Taxes for Americans

[rossabout]

Next year I move to Thailand. Question for American Expats. How and where do you file taxes?

Do you still have state taxes? Lastly, can you still vote?

I will not have an income above 16,000 a year, far below the poverty level in america. Can I still take my Thai wife as a tax deduction even if she has given up her permanent resident card. She still holds a SSN. Same for our Thai daughter( permanent resident with SSN under 18), Can I still deduct here as well?

Anyone with experience with this would be most helpful.

For any of you that live in Rayong; Where is the local immigration office. What is the process like in this office for the 90 day meet and greets. What do you show up with every 90 days and how long does the entire process take? Do any of you go together every 90 days?

I have less than 9 months before moving and want to be as prepared as possible.

[Jingthing]

You can divorce yourself for your current state by filing a PARTIAL state tax form for the last year of residence.

Then you'll have a case for stopping state filings.

Yes you can vote. Register based on your last voting residence in the USA which will be your voting residence for life unless you repatriate.

You can file online using taxact.com ... and it supports using a foreign address.

If you want to mail in your forms, there is a special address for expat filings.

Deduction stuff, I punt.

[ZigZagMan]

TurboTax Online works for me.

Simple & cheap.

Doing the 90 day report:

<removed link to commercial website giving outdated and incorrect info>

Look here for correct info: http://immigration.go.th/nov2004/en/base.php?page=90days

Edited April 26, 2014 by ubonjoe

[Thanyaburi Mac]

I just snail mailed my 1040 to the IRS address for refunds in Austin, TX yesterday. If you owe $$, as I did last year, send to Charlotte, NC. All explained in the downloadable 1040 instructions.

My Thai wife is a deduction, got her a SS Card long ago, but a ITIN also works.

Don't pay state taxes as am an expat.

Mac

[GinBoy2]

Turbotax works fine, electronic filing makes it simple. When I did my final California State return, they wouldn't allow an electronic filing since I had an overseas address, but just printed it all out from Turbotax and mailed it to Sacramento with no issues. Thai Post EMS allows express mail with tracking and receipt confirmation, Once you file that return with an overseas address and I assume a partial year, you are done with State taxes. Voting, yes you can just use your last US address for registering. No clue on the spousal deduction stuff since I file as Single.

Edited April 26, 2014 by GinBoy2

[ubonjoe]

Before you have to worry about 90 day reports you will need to have an extension of stay or a OA long stay visa. Doing them is no big deal. You just fill out a TM47 form and present your passport at immigration (at most immigration offices some want copies of other things). My wife and I sometimes go together for the reports but for most of them she goes alone to make them for me.

You will use the immigration office in Mataphut if are living in Rayong.

Voting info here on embassy website: http://bangkok.usembassy.gov/services/visa/acs/voting.html

For taxes I suggest you download this "Tax Guide for U.S. Citizens and Resident Aliens Abroad" http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p54.pdf

Every state has it's own rules if you are living abroad. Most exempt you but some greedy ones don't.

[NancyL]

rossabout -- what state are you from?

[mahjongguy]

Every state that has an income tax will continue to tax income from activity based in that state. The most common source would be rental income from a property.

A few states, which at least at one time included California, require an ex-pat to continue filing if he/she receives a state or municipal pension.

[TerryLH]

"Every state has it's own rules if you are living abroad. Most exempt you but some greedy ones don't."

I'm under the impression that expats are not required to file in any states. Do you have a list of the 'greedy' ones?

"A few states, which at least at one time included California, require an ex-pat to continue filing if he/she receives a state or municipal pension."

Completely untrue about California, unless your 'at one time' is sometime before 1994.

I believe it's the same for all states now.

[rucus7]

Every state that has an income tax will continue to tax income from activity based in that state. The most common source would be rental income from a property.

A few states, which at least at one time included California, require an ex-pat to continue filing if he/she receives a state or municipal pension.

I am not required to file in CA. I am a CALPERS retiree. That law changed in the 1990's. If I were move to lets say Idaho, I would have to file an Idaho state return.

[ubonjoe]

"Every state has it's own rules if you are living abroad. Most exempt you but some greedy ones don't."

I'm under the impression that expats are not required to file in any states. Do you have a list of the 'greedy' ones?

"A few states, which at least at one time included California, require an ex-pat to continue filing if he/she receives a state or municipal pension."

Completely untrue about California, unless your 'at one time' is sometime before 1994.

