Myanmar says workers innocent of murdering Britons on Koh Tao

[boomerangutang]

There are 2 pair of shorts at the beach. We remember earlier reports. Supposedly runman changed shorts with David, then he didn't. And then there was the story that the murderer left the shorts at the beach. I am learning almost all of the rtp reports have a ring of truth to it. But with so many police and reports it is like a messed up jigsaw.

I think there 2 pair and 1 pair belong to a person that was there. We know that everybody in other footage has their pants on. We know that the boys clothes were stolen.

So far we have not seen any pictures of someone with these small black shorts. There must be 2 entrance to the beach within close proximity to each other. I know this because many pic of runman show him go 2 times. With no come back time in between. Then 2 pics come back but no pic of him go in between. So he must have been using 2 ways. With 1 being on camera and 1 not. Could it be the runman thought he was only in footage that was withheld. Not realising that he used 2 ways that night. My point is. The owner of the black shorts may have used the other entrance also.

The questions you, and other concerned observers are asking, are the sorts of q's which RTP investigators should have been looking in to. They're not, as far as we've heard. Perhaps their excuse is lukewarm, as they're not well trained at crime investigations (for example, clothing left at a scene can have 'identifiers' other than bodily fluids. It can have pubic hairs, dandruff, tiny threads of material, or various types of organic and inorganic dust/pollen).

Here's a comparison of how Thais think, and how farang think: I often do a small trek near my home, to a large cavern with natural skylights. I've gone with hundreds of farang and dozens of Thais. There's a subtle pattern: Every time farang get in to the main chamber, they look up and gaze for minutes in wonderment at the cavern and its bats. When Thais enter, they gaze for seconds, and then want to move on to the next thing. It's as though their brains took a photo, and that's sufficient.

Here's how that sort of mind-set could apply to crime investigation. Thai cops (who, as I said earlier, aren't fully trained in investigative procedures) take a glance at evidence, and that's sufficient for them to make all their conclusions. In contrast, farang crime investigators might take a longer time, and scrutinize item(s) minutely - to see if there's some clue, however small, which might prove significant.

The Thai mind-set was also at work re; the reenactment. The official scenario is: two farang stroll down the beach, just before dawn, take their clothes off, the lie down to have sex. Two small young Burmese men, see them, get lustful, grab a hoe and bludgeon them, after raping the girl. It's simplistic and unrealistic to the 10th degree, but that's what the prosecution will want the judge to believe, in order to get death sentences for the B2.

[greenchair]

I agree.

[aimbc]

Police are not equipped to do crime scene investigation. So why are they taking on the task. Besides most of the time they are unwillingly to do their job. Just their more lucrative side line jobs like taking bribes.

This case will be a case for the history books in Thailand of how incompetent or the amount of cover up going on by the police. And how truly most of the cops are corrupt in Thailand.

[greenchair]

I agree too. ??

[greenchair]

I find it interesting that these 3 are all out and about at strange hours of the morning. Around the same time.

5.46 and 5.41

4.51.25 and 4.51.28

All 3 running back from the beach.

What were they doing during that 1 hour walking around the streets.

Not forget ????

[boomerangutang]

I find it interesting that these 3 are all out and about at strange hours of the morning. Around the same time.

5.46 and 5.41

4.51.25 and 4.51.28

All 3 running back from the beach.

What were they doing during that 1 hour walking around the streets.

post-223227-0-88894700-1419906585.jpg

post-155768-0-37866300-1418771831.jpg

post-223227-0-47481400-1419906699.jpg

Not forget ????

Those photos there show 3 people. The bearded farang guy with (apparent) Thai g.f. and the running man in white shorts, who I (and others) have pegged as Nomsod. The farang and the girl don't look suspicious, though they look (by body language) at least a bit spooked - as it's likely they just heard/saw something alarming. The running man in the white shorts looks very suspicious, and Thai cops said the same (qualifier: the first team of cops, before they were replaced by Bkk). If that photo could be ascertained as being Nomsod, then that would be a big part of the puzzle. His soggy alibi and all the other dross his protectors have been trying to shield him with, would come down like a house of cards.

