what do you do if you are too old to get insurance?

[USNret]

4 hours ago, johnnybgood said:

When my insurance becomes untenable here,  I intend to return to Blighty. The wife can follow if she wants to. 
Why should Thailand be the terminus? The place has no soul.

 

Why not leave now? You sound very unhappy here. It's not worth staying in a place you despise. 

[JaseTheBass]

1 hour ago, JSixpack said:

 

Exactly. You've hit the nail on head. Return to Blighty is the best possible solution. Many, in fact, wisely don't wait for the health insurance issue to arise. Fortunately we have lots of helpful threads on the forum about moving back to the UK. Hart in Hampshire looks lovely, no cesspool that: Best places to live in the UK: Hart in Hampshire tops list for the fifth year in a row.

 

I bet there's lots of lovely, affordable accomodation to be had, too.

[Kwasaki]

2 hours ago, chiang mai said:

I have 5 mill set aside for this purpose and have had for the past ten years, it has nothing to do with my income or my savings, it's completely separate. And as said, I review each medical scenario as it arises, I don't rule out the possibility that I may return to the UK at some point in the future, if I do I will be ahead by at least twelve years health insurance premiums.

 

I guess everyone to their own and with respect sorry that don't make sense to me, in 10 years my health accident life insurance cover would of cost me 408,000 baht,  you may not mind returning to UK but l do one of the reasons apart from getting older l took it out.

 

1 hour ago, OMGImInPattaya said:

Can you name any that covers expatriates in Thailand?  I don't know of any...and if they do, after a certain age the premiums become prohibitively expensive for the limited coverage provided.

Basically, after 60 or 65, expats have to self-insure or rely on the cheap government hospitals.

 

As said yes you can,  you only have enquire, Google can be good for your health too. 

 

@  OP said. " I'm nearly to that stage.!! " ......What stage is that,  you've had good advice here you have a choice.

OP said. " Do you cast yourself at the mercy of the Thai public health hospitals? " ....You can run up high costs in Thai Gov hospitals too, again you have a choice. 

 

[impulse]

1 hour ago, Deepinthailand said:

Not so but if that's your experiance then you picked the wrong company 

 

Yeah.  Thousands of families every year figure out the picked the wrong one.  Usually too late.  Right after they get the termination notice and no other company will take them on because of the expensive condition they got terminated for.

 

My point?  Research the company before you count on them.  Find others who have actually had BIG claims with the company and talk to them.  Not the guys who have had all their 5,000 baht claims payed on time.  BIG claims, for chronic illness with the prospect of more big claims in the future.  See how they've been treated.  Because the guys in the photos on the website always look happy.

 

Keep in mind insurance isn't about that one big incident.  It's gotta take you to the end of your life, and if you end up with a chronic illness- that's a lot of claims over lots of years.

[4MyEgo]

5 hours ago, chiang mai said:

I've been "self insuring" for more than twelve years and it's worked well for me and I intend to continue to do so, I will review each health related scenario that emerges and take a view at that time. Most likely I will continue to use the doctors and hospitals I know well, for the larger things I have no problems using the Provincial Hospital here, I've seen them in action several times and I'm impressed. I suggest that if you are going to do the same that you should get over any reluctance or stigma associated with provincial hospitals first.

 

I am 56 and have tried twice through brokers to get cover for a pre-existing condition (heart attack), clot back in 2008, stent cleared the blockage, and never felt better since and don't need Viagra or anything else as the blood flow is awesome, but to the intending insurers, I am a risk, suffice to say, I will also self insure myself and use the 85,000 baht a year that they could have had, and build on that if and when an event ever happens. If they think I would give them 85,000 baht for just health cover, without my pre-existing condition, they can kiss my left one

 

If the Australian government looked after its own, including expat retiree's (self funded) and allowed them to pay the Medicare levy surcharge of 2% as non residents, I wouldn't be in the is predicament, but know, leave it for those on Centrelink who don't contribute to anything, makes sense, doesn't it, besides, if you don't live in Australia and don't contribute to Australia, your an outcast, unless you qualify for Centrelink, what was those famous words Gough used back in the 70's. 