I believe it's the same for all states now.

I didn't find a list but I found many articles that mention state taxes being collected and as a concern for expats.

Here is one; http://blogs.angloinfo.com/us-tax/2012/08/20/avoiding-us-state-income-taxes-when-residing-overseas/

Also page 62 of this KPMG PDF. http://www.kpmg.com/US/en/IssuesAndInsights/ArticlesPublications/Documents/us-tax-americans-abroad.pdf

[CaptHaddock]

The OP needs to research the tax domicile rules for the state he is leaving. As with most questions of law what matters is what the law states, not anyone's common sense. The most aggressive states are CA and VA. VA goes so far as to claim that you continue to owe taxes to the commonwealth until such time as you establish residence in another state. Other states, like CA, count factors such as whether you have property, bank accounts, professional service providers (lawyer, accountant, etc.) or friends in the state. You have the right to vote in the state after you leave, but some states construe the act of voting as evidence of establishing tax domicile.

You need to research the rules for your state and follow them to the letter.

To the OP, if your wife had permanent residence in the US and lived there as your wife there for at least five years with a green card, then she will be able collect Social Security benefits on your earnings, if your earnings qualify you when she has reached the appropriate age.

[purushanti]

BKK US Embassy and CM US \consulate both have referrals for tax accountants. Forms can be e-filed from here to the IRS.

[phuketrichard]

as an expat u also need file form 2555 along with your 1040.

I hold residency in Ca an have not filed state returns in over 17 years there. ( have never voted)

since u need file this to get your $96,000 tax exemption you need paperfile ( snail mail), its all on the form where to send.

been doing it for years as i than can than file the FAFSA, so my daughter in unviersity in Ca, gets her grants.

To collect ss u need have worked 40 quarters ( 10 years ) in your life time. ( you will deal with ss office in the Phillippines.)

Make sure u keep less than $10,000 TOTAL in all your foreign bank accounts so you never have to FBAR

so its better to do the combo method for your retirement extension if you have any kind of Pension./ss payments

Edited April 26, 2014 by phuketrichard

[Pib]

Just use tax software like TaxCut, TurboTax, etc., to file your federal and state taxes. Whether you are still on the hook for state tax depends on your state of residence. You can still vote by requesting an absentee ballot.

http://americansabroad.org/issues/taxation/us-taxes-while-living-abroad-faq/

US Taxes While Living Abroad FAQ

Do I need to file a US tax return? What forms do I use? Can I deduct foreign taxes?... The following FAQ about filing your US taxes even though you live outside the USA was adapted from a contribution by I.J. Zemelman.

I am an American living and working abroad. Do I need to file a US tax return?

Regardless of where you live now, being a United States citizen requires that you file a yearly tax return with the IRS. Green card holders and all US citizens are required to file a US return, no matter where they live, as long as their income (earned in-US and abroad) is just over $9,000. Many people wrongly assume that because they have never owed money to the IRS, they simply dont have to file. Earning anything over $9,350.00 does require you to file, however. The US has treaties with many foreign countries that will reduce or even eliminate actual owed tax. You cannot, however, take advantage of these benefits if you don't file.

Do I need to file a State Tax Return?

As is the case with many legal matters, each US state sets its own rules regarding state taxes and expats. Some states do demand that you file a state return, while others release you when you move away. The rules can be complicated, so be sure to ask your tax preparer before making assumptions as to the requirements of your former home. The most stubborn states are New Mexico, California, Virginia and South Carolina. If you moved abroad from one of those states, it is unlikely that you have been released from the obligation of filing. To read more about this issue see: [/size]State Taxes and the American Expats - Can You Ever Set Yourself Free?

[ubonjoe]

Since the OP is married to a Thai he will have enough income to get an extension of stay based upon marriage so he will not need any money in the bank,

[GinBoy2]

Just use tax software like TaxCut, TurboTax, etc., to file your federal and state taxes. Whether you are still on the hook for state tax depends on your state of residence. You can still vote by requesting an absentee ballot.

http://americansabroad.org/issues/taxation/us-taxes-while-living-abroad-faq/

US Taxes While Living Abroad FAQ

Do I need to file a US tax return? What forms do I use? Can I deduct foreign taxes?... The following FAQ about filing your US taxes even though you live outside the USA was adapted from a contribution by I.J. Zemelman.

I am an American living and working abroad. Do I need to file a US tax return?