[greenchair]

I find it interesting that these 3 are all out and about at strange hours of the morning. Around the same time.

5.46 and 5.41

4.51.25 and 4.51.28

All 3 running back from the beach.

What were they doing during that 1 hour walking around the streets.

post-223227-0-88894700-1419906585.jpg

post-155768-0-37866300-1418771831.jpg

post-223227-0-47481400-1419906699.jpg

Not forget ????

Those photos there show 3 people. The bearded farang guy with (apparent) Thai g.f. and the running man in white shorts, who I (and others) have pegged as Nomsod. The farang and the girl don't look suspicious, though they look (by body language) at least a bit spooked - as it's likely they just heard/saw something alarming. The running man in the white shorts looks very suspicious, and Thai cops said the same (qualifier: the first team of cops, before they were replaced by Bkk). If that photo could be ascertained as being Nomsod, then that would be a big part of the puzzle. His soggy alibi and all the other dross his protectors have been trying to shield him with, would come down like a house of cards.

Well I am sorry to disagree boomy.

But the police and mon himself have said that it is mon. I have looked at it often. I think it looks just like. Why would he say it was himself, if it wasn't. I don't believe he would say it was himself to protect nomsod. He would finger someone else rather than say it was himself.

[boomerangutang]

Those middle two stills, of the running man, is telling. I've said it before, and will say it again: That's not a man (like Mon), that's a boy's body (Nomsod). Also, there's the reminder of the sideburns facing forward, just like photos of Nomsod prior to the crime. After the crime, Nomsod had a week to arrange with his barber (or g.f?) to train his pretty little sideburns to face towards his ears. Also, the gimpy left arm. Again, that fits with Nomsod. Not only is he left-handed (and David's wounds were likely inflicted by a leftie), but photos of him prior to the crime show him with his odd left arm positioning (gravitating to his belly) - not dissimilar to the photos.

[boomerangutang]

I find it interesting that these 3 are all out and about at strange hours of the morning. Around the same time.

5.46 and 5.41

4.51.25 and 4.51.28

All 3 running back from the beach.

What were they doing during that 1 hour walking around the streets.

post-223227-0-88894700-1419906585.jpg

post-155768-0-37866300-1418771831.jpg

post-223227-0-47481400-1419906699.jpg

Not forget ????

Those photos there show 3 people. The bearded farang guy with (apparent) Thai g.f. and the running man in white shorts, who I (and others) have pegged as Nomsod. The farang and the girl don't look suspicious, though they look (by body language) at least a bit spooked - as it's likely they just heard/saw something alarming. The running man in the white shorts looks very suspicious, and Thai cops said the same (qualifier: the first team of cops, before they were replaced by Bkk). If that photo could be ascertained as being Nomsod, then that would be a big part of the puzzle. His soggy alibi and all the other dross his protectors have been trying to shield him with, would come down like a house of cards.

Well I am sorry to disagree boomy.

But the police and mon himself have said that it is mon. I have looked at it often. I think it looks just like. Why would he say it was himself, if it wasn't. I don't believe he would say it was himself to protect nomsod. He would finger someone else rather than say it was himself.

It's ok if we don't agree. At least we're both sincerely trying to unravel the mystery. I still maintain that if Mon said it was himself, that he was covering for who it really was: his nephew. Whether it was Mon or Nomsod, the running man in white shorts is implicated in the crime. Even the police team (before being replaced) claimed that. Indeed, it was the same video which bolstered their declaration that Mon and Nomsod were initial prime suspects. The timing of the running man is just minutes after the crime. Very implicating.

Yet another proof, as if any were needed, that THAI INVESTIGATORS ARE NOT DOING THEIR JOBS.

Edited February 1, 2015 by boomerangutang

[thailandchilli]

I find it interesting that these 3 are all out and about at strange hours of the morning. Around the same time.

5.46 and 5.41

4.51.25 and 4.51.28

All 3 running back from the beach.

