PM Prayuth to decide on tough new penalties for foreigners who overstay

[chrissables]

USA is same... 10 years ban and it s easy to be banned.

so guys, if you don't like Thai rules, you are welcome to go home. nobody force you to stay in Thailand or apply as a refugee or be 50 years old and get retirement visa.

I am living in Thailand and care not one iota what the laws are in other countries, they have no meaning what so ever to living here.

[momtaz]

Good idea, a such linient policy made the country as heaven distinction for thousands of criminals and devil minded vagabonds,

The policy could be a very effective one if they install biometric devices to record those overstayed ones and apply some harder punishments if the guilty breach the ban,

I'm sure sure there are lot of criminals who are hiding in Thailand will be upset by this new policy,,, the punishment rule also should effect the corrupted ones who involved in smuggling, trafficking human, immigration offices or anyone else to be involved, this will be a balanced effective policy to liminate illegal overstayed foreigners and avoid such possible bombing blast as happened in last August, anyone who is living and working legally,, have no thing to worry about as long as you are respecting the law.

[elviajero]

If you are arrested for overstay, the penalty for overstay of under 1 year is the same as overstay of more than one year?

It's a typo. Over 1 year is a 10 year ban.

[Thaidream]

I am neither a moaner or groaner who has ever overstayed even 1 day in 50 years. I have had every Visa Thailand offers except Permanent Residency. The overstay issue has been discussed for years. The real reason it has become a big issue now is that the so called Erawan Bombers were allowed to enter Thailand illegally and someone has now lost face. By the way- these people are not considered Farang under the way Thais view foreigners. They would be labeled as Kaek. Arresting every overstayer now in Thailand and deporting them and banning them forever would not solve the problem of corruption. That is how a potential terrorist can enter. In addition, a person who wants to cause problems can get a visa- they do not need to overstay. All of the 9/11 terrorists entered the US with legal Visas.

I am hopeful the General does not use Section 44 in this case because it would not be of any value. There already is a law for overstay and it works just fine. Searching for overstayers and disrupting marriages does nothing to improve security- it only ties down the police and military on a useless exercise when they could be doing other more pertinent things.

[BritTim]

I think it very likely that the new overstay penalties will go into effect. It will be a popular solution to a non problem. If trying to keep out undesirables, this needs to be done when they enter. Further, some overstayers are young people, without much money, but nevertheless positive for the country, not undesirables. Just having a blanket ban on overstayers will, coincidentally, get rid of some bad people, but most bad people will not be overstayers and some overstayers not bad.

[dennis123]

Thought over stayers were a vital source of revenue, and those people were applauded, where those who did constructive things were considered dodgy.

Why not open the country up for foreign entrepreneurs ?

There is a Thai Elite visa for entrepreneurs or you can start a business and get a work permit.

And there is a big difference between an entrepreneur and a dead broke wannabe IM'er, on those internet marketing forums they talk about how they survive at 500 dollars a month in Chiang Mai lol, is that you're intepretation of entrepreneur perhaps? That would definitely explain those people who can't afford the 20k fine or a plane ticket as it often only takes one Google update to wipe their whole income, in other words a bunch of amateurs. In case you feel addressed by this, there's a new Penguin update coming up, very soon!!!

I'm considering the Thai Elite myself, just not sure yet as I'm also considering to live 6 months in my own country and 6 months in Thailand so I wouldn't need Thai Elite for that, tourist visa would be sufficient for that purpose, ok not completely legal if I work here but it's not like I take any cheese from Thailand as all income is foreign.

Back to the entrepreneur part again, Thailand is quite generous with this Thai Elite visa as it's a no questions asked thing and you can do whatever you want for only 8k baht/month, still have to meet the first entrepreneur that can't afford 200 euro/mo for this Thai Elite program. I do consider 400 euro/mo a bit expensive, just to live in a country, which would be my case if I decided to stay only 6 months a year here so yes I'd be breaking some rules but I do spend a lot here so the economy will benefit one way or another, if it's only increasing spending power of Thai nationals.

[Time Traveller]

The penalties are not harsh enough ! But it is about time. Thousands of dodgy foreigners are crapping in their pants right now. GOOD!

....and then there's the wierdo foreigners ejaculating in their pants about stricter laws. Probably think their own status will be elevated by kicking out a few not so lucky people.

Yeah admit it, that's what makes you happy.

Edited October 26, 2015 by Time Traveller

[metisdead]

Please use discretion in your references to the government. Phrases which can be considered as anti-coup will be removed. Referring to Thailand or the government as a dictatorship, military dictatorship or other such terms will be removed.