Regardless of where you live now, being a United States citizen requires that you file a yearly tax return with the IRS. Green card holders and all US citizens are required to file a US return, no matter where they live, as long as their income (earned in-US and abroad) is just over $9,000. Many people wrongly assume that because they have never owed money to the IRS, they simply dont have to file. Earning anything over $9,350.00 does require you to file, however. The US has treaties with many foreign countries that will reduce or even eliminate actual owed tax. You cannot, however, take advantage of these benefits if you don't file.

Do I need to file a State Tax Return?

As is the case with many legal matters, each US state sets its own rules regarding state taxes and expats. Some states do demand that you file a state return, while others release you when you move away. The rules can be complicated, so be sure to ask your tax preparer before making assumptions as to the requirements of your former home. The most stubborn states are New Mexico, California, Virginia and South Carolina. If you moved abroad from one of those states, it is unlikely that you have been released from the obligation of filing. To read more about this issue see: [/size]State Taxes and the American Expats - Can You Ever Set Yourself Free?

The State section is a little misleading I think, at least for California, I can't comment on the rest. Yes, if you lived in California for any portion of the reporting year before you moved overseas you absolutely are required to file a CA return. After that, no requirement

[rickirs]

Based on your information you can file federal income tax return free online directly with the IRS through its Freefile program:

http://www.irs.gov/uac/Free-File:-Do-Your-Federal-Taxes-for-Free

[Hunter88]

And, you have two extra weeks to file if you live outside the U.S.

[Jingthing]

And, you have two extra weeks to file if you live outside the U.S.

Much more than two WEEKS!

http://www.forbes.com/sites/robertwood/2013/06/12/expat-irs-tax-filing-deadline-is-june-17/

Two MONTHS!

You can also choose to file an extension (I think by April 15) and get the normal long extension to OCTOBER 15.

Expat IRS Tax Filing Deadline Is June 17

You may be used to thinking of April 15 as tax return filing day. For many, it is. But there’s an automatic two month extension for some. It applies to U.S. citizens and resident aliens living overseas, or serving in the military outside the U.S. on the regular due date of their tax return.

Edited April 26, 2014 by Jingthing

[mahjongguy]

As with any extension for filing, automatic or requested, interest is charged beginning from April 15th.

[moe666]

Yes you can deduct your wife and daughter on income tax as they have a SS number. I have been deducting my girlfriend for years using a ITN number. The ITN is used by people who have dependants living outside the US and they do not have a SS number and cannot obtain a SS number. When I applied for mine some years back at the IRS office the very helpful staff knew what I wanted and what forms to file.

[CaptHaddock]

Just use tax software like TaxCut, TurboTax, etc., to file your federal and state taxes. Whether you are still on the hook for state tax depends on your state of residence. You can still vote by requesting an absentee ballot.

http://americansabroad.org/issues/taxation/us-taxes-while-living-abroad-faq/

US Taxes While Living Abroad FAQ

Do I need to file a US tax return? What forms do I use? Can I deduct foreign taxes?... The following FAQ about filing your US taxes even though you live outside the USA was adapted from a contribution by I.J. Zemelman.

I am an American living and working abroad. Do I need to file a US tax return?

Regardless of where you live now, being a United States citizen requires that you file a yearly tax return with the IRS. Green card holders and all US citizens are required to file a US return, no matter where they live, as long as their income (earned in-US and abroad) is just over $9,000. Many people wrongly assume that because they have never owed money to the IRS, they simply dont have to file. Earning anything over $9,350.00 does require you to file, however. The US has treaties with many foreign countries that will reduce or even eliminate actual owed tax. You cannot, however, take advantage of these benefits if you don't file.

Do I need to file a State Tax Return?

As is the case with many legal matters, each US state sets its own rules regarding state taxes and expats. Some states do demand that you file a state return, while others release you when you move away. The rules can be complicated, so be sure to ask your tax preparer before making assumptions as to the requirements of your former home. The most stubborn states are New Mexico, California, Virginia and South Carolina. If you moved abroad from one of those states, it is unlikely that you have been released from the obligation of filing. To read more about this issue see: [/size]State Taxes and the American Expats - Can You Ever Set Yourself Free?