What were they doing during that 1 hour walking around the streets.

post-223227-0-88894700-1419906585.jpg

post-155768-0-37866300-1418771831.jpg

post-223227-0-47481400-1419906699.jpg

Not forget ????

The bearded man and what looks like Thai woman are at the very least witnesses to the running man and could identify him to clear up all speculation. If the RTP did not question them why not? I have not seen reports but maybe they have. If they have then we would expect to see their statements at the trial. I'm pretty sure if this had happened in the west those 2 people would have been asked to attend an identification parade to identify who this was. Its not the west and its the RTP so no surprise if this did not happen.

CCTV is another concern for me, I would like to view the video of the farrang woman the RTP said they saw running near the scene, where is that? Oh I know, not relevant to release to the public eh but why then mention it to reporters

Edited February 1, 2015 by thailandchilli

[rockingrobin]

The bearded man with thai woman , is holding something in his right hand between his thumb and finger, as though he doesn't want to fully grasp it.

In the cctv at 5:46 the bearded man appears to be walking away from the woman, (possibly looking to discard item in hand).

With reference to cctv showing a man walking and then running, (police gave this person a reason for his actions before they had identified him , e.g he probably saw the murder and ran away in shock) I would like to ask peoples opinions if they think during his arm movement that the palm of his hand turns upwards during its back swing

[greenchair]

Does look a bit weird his arm.

I wonder what the guy has in his hand. In my younger years I was a bit of a rebel. That is exactly how I would hold something I didnt want my fingerprints on.

[loonodingle]

Has anyone found out who the bearded guy is?

[greenchair]

Has anyone found out who the bearded guy is?

Well, everybody seems to have bypassed this guy. He was only 3 seconds ahead of running man in one video. And out about an hour later at the same time as running man. I think it would not be hard for a good investigator to locate him.

He (I believe )is either a suspect or a witness.

[boomerangutang]

Why has RTP not bothered with the bearded guy and his female friend? Probably for the same reasons the RTP has not seriously interviewed Sean not looked into dozens of basic things they should have been scrutinizing: They don't want to deal with anything which might implicate the people they're shielding.

[greenchair]

Why has RTP not bothered with the bearded guy and his female friend? Probably for the same reasons the RTP has not seriously interviewed Sean not looked into dozens of basic things they should have been scrutinizing: They don't want to deal with anything which might implicate the people they're shielding.

I imagine they originally thought it was hannah and david.

By the time they figured it wasnt. The bearded guy may have left. Definitely something not right there.

[boomerangutang]

Why has RTP not bothered with the bearded guy and his female friend? Probably for the same reasons the RTP has not seriously interviewed Sean not looked into dozens of basic things they should have been scrutinizing: They don't want to deal with anything which might implicate the people they're shielding.

I imagine they originally thought it was hannah and david.

By the time they figured it wasnt. The bearded guy may have left. Definitely something not right there.

Jeezo, did they really think it might have been David and Hannah? That would be funny, if not such sad implications (for letting potential witnesses go). That's akin to RTP saying they found Hannah's phone by the B's shack, and then having to eat those words when it was shown (by jdinasia's hated social media) that it could not have been Hannah's phone, because her phone was handed to RTP on the day of the crime.

No wonder RTP echoers hate social media, and keep calling us all 'conspiracy theorists' until they're blue in the face. There have been some implicating photos and witness accounts published in social media, and (sorry guys) there will be more. It's ironic; the media that jdinasia, AleG and JTJ take every chance to discredit (calling all posters 'moronic' etc) is the same sort of social media which they themselves post in. And where are social media sites which bolster the RTP frame-up and other of their stories? None exist. It's not that RTP supporters aren't internet savvy, but rather because they don't have the support or credence to get a site started.

[greenchair]

Not able to post the news item.

But the police said, they were suspicious of the Burmese, because one of them had dyed hair and quickly dyed it back to black the day after the murders. Then everyone said the hair on motorbike of all 3 was black. Then they said the one in the middle, you can see the shading is different and that's what dyed hair looks like from cctv.

