Multiple Speakers - Recommendations pls.

[SoloFlyer]

Cant find an old thread that had lots of relevant info ...

But anyway, I'm revisiting my need for new speakers. I need a few sets for several areas, so need to spread the budget.

Part of the reason for re-visiting this now is that I've got a couple of the new chromecast audios - so multi-room streaming just got way easier and cheaper.

My reference would be the Harmon Kardon Sticks. But I do remember in that old thread, many alternatives were mentioned.

Rooms that need doing:

The home office - where I do a fair bit of sitting and listening and the sound generally percolates to surrounding rooms, but not loudly enough.

Bedroom - possibly hooked into TV?

Main Office - wouldn't mind a mobile / moveable setup.

Downstairs Living: Already has a NAD amp and B&W speakers, but toying with the idea of a 'lighter' back-up pair.

Bathroom: Yeah, overkill, but sick of listenting through iPhone in there.

What would be some options?? Diff rooms would have diff budgets, but lets say up to 15k per... (roughly)

[Kered]

Consider Sonos which is WiFi based controlled by a phone or tablet with the same or different music on each speaker.

[IMHO]

How exactly do you envisage this all working? You mention "a couple of Chromecast audio" adaptors, but then go on to mention several more locations than that.

Also, if your reference is the HK Sticks, why the need to consider something else, seeing as they're well within budget?

[IMHO]

In any case, seeing as your budget is 15K Baht/pair I'm going to throw out something I've recommended a few times before:

http://asia.jblpro.com/www/products/recording-broadcast/3-series/lsr305

Which are now officially imported to Thailand (finally) and sell for 14,900/pair: http://www.mahajak-pro.com/promotion/promotion-now-jbl-studio-monitor-lsr-3series/

You'd need a couple of RCA-1/4" phono adaptors to use them with your Chromecast Audio:

Even more than 2 years on from buying my first pair, I'm still yet to hear anything for this price, or double, that comes close.

I like them so much I'm now using 9 of them now for centre, surround, surround back, front height and rear height in my Atmos/DTS:X HT system - on top of the pair I still use in my home office, and the LSR308's I use in my bedroom

There's plenty of reviews online if you're into that kind of thing:

https://www.google.com/?q=jbl+lsr305+review

I particularly like this guy's style though

http://noaudiophile.com/JBL_LSR305/

Well, these sound good out the box. Not in a generic "it makes music good" way, but good on the level of "Compared to everything I've ever heard these sound good." In this setup these speakers have more detail than anything I've heard. Hands down no shit detail, not colored rising response detail. This is the kind that you get from a dead room with headlight beam dispersion speakers, but these are not headlights, and this room is anything but dead.

You should be able to get them for about 10% less than the (discounted) MSRP - or possibly even cheaper on eBay.

Edited April 25, 2016 by IMHO

[IMHO]

Consider Sonos which is WiFi based controlled by a phone or tablet with the same or different music on each speaker.

The Chromecast Audio does the same thing - i.e. multi-room audio streaming from phone/tablet/pc

[KittenKong]

Consider Sonos which is WiFi based controlled by a phone or tablet with the same or different music on each speaker.

The Chromecast Audio does the same thing - i.e. multi-room audio streaming from phone/tablet/pc

Chromecast does something similar to Sonos. Nothing that I am aware of does exactly what Sonos does, or as well or completely as Sonos does it. The only areas in which Sonos falls down are the lack of HD audio support and lack of any built-in way to stream PC audio.

And with Chromecast any speakers and amps will be an extra purchase whereas Sonos speakers require nothing more.

It is true that other manufacturers are steadily closing the gap with Sonos.

[IMHO]

Consider Sonos which is WiFi based controlled by a phone or tablet with the same or different music on each speaker.

The Chromecast Audio does the same thing - i.e. multi-room audio streaming from phone/tablet/pc

Chromecast does something similar to Sonos. Nothing that I am aware of does exactly what Sonos does, or as well or completely as Sonos does it. The only areas in which Sonos falls down are the lack of HD audio support and lack of any built-in way to stream PC audio.

And with Chromecast any speakers and amps will be an extra purchase whereas Sonos speakers require nothing more.

It is true that other manufacturers are steadily closing the gap with Sonos.

Of course you're right - but with Sonos you've got nowhere to go on sound quality - it is what it is... For the same money as the Sonos Play3, the LSR305's are in a different universe, IMHO

[KittenKong]

I suggest that the OP takes a look at Yamaha MusicCast. I have this and it's rather good.