The State section is a little misleading I think, at least for California, I can't comment on the rest. Yes, if you lived in California for any portion of the reporting year before you moved overseas you absolutely are required to file a CA return. After that, no requirement

You fail completely to grasp the complexity of tax domicile, which as I mentioned, does not depend on your common sense understanding of residency. Here is a quote from the document, "FTB Publication 1031, Guidelines for

Determining Resident Status — 2012" produced by the State of California Franchise Tax Board:

G Guidelines for Determining

Residency

The underlying theory of residency is that you are

a resident of the place where you have the closest

connections.

The following list shows some of the factors you can

use to help determine your residency status. Since your

residence is usually the place where you have the closest

ties, you should compare your ties to ­ alifornia with your

C

ties elsewhere. In using these factors, it is the strength

of your ties, not just the number of ties, that determines

your residency. This is only a partial list of the factors to

consider. No one factor is determinative. Consider all

the facts of your particular situation to determine your

residency status.

Factors to consider are as follows:

• Amount of time you spend in ­ alifornia versus amount

C

of time you spend outside ­ alifornia.

C

• Location of your spouse/RDP and children.

• Location of your principal residence.

• State that issued your driver’s license.

• State where your vehicles are registered.

• State in which you maintain your professional licenses.

• State in which you are registered to vote.

• Location of the banks where you maintain accounts.

• The origination point of your financial transactions.

[TravelerEastWest]

Just use tax software like TaxCut, TurboTax, etc., to file your federal and state taxes. Whether you are still on the hook for state tax depends on your state of residence. You can still vote by requesting an absentee ballot.

http://americansabroad.org/issues/taxation/us-taxes-while-living-abroad-faq/

US Taxes While Living Abroad FAQ

Do I need to file a US tax return? What forms do I use? Can I deduct foreign taxes?... The following FAQ about filing your US taxes even though you live outside the USA was adapted from a contribution by I.J. Zemelman.

I am an American living and working abroad. Do I need to file a US tax return?

Regardless of where you live now, being a United States citizen requires that you file a yearly tax return with the IRS. Green card holders and all US citizens are required to file a US return, no matter where they live, as long as their income (earned in-US and abroad) is just over $9,000. Many people wrongly assume that because they have never owed money to the IRS, they simply dont have to file. Earning anything over $9,350.00 does require you to file, however. The US has treaties with many foreign countries that will reduce or even eliminate actual owed tax. You cannot, however, take advantage of these benefits if you don't file.

Do I need to file a State Tax Return?

As is the case with many legal matters, each US state sets its own rules regarding state taxes and expats. Some states do demand that you file a state return, while others release you when you move away. The rules can be complicated, so be sure to ask your tax preparer before making assumptions as to the requirements of your former home. The most stubborn states are New Mexico, California, Virginia and South Carolina. If you moved abroad from one of those states, it is unlikely that you have been released from the obligation of filing. To read more about this issue see: [/size]State Taxes and the American Expats - Can You Ever Set Yourself Free?

The State section is a little misleading I think, at least for California, I can't comment on the rest. Yes, if you lived in California for any portion of the reporting year before you moved overseas you absolutely are required to file a CA return. After that, no requirement

You fail completely to grasp the complexity of tax domicile, which as I mentioned, does not depend on your common sense understanding of residency. Here is a quote from the document, "FTB Publication 1031, Guidelines for

Determining Resident Status — 2012" produced by the State of California Franchise Tax Board:

G Guidelines for Determining

Residency

The underlying theory of residency is that you are

a resident of the place where you have the closest

connections.

The following list shows some of the factors you can

use to help determine your residency status. Since your

residence is usually the place where you have the closest

ties, you should compare your ties to ­ alifornia with your

C

ties elsewhere. In using these factors, it is the strength

of your ties, not just the number of ties, that determines

your residency. This is only a partial list of the factors to

consider. No one factor is determinative. Consider all

the facts of your particular situation to determine your

residency status.

Factors to consider are as follows:

• Amount of time you spend in ­ alifornia versus amount

C

of time you spend outside ­ alifornia.

C

• Location of your spouse/RDP and children.

• Location of your principal residence.

• State that issued your driver’s license.

• State where your vehicles are registered.

• State in which you maintain your professional licenses.

• State in which you are registered to vote.

• Location of the banks where you maintain accounts.

• The origination point of your financial transactions.

Capt Haddock,

You are maybe the only one in this thread giving good advice about State tax requirements, I salute you. Although a few others gave partial answers.

Virginia sounds interesting as I have never lived there and did not know about their tax rules. They may have beaten California in the contest for the toughest state tax rules.

I have also heard of states where you can be registered to vote for Federal elections but not state ones and then be OK for not filing State taxes (or at least not have it held against you).

