Even though we voted for it, a Brexit won't happen in the end. Here's why

[tribalfusion001]

If the US tells us to "walk back", then thats what we will do, we have been the US's poodle since the end of WW2.

So, we have stalemate, no informal discussions (EU) and no article 50 before discussions (UK), is this now limboBrexit?

The government will say Brexit will cause too much harm to the economy and we will leave the option of leaving with the mandate in the future.

The whole thing will be a fudge, loss of face and a complete waste of time. Boris or May won't invoke article 50, just like Cameron didn't, but he promise to, he squirmed out of that, no one will have balls to do it just in case we get a worse deal.

Checkmate...

[Thaiwine]

If the US tells us to "walk back", then thats what we will do, we have been the US's poodle since the end of WW2.

So, we have stalemate, no informal discussions (EU) and no article 50 before discussions (UK), is this now limboBrexit?

The government will say Brexit will cause too much harm to the economy and we will leave the option of leaving with the mandate in the future.

The whole thing will be a fudge, loss of face and a complete waste of time. Boris or May won't invoke article 50, just like Cameron didn't, but he promise to, he squirmed out of that, no one will have balls to do it just in case we get a worse deal.

Checkmate...

That does not seem to be the noise coming out of Washington

http://www.speaker.gov/general/speaker-ryan-calls-free-trade-agreement-uk-after-brexit

[Jumper]

In my years here I rarely post.

I'm an American so it can be debated if I have a horse in this race.

Maybe the Brits have just voted themselves into recession. That's to be seen, but I wonder if anyone here understands the EU concept of Qualified Majority Voting? If so, maybe you can explain it ti the masses.

For sure the Brits have just shot themselves in the foot in near term economic terms, but maybe that was better than shooting themselves in the head in terms of the long term solution.

In my mind there is not a simple answer to this complex question. For sure the Brits economically would be better off (now) staying in the union, but at what long term cost? The loss of sovereignty over their own country?

Again, speaking as an American, I would pay the price to throw off the yoke of debilitating regulation so that my progeny might live free of it.

My support to David Cameron. He is a leader the west needs more of.

We regularly get recessions, in fact many people haven't come out of the last one. It is time to think long term and the Soviet styled EU was certainly not the future for 'ol Blighty.

Who we need now is the love child of Ludwig Erhard and Sir John Cowperthwaite to sort it out.

For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple and wrong. - H.L. Mencken.

To me an understanding of the EU concept of Qualified Majority Voting is where the EU really went off the rails.

If that doesn't do it for you google the EU positions on Common and Foreign Security Policy and Justice and Home Affairs.

The EU is a grand experiment in Europe that we all hope will succeed, but in it's current incarnation t's a train wreck waiting to happen.

This is the main reason (actually the only reason) I voted leave . . .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2-cQ8TfU4A

Stuffy old goats, but the message isn't wrong.

A bit of tin foil hat stuff for me, but the Brits are a sovereign nation and can take whatever position they want.

On a lighter side we should remember Monty Python's Upper Class Twit of the Year Contest:

Brits: We're not laughing at you, we're laughing with you. This was, after all a Brit production.

Certainly no offense intended, and I'm equally ready to laugh with you all at various possible American faux pas.

[tribalfusion001]

If the US tells us to "walk back", then thats what we will do, we have been the US's poodle since the end of WW2.

So, we have stalemate, no informal discussions (EU) and no article 50 before discussions (UK), is this now limboBrexit?

The government will say Brexit will cause too much harm to the economy and we will leave the option of leaving with the mandate in the future.

The whole thing will be a fudge, loss of face and a complete waste of time. Boris or May won't invoke article 50, just like Cameron didn't, but he promise to, he squirmed out of that, no one will have balls to do it just in case we get a worse deal.

Checkmate...

That does not seem to be the noise coming out of Washington

http://www.speaker.gov/general/speaker-ryan-calls-free-trade-agreement-uk-after-brexit

He is a republican and John Kerry said about walking back the referendum, Clinton is likely to be the next US president, Trump is a very long shot to get elected.