Other profane and inflammatory posts and replies have been removed.

[chilli42]

These are not harsh penalties at all. Try overstaying in the US and see what happens.

[boomerangutang]

if the new laws will make a difference to the type of people we let into the country then I am in favour we do need to sort out the wheat from the chaff there are far too many undesirables here and they need to be sorted .

wheat from chaff. Wheat = good, and chaff = bad

but wait a kotonpikinminute, some time chaff looks like wheat. I've met chaff who dress up real handsome and smile disarmingly.

Thais hire teachers to teach English. Unfortunately, the Thai hirers can't tell an adept English speaker from an inept one.

Same applies to farang applying for visa extensions: Thai officials are easily fooled into thinking well-dressed, well-groomed polite applicants (looking like Mitt Romney or a car salesman) are all good, and others are questionable. Oh, and it helps immensely to show up at Immigration with a Thai person, particularly a Hi_So, if possible. The better dressed, more jewelfy, and more polite that person, the better/quicker you get approval. If that person has a Thai uniform on or is well-connected socially (or oozes wealth) then you're home free.

If you come in dressed and groomed like Bill Gates or Bernie Sanders (mussed up hair, old blue jeans) you're going to get more scrutiny and delays.

[zackattack]

Most of you on here can't even pop wood anymore so I'm a 2nd lieutenant in the army of the USA and have fought for my country for 22 years and we give millions of dollars to Thailand plus all the old tanks,all guns,air craft,destroyers,and every other kind of ship we make plus not all the money will give every month in renewing our stinking visas. So gen. What do you want us to do for you more hmmm.

You have the money to give but wont and the whole world knows this the only one that doesn't know I think is you. I love this country, children are Thai/American and what would you have me do leave them fatherless just because I didn't get a visa renewed

You are a joke

[StevieDee]

Leaving the incessant bickering aside for a moment, does anyone have a vague idea of how long it might take Prayuth to rubber stamp these new rules? And would there be some kind of grace period or do they come into effect immediately?

And before you go accusing me, yes I am an overstayer :-)

Am no expert but regardless of how long it takes to implement, if it ever does, my advice would be to sort your over stay out sooner rather than later, with right now being your best option. Many previous posts before explain that flying out and paying amount due at airport is much better than doing it at immigration with being stopped randomly with overstay is something to be avoided.

[blackcab]

I still believe the process could be simplified. Just charge us a flat sum per day or month and all will be good. Something like 200 baht, stay as long as you like without visa....

Your wish has already been granted. You can stay for 5 years if you pay 274b a day. It's called a PE visa and for most people it's very simple to obtain.

The only catch is you have to pay 5 years in advance, which costs 500,000b.

[arrowsdawdle]

Doubt it happens if it didn't last year, it's the same proposal. They'd have to change the 1971 immigration act.

Easily done with Article 44.

[elviajero]

Leaving the incessant bickering aside for a moment, does anyone have a vague idea of how long it might take Prayuth to rubber stamp these new rules? And would there be some kind of grace period or do they come into effect immediately?

And before you go accusing me, yes I am an overstayer :-)

Depends on how they do it.

I think it will be done by Ministerial Regulation which would mean they would have to publish the change in the Royal Gazette and it could come in to effect after 60 days from publication. If Prayuth uses article 44 then I guess it could be anytime. I don't believe they will change the immigration act.

[MaxLee]

Well,... in other words.... sending EXPATS home with article number "not-to-be-named"

[keithcresswell]

Mostly it's because they are skint and shouldn't have been here in the first place.

If someone is ill they can apply for an extension of stay on medical grounds.

90 day reporting is not overstaying.

​

Missing a 90 day report is overstaying; well It is at Jomtien anyway. I made the mistake of thinking that I needed to report 90 days after I got my retirement extension. I duly went to immigration 83 days later assuming I was a week early and was fined for overstaying and had it stamped so in my passport. I completely forgot that logic goes out of the window in Thailand. Anyway I know now.

[BritTim]

There is a Thai Elite visa for entrepreneurs or you can start a business and get a work permit.

And there is a big difference between an entrepreneur and a dead broke wannabe IM'er, on those internet marketing forums they talk about how they survive at 500 dollars a month in Chiang Mai lol, is that you're intepretation of entrepreneur perhaps? That would definitely explain those people who can't afford the 20k fine or a plane ticket as it often only takes one Google update to wipe their whole income, in other words a bunch of amateurs. In case you feel addressed by this, there's a new Penguin update coming up, very soon!!!