But in these pictures clearly nobody has dyed hair. So what is the reason rtp were suspicious if take away the hair excuse.

This guy has blonde hair

[IslandLover]

greenchair, on 05 Feb 2015 - 23:43, said:

Not able to post the news item.

But the police said, they were suspicious of the Burmese, because one of them had dyed hair and quickly dyed it back to black the day after the murders. Then everyone said the hair on motorbike of all 3 was black. Then they said the one in the middle, you can see the shading is different and that's what dyed hair looks like from cctv.

But in these pictures clearly nobody has dyed hair. So what is the reason rtp were suspicious if take away the hair excuse.

received_10153014864933728.jpegBuyciggy23.12.19.jpgBoybike23.10.23.jpg

This guy has blonde hair

1017426_10201544419024917_1891874423_n.jpg

This is what it said in the Nation on 4th October 2014:

Tip-off from Myanmar workers on Koh Tao played key role in arrests over the killings of Britons

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/national/Rape-suspects-charged-30244751.html

I have not seen this fact reported anywhere else.

The report about the hair dye appears to have been a lie, so is the report about the tip-off a lie too?

[greenchair]

The pictures of the crime-scene were widely published. Not a single guitar in sight.

The police remarked how strange it was,that the hoe was just lying there under a cloth. And here's the picture with no guitar. Look at that guitar all nicely in its jacket. One could say. "Oh they left the guitar because they were spooked and ran.if that was the case how did they have time and thought to cover the hoe.

So the police must have went to the crime scene, saw the nice guitar and quickly hid it in the police car.

And the b2 must have left the guitar out of its case on the ground ,ran down to kill h and d with the hoe that was already lying around at the beach, then gone back to where they were sitting and remember to cover the hoe,but forget to pick up the guitar and then leave.

Or the guitar was at the AC bar and the person that tipped the police, gave it to the police to show they were the ones playing a guitar.

I don't know if there are any news reports saying where the guitar was found.

But if they say it was at the beach next to the log ,there are many photos of that spot with no guitar. So the tipper is not honest dyed hair lie 1. Guitar lie 2.

[greenchair]

Which would they have done?

Lovingly put the guitar in its jacket before murder. But forget to take it.

Or leave the guitar lying on the beach outside of its jacket ,but remember to take the hoe back to the place they were sitting and cover it. And leave with no care about guitar.

[AleG]

The pictures of the crime-scene were widely published. Not a single guitar in sight.

The police remarked how strange it was,that the hoe was just lying there under a cloth. And here's the picture with no guitar. Look at that guitar all nicely in its jacket. One could say. "Oh they left the guitar because they were spooked and ran.if that was the case how did they have time and thought to cover the hoe.

So the police must have went to the crime scene, saw the nice guitar and quickly hid it in the police car.

And the b2 must have left the guitar out of its case on the ground ,ran down to kill h and d with the hoe that was already lying around at the beach, then gone back to where they were sitting and remember to cover the hoe,but forget to pick up the guitar and then leave.

Or the guitar was at the AC bar and the person that tipped the police, gave it to the police to show they were the ones playing a guitar.

I don't know if there are any news reports saying where the guitar was found.

But if they say it was at the beach next to the log ,there are many photos of that spot with no guitar. So the tipper is not honest dyed hair lie 1. Guitar lie 2.

10960216_1019715764711900_300180706917354726_o.jpg

10406792_1001957826487694_2633892230959155920_n (1).jpg

The guitar is not in a jacket, it's in a plastic bag to prevent contamination.

So you cook up a scenario for where the guitar was/could had been found, then you say the police don't mention the scenario you created, therefore they are lying. Who could argue with logic like that.