[Thaiwine]

And more good news Boeing has chosen Britain for it's new European headquarters even if we leave the EU

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-3497621/Boeing-s-Brexit-boost-World-s-largest-aircraft-maker-picks-Britain-home-new-European-headquarters.html

[tribalfusion001]

And more good news Boeing has chosen Britain for it's new European headquarters even if we leave the EU

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-3497621/Boeing-s-Brexit-boost-World-s-largest-aircraft-maker-picks-Britain-home-new-European-headquarters.html

Brexit won't happen, I voted for it, the establishment don't actually want it to happen. If the UK government were serious they would have invoked article 50 last Friday, they didn't, all over!

[MJP]

And more good news Boeing has chosen Britain for it's new European headquarters even if we leave the EU

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-3497621/Boeing-s-Brexit-boost-World-s-largest-aircraft-maker-picks-Britain-home-new-European-headquarters.html

Brexit won't happen, I voted for it, the establishment don't actually want it to happen. If the UK government were serious they would have invoked article 50 last Friday, they didn't, all over!

I doubt full Brexit will happen, more likely a halfway house like the Norwegian model. Tweaks to immigration likely, including prevention of criminal gangs entering the UK and a right to deport criminals. No further political integration. Associate membership, which the UK pays for but able to make free trade deals outside the EU. Cooler heads will prevail, they won't be politicians bonces but business leaders.

Too much at stake on both side of the English Channel.

Edited June 29, 2016 by MJP

[Thaiwine]

And more good news Boeing has chosen Britain for it's new European headquarters even if we leave the EU

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-3497621/Boeing-s-Brexit-boost-World-s-largest-aircraft-maker-picks-Britain-home-new-European-headquarters.html

Brexit won't happen, I voted for it, the establishment don't actually want it to happen. If the UK government were serious they would have invoked article 50 last Friday, they didn't, all over!

I have a sneaky suspicion you maybe right but I'm not writing it off yet, the Uk politicians like their gravy train, they will need a good getout clause to get elected in the next election should they circumvent the peoples wishes.

[Thaiwine]

And more good news Boeing has chosen Britain for it's new European headquarters even if we leave the EU

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-3497621/Boeing-s-Brexit-boost-World-s-largest-aircraft-maker-picks-Britain-home-new-European-headquarters.html

Brexit won't happen, I voted for it, the establishment don't actually want it to happen. If the UK government were serious they would have invoked article 50 last Friday, they didn't, all over!

I doubt full Brexit will happen, more likely a halfway house like the Norwegian model. Tweaks to immigration likely, including prevention of criminal gangs entering the UK and a right to deport criminals. No further political integration. Associate membership, which the UK pays for. Cooler heads will prevail, they won't be politicians bonces but business leaders.

Too much at stake on both side of the English Channel.

I am hoping for a full getout and back to WTO rules and start fresh from there, get back our fishing grounds potential 50.000 jobs there, for me no fudges we get what we want or we walk.

[tribalfusion001]

And more good news Boeing has chosen Britain for it's new European headquarters even if we leave the EU

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-3497621/Boeing-s-Brexit-boost-World-s-largest-aircraft-maker-picks-Britain-home-new-European-headquarters.html

Brexit won't happen, I voted for it, the establishment don't actually want it to happen. If the UK government were serious they would have invoked article 50 last Friday, they didn't, all over!

I have a sneaky suspicion you maybe right but I'm not writing it off yet, the Uk politicians like their gravy train, they will need a good getout clause to get elected in the next election should they circumvent the peoples wishes.

I wouldn't write it off either. I think the government have set themselves up for a stalemate and the EU leaders the same, a bit like the battle of the Somme, 100 years ago.

Edited June 29, 2016 by tribalfusion001

[MJP]

And more good news Boeing has chosen Britain for it's new European headquarters even if we leave the EU

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-3497621/Boeing-s-Brexit-boost-World-s-largest-aircraft-maker-picks-Britain-home-new-European-headquarters.html

Brexit won't happen, I voted for it, the establishment don't actually want it to happen. If the UK government were serious they would have invoked article 50 last Friday, they didn't, all over!

