Immigration clarifies and confirms overstay crackdown

[moe666]

Serial over stays are what probably one percent, as said before everyone happy when cracking down on the Thais but when the deadbeat farangs get hit all kinds of excuses. There is no real good reason to over stay except the one were a few think the rules are not for them.. Good on the junta for the crack down they are just tired of people breaking the law.

[WhamBam]

Being one who has always had a visa and only ever overstayed by one day (several years ago after getting my return flight date wrong), I do not see a problem with tightening the rules.

[cookee68]

Being one who has always had a visa and only ever overstayed by one day (several years ago after getting my return flight date wrong), I do not see a problem with tightening the rules.

and what if that happened again to somebody else like yourself but got stopped on the way to the airport, goodbye girlfriend or wife for 5 years, it can happen, it happened to you, and it possibly will happen again

[diehard60]

Think of all the money that will be lost. This doesn't seem like a good idea. Taking money out of an economy rarely makes it grow. Strange.

The idea is to stop the illegals from staying here. If I am not mistaken it is the same in most countries. So if you are going to stay here it is simple - just follow the rules and don't make up your own.

[ukrules]

Being one who has always had a visa and only ever overstayed by one day (several years ago after getting my return flight date wrong), I do not see a problem with tightening the rules.

and what if that happened again to somebody else like yourself but got stopped on the way to the airport, goodbye girlfriend or wife for 5 years, it can happen, it happened to you, and it possibly will happen again

Immigration confirmed that the bans will only apply to people who overstay by 90 days or more (confirmed in the first post of this thread) so that won't happen will it.

Edited July 8, 2014 by ukrules

[maxman71]

What is the big deal about farangs being unable to abide by the law for not overstaying??? In absence of a serious situation like an illness or accident, there is NO excuse. If you don't like the laws in Thailand go somewhere else...PLEASE!

[cookee68]

Being one who has always had a visa and only ever overstayed by one day (several years ago after getting my return flight date wrong), I do not see a problem with tightening the rules.

and what if that happened again to somebody else like yourself but got stopped on the way to the airport, goodbye girlfriend or wife for 5 years, it can happen, it happened to you, and it possibly will happen again

Immigration confirmed that the bans will only apply to people who overstay by 90 days or more (confirmed in the first post of this thread) so that won't happen will it.

it also states if you live in a country to respect its rules, and the rules include from 1 day up overstay, but in Thailand one never knows what the rules are because they change every day

[jacko45k]

Well this change may cause a few last long-term over stayers to rush to become legal... but after that they are just going to go underground and stay that way.

[smedly]

I have heard that the age for getting an extension based on retirement may also be going up from 50 to 65, I'm posting this here to see if anyone else has heard this

[Jingthing]

I have heard that the age for getting an extension based on retirement may also be going up from 50 to 65, I'm posting this here to see if anyone else has heard this

No. Which bar was it?

[ubonjoe]

Several off topic, abusive, Thai bashing, etc, etc posts and replies to them have been removed.

[cassde]

I got a new extension at CW yesterday and wasn't asked to sign a form acknowledging the new rules on overstaying.

Sent from my K012 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[sometimewoodworker]

Let us hope that there is some discretion permitted to immigration officials.

As the current UK passport renewal problems have caused a few to overstay because their passport has been canceled for travel and the new one has taken over 2 months to arrive.

So under the law as proposed if there is no discretion permitted and if they have the bad luck to be caught then they could be banned for 5 years thanks to HMG & HMPO. in most of those cases it was not bad planning on their part but lies by HMG & HMPO about the renewal time that cause the overstay.

[gemguy]

Keep in mind folks that the Farang population is only a smaller percent of the over stay violations.

When they say foreigners us Farang tend to think they mean us...but in reality most of the overstay abuse is related to all the Burmese and Cambodians and many other Asian region nationalities.

Of course there are farang violating the laws also...but what are the percentages.

Maybe there are more than we understand but I do not think it is out of control and run amuck.

But yes they do want people to clean up their act and try to be here legally.

But like I said before......people overstaying results in nothing negative occurring of any significant consequence while the immigration officials have always made money off of the infraction of the law.

If anyone on this forum can point out any serious or note worthy negative ramifications caused by people overstaying, please speak up and point out them out.

[al007]

Well done to the current government, it is not before time.

UK USA or Europe to name but a few have no leniency for those who over stay.

