From the battle for a daughter to a son lost

[richard_smith237]

Have no use for Gay couples wanting to have and raise children, especially two men !! Of, course my being raised in the USA I have a different standard than they seem to have in some other countries.

This thing has gotten so crazy they are now wanting Gay Boy Scout Masters. Try and tell me they will not try and teach their own habits to others !!

Yep. Gotta agree with this. Liberal western ideas on gays are rubbish. A kid needs a mum and a dad. Not two dad's where one is pretending to be a woman.

haha... the absolute blindly ignorant and dumbfoundingly idiotic assumptions made on this forum are absolutely astounding...

With evidence of such ignorance I wonder what level of even basic parenting balance some posters are capable of...

[Jingthing]

Thailand has already changed it's surrogacy laws for foreigners so there won't be future cases like this, but maybe there's a silver lining here. This custody struggle is widely reported in Thailand and while some Thais support the surrogate mother and some Thais support the married couple, they all can see how lovely the family from Spain is with their children. I reckon this will help move Thailand forward towards marriage equality (probably with a civil union scheme) within Thailand. It probably won't be 100 percent equality at first and may restrict parental rights ... but it would be a start.

[smutcakes]

considering that the thai woman did not conceive this baby,( ie she had the fertilized(one of the fathers) egg(donated) placed in her womb) how does she have any parental rights, she simply carried the egg to term without having any biological connection what so ever. The two men simply paid her to hire out her womb for 9 months, this is simply all about making a heap of money like the other did with the little boy, she sees herself in a big house with her future paid for by others if she can keep the baby.

Well maybe they should of had their own child! oh wait they can't. Any lady who carries a child in their womb for 9 months has a biological connection to that child, at the very least a hell of a lot more than one of the men.

It is impossible to get any proper factual information, but if the man did 'forget' to say the child was going to be raised by a pair of gays, then it is a fairly large omission on his behalf, or he purposely did not mention it.

What parental 'right' does one of the fathers have? He has no biological connection, he did not have it in him etc, The Thai lady sure has a hell of a lot bigger claim than he does.

[Patsycat]

The bigotry and homophobia on this subject absolutely disgusts me.

[greenchair]

It's not her child. She has absolutely no say in its upbringing.

She is the birth mother. Ask any court, in Thailand and abroad.

She has no generic link to this child.

She was paid to carry it.

She took the job and the money.

That was her role and that role ended when she gave birth.

It's not her child. She has no say in its upbringing.

She was duped into taking a job under false pretences. A job that they fraudulently paid a pittance for by the way. 15,000 baht for the pregnancy, no more than a full time job would offer .

Then a pittance at the end. Artificial insemination is no fun to go through. There are dozens of doctors visits, needles, and pain. It is an incredibly difficult thing to do. She deserved every baht and more .

By the law, she is the

birth mother.the child was conceived in her body. The is as much hers as his. His boyfriend is the only one with no right to decide on the child's upbringing.

[Bluespunk]

It's not her child. She has absolutely no say in its upbringing.

She is the birth mother. Ask any court, in Thailand and abroad.

She has no generic link to this child.

She was paid to carry it.

She took the job and the money.

That was her role and that role ended when she gave birth.

It's not her child. She has no say in its upbringing.

She was duped into taking a job under false pretences. A job that they fraudulently paid a pittance for by the way. 15,000 baht for the pregnancy, no more than a full time job would offer .

Then a pittance at the end. Artificial insemination is no fun to go through. There are dozens of doctors visits, needles, and pain. It is an incredibly difficult thing to do. She deserved every baht and more .

By the law, she is the

birth mother.the child was conceived in her body. The is as much hers as his. His boyfriend is the only one with no right to decide on the child's upbringing.

She deserved the money she was paid? Yep fully agree. However that is the point, she was paid for a job and that is it. That's all.

Did she deserve more? Maybe, I'm not a fan of this type of suragocy so not sure how much money would make it right.

However it is still not her child. She has no say on its upbringing. None at all.

We clearly do not agree on this and are just reiterating the same points. I don't see any further point in this unless either of us can come up with a different argument.

Edited August 1, 2015 by Bluespunk

[MyFriend You]

Have no use for Gay couples wanting to have and raise children, especially two men !! Of, course my being raised in the USA I have a different standard than they seem to have in some other countries.

This thing has gotten so crazy they are now wanting Gay Boy Scout Masters. Try and tell me they will not try and teach their own habits to others !!

What part of the American Constitution says YOUR OPINION on how gays should live is gospel/ scripture/ the law? Clearly you're the bigot when you don't even know your own USA's law of the land!

No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

One of my Scout Masters was a Homosexual - we didn't call them 'Gays' back then, he was also the editor of the local newspaper, had two kids he raised on his own, a boy & a girl, and as far as I know they weren't honosexual or lesbian either. This was 1960-1964. I disagree with some of the posters that the child does not belong to the natural mother, Its not a freaking car we are talking about, it's her flesh & blood, so crawl back under the rocks you idiots came from and re-think your positions.

[Jingthing]

Huh?

Carmen is not from the surrogate's egg so of course she is NOT the surrogates flesh and blood. DUH!

