Condos rotting?

[12DrinkMore]

What is the realistic expected life of a condo built in Thailand?

This article reckons that the rebar is slowly corroding away and that 50 to 100 years is the most to be expected. That is based on US building practices. I would be surprised if Thai standards would be at the same level and subject to the same inspections.

Are the condos destined to become uninhabitable monuments in just a few decades? Maybe turning into slums as the poor enjoy a 3,000,000 Baht hazardous view as the structure crumbles around them?

https://theconversation.com/the-problem-with-reinforced-concrete-56078

Edited July 10, 2016 by 12DrinkMore

[Jingthing]

I'd say 30 to 50 years is realistic.

[topt]

Interesting article OP - thanks.

[Delight]

Suspect that after 50 years a condo will be seen as so old fashioned that few will wish to live there.

[12DrinkMore]

Suspect that after 50 years a condo will be seen as so old fashioned that few will wish to live there.

If the building is still structurally sound it could be modernized at a reasonable cost. If the building is rotting away from the inside nobody is going to invest, and existing owners probably will not be able to sell, nor want to fund the costs of demolition and a rebuild.

If the article is accurate, then this is going to be a massive global problem.

[trogers]

The oldest highrise hotel in Thailand is the Indra Hotel at Pratunam. Built in 1976.

The oldest highrise condo in Thailand is Premier in Phrom Phong. Built in 1983.

Both are still standing strong...

Edited July 10, 2016 by trogers

[12DrinkMore]

The oldest highrise hotel in Thailand is the Indra Hotel at Pratunam. Built in 1976.

The oldest highrise condo in Thailand is Premier in Phrom Phong. Built in 1983.

Both are still standing strong...

Exactly, the oldest high-rise in Thailand is just 40 years old, and anecdotal evidence is that the more modern buildings have a cheaper construction. I am certainly not an expert, I wonder if this internal damage can be detected before cracks appear?

I guess most high-rises have been erected in the last 20 to 25 years.

Some don't last more than a couple of years. Such as that shopping centre on Phuket. Wonder what is happening there?

[trogers]

The oldest highrise hotel in Thailand is the Indra Hotel at Pratunam. Built in 1976.

The oldest highrise condo in Thailand is Premier in Phrom Phong. Built in 1983.

Both are still standing strong...

Exactly, the oldest high-rise in Thailand is just 40 years old, and anecdotal evidence is that the more modern buildings have a cheaper construction. I am certainly not an expert, I wonder if this internal damage can be detected before cracks appear?

I guess most high-rises have been erected in the last 20 to 25 years.

Some don't last more than a couple of years. Such as that shopping centre on Phuket. Wonder what is happening there?

Perhaps that shopping centre was build by a shop house contractor.

Building technology comprising of tower crane, ready-mixed concrete, concrete pump, precast concrete and post-tension came to Thailand in 1980 and was employed for the hotel, office and shopping complex of Central Lardprao.

[swissie]

Another aspect: The "Pacific Ring of Fire", not all that far away from Thailand, is one of the most active geological zones. I wonder, how many of the High-Rises (Condos) in Pattaya could withstand a "major rumble"?

Cheers.

[thrilled]

GBe careful of any built with wood.Termites will destroy it

[peterrabbit]

The question is whether a condo block would ever be condemned by the authorities even if it is in obvious danger of collapse. I suspect the answer to that would be never or at least before part or all of it had already collapsed. Then it would be classed as unsafe until 'repairs' had been carried out.

Remember that TIT and any 'safety certificates' required, can be easily 'acquired' from the relevant authorities.

[peterrabbit]

Another aspect: The "Pacific Ring of Fire", not all that far away from Thailand, is one of the most active geological zones. I wonder, how many of the High-Rises (Condos) in Pattaya could withstand a "major rumble"?

Cheers.

Pattaya is built on reclaimed sea marsh land so it would probably liquidate in a serious earthquake. I suspect that a shallow major earthquake in the immediate location would see most of Pattaya's highrise buildings sink and topple.

I think a more likely threat is hurricane winds blowing from the south. The biggest force on any building is windage and those View Talay buildings and others (without foundations into bed rock) are very big sail areas for 200mph+ winds!

[Torrens54]

Okay,so don't buy a condo unless you plan on flogging it off well before The Rot Sets In.

[trogers]

Another aspect: The "Pacific Ring of Fire", not all that far away from Thailand, is one of the most active geological zones. I wonder, how many of the High-Rises (Condos) in Pattaya could withstand a "major rumble"?

Cheers.

Pattaya is built on reclaimed sea marsh land so it would probably liquidate in a serious earthquake. I suspect that a shallow major earthquake in the immediate location would see most of Pattaya's highrise buildings sink and topple.

I think a more likely threat is hurricane winds blowing from the south. The biggest force on any building is windage and those View Talay buildings and others (without foundations into bed rock) are very big sail areas for 200mph+ winds!

I have never heard of any major sea reclamation works in Thailand since being here from 1983...

[manarak]

Another aspect: The "Pacific Ring of Fire", not all that far away from Thailand, is one of the most active geological zones. I wonder, how many of the High-Rises (Condos) in Pattaya could withstand a "major rumble"?

Cheers.

Pattaya is built on reclaimed sea marsh land so it would probably liquidate in a serious earthquake. I suspect that a shallow major earthquake in the immediate location would see most of Pattaya's highrise buildings sink and topple.

I think a more likely threat is hurricane winds blowing from the south. The biggest force on any building is windage and those View Talay buildings and others (without foundations into bed rock) are very big sail areas for 200mph+ winds!

lol... it must be very expensive to build hills on reclaimed marsh land, hihihihi.

