Changes To British Passport Services In Thailand

[KillingTime]

So i'm likely to have to wait 7 or 8 weeks for the new passport (his estimate) but my visa runs out in a month and i have to go to Cambodia to get a 90 day extension on my Non-Imm O visa which runs out next month. Can the UK government really be terminating my "old" passport 6 weeks before returning the new one? In which case i won't be able to travel on this document anyway.

3 weeks ago i went to the Trendy building regarding my daughters passport. I made a point of asking about when my old passport would be terminated and she told me it was up to me and that it would remain valid until i decided to change passports. Now this guy says there are "new rules".

Should i go on a visa run asap and just lose a month on my visa? or is there any way of finding out when my current (old) passport is going to become invalid?

Any advice what to do about this? Presumably it's illegal to have no valid passport as an expat and i can't believe the UK government are putting us in this situation due to their failure to clear the backlogs in time.

Thanks

OK Update. I can do a visa run on Sunday but i need to know if my current(old) passport is still active. DHL tracking tells me the photocopied version i've sent back has reached the East Midlands on its way to Liverpool I'm guessing it will get to Liverpool today 48 hours before my planned visa run. Do i just go to the border and hope for the best, or is there a way of finding out first?

[sandyf]

I have two passports.

I use one for travel in and out of Thailand and the other for my overseas work visas.

If I apply to renew my 'Thailand' passport I understand it is cancelled. Would I be able to fly out and into Thailand using my valid second passport and showing Immigration my valid O-A Extension and Multi-Entry permit in my cancelled passport?

I would doubt it very much. It is my understanding that globally people with 2 passports are not allowed to enter on one and exit on the other.

[digitalchromakey]

So i'm likely to have to wait 7 or 8 weeks for the new passport (his estimate) but my visa runs out in a month and i have to go to Cambodia to get a 90 day extension on my Non-Imm O visa which runs out next month. Can the UK government really be terminating my "old" passport 6 weeks before returning the new one? In which case i won't be able to travel on this document anyway.

3 weeks ago i went to the Trendy building regarding my daughters passport. I made a point of asking about when my old passport would be terminated and she told me it was up to me and that it would remain valid until i decided to change passports. Now this guy says there are "new rules".

Should i go on a visa run asap and just lose a month on my visa? or is there any way of finding out when my current (old) passport is going to become invalid?

Any advice what to do about this? Presumably it's illegal to have no valid passport as an expat and i can't believe the UK government are putting us in this situation due to their failure to clear the backlogs in time.

Thanks

OK Update. I can do a visa run on Sunday but i need to know if my current(old) passport is still active. DHL tracking tells me the photocopied version i've sent back has reached the East Midlands on its way to Liverpool I'm guessing it will get to Liverpool today 48 hours before my planned visa run. Do i just go to the border and hope for the best, or is there a way of finding out first?

You applied to renew your passport at Trendy BKK on what date?

If your fee payment has already been deducted from your Credit Card, then it appears that your passport will now be invalid for travel and entered on an international data base that Thai Immigration can access.

The HMPO Website states as regards your passport:

You can’t travel with it after you’ve applied for a new one - but you will be able to keep your existing passport for ID purposes.

We already have one posting on this thread that a UK Passport holder was refused exit to Laos just a few days after applying to renew at Trendy. He had a passport with free pages, which was not marked as being due to expire for another 6 years.

Current turn around from application at Trendy to new passport collection is running at about 8 weeks, worst case reported to date being 16 weeks.

Welcome to the train wreck.

Edited June 27, 2014 by digitalchromakey

[KillingTime]

OK. But my question is still whether there is any way of finding out if the passport is still active without going to the border?

[digitalchromakey]

OK. But my question is still whether there is any way of finding out if the passport is still active without going to the border?

My guess is that they only physically cancel your existing passport once the application is received at HMPO Liverpool, I can't imagine Trendy being empowered to do this.

Again, on what date did you apply?

You could try phoning the HMPO UK Helpline on say Saturday; normally they will just tell you what is on the HMPO Website i.e. your passport is invalid for travel.

However If you ask as to whether your application has been 'received', if the answer is no you might get away with it - who knows - there no way of finding out short of going to the border and trying.

Don't raise your hopes too much though, the official guidance is that your passport is already invalid for travel.

Edited June 27, 2014 by digitalchromakey

[ubonjoe]

You could check to see if they have taken the money for the passport yet. If not you would be good to go.

[soihok]

Digi.

When you get your passport through, I'm sure you will let us all know. Please do as I will have a few beers on your behalf.

No phone back from the passport office in Liverpool as promised. Why am I not surprised.

[KillingTime]

I put my daughter's passport (still not arrived) in on the 14th of May. Cash left my account on the 21st 7 days later. Hopefully my passport will still be working to give me a new 90 days on Sunday. The guy at Trendy thought i'd be ok if i left within a week and it will be 4 days. I'll keep you posted.