[facthailand]

Thailand Travel Shield

http://thailandtravelshield.tourismthailand.org

B12,000/year for B2mil coverage

Only caveat is coverage is only for 60 day periods after which one needs to leave & re-enter

[4MyEgo]

7 minutes ago, facthailand said:

Thailand Travel Shield

http://thailandtravelshield.tourismthailand.org

B12,000/year for B2mil coverage

Only caveat is coverage is only for 60 day periods after which one needs to leave & re-enter

 

Always read the fine prints:

 

Can foreigner purchase this insurance after arriving in Thailand?

This insurance policy will cover only tourist who has purchased the insurance before traveling to Thailand. Therefore, if the insured has arrived Thailand then purchased the insurance. This would be considered default. The purchase and coverage are considered voidable.

 

Can foreigner who permanently resides in Thailand purchase this insurance?

Foreigner with permanent residency in Thailand is not eligible to purchase this insurance and the coverage will be voidable.

[soalbundy]

6 hours ago, johnnybgood said:

When my insurance becomes untenable here,  I intend to return to Blighty. The wife can follow if she wants to. 
Why should Thailand be the terminus? The place has no soul.

 

4 hours ago, chiang mai said:

 

 

 

6 hours ago, johnnybgood said:

When my insurance becomes untenable here,  I intend to return to Blighty. The wife can follow if she wants to. 
Why should Thailand be the terminus? The place has no soul.

Like the UK NHS has a soul ? A health insurance wont make you invincible, after a certain age you are living on borrowed time. In past centuries people lived and died without medical assistance, many died younger than need be but they still died quite successfully.  

[chiang mai]

Exactly. And I'm under no illusion that if returned to the UK with a dread disease that my time on a waiting list would probably see me out anyway, who wants to live for ever for goodness sake.

[thaibeachlovers]

4 hours ago, Moonlover said:

There is the old saying 'Prevention is better than cure'. I take that proverb quite seriously, when it comes to this topic. No one will offer me insurance now as I'm post 70, so I take matters into my own hands.

 

Taking care of oneself through regular exercise, watching one's weight and eating healthily are, for me the key ingredients in keeping away from the doctor's office. I also meditate daily and monitor my blood pressure regularly.

 

One of the big threats to health here is alcohol and it can very difficult to avoid at times. It is in the culture,of  both falangs and Thais. I've been horrified by the amount of drinking that takes place among the Thai community and the adverse affect it has on their health.

 

Many of my wife's friends and relatives, from the village have succumbed at an early age due to renal failure, directly attributable to alcohol. We haven't taken the pledge completely, but we both now strictly limit our intake.

 

At the end of the day, we are responsible for our own health. Doctors and hospitals only have an interest in sick people, not healthy ones.

 

I thoroughly recommend the website 'webmd' as a useful guide to healthy living. And if you are so minded, look up Dr. Walter Bortz - 'Dare to be 100' on YouTube. It is very interesting.

 

Stay healthy, live well.

 

I understand what you are saying, but I'm more concerned as to emergencies as in being knocked down by a baht bus and have a broken leg requiring expensive surgery and such.

With long term illnesses I would go home if possible. With the amount of tax I paid in my life I earned that care. However, can't get on a plane with a shattered femur.

 

To those that say keep paying the insurance, I would if I could keep paying ever increasing large amounts of cash for it, but I don't have 5 million to put aside. Good luck if you do, but that's not what I'm asking about.

 

The only way I can stay in LOS till I  die is to get the pension paid here, and to get my pension paid in LOS I have to live in home country for 2 years more, and I can't afford to be paying insurance here for 2 years when I don't live here, and that means I won't get insurance if I come back, so round and round it goes.

I guess I've always accepted that one day lack of money would see me boarding a plane in LOS for the very last time, but I'd like to put it off as long as possible.

 

Thanks to all that answered.

[geronimo]

You carry on with your life regardless, and maybe are extra careful, and take good care of the physical bit.

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, Deepinthailand said:

Not so but if that's your experiance then you picked the wrong company

So, are you going to tell us the right one?

[Kwasaki]

44 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

Exactly. And I'm under no illusion that if returned to the UK with a dread disease that my time on a waiting list would probably see me out anyway, who wants to live for ever for goodness sake.

 

Before Trans beats me to it. 

 

[thaibeachlovers]

4 hours ago, elliottm said:

Give up whoring (at your age) and use your home country health care?

Good grief!

There's more to LOS than whoring, and I don't want to go "home".