Most of the moaning and complaining come from those who in reality can not afford to be here and add very little to the economy.

The rules for those with even modest means are very fair and simple.

Those generally on overstay are the undesirables,and on the run, let them go back to their own countries.

I have been here for six plus years all legally with few complaints

Very welcome news

[paz]

Keep in mind folks that the Farang population is only a smaller percent of the over stay violations.

When they say foreigners us Farang tend to think they mean us...but in reality most of the overstay abuse is related to all the Burmese and Cambodians and many other Asian region nationalities.

Of course there are farang violating the laws also...but what are the percentages.

Maybe there are more than we understand but I do not think it is out of control and run amuck.

But yes they do want people to clean up their act and try to be here legally.

Correct. But to the eyes of many, these people, the illegal Asians, are invisible, they are the untouchables. They are the ones that build your condo, clean your managed apartment, sort your garbage, sew your garments and do any kind of menial work that Thais will not do. They are the ones which keep the cost of labor so low, that the economy can thrive, and allow the cost of living in Thailand to be so affordable. Westerners don't care much for them, but maintain a sense of self-importance for which the next white guy still trying to survive on a expired visa becomes the biggest evil and shame. Although many, given the occasion, will be ready to affirm the sacred principle that legality in immigration is fundamental to anything. I would understand if that complain was coming from an unemployed Thai, but not when it comes from Westerners that are, in comparison to Asian illegals and refugees, nothing less than billionaires.

But like I said before......people overstaying results in nothing negative occurring of any significant consequence while the immigration officials have always made money off of the infraction of the law.

If anyone on this forum can point out any serious or note worthy negative ramifications caused by people overstaying, please speak up and point out them out.

Here you're calling for all the self-righteous sermon throwers to regurgitate again their trite, hate-filled reasoning. Just go back few pages or read almost any TV thread to get an idea. It is just not a possible to have a normal discussion on the matter. Edited July 9, 2014 by paz

[thaifamilyguy]

So many questions, please KEEP ON THEM FOR DETAIL.

I have a now 2+ year old that has no visa as never needed, overstays everytime while the older 2 children & parents have resident visas renewed each year. So will be interesting to see how thoughful immigration is on in/out for the 2 year old. No way to get her a visa as all of ours are based on the kids in school here.

I work outside thailand but thankfully even though out of country by plane every month, I went and got the full O visa, the limits on non-visa entries would have caused a huge crisis!

wjs

[pizzachang]

Can only see gloom and doom for the economy I would think that overstays. Must be in the 1,000s if not millions and who will foot the bill to deport all these people I would assume that if they cannot afford a visa then they would not have the money to leave the kingdom I would assume the biggest offenders would be those from neighbouring countries Burma,Cambodia,Malaysia all these people would be doing the jobs Thais won't touch

It would seem logical that the vast majority of overstay offenders come from neighboring countries. I'd like to see the Immigration Ministry produce some statistics showing the percentages of offenders broken down by country. I accidentally had an overstay when I first started living in Thailand and was pretty upset that I had made that kind of mistake on the dates. Never happened again.

[pizzachang]

Well done to the current government, it is not before time.

UK USA or Europe to name but a few have no leniency for those who over stay.

Most of the moaning and complaining come from those who in reality can not afford to be here and add very little to the economy.

The rules for those with even modest means are very fair and simple.

Those generally on overstay are the undesirables,and on the run, let them go back to their own countries.

I have been here for six plus years all legally with few complaints

Very welcome news

You should probably look more carefully at the situation at the US/Mexico border. Legal entry and overstay can be dealt with but that requires secure borders in the first place.

[jimdob1]

Come on folks, let's get real!

​At last count, there are 13 different types of visas available in Thailand which allow you to legally stay in the Kingdom for at least one year at a time. (retirement, marriage, employment, business and etc.)

​The normal progression is to switch from the Visa Upon Arrival > to the Non-Immigrant O Visa > the new One Year Visa.

For most of us on a Retirement Visa the cost is 1,900 Baht for the Non Immigrant O and 1,900 Baht for the Retirement Visa. Once you have the Retirement Visa, you do not need to renew the Non Immigrant O- so the cost is 1,900 Baht per year to renew the Retirement Visa.

I am all sure we know many people who are abusing the system by using nefarious means and "visa agencies" that can charge up to 21,000 Baht for getting a "legal visa".

How do you explain a man in his 20's or 30's, living in Thailand for a number of years, with no visible means of support, no job in their home countries, no education and no skills?