I doubt full Brexit will happen, more likely a halfway house like the Norwegian model. Tweaks to immigration likely, including prevention of criminal gangs entering the UK and a right to deport criminals. No further political integration. Associate membership, which the UK pays for. Cooler heads will prevail, they won't be politicians bonces but business leaders.

Too much at stake on both side of the English Channel.

I am hoping for a full getout and back to WTO rules and start fresh from there, get back our fishing grounds potential 50.000 jobs there, for me no fudges we get what we want or we walk.

Me too. I'd sooner just have free trade deals around the World without strings.

[jope]

But then on the bright side I have just seen this

http://heatst.com/uk/11-countries-gearing-up-to-strike-trade-deals-with-britain/

See we don't need the EU it's only about one week

Unfortunately (I am not using the word ironically), these trade deals, if they actually materialize, may not be enough to make good for the losses. I am not an expert in economy but my understanding is that the City of London contributes decisively to the GNP. Without a deal with the EU a lot of this trade will be gone. Just a few percent less will hit the British budget hard. And many foreign banks and traders are in London because it gives them access to the whole European market, These banks and traders will have no reason to stay in the UK. Dublin or Paris or Frankfurt will suit them better (Dublin being a good candidate because of this funny little language they speak ).

Don't get me wrong. I do not hope that that will happen but I think there is good chance that it will. That being said, I always wonder why so many people on this forum wish for the EU to collapse. I understand that people feel British and want to remain independent (I do not, I regard myself as being patriotic but nevertheless I would describe myself as a European from Germany like many of my friends and colleagues would describe themselves as Europeans from France or Holland or wherever). So, that I understand but I would not want the UK to collapse or the British people to suffer. Obviously, for some people it is not enough "to win", the others also have to lose. Why is that, I wonder. My hobby-psychological diagnosis: they maybe simply a-holes.

[jope]

double post

Edited June 29, 2016 by jope

[MJP]

But then on the bright side I have just seen this

http://heatst.com/uk/11-countries-gearing-up-to-strike-trade-deals-with-britain/

See we don't need the EU it's only about one week

Unfortunately (I am not using the word ironically), these trade deals, if they actually materialize, may not be enough to make good for the losses. I am not an expert in economy but my understanding is that the City of London contributes decisively to the GNP. Without a deal with the EU a lot of this trade will be gone. Just a few percent less will hit the British budget hard. And many foreign banks and traders are in London because it gives them access to the whole European market, These banks and traders will have no reason to stay in the UK. Dublin or Paris or Frankfurt will suit them better (Dublin being a good candidate because of this funny little language they speak ).

Don't get me wrong. I do not hope that that will happen but I think there is good chance that it will. That being said, I always wonder why so many people on this forum wish for the EU to collapse. I understand that people feel British and want to remain independent (I do not, I regard myself as being patriotic but nevertheless I would describe myself as a European from Germany like many of my friends and colleagues would describe themselves as Europeans from France or Holland or wherever). So, that I understand but I would not want the UK to collapse or the British people to suffer. Obviously, for some people it is not enough "to win", the others also have to lose. Why is that, I wonder. My hobby-psychological diagnosis: they maybe simply a-holes.

Quite agree. No reasonable person wants to see Europe collapse, quite the opposite. But I'd like to see Europe thrive without the EU. It's an outdated model.

[Thaiwine]

But then on the bright side I have just seen this

http://heatst.com/uk/11-countries-gearing-up-to-strike-trade-deals-with-britain/

See we don't need the EU it's only about one week

Unfortunately (I am not using the word ironically), these trade deals, if they actually materialize, may not be enough to make good for the losses. I am not an expert in economy but my understanding is that the City of London contributes decisively to the GNP. Without a deal with the EU a lot of this trade will be gone. Just a few percent less will hit the British budget hard. And many foreign banks and traders are in London because it gives them access to the whole European market, These banks and traders will have no reason to stay in the UK. Dublin or Paris or Frankfurt will suit them better (Dublin being a good candidate because of this funny little language they speak ).