I'm considering the Thai Elite myself, just not sure yet as I'm also considering to live 6 months in my own country and 6 months in Thailand so I wouldn't need Thai Elite for that, tourist visa would be sufficient for that purpose, ok not completely legal if I work here but it's not like I take any cheese from Thailand as all income is foreign.

Back to the entrepreneur part again, Thailand is quite generous with this Thai Elite visa as it's a no questions asked thing and you can do whatever you want for only 8k baht/month, still have to meet the first entrepreneur that can't afford 200 euro/mo for this Thai Elite program. I do consider 400 euro/mo a bit expensive, just to live in a country, which would be my case if I decided to stay only 6 months a year here so yes I'd be breaking some rules but I do spend a lot here so the economy will benefit one way or another, if it's only increasing spending power of Thai nationals.

Your post is interesting, mainly because it shows the mentality of many Thais and many Westerners is similar. Those who are successful and wealthy are justified in having an easy life. Those who have not (at least yet) inherited or earned a nest egg are undesirables, and it should be made as difficult as possible for them to better their lives.

On a point of information, while you can start a business in Thailand, you usually cannot legally own it. Of course, if you have money, the lawyers can find (illegal but tolerated) workarounds that allow you to retain effective control.

[dennis123]

Most of you on here can't even pop wood anymore so I'm a 2nd lieutenant in the army of the USA and have fought for my country for 22 years and we give millions of dollars to Thailand plus all the old tanks,all guns,air craft,destroyers,and every other kind of ship we make plus not all the money will give every month in renewing our stinking visas. So gen. What do you want us to do for you more hmmm.

You have the money to give but wont and the whole world knows this the only one that doesn't know I think is you. I love this country, children are Thai/American and what would you have me do leave them fatherless just because I didn't get a visa renewed

You are a joke

I think they could consider a new visa for people who are on early retirement or disabilitiy payment, however same rules would need to be applied as for the current retirement visa, not cause I want that but due to fairness. Thing is that most people I know of that are on disability payment don't meet those benchmarks of 800k in the bank and/or 65k per month so I suspect few people would benefit from that.

But is it different then any other country? I make good money but I'm not rich so I can't just go live in the US if I wanted to, just to name something, so why does Thailand have to open it's doors to anyone? You made the decision to start a family and have kids while being on tourist visas, which is pretty irresponsible if you ask me. However there's something like a parental visa (non immigrant O right?), I know a divorced guy got one so why can't you if you're the legal father?

[blackcab]

The only strange bit is this:

"For an offender who is arrested for overstaying their visa:

Overstay of less than 1 year = barred from re-entering Thailand for five years.

​

Overstay of more than 1 year = barred from re-entering Thailand for five years."

They could have just said if you don't hand yourself in and we catch you it's a 5 year ban.

[TEFLKrabi]

The penalties are not harsh enough ! But it is about time. Thousands of dodgy foreigners are crapping in their pants right now. GOOD!

I'd be happy to see this is they offered an amnesty period (again) for people to correct their current situation, maybe 3 months to sort yourself out.

[thhMan]

I hope with this rule, they also make things fair for those that dont overstay...

Something like......

Same Rights that are afforded Thai nationals in other countries

And shame on you to those who are ready to blame those that suddenly fall on hard times and find they cannot abide by the rules, simply because they cant...

Ive said it before... I worked for x years in Thailand, supporting my family and my employer let me go, without notice, without severance and instead contacted (hounded) immigration to deport me as my Work Permit was cancelled, leaving me with 7 days to get out or fix the situation... Had I been paid a decent wage that let me save a little, instead of living hand to mouth, I could have taken care of the situation....

Had the Employment people taken my case and acted decently, instead of just refusing my legal right and saying it was "farang problem", then things wouldnt have gotten as bad as they did...

And I know others have experienced situations out of their control and denied their rights to seek compensation.....

Yep, its not all cut and dried as some of you "nasty old men" make it out to be... Shame on you!

Edited October 26, 2015 by thhMan

[Soutpeel]

Mostly it's because they are skint and shouldn't have been here in the first place.

If someone is ill they can apply for an extension of stay on medical grounds.

90 day reporting is not overstaying.

​

Missing a 90 day report is overstaying; well It is at Jomtien anyway. I made the mistake of thinking that I needed to report 90 days after I got my retirement extension. I duly went to immigration 83 days later assuming I was a week early and was fined for overstaying and had it stamped so in my passport. I completely forgot that logic goes out of the window in Thailand. Anyway I know now.