[KittenKong]

Of course you're right - but with Sonos you've got nowhere to go on sound quality - it is what it is... For the same money as the Sonos Play3, the LSR305's are in a different universe, IMHO

Sonos does make non-Play devices for those who prefer to source their own speakers (or even their own amp and speakers): so you dont have to restrict yourself as far as speaker quality goes.

A large part of what you are paying for in the Play range is the Sonos software, functionality and regular updates (and excellent support), which cant really be compared with simple powered speakers.

But it all has a price and certainly no one could ever accuse Sonos of being a budget solution. I got my Play5 units on special offer prices at different times from various EU Amazon sites (and they still weren't cheap), largely because I knew I could fit them in my checked luggage and that they offer a good quality, all-in-one and portable solution that covers all the needs of a condo-dweller who likes internet radio and streaming local audio files and improving TV audio.

I also recommended them to a couple of technophobe friends who like them for their simplicity and clean lines.

[SoloFlyer]

Thanks guys.

Yes, the CCA way cheaper than the Sonos, which was what I was talking about, or meant. I've always had my eyes on Sonos, but the comments above are correct - its a very walled environment. With the CCA I can add that to existing equipment and expand as I please.

IMHO - Thanks. I think the JBLs you mention are the ones I was referring to in the lost thread. I wasted one of my 6 days in Melbourne last year going from one JB hi-fi to the next on the hunt for the single pair they had in stock - to eventually be told that they were a returned dud set!!

By your comments you'd use these for all environs? I mentioned the sticks, just as a reference point.

I plan to get more of the CCA's - as they do what I'm looking for. Grouped the two I have over the weekend, having Spotify play from one device to 2 locations. That capability is said to expand later in the year ...

[IMHO]

IMHO - Thanks. I think the JBLs you mention are the ones I was referring to in the lost thread. I wasted one of my 6 days in Melbourne last year going from one JB hi-fi to the next on the hunt for the single pair they had in stock - to eventually be told that they were a returned dud set!!

By your comments you'd use these for all environs? I mentioned the sticks, just as a reference point.

I've used them practically everywhere now, even outdoors as poolside speakers where they still impressed. They're definitely not limited to nearfield use only.

You should be able to audition them here in TH now - Mahajak started importing them officially late last year. When you do audition, make sure they're adequately spaced apart, and then walk all the way around the room, even to the totally off-axis corners so you can hear their unique 'trick' - even at highly acute listening angles these still present a full sound stage with width, height and depth - something you can never achieve from the 'ghetto blaster format' home speakers being produced these days

[SoloFlyer]

^ cheers. Thats what I was looking for. For the main two pair. (Both offices).

[SoloFlyer]

Typical ... experience ... I try to hold it in ... but but but .... end of it all, got a set being delivered for testing next week. Frustrating.

[IMHO]

Here's a video you can watch while you're waiting, LOL:

I still remember having the same basic "wow, how do I use words that give these things justice, but don't make it sound like I'm saying they're better than $5000 speakers?" reaction when I first heard them about 2 years ago - now they're just my standard by which other speakers are judged - if if those others are only 4x the price, they're probably losing

He gets a few things wrong though: First, -10dBV is the setting you'd use for RCA input - +4dBV is what you'd use with an XLR drive. Next, he thinks these are JBL home line speakers and goes on to mention how far their home gear has come. They're not home speakers though, they're professional studio mastering monitors. Lastly, he clearly hasn't used the matching JBL LSR10s sub - because it does all the crossover duties for itself and the LSR305's. That said, I suspect you won't need a sub, unless your room has particularly difficult dead spots, or you want to have an EDM party

Edited April 29, 2016 by IMHO

[SoloFlyer]

^ cheers IMHO, will watch when I've done my morning duties. Found the old thread yday too... so got that to read up on too.

Appreciated.

The kid on the phone yesterday tried to tell me they were 8k per pair. I said "you sure"? ... yes yes. At that point I ordered 4 sets! Needless to say I got a phone call shortly after.

[IMHO]

^ cheers IMHO, will watch when I've done my morning duties. Found the old thread yday too... so got that to read up on too.

Appreciated.

The kid on the phone yesterday tried to tell me they were 8k per pair. I said "you sure"? ... yes yes. At that point I ordered 4 sets! Needless to say I got a phone call shortly after.

Right, they're sold at 7,900 each, or 14,900 a pair - gotta watch that.

