Liquorice Posted January 24, 2015 Author Share Posted January 24, 2015 Mario2008, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:51, said: Let him call 1178 (immigration hotline) and tell about his problem. If they agree Amnat is wrong they can contact that office and set them straight. In case of conversion no need for seasoning. He was issued a Non Imm O one day, extension based on retirement the next day. Are you saying his funds didn't need seasoning for the conversion. Link to the info please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkey dog Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 hes got a multi reentry why not use it. far easier than dealing with immigration these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lopburi3 Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 Lite Beer, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:24, said: The 90 day report will be 90 days after returning. But he will be fined 2,000 Baht for not reporting on 26th. Thank you Lite Beer. So you would have to be out of Thailand for the full period of the 21 days you could possibly report in order to legally miss not reporting without any fines. He needs to depart prior to staying 90 days (or in this case first application for extension of stay) - you had a departure two days after reporting of 90 day due in your question. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquorice Posted January 24, 2015 Author Share Posted January 24, 2015 stevenl, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:56, said:He hired a legal company to sort out his visa, let the legal company sort this out as well. He's trying but there attitude is arrogant and they can't see what the problem is. Hundreds use these types of agents to get Visas and extensions. They don't have problems thereafter. Amnat have said' before OK they accept, now Army, cannot or will not do' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquorice Posted January 24, 2015 Author Share Posted January 24, 2015 (edited) lopburi3, on 24 Jan 2015 - 10:08, said:lopburi3, on 24 Jan 2015 - 10:08, said: Faz, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:56, said:Faz, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:56, said: Lite Beer, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:24, said:Lite Beer, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:24, said:Lite Beer, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:24, said: The 90 day report will be 90 days after returning. But he will be fined 2,000 Baht for not reporting on 26th. Thank you Lite Beer. So you would have to be out of Thailand for the full period of the 21 days you could possibly report in order to legally miss not reporting without any fines. He needs to depart prior to staying 90 days (or in this case first application for extension of stay) - you had a departure two days after reporting of 90 day due in your question. Thank you lopburi3, I fully understand. So if he crossed the border tomorrow 25/1 he wouldn't need to report on 26/1 and his next report date would be 90 days after re-entry. Edited January 24, 2015 by Faz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevenl Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 (edited) stevenl, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:56, said:He hired a legal company to sort out his visa, let the legal company sort this out as well. He's trying but there attitude is arrogant and they can't see what the problem is. Hundreds use these types of agents to get Visas and extensions. They don't have problems thereafter. Amnat have said' before OK they accept, now Army, cannot or will not do' Yes, that means there is something wrong, as said earlier by others, most likely the seasoning. If they say 'no problem', have them go with him to do the 90- days report. Or simply avoid the issue by going abroad at 9-0 days report time, and extend according to the rules when that time comes. Edited January 24, 2015 by stevenl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billphillips Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 billphillips, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:43, said: It's possible to make the 90 day report at any immigration office. Why not try another office nearby and see what transpires. I have a feeling though that the computer records have been marked along the lines of ... Refer back to issuing office. Alternately, speaking to the head shed of the local office and parting with some cash may possibly resolve the issue. These agents are well known for "under the table transactions" with their pet immigration contact. Don't expect any help or sympathy from them. Avoid using them at all costs in the future. It's not difficult or complicated to make the application and get a visa / extension on your own behalf. Actually it's a requirement that the application is made in person, although you can recruit assistance to accompany you. I was under the impression from other topics that you could only do the 90 day reporting at your local Immigration Office where your registered address is. No that's not the case. A visa or extension application has to be made at the office covering your residential area. The 90 day report can be made at any office. I reported while on vacation in Jomtien, I live in Udon. I believe it can also be done by post at some offices. Take care if your friend leaves Thailand. If the computer file is marked as I suspect ... They won't let him back in on that visa and will only give a "visa on entry" for 30 days..... 50k down the drain. Good advice above was to try the immigration hotline number. If no joy with that .. Get to BKK immigration asap and sort it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevenl Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 billphillips, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:43, said: It's possible to make the 90 day report at any immigration office. Why not try another office nearby and see what transpires. I have a feeling though that the computer records have been marked along the lines of ... Refer back to issuing office. Alternately, speaking to the head shed of the local office and parting with some cash may possibly resolve the issue. These agents are well known for "under the table transactions" with their pet immigration contact. Don't expect any help or sympathy from them. Avoid using them at all costs in the future. It's not difficult or complicated to make the application and get a visa / extension on your own behalf. Actually it's a requirement that the application is made in person, although you