If finding the whereabouts of the guitar is so crucial to your investigation how could have missed this?:

“Maung Maung said he woke them up and asked them, ‘Where is the guitar?’ at which point one of the pair indicated it was in AC Bar... Maung Maung said he then went to AC Bar to look for the guitar and his sandals"

Mind you, the two Burmese suspects also claimed that their guitar was stolen:

"The Embassy officer said: “The two boys told him that they were swimming at beach near AC Bar and Maya Bar on that night, after 10 or 15 minutes, when they come back to the beach after swimming, they did not find their guitar and cloth on where they left"

You don't find their contradictory testimony (about this and other details) curious?

[greenchair]

I am sorry to say I have not taken Muang Muang off the suspects list. I have just put him on hold for a minute.

How do you know he rode barefoot with his girlfriend. A picture would be a treat. ??

[berybert]

I am sorry to say I have not taken Muang Muang off the suspects list. I have just put him on hold for a minute.

How do you know he rode barefoot with his girlfriend. A picture would be a treat. ??

I didn't say he rode barefoot. I am just assuming he doesn't normally go out with 2sets of footware. And as AleG seems to think he rode off to see his girlfriend and left his sandals behind he went barefoot.

[mrtoad]

Where is Stacey Dooley?

[tonytigerbkk]

Where is Stacey Dooley?

I believe she is working on a West End stage version of Stacey Dooley investigates.

[berybert]

Where is Stacey Dooley?

She is currently doing an undercover investigation regards orphaned Owls being sold as cheap underware in Egypt.

[draftvader]

My sincerest apologies. Sometimes you have to make a judgement call then you realise you might not have been well informed. Having lived in Thailand for 7 years and having been out of the UK for 9 years I have NO idea who Stacey Dooley is and only a strange topic in the Farang Pub section has bought it to my attention. Now I understand it is on-topic I have re-instated those posts.

The 2 posts that I have left out contain a mixture of icons that look like a profanity. I don't think they are but it is certainly the impression they gave me on the glance and, unfortunately, fit very well in that context. If you are going to insist on using off-forum icons then please consider how the could be perceived.

A comment about moderation has been removed. Due to my reflection no further action will be taken on that comment. Nonetheless I stand by my "be civil" quote.

Thank you

[catsanddogs]

Why has RTP not bothered with the bearded guy and his female friend? Probably for the same reasons the RTP has not seriously interviewed Sean not looked into dozens of basic things they should have been scrutinizing: They don't want to deal with anything which might implicate the people they're shielding.

I imagine they originally thought it was hannah and david.

By the time they figured it wasnt. The bearded guy may have left. Definitely something not right there.

And maybe once the RTP realised is wasn't Hannah and David (after the rest of the world did), they took them to one side, gave them enough money to have a lovely life, and told them 'you din't see nothing right?'. If I was bearded guy or Asian woman and had had my mug plastered all over social media and the press I would be giving interviews left right and centre to reassure everyone I wasn't a murderer and clear my name. But neither of these two have come out and said anything. Highly suspicious.

[boomerangutang]

And maybe once the RTP realised is wasn't Hannah and David (after the rest of the world did), they took them (the bearded farang / Asian woman couple) to one side, gave them enough money to have a lovely life, and told them 'you din't see nothing right?'. If I was bearded guy or Asian woman and had had my mug plastered all over social media and the press I would be giving interviews left right and centre to reassure everyone I wasn't a murderer and clear my name. But neither of these two have come out and said anything. Highly suspicious.

Actually, it's understandable. If the woman is Asian, which it looks likely she is (and probably Thai), she's going to lay low, away from public scrutiny for many reasons. The big bearded fellow is almost certainly farang and, if he knew anything useful for the investigation, he might want to speak out. More likely, however, if he's not cornered and forced to speak up, he will do what he's been doing - lay low and make no waves. Totally understandable.

There's also the factor which affects anyone who may have heard/seen or knows anything useful about the crime - they're not going to speak out for the simple reason, they don't want to be killed and/or have their families harmed. Anyone who doesn't believe that's a very real possibility, doesn't know much about Thailand. And just as assuredly, it's clear which people have the most vested interests in not wanting the truth of the crime to come to light. Rhymes with 'dead Dan's sheeple.'