Don't get me wrong. I do not hope that that will happen but I think there is good chance that it will. That being said, I always wonder why so many people on this forum wish for the EU to collapse. I understand that people feel British and want to remain independent (I do not, I regard myself as being patriotic but nevertheless I would describe myself as a European from Germany like many of my friends and colleagues would describe themselves as Europeans from France or Holland or wherever). So, that I understand but I would not want the UK to collapse or the British people to suffer. Obviously, for some people it is not enough "to win", the others also have to lose. Why is that, I wonder. My hobby-psychological diagnosis: they maybe simply a-holes.

You may well be right about job loses there obviously will be some, who knows how hard it will be? I doubt anyone can know but there will be a price for restructuring, some jobs will go some will be created the pize is an inderpendent UK, there are plenty of countries around the world where we can make bespoke trade deals for specific customer needs, I think we will be better stronger out.

I donot wish the EU ill tho I suspect it will struggle more with out the UK, the EU has many problems can it survive as it now is? I don't know same as us time will tell.

[tribalfusion001]

But then on the bright side I have just seen this

http://heatst.com/uk/11-countries-gearing-up-to-strike-trade-deals-with-britain/

See we don't need the EU it's only about one week

Unfortunately (I am not using the word ironically), these trade deals, if they actually materialize, may not be enough to make good for the losses. I am not an expert in economy but my understanding is that the City of London contributes decisively to the GNP. Without a deal with the EU a lot of this trade will be gone. Just a few percent less will hit the British budget hard. And many foreign banks and traders are in London because it gives them access to the whole European market, These banks and traders will have no reason to stay in the UK. Dublin or Paris or Frankfurt will suit them better (Dublin being a good candidate because of this funny little language they speak ).

Don't get me wrong. I do not hope that that will happen but I think there is good chance that it will. That being said, I always wonder why so many people on this forum wish for the EU to collapse. I understand that people feel British and want to remain independent (I do not, I regard myself as being patriotic but nevertheless I would describe myself as a European from Germany like many of my friends and colleagues would describe themselves as Europeans from France or Holland or wherever). So, that I understand but I would not want the UK to collapse or the British people to suffer. Obviously, for some people it is not enough "to win", the others also have to lose. Why is that, I wonder. My hobby-psychological diagnosis: they maybe simply a-holes.

The US don't want the EU to collapse, far from it, It's a buffer against Russia and Putin. We, the British never like the EU, but it seems we are too far down the line to divorce without harming our own economy for 5 to 10 years.

After watching England lose to Iceland, I don't hold much hope of us getting a good trade deal, the place is run by fools, even that buffoon Corbyn won't quit!

[MJP]

But then on the bright side I have just seen this

http://heatst.com/uk/11-countries-gearing-up-to-strike-trade-deals-with-britain/

See we don't need the EU it's only about one week

Unfortunately (I am not using the word ironically), these trade deals, if they actually materialize, may not be enough to make good for the losses. I am not an expert in economy but my understanding is that the City of London contributes decisively to the GNP. Without a deal with the EU a lot of this trade will be gone. Just a few percent less will hit the British budget hard. And many foreign banks and traders are in London because it gives them access to the whole European market, These banks and traders will have no reason to stay in the UK. Dublin or Paris or Frankfurt will suit them better (Dublin being a good candidate because of this funny little language they speak ).

Don't get me wrong. I do not hope that that will happen but I think there is good chance that it will. That being said, I always wonder why so many people on this forum wish for the EU to collapse. I understand that people feel British and want to remain independent (I do not, I regard myself as being patriotic but nevertheless I would describe myself as a European from Germany like many of my friends and colleagues would describe themselves as Europeans from France or Holland or wherever). So, that I understand but I would not want the UK to collapse or the British people to suffer. Obviously, for some people it is not enough "to win", the others also have to lose. Why is that, I wonder. My hobby-psychological diagnosis: they maybe simply a-holes.