As the Captain correctly says State taxation can be complicated.

[slipperylobster]

Yes..the best thing about online tax preparation is that...with the one I use...your data for this year is available for next year...and you can print it out where ever you are. I use the previous year as a template, and just update a few blocks of information. I did mine too early...but they sent it off the first day IRS was accepting taxes. Took only 3 weeks or so to get a refund in my bank. Great, handy stuff...and not expensive.

Edited April 26, 2014 by slipperylobster

[Thaiready]

If you own property as I do in Georgia you still have to file State Tax

[slipperylobster]

Capt Haddock,

You fail completely to grasp the complexity of tax domicile, which as I mentioned, does not depend on your common sense understanding of residency. Here is a quote from the document, "FTB Publication 1031, Guidelines for

Determining Resident Status — 2012" produced by the State of California Franchise Tax Board:

G Guidelines for Determining

Residency

The underlying theory of residency is that you are

a resident of the place where you have the closest

connections.

The following list shows some of the factors you can

use to help determine your residency status. Since your

residence is usually the place where you have the closest

ties, you should compare your ties to ­ alifornia with your

C

ties elsewhere. In using these factors, it is the strength

of your ties, not just the number of ties, that determines

your residency. This is only a partial list of the factors to

consider. No one factor is determinative. Consider all

the facts of your particular situation to determine your

residency status.

Factors to consider are as follows:

• Amount of time you spend in ­ alifornia versus amount

C

of time you spend outside ­ alifornia.

C

• Location of your spouse/RDP and children.

• Location of your principal residence.

• State that issued your driver’s license.

• State where your vehicles are registered.

• State in which you maintain your professional licenses.

• State in which you are registered to vote.

• Location of the banks where you maintain accounts.

• The origination point of your financial transactions.

You are maybe the only one in this thread giving good advice about State tax requirements, I salute you. Although a few others gave partial answers.

Virginia sounds interesting as I have never lived there and did not know about their tax rules. They may have beaten California in the contest for the toughest state tax rules.

I have also heard of states where you can be registered to vote for Federal elections but not state ones and then be OK for not filing State taxes (or at least not have it held against you).

As the Captain correctly says State taxation can be complicated.

..........................................................................................................................................................................

From Slipper...

Add into that a military man who enlisted in New York, purchased a home in Hawaii, sold that and purchaseda home in California, after being transferred there, then gets moved to Japan but buys a house in Nevada, votes there, banks there, but cannot physically live there.... Then California claims taxes of 15000 dollars. I beat the state taxes by sending a letter off explaining that I was stationed in California by order of the Federal Government, and was required to roll money over after a home sale. The property was never lived in....but had to rent it (catch 22 when overseas). I told california I hated being there, and would never call it my home. I chose Nevada as my State of Residence (No taxes) and never changed. 18 years overseas. Never lived in New York since enlisting. California wrote back that I owed zero state taxes. I won... with a letter.

Edited April 26, 2014 by slipperylobster

[ggt]

Use to pay accountant for tax services...very expensive...filed for an extension...even though he had all info for months in advance...now using Turbo Tax...filing is quick and easy...at a fraction of the cost...this method of tax filing empowers you to take control of your filing...priceless...

[wwest5829]

Can only speak from my experience. I sold all property in the U.S. and retired from Kentucky to Thailand in 2011. Thus Thailand is my sole residence (federal regulation speaks of how many days you must live in a place to be declared your residence). I am not subject to any state income taxes because I am not a resident. Federal voting allows voting from your last U.S. address, thus I just received my absentee primary ballot and will vote again in November. My Federal income tax form has been sent snail mail last year and now this year as the online filing did not seem to work for me but I utilized the irs website for all pertain ant forms and instruction. I renewed my Driver's License and Concealed Carry License before departing and can renew them when they expire (the latter only valid in the U.S. After moving here, you need to obtain a Thai Driver's License if you want to continue to drive here. By the way, if you come with an International Driver's License (obtainable through AAA), it will ease getting the Thai License. I use a friend's address if I need to register a U.S. mail address. Most things are now dealt with exclusively online.

I defer to those having families to answer your other questions about dependents.

[Gonsalviz]

I cannot say about state taxes (each have their own) but there is a minimum amount that if you are below, you do not have to file federal taxes at all. I am almost sure it it in the low 20's. I am sure your income of $16k falls into this category.