[KillingTime]

My passport arrived in Liverpool at 11.15 Uk time today according to DHL.

[soihok]

Wow, one and a half months to get to Liverpool

Edited June 27, 2014 by soihok

[KillingTime]

just over 48 hours actually. What are you drinking?

[soihok]

You said "I put my daughter's passport (still not arrived) in on the 14th of May".

Happy to hear yours arrived.

I am having a Tiger Beer, you want one?

Edited June 27, 2014 by soihok

[KillingTime]

So you're hanging out on a forum where people have genuine gripes with the outrageous inefficiency of the UK government so you can have a laugh making daft pedantic points.

Get lost pal.

Sheesh!

[laolover88]

Got a new passport from Hong Kong in October 2013 valid until 2024. Went missing for a while as DHL can't tell the difference between Nakhon Phanom and Nakhon Pathom. Fortunately some helpful person in Thailand Post knew the Postcodes and scribbled the right Jangwat on the envelope. I have a passport rapidly running out of pages expires in 2016. Have never used the new passport. Went through Swampy and Heathrow last month and back to Swampy a month later on the 'old' passport' without so much as a blip. Officials may be able to access a database..but do they do it? The fun will start when visas and permits to stay need transferring to the 'new' passport. Maybe HMPO have cancelled the new one as I used the old one. Passports Through The Looking Glass said Alice. Anything possible I should not wonder

[digitalchromakey]

My passport arrived in Liverpool at 11.15 Uk time today according to DHL.

Re your situation, have a look at this post:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/713867-changes-to-british-passport-services-in-thailand/?p=8006688

This guy stated that:

My application was put in on 29th May, i tried to leave Thailand to enter Laos on 3rd June, the same day that my passport application arrived at Liverpool passport office

Please note that the poster later confirmed that his passport expiry date was 15/11/2020 and it had enough blank pages.

Looks like you might have a similar problem at the border.

[digitalchromakey]

Got a new passport from Hong Kong in October 2013 valid until 2024. Went missing for a while as DHL can't tell the difference between Nakhon Phanom and Nakhon Pathom. Fortunately some helpful person in Thailand Post knew the Postcodes and scribbled the right Jangwat on the envelope. I have a passport rapidly running out of pages expires in 2016. Have never used the new passport. Went through Swampy and Heathrow last month and back to Swampy a month later on the 'old' passport' without so much as a blip. Officials may be able to access a database..but do they do it? The fun will start when visas and permits to stay need transferring to the 'new' passport. Maybe HMPO have cancelled the new one as I used the old one. Passports Through The Looking Glass said Alice. Anything possible I should not wonder

When you got your passport, it was issued by the FCO, the system has changed twice since then, with passports now issued through the Home Office aka HMPO; the system is doubtlessly significantly different, even if the passports look similar.

HMPO seem now to be able to 'zap' British passports, maybe you have been lucky, or maybe they haven't retrospectively 'zapped' old passports that were issued by the FCO.

Maybe HMPO can't 'zap' UK passports and the guy who got turned back from Laos the day his application arrived in Liverpool after applying to renew 5 days earlier at Trendy was just having a bad (read for Thais = 'unlucky') day, who knows?

Lewis Carroll:

“I can't go back to yesterday because I was a different person then.”

[personchester]

Bugger Me again!

We then have to go back to the Visa Application Centre to collect the new passport.

This is a wonderful change for someone living in northern Thailand !

Correct, the current new passport application procedure for Brits living in northern Thailand is a messy procedure, and many fellows are now hoping that the current setup will be changed so that passport application can be made again via postage.

British chaps living in Bangkok or near Bangkok have no problems to renew their passports, but for those living far away north or south it is indeed a messy passport application setup.

[digitalchromakey]

Bugger Me again!

We then have to go back to the Visa Application Centre to collect the new passport.

This is a wonderful change for someone living in northern Thailand !

Correct, the current new passport application procedure for Brits living in northern Thailand is a messy procedure, and many fellows are now hoping that the current setup will be changed so that passport application can be made again via postage.

British chaps living in Bangkok or near Bangkok have no problems to renew their passports, but for those living far away north or south it is indeed a messy passport application setup.

... and it isn't a messy procedure for people living nearer to BKK in the North, West, East or South of Thailand or even BKK for that matter?

If you care to read the British Passport renewal procedures on the HMPO Website, you would see that it is no longer necessary to attend trendy in person to apply for a new passport.

Please read this link : https://www.gov.uk/overseas-passports/y/thailand/renewing_new/adult

True, no information on the actual procedures/details for a third party application are currently published, but HMPO certainly allows it.

When you apply to trendy they will also tell you that you can nominate a third party to collect your new passport with written authorization this is not on the HMPO Website.