My Thai vendor gave me an extra 10% off those prices (inc. VAT), so push yours for a discount

[SoloFlyer]

Great Vid. Was waiting for the technicalities... (thankfully) they never came. His loss of words was good enough to sell me.

[melvinmelvin]

OP said:

"Downstairs Living: Already has a NAD amp and B&W speakers, but toying with the idea of a 'lighter' back-up pair.

Bathroom: Yeah, overkill, but sick of listenting through iPhone in there."

bathroom; nope, not overkill to have decent speakers there if you spend time in the room,

like in the tub reading a book enjoying a drink or whatever

downstairs living; don't NAD and B&W suffice? what do you mean by back-up pair? back speakers like in a 4 channel system?

dunno which B&W you have but if they are reasonably upscale they should do well on their own

had quadro from the very start of that stuff, went sick of it - back to quality stereo

had this 5/6/7 channel home theatre stuff from the early start, went sick of it - back to quality stereo

this last change resulted in some B&Ws surplus,

I now have ample stereo(tuner, amp, discplayer) and B&Ws in office, guestroom, kitchen, bedroom, living room

don't think I'll ever move from stereo again

----

Sonos are fairly OK, several JBLs are OK, Accoustic Energy ain't bad, there are MANY fairly good speakers out there, just find your taste

B&Ws are not for everyone, the sound is quite different from most speakers.

[SoloFlyer]

^ The amp and speakers in the main room I didn't give thought to when designing the living room ... Just thought I'd squeeze em in to the cabinets around the TV ... I'm not into that special spacing and stands etc ... but I didn't allow them enough air to breathe ... they get too hot, esp the amp ... so was thinking some cheapish speakers for casual listening ....

I've currently got some bad humming through the B&W's and there's a delay between TV and audio if I try to do the movie thing .... I ain't no electronic guru when it comes to the backside of these things ... so was thinking a backup pair of speakers in this area might be more efficient. If that makes sense. I know its all on youtube these days .... but its not someting I wanna spend half a day on ...

[IMHO]

B&Ws are not for everyone, the sound is quite different from most speakers.

That's for sure. I bought some of the new B&W 6-series a few years ago for my bedroom, replaced them with Jamo Concerts after a few months because I just couldn't get them to sound the way I wanted.. I later replaced the Jamo's with KEF LS50's (and some new electronics) - which was a big step up at the time - they were later replaced by JBL LSR305's.

So I've gone from 35K Baht speakers, to 40K Baht, to 50K Baht, and then to 15K Baht - and each step the sound has improved

I'm now running some LSR308's in that room, but even with the bass trimmed down they're still just too much speaker for the space, so will probably be changing them back to the LSR305's.

Edited May 1, 2016 by IMHO

[IMHO]

^ The amp and speakers in the main room I didn't give thought to when designing the living room ... Just thought I'd squeeze em in to the cabinets around the TV ... I'm not into that special spacing and stands etc ... but I didn't allow them enough air to breathe ... they get too hot, esp the amp ... so was thinking some cheapish speakers for casual listening ....

I've currently got some bad humming through the B&W's and there's a delay between TV and audio if I try to do the movie thing .... I ain't no electronic guru when it comes to the backside of these things ... so was thinking a backup pair of speakers in this area might be more efficient. If that makes sense. I know its all on youtube these days .... but its not someting I wanna spend half a day on ...

One point of note there is that the amp plates on the LSR's run absolutely cool - I've never even felt them get warm, let alone hot.

[SoloFlyer]

^ Great to hear. I'm itching for Wednesday to come around now.

IMHO, how would you go about hooking a set of these to a TV?

Could I bother your for your vendors contact? (In-case maharaj (?!) wont budge on price).

[IMHO]

^ Great to hear. I'm itching for Wednesday to come around now.

IMHO, how would you go about hooking a set of these to a TV?

Could I bother your for your vendors contact? (In-case maharaj (?!) wont budge on price).

In my bedroom I use the TV's 1/8" headphone out - to RCA - to 1/8" phono.

In my office I use a USB Focusrite 2i2, then balanced XLR's to each speaker.

In my home theatre I use a Marantz AV7702MkII pre-pro, then balanced XLR's to each speaker.

If your TV has RCA outs with volume control (mine doesn't) you'd just use RCA patch leads to the RCA-1/8" phono adaptor.

[IMHO]

Here's another video to watch while you wait for Wednesday:

Skip to 1:45

Although these types of comparisons are usually fairly useless, because you're listening to speaker via a mic and then through your own speakers, this one is semi-useful because it includes the source track itself - so it does provide an indication of how the speakers in the video are coloring the sound.