The ones I have met came here on a holiday, got bitten by the Thailand bug and decided there is no future in their home country, so they decide to stay in Thailand - whatever the cost. Their means of support usually involves pleading with relatives to wire them some money, ripping off tourists, dealing drugs or whatever in order to stay here.

THE POINT IS THIS; MOST OF US HAVE EARNED THE RIGHT TO BE IN THAILAND BECAUSE WE HAVE WORKED SOME 50 YEARS AND HAVE A PENSION AND SAVINGS!

For the most part, those individuals that are illegally staying here are not man enough to get a job or 2 jobs if necessary, live frugally, stay out of the bars, advance their education, save their money and finally come to Thailand with a pension and savings - as we have done ourselves.

THE BEST THING FOR THEM IS TO GET BOOTED OUT OF THAILAND AND GO HOME AND START ACTING LIKE A RESPONSIBLE HUMAN BEING!!

[finnomick]

Thank you, it's very blurred on my screen, had to use the magnifying glass.

You welcome. With most browsers, type "Ctrl +" to enlarge any screen,

Thank you Paz, I have learned something new today.

[John1thru10]

It's good to see Thailand trying to get rid of more of its trash.

I'll just never understand why you old guys think your personal, judgemental opinions of people you've never met, are so important to post all the time that way. This is an information forum: not your personal opinion blog.

I'm sorry, but I come here for actual information, not your hateful judgements You are no authority figure, in life, or on a forum somewhere.

Edited July 9, 2014 by John1thru10

[catweazle]

The thing is, one can whine about this as long as he wants, but at the end of the day, we are all just guests and have to live with and respect whatever the Thai government throws at us. I am here now legally for 23 years with proper visas and work permit, etc. and managed to not have one single day of overstay, never a problem with immigration, police or labour department. It is doable folks! Thus stop complaining about the illegal doors being shut and locked now!

I pay a lot of money in taxes, social security, insurance, employees and all, and I always despised the freeloaders and illegal dive and tour guides for having it their cheap and illegal ways with monthly border runs, etc. not paying any tax, not having to apply for and renew work permits, etc... So now the good times for Cheap Charlies seem to finally be over. What money is lost? The few hundred Baht they spent at night in their bars or the few hundred Baht they hand over to the Rasta beach bums for a pack of weed? Come on, get real!!!

Only thing the Thai government should do in addition is to come up with rules and regulations that allow business owners, language schools, etc. to legally employ more foreign staff without having to employ hundreds of (non willing to work) Thai employees, ease the process of applying for and renewing work permits, etc. to keep it all in balance. It's a long way to go and unfortunately with Thai people, there always is the self-centered nationalistic attitude that hinders progress...

[MrWorldwide]

does this crackdown pertain to all foreigners or just westerners? (serious question)

If you read the first major newspaper article on the crackdown, you'd know it was aimed at Koreans, Vietnamese and Russians. Given that most here dont seem to include the latter in their selective interpretation of who 'Farang' are, I'd say you're barking up the wrong tree.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/727092-thai-immigration-border-insecurity-mounts-as-tourist-visa-abuse-is-targeted/

Ask yourself how you'd feel if you were a Russian with serious money invested in a new life in Pattaya, got your visa sorted OS and still had to face the crackdown at the border - I'd imagine that it's not pleasant to know you're from one of three countries that are being actively targeted. Someone posted another story on a Russian woman who was bounced recently and her defence amounted to 'I know some Russians are working illegally in Thailand but why punish all of us ?'.

gemguy touched on the fact that Caucasians from Western countries - and that's what most here mean when they use the term 'Farang' - are a much smaller percentage of the alien population in Thailand than we like to think : we are simply more visible. If you've seen any of the docos on North Koreans being smuggled into Thailand via southern China you'll know that they regard their path to Seoul as guaranteed once they get over the Mekong. How many of us would willingly put our lives in the hands of Chinese 'human smugglers' ?

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Korea/HK09Dg01.html

[smedly]

Thank you, it's very blurred on my screen, had to use the magnifying glass.

You welcome. With most browsers, type "Ctrl +" to enlarge any screen,

Thank you Paz, I have learned something new today.

or CNTL and the mouse wheel to zoom any window in or out

There is also a "magnifier" in windows that can be pinned to the task bar

[ukrules]

How do you explain a man in his 20's or 30's, living in Thailand for a number of years, with no visible means of support, no job in their home countries, no education and no skills?