So maybe only one trip to BKK is required now, at worst.

Edited June 27, 2014 by digitalchromakey

[surinderek]

Good news for those without a Thai bank account or credit card. Getting a bankers draft to send to Hong Kong was not a easy option for those not living in BKK, Korat or Ubon in the Isaan region;

[KillingTime]

Yeah i read that post. I've also been told that if the cash hasn't left your account it hasn't' been processed. Maybe his was processed quickly.

But it's ludicrous that we have to go to a border to discover whether our passport works or not. Why can't the passport office give this information? My old lady was told by Liverpool that i was good for a week, as did the guy at the Trendy building. We'll see.

But none of this addresses the elephant in the room:

Why is the British government disabling passports when it's unable to process new ones? Passport renewals are relatively simple affairs but apparently they're far too busy to do it. However they have the time to go through new arrivals and disable them without renewing them. How can this be? Surely if they have time to pull them out of a bag and start playing with them, they have time to turn them around around and send them on? Why are they disabling them for weeks (sometimes months) before they've had the chance to do what they've been paid to do? The system is completely bonkers!

[digitalchromakey]

Good news for those without a Thai bank account or credit card. Getting a bankers draft to send to Hong Kong was not a easy option for those not living in BKK, Korat or Ubon in the Isaan region;

Only if you have a valid Credit Card or UK Debit Card, else you are completely stuffed, as payment is taken in Liverpool as if it were UK Mail Order, not in Bangkok.

Really don't think that this new payment system is any better than it was before with Bankers Drafts and Credit Cards.

They have just swapped UK Debit Cards for International Banker's Drafts - UK Debit Cards are also difficult for many long term residents here.

My UK bank closed my only UK account a couple of years ago because there had been no activity on it for some period and so my only UK Debit Card died with the account.

The account was in credit, so I wasn't concerned to follow it closely, but apparently now UK banks are obliged by law to close any accounts where there is no activity for more than a certain length of time.

HMPO

Fill in a ‘Paying by credit card or debit card’ form for each passport you’re applying for and submit it with your application.

Your credit or debit card will be charged in sterling.

You can use Mastercard, Visa, Electron, Diners Club and JCB.

[digitalchromakey]

Yeah i read that post. I've also been told that if the cash hasn't left your account it hasn't' been processed. Maybe his was processed quickly.

But it's ludicrous that we have to go to a border to discover whether our passport works or not. Why can't the passport office give this information? My old lady was told by Liverpool that i was good for a week, as did the guy at the Trendy building. We'll see.

But none of this addresses the elephant in the room:

Why is the British government disabling passports when it's unable to process new ones? Passport renewals are relatively simple affairs but apparently they're far too busy to do it. However they have the time to go through new arrivals and disable them without renewing them. How can this be? Surely if they have time to pull them out of a bag and start playing with them, they have time to turn them around around and send them on? Why are they disabling them for weeks (sometimes months) before they've had the chance to do what they've been paid to do? The system is completely bonkers!

Please don't be too hard on soihoc, he also has genuine grievances about the British Passport application procedure, he has been emailing and writing to HMPO and everyone else involved in this fiasco non stop about the serious issues raised by the new application process.

Not sure as to the exact procedures at HMPO Liverpool, but payment always coincides with your passport application being flagged on their system as "Awaiting Examination" (More recently their computer system has been changed to call this stage "In Examination").

Payment is normally taken 3-4 working days after your application is made at trendy.

Some time, probably immediately after payment is taken, ones old passport appears to be zapped.

Don't trust what trendy tell you, they are not really in the loop and function purely as a kind of sub-post office for passport applications. Not sure trendy would know anything beyond the HMPO contract instructions on application paperwork processing.

You can't speak direct to Liverpool, but the HMPO UK help line (run by a private Call-Centre agency) has recently had to take on a large number of new staff to deal with the unprecedented number of enquiries. These guys seem to work from scripts and many of them seem to know little more than you or I do about passport application procedures.

As regards your main point, I couldn't agree with you more - the new system is visibly broken and almost everyone can see the bloody great elephant in the room, but that's never stopped the politicians in the past and unfortunately it won't this time.

It appears that we overseas resident British are of little value to the homeland, what's more we (or at least our identities overseas) are mainly perceived purely as a massive potential security risk to the motherland.

My dealings with the new passport system to date lead me to conclude that HMPO/The British Government really don't give a flying f..k about our predicament, they are just doing whatever is necessary to keep, where possible, their new ideas on high security, whilst minimizing the queues for the guys back at home (aka electors/tax payers).

Overseas applications can be safely delayed or deferred with minimal political penalty.

We overseas resident Britons meanwhile have to wait whilst our passport applications sit in orange boxes whilst hoards of Brits are being fast tracked for free, to get their well earned two week in the sun.