The US don't want the EU to collapse, far from it, It's a buffer against Russia and Putin. We, the British never like the EU, but it seems we are too far down the line to divorce without harming our own economy for 5 to 10 years.

After watching England lose to Iceland, I don't hold much hope of us getting a good trade deal, the place is run by fools, even that buffoon Corbyn won't quit!

Take heart old chap . . .

http://edition.cnn.com/2016/06/28/opinions/brexit-overreaction-lessons-lynn/

[Jumper]

And more good news Boeing has chosen Britain for it's new European headquarters even if we leave the EU

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-3497621/Boeing-s-Brexit-boost-World-s-largest-aircraft-maker-picks-Britain-home-new-European-headquarters.html

Come on, what's all the fuss about (speaking as an American)? What, you might have to pay a 3% duty on goods into the continent? Get real and join the rest of the world! UK manufacturing can compete!

A basic economic premise: nations become wealthy by producing wealth. We don't get wealthy by serving hamburgers to each other, we get wealthy by real production of wealth: manufacturing, mining, agriculture, etc.

Banking services (that the UK might loose) do not produce wealth. They do not make the pie bigger, they only decide how the pie is sliced.

UK have confidence that your US brothers are with you in your search in determining your own future. We broke from King George over 200 years ago over similar issues, and we are with you today.

[tribalfusion001]

But then on the bright side I have just seen this

http://heatst.com/uk/11-countries-gearing-up-to-strike-trade-deals-with-britain/

See we don't need the EU it's only about one week

Unfortunately (I am not using the word ironically), these trade deals, if they actually materialize, may not be enough to make good for the losses. I am not an expert in economy but my understanding is that the City of London contributes decisively to the GNP. Without a deal with the EU a lot of this trade will be gone. Just a few percent less will hit the British budget hard. And many foreign banks and traders are in London because it gives them access to the whole European market, These banks and traders will have no reason to stay in the UK. Dublin or Paris or Frankfurt will suit them better (Dublin being a good candidate because of this funny little language they speak ).

Don't get me wrong. I do not hope that that will happen but I think there is good chance that it will. That being said, I always wonder why so many people on this forum wish for the EU to collapse. I understand that people feel British and want to remain independent (I do not, I regard myself as being patriotic but nevertheless I would describe myself as a European from Germany like many of my friends and colleagues would describe themselves as Europeans from France or Holland or wherever). So, that I understand but I would not want the UK to collapse or the British people to suffer. Obviously, for some people it is not enough "to win", the others also have to lose. Why is that, I wonder. My hobby-psychological diagnosis: they maybe simply a-holes.

The US don't want the EU to collapse, far from it, It's a buffer against Russia and Putin. We, the British never like the EU, but it seems we are too far down the line to divorce without harming our own economy for 5 to 10 years.

After watching England lose to Iceland, I don't hold much hope of us getting a good trade deal, the place is run by fools, even that buffoon Corbyn won't quit!

Take heart old chap . . .

http://edition.cnn.com/2016/06/28/opinions/brexit-overreaction-lessons-lynn/

It doesn't effect me very much, apart from if food and beer prices go up. I work online and get paid in US $ and I do match betting in UK £. I'll be out of here in September and back to BKK, hopefully for the autumn and winter.

[MJP]

^^Hope I'll be back around November when the first phase of this Blighty project's finished. Back home with the kids. Then it's endless "Dad, give me, get me I want!" for a few months.

[Richard W]

My understanding is that a lot of people voted to leave based on xenophobia and racism. So the day after their "victory" they realized the Poles and the Muslims, etc. aren't going anywhere. Oops!

Unfortunately, many people have assumed we will have to do this ourselves rather than via government agencies.

Other European countries are seeing it in simple terms.

You voted to leave, so you will leave.