[cookee68]

Thank goodness this girl has the courage to speak out concerns for the safety of the little baby. The baby will go to Spain with a gay couple barely married 3 years. In Spain there will never be any checks on this child's well being. They were married barely a year, when they endeavoured to get their first child. All the Thai girl wants is to at least be able to go and check on the little girl sometimes. She was made to believe this child would be going to America with a mother and a father. She has every right to be concerned for the child's well being. Since she brought the girl into this world, she has a duty to make sure the baby will be cared for correctly.

She said she would never have accepted if she knew the truth.

The contract is void, due to deception. Even I am a little worried about the future of this little girl.

She knew the score when she took the money and became a surrogate mother, many gay and lesbian live in my town that have kids, and they seem just fine, What is wrong with Spain, they are more family orientated than most western countries. She did not use her egg, and the father is the bilogical father, all she did was house what was not hers for 9 months and got paid for it, she just want a Farang child,

[cookee68]

Have no use for Gay couples wanting to have and raise children, especially two men !! Of, course my being raised in the USA I have a different standard than they seem to have in some other countries.

This thing has gotten so crazy they are now wanting Gay Boy Scout Masters. Try and tell me they will not try and teach their own habits to others !!

What part of the American Constitution says YOUR OPINION on how gays should live is gospel/ scripture/ the law? Clearly you're the bigot when you don't even know your own USA's law of the land!

No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

One of my Scout Masters was a Homosexual - we didn't call them 'Gays' back then, he was also the editor of the local newspaper, had two kids he raised on his own, a boy & a girl, and as far as I know they weren't honosexual or lesbian either. This was 1960-1964. I disagree with some of the posters that the child does not belong to the natural mother, Its not a freaking car we are talking about, it's her flesh & blood, so crawl back under the rocks you idiots came from and re-think your positions.

The child is not her flesh and blood, they used another egg not hers, and fertilized that egg, her body was only been used, and paid for

[seajae]

considering that the thai woman did not conceive this baby,( ie she had the fertilized(one of the fathers) egg(donated) placed in her womb) how does she have any parental rights, she simply carried the egg to term without having any biological connection what so ever. The two men simply paid her to hire out her womb for 9 months, this is simply all about making a heap of money like the other did with the little boy, she sees herself in a big house with her future paid for by others if she can keep the baby.

Well maybe they should of had their own child! oh wait they can't. Any lady who carries a child in their womb for 9 months has a biological connection to that child, at the very least a hell of a lot more than one of the men.

It is impossible to get any proper factual information, but if the man did 'forget' to say the child was going to be raised by a pair of gays, then it is a fairly large omission on his behalf, or he purposely did not mention it.

What parental 'right' does one of the fathers have? He has no biological connection, he did not have it in him etc, The Thai lady sure has a hell of a lot bigger claim than he does.

pretty pathetic reply actually and no, she doesnt have a bigger biological connection than the actual father as it is his DNA that the child carries, not hers. A simple dna test will show that one of them is the real father and that she is not the mother as it was not her egg in the first place so the genetic make up in the child has bugger all to do with her. While I may not agree with the way it was conceived and by who I can see that these two have more rights to the child as one of them is the actual father and as a father I know I would never give up one of my own children so in this case I will back the rights of the true father and not of a woman who rented her womb for 9 months for cash and has no genetic connection to the child in question. Some things are simply bigger than biased homophobic crap responses, are you or the others whinging actually a father, if so think how you would feel if you were refused the rights of parenthood to your own kids.

[Patsycat]

I signed the petition and will sign any others if there are any.

I also had a look at the Facebook, what a lovely family. Just to see how she is so smiley with her big brother. Lovely pics, of a normal loving family.

As said before, they have at least 25 close family members in Spain. Just waiting to welcome Carmen into their arms.

Whilst some money grabbing whatever wants to ruin that? How cold and calculating can some people be, especially over a child.

Yes, she went through the pregnancy. But that was the deal.

And the things saying that she wanted a Leakrung baby. I'm sorry, but Carmen looks a bit Chinese. Aroud the eyes.

Edited August 2, 2015 by Patsycat

[richard_smith237]

One of my Scout Masters was a Homosexual - we didn't call them 'Gays' back then, he was also the editor of the local newspaper, had two kids he raised on his own, a boy & a girl, and as far as I know they weren't honosexual or lesbian either. This was 1960-1964. I disagree with some of the posters that the child does not belong to the natural mother, Its not a freaking car we are talking about, it's her flesh & blood, so crawl back under the rocks you idiots came from and re-think your positions.

This is the basis of your argument ? I'm wondering who the idiot really is... he who's only contribution to a debate is 'I disagree with you so you are idiots' !!!

Do you think the child's DNA would match the mother or father ?

[ableguy]

Have no use for Gay couples wanting to have and raise children, especially two men !! Of, course my being raised in the USA I have a different standard than they seem to have in some other countries.

This thing has gotten so crazy they are now wanting Gay Boy Scout Masters. Try and tell me they will not try and teach their own habits to others !!

Would be interested to hear your views on the KKK, just a guess, but I suspect you may have first hand knowledge?

What a BS response.