It's called wealth and there's a lot of people well under 50 years of age here who have a huge chunk of money at their disposal.

In my experience the most obnoxious of them tend to have inherited it.

[schondie]

“It is time to stop. If you live in a country, you respect its rules.”

Gen Thatchai also warned that foreigners caught on overstay can expect no right of appeal to be granted.

There's probably some TV members that disagree with this statement but moan about how the illegal immigrants have ruined their country. You certainly can't have both ways, regardless of ethnicity, staying in a country illegally shouldn't be tolerated.

Good on them for doing the right thing, no right of appeal once it's been proved that you've broken the law. In a perfect western world the same would apply instead of dragging out the deportation process for months or years. Think of the costs to the tax payer.

[MrWorldwide]

The thing is, one can whine about this as long as he wants, but at the end of the day, we are all just guests and have to live with and respect whatever the Thai government throws at us. I am here now legally for 23 years with proper visas and work permit, etc. and managed to not have one single day of overstay, never a problem with immigration, police or labour department. It is doable folks! Thus stop complaining about the illegal doors being shut and locked now!

I pay a lot of money in taxes, social security, insurance, employees and all, and I always despised the freeloaders and illegal dive and tour guides for having it their cheap and illegal ways with monthly border runs, etc. not paying any tax, not having to apply for and renew work permits, etc... So now the good times for Cheap Charlies seem to finally be over. What money is lost? The few hundred Baht they spent at night in their bars or the few hundred Baht they hand over to the Rasta beach bums for a pack of weed? Come on, get real!!!

Only thing the Thai government should do in addition is to come up with rules and regulations that allow business owners, language schools, etc. to legally employ more foreign staff without having to employ hundreds of (non willing to work) Thai employees, ease the process of applying for and renewing work permits, etc. to keep it all in balance. It's a long way to go and unfortunately with Thai people, there always is the self-centered nationalistic attitude that hinders progress...

+1

For a large chunk of those 23 years, many of us have made the trek back to DM or Swampy for some downtime in the dreaded Departure Lounge, dreaming of the day we'd be able to get off the plane from our home country knowing we wouldnt have to go back for another stint of 6-12 months at work. All the things people who live here can ignore - Winter and the tax office were my personal favorites - waited for us back in our own countries, but we kept coming back. I didnt have a problem with the '2-week millionaire' and 'weekend warrior' tags but I did have a problem with people gloating about their charmed life in Thailand. This crackdown has made it clear that many of those people weren't as concerned about playing by the rules as I was, even if the prospect of working in Thailand (legally or otherwise) has never appealed to me. I know - world's smallest violin, right ? - this isnt the board to come to for sympathy yet some here clearly believe it's time someone saw it from their POV. No surprises that some of the retirees have played that very same violin when the tears started in earnest about a week ago.

If you've been playing the system in the belief that it's poorly administered or inconsistently applied at various Consulates/borders, I get that, but its clear that there's a new Sheriff in town and he's not afraid to remove people from jobs they previously thought were 'guaranteed for life', If the heads of Immigration and the labor department have been told to clean up their act or join the former Chiefs of Police in early retirement, is it possible that every Immigration Officer and Consulate official might have received a similar directive ? I dont know, but I guess we'll find out on August 12 - I'm prepared to stay on this side of the border until then.

[Krataiboy]

Think of all the money that will be lost. This doesn't seem like a good idea. Taking money out of an economy rarely makes it grow. Strange.

Not strange at all. All sovereign states have visa restrictions and most enforce them strictly. It's hypocritical to praise the generals for tackling corruption and crime (as TV posters have been doing in sycophantic droves) and then complain at being caught in the crackdown.

Thailand can probably manage to scrape by without the paltry contribution of the minority of falangs who flout its visa laws and regulations and who, frankly, deserve to be shown the door.

[Krataiboy]

Think of all the money that will be lost. This doesn't seem like a good idea. Taking money out of an economy rarely makes it grow. Strange.

Not strange at all. All sovereign states have visa restrictions and most enforce them strictly. It's hypocritical to praise the generals for tackling corruption and crime (as TV posters have been doing in sycophantic droves) and then complain at being caught in the crackdown.

Thailand can probably manage to scrape by without the paltry contribution of the minority of falangs who flout its visa laws and regulations and who, frankly, deserve to be shown the door.