[Deepinthailand]

14 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

So, are you going to tell us the right 

There is no right or wrong horses for courses I've had mine for a long time but if I was to go to them now I dare say they would ramp up the money and put certain restrictions. Age is and always has been a cash cow for insurance companies. Mine tell me as I have already said they will cover everything but every year they ramp up the fee. In 1 year when I retire I will in all probability end it and self fund. Everyone could tell you what we get but same insurance company might tell you diffrent. All this about they won't pay out for big claims I belive to be rubbish and scaremongering.

[OMGImInPattaya]

3 hours ago, chiang mai said:

 

AXA, Cigna and Pacific Cross all insure past age 65.

Ok...but what are the premiums and what's the coverage...do they cover pre-existing conditions...what are the lifetime benefits and per occurrence?

 

From just a cursory look at AXA Thailand's website, there "cancer" policy, which a senior might think a prudent purchase, is only renewable up to age 65...funny how that seems to corrolate to when someone may actually get cancer...

 

• No medical checkup required
• Total compensation in the event of claim
• Provides coverage for of cancer
• Coverage for skin cancer, 20% sum is insured
• Coverage for unlimited unmarried children age 1-22 years old for the family plan.
• Renewal up to age 65

 

As for one of their "senior" policies, it comes with a generous 60k coverage per illness...which will get you allot of treatment at a government hospital but not much from a private one, where most foreigners would want to be treated.

 

• Maximum coverage up to 60,000 THB per accident/illness

It will be the same with all the insurers...they're in the business to make as much money as they can, which means paying the least in claims and not insuring bad risks...and in health insurance, this means keeping old people out of the insurance pool. You're just kidding yourself if you think otherwise.

[chiang mai]

3 minutes ago, OMGImInPattaya said:

Ok...but what are the premiums and what's the coverage...do they cover pre-existing conditions...what are the lifetime benefits and per occurrence?

 

From just a cursory look at AXA Thailand's website, there "cancer" policy, which a senior might think a prudent purchase, is only renewable up to age 65...funny how that seems to corrolate to when someone may actually get cancer...

 

• No medical checkup required
• Total compensation in the event of claim
• Provides coverage for of cancer
• Coverage for skin cancer, 20% sum is insured
• Coverage for unlimited unmarried children age 1-22 years old for the family plan.
• Renewal up to age 65

 

As for one of their "senior" policies, it comes with a generous 60k coverage per illness...which will get you allot of treatment at a government hospital but not much from a private one, where most foreigners would want to be treated.

 

• Maximum coverage up to 60,000 THB per accident/illness

It will be the same with all the insurers...they're in the business to make as much money as they can, which means paying the least in claims and not insuring bad risks...and in health insurance, this means keeping old people out of the insurance pool. You're just kidding yourself if you think otherwise.

 

They all have different rules regarding existing conditions, some have a waiting period of a few years, some want a waiting period AND a co-pay and so on. You'd need to contact each one to obtain their rules but coverage is definitely available, at a price.

[khunPer]

When one reach 65+ year in Thailand, insurance cover goes up, so it's worth considering ones heath situation against costly insurance vs. self-insurance. A reasonable health insurance easily cost up to 100,000 baht or more a year, whilst a more affordable or cheap health insurance often is not worth the money, as the cover for each incident is so limited; i.e. annual cover up to 300,000 baht, but each incident only up to 30,000 baht all inclusive, annual cost close to 15,000 baht.

 

Insured or not, you will always need some easy access cash in a "rainy-day account", let that grow by some monthly deposits while you still have an insurance, so you always have some fund, just in case. How much for self-insurance is a good question – some says around 800,000 baht; others mention 3 million baht – and when that money has gone in an expensive private hospital, what then for the following years..?

 

I think it's a balance of your health situation and what you can afford. The Thai government hospitals I've seen, seems fairly Okay – especially compared to how public hospitals has developed in my Scandinavian home country over the past decades – and the fees are affordable. I believe you can manage quite a bit with even smaller savings – and meanwhile hope that the Thai government may come up with an affordable alien-healthcare-cover, as your back-up.

 

When I moved here on early retirement (57 yo) I bought a reasonable insurance – in my home country we had government paid health care, so insurance were never an option – but instead of the most expensive and best cover, I downgraded one step and saved the difference in a "rainy-day account". When I passed 60+ I reconsidered my health insurance situation – being in fair shape and good family history of senior health – and changed to a cheaper insurance, just in case that health-insurance would be mandatory for Visa-extension, and paid the remaining fee I otherwise should have given to an insurance company into my rainy-day account. When reaching 65 I decided to give up insurance and be self-insured – was luckily able to deposit some little extra cash into my account – but continue to pay a monthly "insurance fee" to myself. I'm aware of the risk, if I run out of funds; but I'm guaranteed to end this life anyway at some point, whatever happens...