Missing a 90 day report is not an overstay even at Jomtien, as your permission to stay stamp and date is still valid, you have been fined for non reporting, not overstaying, how can you overstay if your permission to stay is current and valid and remains so ?,

if it was truely and overstay, this means your permission to stay is invalid and you would have to reapply for your extension...so did you have to reapply for your retirement extension..? NO

and if they did put a stamp in your pp, it will be to note you have paid the fine, not that you were on an overstay

I believe you misunderstanding what has gone on

[dennis123]

Your post is interesting, mainly because it shows the mentality of many Thais and many Westerners is similar. Those who are successful and wealthy are justified in having an easy life. Those who have not (at least yet) inherited or earned a nest egg are undesirables, and it should be made as difficult as possible for them to better their lives.

On a point of information, while you can start a business in Thailand, you usually cannot legally own it. Of course, if you have money, the lawyers can find (illegal but tolerated) workarounds that allow you to retain effective control.

Maybe I take your words the wrong way but to me it sounds like you underestimate the accomplishment of this easy life. Most people are not born rich but worked hard for it.

I didn't return to Thailand for 12 years, that's what it took to get my act together and earn sufficient money to stay here so I feel zero pity for people coming here on a nickle and a dime just cause they want this easy life.

Edited October 26, 2015 by dennis123

[Time Traveller]

The only strange bit is this:

"For an offender who is arrested for overstaying their visa:

Overstay of less than 1 year = barred from re-entering Thailand for five years.

​

Overstay of more than 1 year = barred from re-entering Thailand for five years."

They could have just said if you don't hand yourself in and we catch you it's a 5 year ban.

That is pretty strict. Most foreigners working here have hardly any understanding of thai immigration law. I know I didn't when I started working in thailand.

Even the immigration staff hate talking to foreigners and usually communicate only with the employer's HR person. So how would you know anyway? Essentially, the average foreign worker is at the mercy of a 23 yr old HR girl who's probably more interested in her phone than in explaining to their expat employees what happens on their extensions of stay and at the end of their employment.

I know a lot of innocent people are going to get banned because of this law.

Edited October 26, 2015 by Time Traveller

[Benmart]

Comments and debate is fine for some. Me, I obey the immigration laws and leave others to decide for themselves.

[TEFLKrabi]

good overstayers are nothing but trouble for the rest of us who abide by the rules, it's not hard.

Looking at the photos, very very few were 'farang' overstayers. Mostly migrant workers so don't raise your blood pressure too high.

[bazza40]

good overstayers are nothing but trouble for the rest of us who abide by the rules, it's not hard.

Please explain how a person overstaying affects you in any way at all. Total rubbish.

It's quite simple. By overstaying and breaking the law, they tar "all" foreigners with the same brush, making it more likely that other visa restrictions/regulations also get tightened up in the near future rather than loosened.

Tar us with same brush? Most Thai people are barely aware of immigration laws at all and don't care about overstay.

Want to know what tars all foreigners with the same brush, which is a crime that is never enforced? Prostitution. Foriegners frequenting red light areas and walking around with hookers makes all foreigners look bad. All foreigners patronizing prostitutes should be banned for 5 years if they turn themselves in, 10 years if they don't.

Ah, an off topic moral arbiter. I have news for you. Shut down prostitution in Thailand, and the economy would go into a death spiral. So are you going to apply the same standards to male Thais, who are equally promiscuous?

[ericthai]

good overstayers are nothing but trouble for the rest of us who abide by the rules, it's not hard.

Please explain how a person overstaying affects you in any way at all. Total rubbish.

Looks like it's going to effect every overstay-er in the future.

So, because of all the people that overstayed their visa in the past with the I dont care just overstay attitude the rules are now being changed which effect anyone in the future. That is how!

If everyone would have followed the rules and maybe only overstayed a day here or there and not months and years this would not be happening.

Anyway why are you upset are you on overstay?

[Soutpeel]

The only strange bit is this:

"For an offender who is arrested for overstaying their visa:

Overstay of less than 1 year = barred from re-entering Thailand for five years.

​

Overstay of more than 1 year = barred from re-entering Thailand for five years."

They could have just said if you don't hand yourself in and we catch you it's a 5 year ban.

That is pretty strict. Most foreigners working here have hardly any understanding of thai immigration law. I know I didn't when I started working in thailand.

Even the immigration staff hate talking to foreigners and usually communicate only with the employer's HR person. So how would you know anyway? Essentially, the average foreign worker is at the mercy of a 23 yr old HR girl who's probably more interested in her phone than in explaining to their expat employees what happens on their extensions of stay and at the end of their employment.

I know a lot of innocent people are going to get banned because of this law.

"A lot of innocent people are going to get banned because of this law"

why ?

how hard is it to read a date in a passport which tells when you need to leave the country ?