can recruit assistance to accompany you. I was under the impression from other topics that you could only do the 90 day reporting at your local Immigration Office where your registered address is. No that's not the case. A visa or extension application has to be made at the office covering your residential area. The 90 day report can be made at any office. I reported while on vacation in Jomtien, I live in Udon. I believe it can also be done by post at some offices. Take care if your friend leaves Thailand. If the computer file is marked as I suspect ... They won't let him back in on that visa and will only give a "visa on entry" for 30 days..... 50k down the drain. Good advice above was to try the immigration hotline number. If no joy with that .. Get to BKK immigration asap and sort it. Less and less offices are accepting 90 days report 'out of province'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smedly Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 Hypothetical question. The actual due date of my friends reporting is Monday 26/1/15. He can report up to 14 days before, or 7 days after. He needs to buy some time to sort out his problem. If he crosses the border into Lao on 28/1 will this reset his 90 day report date and buy him the time he needs. provided the border immigration don't have an issue with his extension, I would go to Bangkok first and get at least one 90 day report before crossing any border Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquorice Posted January 24, 2015 Author Share Posted January 24, 2015 stevenl, on 24 Jan 2015 - 10:24, said: Faz, on 24 Jan 2015 - 10:08, said: stevenl, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:56, said:stevenl, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:56, said:He hired a legal company to sort out his visa, let the legal company sort this out as well. He's trying but there attitude is arrogant and they can't see what the problem is. Hundreds use these types of agents to get Visas and extensions. They don't have problems thereafter. Amnat have said' before OK they accept, now Army, cannot or will not do' Yes, that means there is something wrong, as said earlier by others, most likely the seasoning. If they say 'no problem', have them go with him to do the 90- days report. Or simply avoid the issue by going abroad at 9-0 days report time, and extend according to the rules when that time comes. That suggestion was put to them on Friday, but they hadn't responded by the evening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lopburi3 Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 Thank you lopburi3, I fully understand. So if he crossed the border tomorrow 25/1 he wouldn't need to report on 26/1 and his next report date would be 90 days after re-entry. Correct. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquorice Posted January 24, 2015 Author Share Posted January 24, 2015 stevenl, on 24 Jan 2015 - 10:29, said: billphillips, on 24 Jan 2015 - 10:28, said: Faz, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:51, said:billphillips, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:43, said:billphillips, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:43, said: It's possible to make the 90 day report at any immigration office. Why not try another office nearby and see what transpires. I have a feeling though that the computer records have been marked along the lines of ... Refer back to issuing office. Alternately, speaking to the head shed of the local office and parting with some cash may possibly resolve the issue. These agents are well known for "under the table transactions" with their pet immigration contact. Don't expect any help or sympathy from them. Avoid using them at all costs in the future. It's not difficult or complicated to make the application and get a visa / extension on your own behalf. Actually it's a requirement that the application is made in person, although you can recruit assistance to accompany you. I was under the impression from other topics that you could only do the 90 day reporting at your local Immigration Office where your registered address is. No that's not the case. A visa or extension application has to be made at the office covering your residential area. The 90 day report can be made at any office. I reported while on vacation in Jomtien, I live in Udon. I believe it can also be done by post at some offices. Take care if your friend leaves Thailand. If the computer file is marked as I suspect ... They won't let him back in on that visa and will only give a "visa on entry" for 30 days..... 50k down the drain. Good advice above was to try the immigration hotline number. If no joy with that .. Get to BKK immigration asap and sort it. Less and less offices are accepting 90 days report 'out of province'. That was my understanding. Amnat refused to accept a 90 day report for a chap from Pattaya visiting a friend in Roi Et only the other week. Said it had to be done at Jontiem. 'Consistency' doesn't appear in the Thai dictionary. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquorice Posted January 26, 2015 Author Share Posted January 26, 2015 Just a quick update and to pass on my friends thanks to all you TV members that offered advice. He did a border run to Savannakhet today and got his 90 day report completed. The IO ;s speak excellent English and after viewing his Visa, Extension and dates couldn't find anything wrong. They felt Amnat were being a little pedantic under the situation. Agreed the 800,000 wasn't seasons but as it was Bangkok that issued it Amnat shouldn't have any concerns. The IO felt that Amnat would probably do his 90 day reports in the future; now the first one is out of the way, but the guy gave Dave his personal mobile to ring him if he had any further problems at Amnat and he would speak to them. Anyway thanks to all from Dave. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nzexpat Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 Faz That all sounds "very odd" ! 90 day reports are never undertaken at borders ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lopburi3 Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 As said if he went to Savannakhet there would have been a new exit/entry into Thailand - not a 90 day address report. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquorice Posted January 26, 2015 Author Share Posted January 26, 2015 Sorry, bad choice of wording. He overcame the requirement to do his 90 day report by crossing the border, thus resetting his date to next report in 90 days from re-entering. Amnat are sticklers for the rules, but hopefully he can continue to do his follow up reports there. If not, he now knows how to overcome the problem. Amnat have already stated they would be happy to do his next extension. I don't think he'll be using any agents again for Visa/Extension processing. Lesson learned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubonjoe Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 If they refuse the 90 day report again and he decides to do another border crossing he might want to go to Chong Mek to do it. It is a walk across crossing that is normally not busy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquorice Posted January 27, 2015 Author Share Posted January 27, 2015 ubonjoe, on 27 Jan 2015 - 08:15, said:If they refuse the 90 day report again and he decides to do another border crossing he might want to go to Chong Mek to do it. It is a walk across crossing that is normally not busy. Thanks Joe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FritsSikkink Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 lopburi3, on 23 Jan 2015 - 17:15, said: A bit over a decade ago it was the case that extensions started on the day ot was approved but that changed to end of current permitted to stay - which is current policy everywhere AFAIK. A single entry visa is always marked used when used - be it on entry or at immigration in the conversion process - but you will have a 90 day stay allowed by that non immigrant visa and any extension should start from the end of that 90 days - those 90 days are needed to allow funds to be in bank the required 60 days prior to first retirement extension of stay. Something it fishy with the information you provided as funds must be in account here for 60 days prior to any approval of extension - and from what you said this was not the case. The rules say the money must be in a Thai bank account for 60 days but these 'one stop shops' as I call them have the connections to get Visas and extensions issued within days of someone entering Thailand....money talks. Money talks but it is still an illegaly acquired visa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LivinLOS Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 He had to transfer funds on the day as proof before they proceeded with the Visa and the Extension, but, and this always amazes me, the Extension was issued without the rule of the 60 day seasoning period. Something that Amnat appear to be questioning. However this happens all the time using agents, laws are flowted and backhanders do the talking. While I can understand the concern.. Lets face it, thats something he used an 'agents fee' to solve hence should be aware of.. I dont think that stands up to scrutiny.. He could have been showing an income cert.. Local office would not know or red flag this.. Also he could have had a bank account in Thailand, before returning to the country and processing this application.. Again local office wouldn't or couldn't know this.. As to claim they 'looked it up on the computer', if my immigration office is anything to go with (they lost parts of my annual extension app..Got it wrong.. Made me come back weeks later, and again knew nothing about the issues and problems they had made until I walked them through their own mistake until they got it) I simply dont think that level of data is easily and readily available at the fingertips of those who do 90 day report. Thats not it couldnt be found should hey need to, but just not normal process. I strongly suspect its something they feel isnt correct in the basic stamps they are viewing in the passport.. Not something in the background application. What that something is.. Cant say.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LivinLOS Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 billphillips, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:43, said: It's possible to make the 90 day report at any immigration office. Why not try another office nearby and see what transpires. I have a feeling though that the computer records have been marked along the lines of ... Refer back to issuing office. Alternately, speaking to the head shed of the local office and parting with some cash may possibly resolve the issue. These agents are well known for "under the table transactions" with their pet immigration contact. Don't expect any help or sympathy from them. Avoid using them at all costs in the future. It's not difficult or complicated to make the application and get a visa / extension on your own behalf. Actually it's a requirement that the application is made in person, although you can recruit assistance to accompany you. I was under the impression from other topics that you could only do the 90 day reporting at your local Immigration Office where your registered address is. And if your on holiday somewhere in the country ?? Can be anywhere no ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LivinLOS Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 Also.. I see its now done.. But in his position, with time to spare, I would have done a report by mail.. His obligation is then done.. They dont like that.. They will need to explain why.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquorice Posted January 27, 2015 Author Share Posted January 27, 2015 LivinLOS, on 27 Jan 2015 - 18:33, said: Also.. I see its now done.. But in his position, with time to spare, I would have done a report by mail.. His obligation is then done.. They dont like that.. They will need to explain why.. He went in November with a TM28 and TM30 form to change his address with Immigration. They changed it on the computer and gave him a notification slip to that effect. He only lives 30 minutes motorcycle ride from Amnat and it was an opportunity to do some shopping in the town. His passport, Visa and extension has been viewed by a few including other Immigration officers who found no fault. He had a bank account and a letter from the bank confirming the funds, but...........the money hadn't been seasoned. His Non Imm O and his extension are perfectly legal, but the rules for issuing the extension weren't followed by Bangkok Immigration. That said, I've at least 2 other examples of Visas and extensions issued the same day from Bangkok. I believe it's quite common for agents to do this procedure through Bangkok, probably hundreds a year. From what I can establish, many other Immigration offices also accepted Extension issued in this way without any concerns. Now the Army is in control and clamping down on corruption Amnat seem to be one of the offices who don't want to get involved with Extensions issued by another office, even