As you will hear, the only thing the LSR305's really do is compress dynamic range, and drop some low-end - which is unavoidable for a speaker, and of course some of it will be the mic too. The other speakers are changing the whole tone of the recording though.

Edited May 1, 2016 by IMHO

[SoloFlyer]

Well the testers arrived today. Needed to delay till tomorrow, but they're closed for 5 days, so ditched work and I now have some mighty fine sounding stacks of cash on my desk.

They take up more space than I was expecting. And I probably have the worse positioning possible for them - backs against the wall, just over a meter apart, 1 foot above my head. But they do sound damn good and I'm for sure hearing pleasant sounds that weren't there last time I listened to this music.

Thanks IMHO for your great and helpful assistance.

[IMHO]

Well the testers arrived today. Needed to delay till tomorrow, but they're closed for 5 days, so ditched work and I now have some mighty fine sounding stacks of cash on my desk.

They take up more space than I was expecting. And I probably have the worse positioning possible for them - backs against the wall, just over a meter apart, 1 foot above my head. But they do sound damn good and I'm for sure hearing pleasant sounds that weren't there last time I listened to this music.

Thanks IMHO for your great and helpful assistance.

For nearfield listing, 1M apart shouldn't be an issue - if you ever use these as room speakers you will want further separation between them though.

What is an issue is the proximity to the wall - that is almost certainly boosting some bass frequencies, while negating the extra bass extension normally provided by the ports. Things you could try:

* Angling the speakers inwards a little so the bass reflex port can breathe a little better, and standing waves aren't exactly parallel to the speaker.

* Try using the -2dB bass trim control

* Set the speakers on some Auralex MoPads

None of these will completely solve the problem of having them up against a wall, but they should help.

In regards to the Auralex MoPads. They look gimmicky, yes, but they're not - they really do work. They will also give you the ability to angle the speakers down a bit. Here's a Thai vendor for them: http://hifipart.com/cart/categorydetail.asp?catid=&subcatid=&proid=789 but you'll find them cheaper overseas or on Thai hifi forums. You need a pair for each speaker, so 4 in total.

Oh yes, they are bigger than what you imagine for a 5" woofer cabinet. The 8" woofer versions are absolutely massive though - you could fit 3 of the 5" cabinets in the space of the 8" cabinet

Edited May 4, 2016 by IMHO

[SoloFlyer]

Cheers for that.

I think I'm going to have to re-work things in the office. The desk/shelves are fixed to the wall. So I have to leave the speakers as are, or perhaps think about placing them behind me at the other end of the room - about 5-6 metres. I do kinda like em up close though.

The other office is much worse - narrow fixed shelving on walls - they would have to go sides to the wall, probably 1.5 metres behind me, 5m apart, with me off-centre.

[IMHO]

Cheers for that.

I think I'm going to have to re-work things in the office. The desk/shelves are fixed to the wall. So I have to leave the speakers as are, or perhaps think about placing them behind me at the other end of the room - about 5-6 metres. I do kinda like em up close though.

The other office is much worse - narrow fixed shelving on walls - they would have to go sides to the wall, probably 1.5 metres behind me, 5m apart, with me off-centre.

Off centre listening is not a problem - you can stand right in front of one of them and still hear a stereo image. Heck you can stand against a side wall and still hear a stereo image These things have a very wide sweetspot. Speakers behind you is a worry though - you're not going to hear them at their best with your back to them

Edited May 12, 2016 by IMHO

[SoloFlyer]

Sounds like in that office I will have to ask the desk to part with its attachment to the wall.

The other office I have no idea how I can work em.

I suppose wall mounted brackets with extension arms are a bad, bad idea??

[IMHO]

Sounds like in that office I will have to ask the desk to part with its attachment to the wall.

The other office I have no idea how I can work em.

I suppose wall mounted brackets with extension arms are a bad, bad idea??

I use wall brackets for my 4x surround-height speakers:

I haven't tried this at ear level or for mains, but I have no reason to suspect it wouldn't work.

I got these brackets off eBay, after the two local suppliers I found both came back to me to say "no have".

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pair-Steel-Large-Bookshelf-Speaker-Side-Clamping-Wall-Mount-Brackets-Black-/310405008416?hash=item4845948c20

http://www.mynke.com/index.php?lay=show&ac=cat_show_pro_detail&cid=27326&pid=115831

Edited May 13, 2016 by IMHO