There is no mechanism to reverse this vote and another referendum is out of the question.

The referendum was advisory, not mandatory.

I believe the decision to leave come under the royal prerogative, and so will be made by the government, not Parliament. On Monday, Cameron stated in parliament that the decision would be made by the government, not by parliament.

[Farang99]

My understanding is that a lot of people voted to leave based on xenophobia and racism. So the day after their "victory" they realized the Poles and the Muslims, etc. aren't going anywhere. Oops!

As a non Brit you understand...........

The true reason for Brexit had nothing to do with immigration or xenophobia. It was the reaction to laws imposed on Britain by an un-elected group of uncivil servants.

[daveAustin]

My understanding is that a lot of people voted to leave based on xenophobia and racism. So the day after their "victory" they realized the Poles and the Muslims, etc. aren't going anywhere. Oops!

Then you clearly have no understanding whatsoever.

My understanding is that a lot of people voted to leave based on xenophobia and racism. So the day after their "victory" they realized the Poles and the Muslims, etc. aren't going anywhere. Oops!

some folk talk utter rubbish since when has wanting to take back control of your country and maintain a good relationship with Europe been racist and xenophobic?

Don't feed the troll.

[teatree]

And more good news Boeing has chosen Britain for it's new European headquarters even if we leave the EU

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-3497621/Boeing-s-Brexit-boost-World-s-largest-aircraft-maker-picks-Britain-home-new-European-headquarters.html

Come on, what's all the fuss about (speaking as an American)? What, you might have to pay a 3% duty on goods into the continent? Get real and join the rest of the world! UK manufacturing can compete!

A basic economic premise: nations become wealthy by producing wealth. We don't get wealthy by serving hamburgers to each other, we get wealthy by real production of wealth: manufacturing, mining, agriculture, etc.

Banking services (that the UK might loose) do not produce wealth. They do not make the pie bigger, they only decide how the pie is sliced.

UK have confidence that your US brothers are with you in your search in determining your own future. We broke from King George over 200 years ago over similar issues, and we are with you today.

The is no reason why the UK can't reach out to countries such as the US, Aus, NZ, India etc as well as the EU.

People talk about 'little Englanders', but I think it's more of a case of 'little Europeans'. There is a big, wide world out there, why focus on one small part of it? We live in an increasingly global economy and as long as we are locked into a failing, protectionist, inward looking EU we are missing out on the opportunities that the whole globe offers.

We are less than a week into Brexit and already we have a queue of countries eager to strike trade deals.

https://heatst.com/uk/11-countries-gearing-up-to-strike-trade-deals-with-britain/

Australian PM Turnbull has suggested a AUS/NZ/UK singe trade deal.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-06-27/turnbull-orders-orders-urgent-review-of-brexit-implications/7546890

There are fantastic opportunities for the UK and I see a bright future once we get over the inevitable turbulence.

[teatree]

In my years here I rarely post.

I'm an American so it can be debated if I have a horse in this race.

Maybe the Brits have just voted themselves into recession. That's to be seen, but I wonder if anyone here understands the EU concept of Qualified Majority Voting? If so, maybe you can explain it ti the masses.

For sure the Brits have just shot themselves in the foot in near term economic terms, but maybe that was better than shooting themselves in the head in terms of the long term solution.

In my mind there is not a simple answer to this complex question. For sure the Brits economically would be better off (now) staying in the union, but at what long term cost? The loss of sovereignty over their own country?

Again, speaking as an American, I would pay the price to throw off the yoke of debilitating regulation so that my progeny might live free of it.

My support to David Cameron. He is a leader the west needs more of.

We regularly get recessions, in fact many people haven't come out of the last one. It is time to think long term and the Soviet styled EU was certainly not the future for 'ol Blighty.

Who we need now is the love child of Ludwig Erhard and Sir John Cowperthwaite to sort it out.

For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple and wrong. - H.L. Mencken.

To me an understanding of the EU concept of Qualified Majority Voting is where the EU really went off the rails.