*some* areas are certainly reclaimed marsh lands on a small scale, but most of Pattaya is built on normal soil.

[manarak]

Regarding concrete as a building material, I would like to point to the romans who used concrete to erect buildings which are still around nowadays, some 2000 years later.

Of course, the condos were not built using the same building techniques, but concrete as such cannot be faulted, only poor workmanship and poor design.

Edited July 10, 2016 by manarak

[KittenKong]

Suspect that after 50 years a condo will be seen as so old fashioned that few will wish to live there.

What can be old-fashioned about a condo? They are just several concrete floors with walls to divide up the units, and some elevators. The elevators can be replaced if needed and the inside of the the units can be renovated if needed also.

I actually prefer old buildings because they tend to have a lot more space than newer ones, the materials used tend to be better quality and most modern design is so tasteless as to be a joke.

[12DrinkMore]

Regarding concrete as a building material, I would like to point to the romans who used concrete to erect buildings which are still around nowadays, some 2000 years later.

Of course, the condos were not built using the same building techniques, but concrete as such cannot be faulted, only poor workmanship and poor design.

The article discusses that.

Romans did not use iron rebar.

It is the corrosion and expansion of the rebar as it corrodes that causes the concrete to crack.

[aussiandrew]

It's the age old question on the life of any building.

The key question has got to be has the building has schedule documented maintenance work carry out by experienced companies.

Ensuring the land has adequate drainage installed to remove excess water during the rainy seasons.

[sharecropper]

Around Pattaya it is common to see major cracks on 'new' buildings only a few years old, and also rusting steel rods quickly becoming exposed through concrete and discolouring the 'new' paintwork.

Really shoddy builds here over the past few years.

[impulse]

One more reason that renting a condo may prove to be more cost effective. Especially with the humidity and salt air in Thailand. It'll be interesting to see how long some of them last before they're condemned for safety or just high maintenance costs.

Edited July 13, 2016 by impulse

[12DrinkMore]

One more reason that renting a condo may prove to be more cost effective. Especially with the humidity and salt air in Thailand. It'll be interesting to see how long some of them last before they're condemned for safety or just high maintenance costs.

This is Thailand. I doubt whether they will be condemned.

The high-rises will stand until they don't. And when they don't, you will not find anybody responsible.

It is karma. The only maintenance will be to pay the monks to come and visit.

[thai3]

The oldest highrise hotel in Thailand is the Indra Hotel at Pratunam. Built in 1976.

The oldest highrise condo in Thailand is Premier in Phrom Phong. Built in 1983.

Both are still standing strong...

Not it's not, that would be the Dusit Thani built in 1970 and the highest building in Bkk at the time

[Henryford]

One more reason that renting a condo may prove to be more cost effective. Especially with the humidity and salt air in Thailand. It'll be interesting to see how long some of them last before they're condemned for safety or just high maintenance costs.

Even if the condo only lasts 50 years i think that is longer than i will be around and still makes buying a much better bet than renting.

[Buzzz]

The oldest highrise hotel in Thailand is the Indra Hotel at Pratunam. Built in 1976.

The oldest highrise condo in Thailand is Premier in Phrom Phong. Built in 1983.

Both are still standing strong...

When a condo detrroriates beyond repairs the CoOwners can vote to liquidate the land.

Land in the central business district is around 450,000bt per SQM.

[trogers]

The oldest highrise hotel in Thailand is the Indra Hotel at Pratunam. Built in 1976.

The oldest highrise condo in Thailand is Premier in Phrom Phong. Built in 1983.

Both are still standing strong...

When a condo detrroriates beyond repairs the CoOwners can vote to liquidate the land.

Land in the central business district is around 450,000bt per SQM.

Most here do not understand the value of land and that the value of real estate is measured in decades.

[Jingthing]

The oldest highrise hotel in Thailand is the Indra Hotel at Pratunam. Built in 1976.

The oldest highrise condo in Thailand is Premier in Phrom Phong. Built in 1983.

Both are still standing strong...

When a condo detrroriates beyond repairs the CoOwners can vote to liquidate the land.

Land in the central business district is around 450,000bt per SQM.

What percentage of owners would you need for that?

[12DrinkMore]

The oldest highrise hotel in Thailand is the Indra Hotel at Pratunam. Built in 1976.

The oldest highrise condo in Thailand is Premier in Phrom Phong. Built in 1983.

Both are still standing strong...

When a condo detrroriates beyond repairs the CoOwners can vote to liquidate the land.

Land in the central business district is around 450,000bt per SQM.

What percentage of owners would you need for that?

Probably 100% unless it is written into the contracts. Which I doubt it is.

Otherwise it would surely be construed as theft and destruction of property.

And if that is correct, then there is absolutely no chance that the building can ever be demolished.

If I was the last person to not sign and the rest wanted to buy me out, the price would reach the nearest galaxy.

[Jingthing]

I assumed 100 percent as well.

[oxo1947]

Its confusing---we were always taught at school that you must have 2 elements to make rust----oxygen & water, i.e as seen in news strips the SS. Titanic has no rust. How does the oxygen & water get through the concrete, all over, (understand there might be a crack in a part of a building) but enough to condemn the whole building. Still if correct then Pattaya will be the least of the worlds problems....better look at Singapore New York etc.

P......no I don't live in a Condo--didn't have any built when I moved to Issan.

Rusting

Iron and steel rust when they come into contact with water and oxygen. Both water and oxygen are needed for rusting to occur. In the experiment below, the nail does not rust when air or water is not present. Remember that 21 per cent of the air is oxygen.

Calcium chloride absorbs water in the right-hand test tube