first, or being shown the prices in the menu first. But it's nothing that I have not faced anywhere else in the world. I have seen "white foreigners" being treated better than Indians in India too btw.

But there are more than plenty Thais out there who are not racist and are actually lovely people.

Also, I don't mind the waitresses or cashiers or other people in the service industry behaving in such a manner, as all they are doing is trying to earn that little extra in way of tips. And if they sincerely feel, which I think they do, that a fair-skinned person is likely to leave them a larger tip, then so be it. I am not going to get upset by someone who is ignorant.

And given the way some of my countrymen behave, I really can’t blame them either. I have seen some appalling behaviour by Indians in many countries, and on many a flights. True, they are generalising, but then so many people in the world do.

[RecklessRon]

Since racism is the topic... just to clarify: You say "I'm Canadian of Indian nationality". I assume that's 'tech support' Indian not 'tomahawk and teepee' native Canadian, eh !

[benalibina]

Really sorry to read your experiences in this country. Honestly, Thais are racist.

A good example that happened already back in 2005 at a well- known primary school in Sisaket. An Indian guy with a Turban walked in the at his time almost new EP classroom, where an older Thai woman was trying to teach the kids.

When the Indian guy wanted to ask her a question, she'd sent him out immediately. Same guy's one of the wealthiest guys in Sisaket now and well respected by all.

Unfortunately, some people seem to hibernate all their lives and never wake up. Ignorance and stupidity is always a bad mixture. -

No money/poor, at least in eye of beholder......racism exposed openly

Money/wealthy, at least in eye of beholder.....respected openly.

Ok.