If that doesn't do it for you google the EU positions on Common and Foreign Security Policy and Justice and Home Affairs.

The EU is a grand experiment in Europe that we all hope will succeed, but in it's current incarnation t's a train wreck waiting to happen.

This is the main reason (actually the only reason) I voted leave . . .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2-cQ8TfU4A

Stuffy old goats, but the message isn't wrong.

Thanks for the link.

The presentation of the video isn't the best - looks like something from the 1970's even though it is actually less than 10 years old - but the information is bang on and that is what counts.

Anyone who thinks the Leave vote was about xenophobia should watch this video. We voted to leave in order to regain the rights and freedoms we fought for centuries to win.

[tonray]

In my years here I rarely post.

I'm an American so it can be debated if I have a horse in this race.

Maybe the Brits have just voted themselves into recession. That's to be seen, but I wonder if anyone here understands the EU concept of Qualified Majority Voting? If so, maybe you can explain it ti the masses.

For sure the Brits have just shot themselves in the foot in near term economic terms, but maybe that was better than shooting themselves in the head in terms of the long term solution.

In my mind there is not a simple answer to this complex question. For sure the Brits economically would be better off (now) staying in the union, but at what long term cost? The loss of sovereignty over their own country?

Again, speaking as an American, I would pay the price to throw off the yoke of debilitating regulation so that my progeny might live free of it.

My support to David Cameron. He is a leader the west needs more of.

We regularly get recessions, in fact many people haven't come out of the last one. It is time to think long term and the Soviet styled EU was certainly not the future for 'ol Blighty.

Who we need now is the love child of Ludwig Erhard and Sir John Cowperthwaite to sort it out.

To me an understanding of the EU concept of Qualified Majority Voting is where the EU really went off the rails.

If that doesn't do it for you google the EU positions on Common and Foreign Security Policy and Justice and Home Affairs.

The EU is a grand experiment in Europe that we all hope will succeed, but in it's current incarnation t's a train wreck waiting to happen.

This is the main reason (actually the only reason) I voted leave . . .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2-cQ8TfU4A

Stuffy old goats, but the message isn't wrong.

Thanks for the link.

The presentation of the video isn't the best - looks like something from the 1970's even though it is actually less than 10 years old - but the information is bang on and that is what counts.

Anyone who thinks the Leave vote was about xenophobia should watch this video. We voted to leave in order to regain the rights and freedoms we fought for centuries to win.

Ha ha...you mean the rights and freedoms your colonial ambitions denied the South Asians and the Africans whose resources you pillaged to become the wealthy nation you are ? Another revisionist in our midst. Perhaps now without the yoke of EU 'oppression' you can resume pillaging some poor souls somewhere in the world.

Edited June 30, 2016 by tonray

[teatree]

In my years here I rarely post.

I'm an American so it can be debated if I have a horse in this race.

Maybe the Brits have just voted themselves into recession. That's to be seen, but I wonder if anyone here understands the EU concept of Qualified Majority Voting? If so, maybe you can explain it ti the masses.

For sure the Brits have just shot themselves in the foot in near term economic terms, but maybe that was better than shooting themselves in the head in terms of the long term solution.

In my mind there is not a simple answer to this complex question. For sure the Brits economically would be better off (now) staying in the union, but at what long term cost? The loss of sovereignty over their own country?

Again, speaking as an American, I would pay the price to throw off the yoke of debilitating regulation so that my progeny might live free of it.

My support to David Cameron. He is a leader the west needs more of.

We regularly get recessions, in fact many people haven't come out of the last one. It is time to think long term and the Soviet styled EU was certainly not the future for 'ol Blighty.

Who we need now is the love child of Ludwig Erhard and Sir John Cowperthwaite to sort it out.

To me an understanding of the EU concept of Qualified Majority Voting is where the EU really went off the rails.

If that doesn't do it for you google the EU positions on Common and Foreign Security Policy and Justice and Home Affairs.

The EU is a grand experiment in Europe that we all hope will succeed, but in it's current incarnation t's a train wreck waiting to happen.