though the extension is legal. It seems to be the fact it was issued without following the rules that they have a problem with. They view it as a 'dodgy' extension. There's a much bigger issue to this because these agents and Bangkok Immigration are making good money from this practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquorice Posted January 27, 2015 Author Share Posted January 27, 2015 (edited) LivinLOS, on 27 Jan 2015 - 18:31, said:LivinLOS, on 27 Jan 2015 - 18:31, said: Faz, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:51, said:Faz, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:51, said: billphillips, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:43, said:billphillips, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:43, said:billphillips, on 24 Jan 2015 - 09:43, said: It's possible to make the 90 day report at any immigration office. Why not try another office nearby and see what transpires. I have a feeling though that the computer records have been marked along the lines of ... Refer back to issuing office. Alternately, speaking to the head shed of the local office and parting with some cash may possibly resolve the issue. These agents are well known for "under the table transactions" with their pet immigration contact. Don't expect any help or sympathy from them. Avoid using them at all costs in the future. It's not difficult or complicated to make the application and get a visa / extension on your own behalf. Actually it's a requirement that the application is made in person, although you can recruit assistance to accompany you. I was under the impression from other topics that you could only do the 90 day reporting at your local Immigration Office where your registered address is. And if your on holiday somewhere in the country ?? Can be anywhere no ?? It would have to be longer than a 3 week holiday because you have a 21 day window to do 90 day reports. The other option would be to complete a TM28 and TM 30 form. Walk in and do an address change first, then do the 90 day report. Of course you'd have to do that again with your local office when returning from your holiday. Maybe a bit long winded, but your following the rules and it overcomes the problem. Edited January 27, 2015 by Faz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lopburi3 Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 There's a much bigger issue to this because these agents and Bangkok Immigration are making good money from this practice. If this is a normal agent assisted application there should not be any off-book payment required to immigration - the agent helps to fill out the paperwork and may attend immigration with applicant but the applicant gets the extension. If this is done without the presence of the applicant that would make it a different ball game. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquorice Posted January 27, 2015 Author Share Posted January 27, 2015 Siam Legal helped him complete the application. They accompanied him to the bank the following day once his funds had been transferred. They got a letter from the bank confirming funds and a copy of his passbook. He did not accompany the agent to Immigration. He entered on a Visa exempt and got both the Non Imm O and extension dated one day apart. Why would it make a difference whether the applicant attended or not. Whichever his funds had been in the bank for a day, not the required 60 days. It wouldn't be possible for me as an individual to get a Non Imm O and extension together, so how do these agents manage to do it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billphillips Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 (edited) Siam Legal helped him complete the application. They accompanied him to the bank the following day once his funds had been transferred. They got a letter from the bank confirming funds and a copy of his passbook. He did not accompany the agent to Immigration. He entered on a Visa exempt and got both the Non Imm O and extension dated one day apart. Why would it make a difference whether the applicant attended or not. Whichever his funds had been in the bank for a day, not the required 60 days. It wouldn't be possible for me as an individual to get a Non Imm O and extension together, so how do these agents manage to do it? Because visa and extension applications must be made in person. It's ok to have someone to help you and do all of the paperwork but you have to sit in front of the immigration officer while they are processing the application. I also understood that it was not possible (officially) to obtain a non O visa from within Thailand. Anyone can confirm? Edited January 27, 2015 by billphillips Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lopburi3 Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 Have you read the back side of a TM.7 application for extension of stay? NOTICE ๑. ผูขอจะตองยื่นคาขออน ํ ุญาตดวยตนเอง APPLICATION MUST BE MADE IN PERSON. ๒. คาธรรมเนียมการยื่นคําขออนุญาต ๑๙๐๐ บาท APPICATION FEE IS 1900 BAHT. ๓. จะไดรับการอนุญาตหรือไมก็ตาม เงินคาธรรมเนียมจะไมคืนให WHETHER PERMISION IS GRANTED OR NOT, APPICATION FEE IS NOT REFUNDABLE. http://www.immigration.go.th/nov2004/download/pdf/tm7.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lopburi3 Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 Yes you can obtain a non immigrant visa or convert a tourist visa inside Thailand in the retirement extension of stay process - it is an additional step/form and 2,000 baht fee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nzexpat Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 (edited) Siam Legal helped him complete the application. They accompanied him to the bank the following day once his funds had been transferred. They got a letter from the bank confirming funds and a copy of his passbook. He did not accompany the agent to Immigration. He entered on a Visa exempt and got both the Non Imm O and extension dated one day apart. Why would it make a difference whether the applicant attended or not. Whichever his funds had been in the bank for a day, not the required 60 days. It wouldn't be possible for me as an individual to get a Non Imm O and extension together, so how do these agents manage to do it? Absolutely possible (or was) to secure a conversion to Non "O" and an extension of stay based on retirement on the same day by personal application. Schemes designed to "scam" the system will always be discovered and eventually closed down. Edited January 27, 2015 by nzexpat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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