We have been thrown to the dogs by these Muppets.

Edited June 27, 2014 by digitalchromakey

[parryhandy]

Yeah i read that post. I've also been told that if the cash hasn't left your account it hasn't' been processed. Maybe his was processed quickly.

But it's ludicrous that we have to go to a border to discover whether our passport works or not. Why can't the passport office give this information? My old lady was told by Liverpool that i was good for a week, as did the guy at the Trendy building. We'll see.

But none of this addresses the elephant in the room:

Why is the British government disabling passports when it's unable to process new ones? Passport renewals are relatively simple affairs but apparently they're far too busy to do it. However they have the time to go through new arrivals and disable them without renewing them. How can this be? Surely if they have time to pull them out of a bag and start playing with them, they have time to turn them around around and send them on? Why are they disabling them for weeks (sometimes months) before they've had the chance to do what they've been paid to do? The system is completely bonkers!

and not just that the same government have the nerve to charge people caught up in the fiasco 95 quid for ETDS.

overseas passports should have a promise to deliver (documents in order) within a certain time frame or any expenses should be reimbursed as part of its charter.I am hoping someone who has really been stung financially by this takes HMPO to court for expenses.

[soihok]

So you're hanging out on a forum where people have genuine gripes with the outrageous inefficiency of the UK government so you can have a laugh making daft pedantic points.

Get lost pal.

Sheesh!

You obviously haven't been reading my many posts on this thread - pal.

I have made several complaints by e mail and letters by registered mail to the UK Government to complain about the new system (its not getting anywhere though).

See post #1335 amongst the numerous others.

As for your last comment - well - no comment.

Sheesh.

[soihok]

No call back from Liverpool, after being promised a reply by phone.

Upon mentioning my daughters disability, the guy on the Passport Helpline seemed genuinely interested to help.

He said it would take up to 72 hours, now we are into the weekend and they won't be working weekends like some of us. I doubt I will get a call from Liverpool now.

I'm going to write another letter.

[bigsteve]

An article from the telegraph about these delays and compensation....

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/insurance/10927750/Will-you-get-compensation-for-passport-delays.html

It's actually more about people applying from within the UK, but is presumably relevant for you guys too...

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Bpuumike]

I have two passports.

I use one for travel in and out of Thailand and the other for my overseas work visas.

If I apply to renew my 'Thailand' passport I understand it is cancelled. Would I be able to fly out and into Thailand using my valid second passport and showing Immigration my valid O-A Extension and Multi-Entry permit in my cancelled passport?

I would doubt it very much. It is my understanding that globally people with 2 passports are not allowed to enter on one and exit on the other.

The idea would be to travel out of Thailand and re-enter presenting both passports to Immigration. One a valid passport but with no Thai visas. The second a passport rendered invalid by my replacement application but containing a valid O-A Extension and my Multi-Entry Permit.

It seems I would have to follow Ubon Joe's suggestion and have my Thai permits transferred to the second passport.

[sandyf]

I have two passports.

I use one for travel in and out of Thailand and the other for my overseas work visas.

If I apply to renew my 'Thailand' passport I understand it is cancelled. Would I be able to fly out and into Thailand using my valid second passport and showing Immigration my valid O-A Extension and Multi-Entry permit in my cancelled passport?

I would doubt it very much. It is my understanding that globally people with 2 passports are not allowed to enter on one and exit on the other.

The idea would be to travel out of Thailand and re-enter presenting both passports to Immigration. One a valid passport but with no Thai visas. The second a passport rendered invalid by my replacement application but containing a valid O-A Extension and my Multi-Entry Permit.

It seems I would have to follow Ubon Joe's suggestion and have my Thai permits transferred to the second passport.

I meant without going to immigration. You will have an entry stamp and TM6 in the passport you wish to renew. As UJ said you need to go to immigration.

[Noodles]

Hi

I have my appointment for the renewal of
my sons passport on Tuesday at Trendy.

This is the information I have ready to take with me;

His old passport

1 app form with sections 1,2,3,4,5, 9 and 10 filled out

x2 passport photos (1 countersigned)

Colour photo copies of every page of old passport (each page signed by me)

Letter from his school (translated into english) Original and copies

Letter from the court about custody (translated into english) originals and copies

Debit card form filled out with my UK debit card details.


I hope I have got everything in order, but please let me know if I have missed
something.

Many thanks

[KillingTime]

Well i went to Cambodia today and got 90 days on my non imm O visa. No problems.

Checked my bank before leaving and HMPO had not taken any cash out 4 days after admission at the Trendy building. The guy at the Trendy did say this would be the case as long as i left soon which is what i did. There's still a month on this visa. Not sure what happened to the guy who went to Laos, but it worked out for me.

Hopefully the new one will arrive by the end of September or it's back to this lunacy.