This is the main reason (actually the only reason) I voted leave . . .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2-cQ8TfU4A

Stuffy old goats, but the message isn't wrong.

Thanks for the link.

The presentation of the video isn't the best - looks like something from the 1970's even though it is actually less than 10 years old - but the information is bang on and that is what counts.

Anyone who thinks the Leave vote was about xenophobia should watch this video. We voted to leave in order to regain the rights and freedoms we fought for centuries to win.

Ha ha...you mean the rights and freedoms your colonial ambitions denied the South Asians and the Africans whose resources you pillaged to become the wealthy nation you are ? Another revisionist in our midst. Perhaps now without the yoke of EU 'oppression' you can resume pillaging some poor souls somewhere in the world.

What? Wow, you really have a chip on your shoulder.

A revisionist? Must I preface each post with an apology for the crimes my country has done against others? The UK has oppressed people and done terrible things, AS HAS EVERY SINGLE NATION ON EARTH! Thankfully, the world has moved on since the colonial age and we are much more enlightened.

So, no, I shall not beat myself with a whip as do not have any guilt for something I had no part in. You can flagellate yourself for whatever crimes your country has done if you like, but I shall pass.

[KarenBravo]

Banking services (that the UK might loose) do not produce wealth.

With that single statement it shows that you know sweet FA about the subject.

You don't think that maybe all those manufacturing industries might need financial services for loans, currency exchanges, insurance schemes, share and bond issues?

Without these services, they couldn't exist, never mind expand and compete.

You're thinking went out of style in the nineteenth century, and your statement was discredited a long, long time ago.

Edited June 30, 2016 by KarenBravo

[Dene16]

My understanding is that a lot of people voted to leave based on xenophobia and racism. So the day after their "victory" they realized the Poles and the Muslims, etc. aren't going anywhere. Oops!

As a non Brit you understand...........

The true reason for Brexit had nothing to do with immigration or xenophobia. It was the reaction to laws imposed on Britain by an un-elected group of uncivil servants.

First and foremost I shall state that I voted to leave and do not believe I will ever regret that decision

Although some points on both sides are valid they don’t address the underlying problems

If David Caneron had come back from Brussels with something other than the meaningless piece of garbage that he came back with I might have voted in the other direction.

Immigration played a huge part in this referendum and everyone living in areas totally taken over by migrants voted accordingly However many of the people that voted to stay did not live in these areas or get to see the kind of devastation this was having on our society. Therefore voting for the status quo and basing their decision solely on our current economy. The problem lies in that people only look at the short-term effects.

I am certainly not racist as I applaud these migrants (I would be here also if I were in their position)

Yes, our economy will suffer, we are heading into uncharted waters that no one can predict or see the outcome. We will have some control of our borders but I am unsure how we are going to stop free movement if we need to go into the single market

Our problems began when Chancellor Gordon Brown gave the go ahead to except unlimited immigrants into the country in 2004 when the rest of Europe put a 7 year hold on new movement for new countries joining the EU, No one then could foresee the implications

It is better we suffer now as in 5 years time it will be too late to turn the clock back and the consequences will be ten fold

Manufacturing has and will continue to fall but this is largely due to the continued enlargement of the EU. Each time new countries have joined manufacturers have moved to take advantage of cheap labour and greater infrastructure funded by the EU (fact). Too many examples to mention,

In or out this was never going to change but it would affect us in that we would have an increased, out of control population (the majority being migrants) with no work

No problem though because we have a very generous welfare system!!!! For migrants anyway.

We no longer have the means to support the continued migration to this country in such vast numbers, housing, hospitals, schools etc.

One way or the other it was and is, always going to be a struggle. Better we attempt to deal with it now before its too late

[FinChin67]

Uk at least escaped this horror:

Britain dodges European Union superstate bullet

And they do not need to be involved in industry like this:

First-Person Testimonial from a Former Refugee Volunteer

Edited June 30, 2016 by FinChin67