Edited September 16, 2016 by khunPer

[balo]

When you die you die , if no insurance and no money just stop eating and your body will give up, 

 

 

[Aladdin]

I had an expensive BUPA insurance and this is getting really expensive the older you get (when you're getting really old) and they don't insure you after reaching a certain age. I have solved this by going "home" once every third year and I take a travel insurance. So far I have saved a lot of money and I had no problem to get 16,000 Baht back that I paid at Bangrumrad for a 1 hour visit when I had tonsillitis.

 

Yes, 16000 Baht and I was chocked and this was the last time I was at Bangrumrad after having been a customer there for more than 20 years. Now I go to the hospital on Thong Lor and I have been happy with every visit and I have never had to bother my insurance company again

Edited September 16, 2016 by Aladdin

[Fookhaht]

When you die you die , if no insurance and no money just stop eating and your body will give up, 

 

 

Just a little Bundle of Sunshine, aren't we?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Moonlover]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I understand what you are saying, but I'm more concerned as to emergencies as in being knocked down by a baht bus and have a broken leg requiring expensive surgery and such.

With long term illnesses I would go home if possible. With the amount of tax I paid in my life I earned that care. However, can't get on a plane with a shattered femur.

 

To those that say keep paying the insurance, I would if I could keep paying ever increasing large amounts of cash for it, but I don't have 5 million to put aside. Good luck if you do, but that's not what I'm asking about.

 

The only way I can stay in LOS till I  die is to get the pension paid here, and to get my pension paid in LOS I have to live in home country for 2 years more, and I can't afford to be paying insurance here for 2 years when I don't live here, and that means I won't get insurance if I come back, so round and round it goes.

I guess I've always accepted that one day lack of money would see me boarding a plane in LOS for the very last time, but I'd like to put it off as long as possible.

 

Thanks to all that answered.

Well Beachlover, I can speak from experience on that one. It happened to me a year ago. Not on the street, but on my own front porch which was wet and slippery. The only honest answer that I can give you is make sure you have a credit card available. It's just about the only thing that will get you out of that jam!

 

But, for all that, my earlier comments do still have credence. By keeping fit, alert agile and above all sober, you're less likely to have an accident. But in the end, it's still down to 'lady luck'. Good luck!

Edited September 16, 2016 by Moonlover
Grammar correction

[NancyL]

7 hours ago, chiang mai said:

 

The main government hospital in the province, typically the largest and best equipped. In CM that's Mahraj/Suan Dok which is linked in to other provincial hospitals they exchange services with, CM for example trades open heart surgery with Lamphun Provincial Hospital, if one is full then the their partner is the fallback and CM residents could find themselves in either.

Actually, Maharaj (Suan Dok) hospital is a regional medical center, the teaching hospital of Chiang Mai University and serves northern Thailand.  Thai residents in Muang Chiang Mai who are part of the basic Thai "30 baht program" obtain their medical care at Nakorn Ping hospital, just north of Lanna golf course and need a referral to receive services at Suan Dok hospital.  Otherwise, they have to pay out-of-pocket to see the doctors at Suan Dok, just as we foreigners do.

 

I'd not want to have open heart surgery at Lamphun Provincial hospital.  It's definitely not on the same level as Suan Dok when it comes to complex procedures.  Sadly, I know one lovely Thai lady who was quoted a wait time of over six months for cardiac bypass surgery at Suan Dok, but could have it done within a couple weeks in Lamphun.  She died on the surgical table in Lamphun.

[chiang mai]

8 minutes ago, NancyL said:

Actually, Maharaj (Suan Dok) hospital is a regional medical center, the teaching hospital of Chiang Mai University and serves northern Thailand.  Thai residents in Muang Chiang Mai who are part of the basic Thai "30 baht program" obtain their medical care at Nakorn Ping hospital, just north of Lanna golf course and need a referral to receive services at Suan Dok hospital.  Otherwise, they have to pay out-of-pocket to see the doctors at Suan Dok, just as we foreigners do.

 

I'd not want to have open heart surgery at Lamphun Provincial hospital.  It's definitely not on the same level as Suan Dok when it comes to complex procedures.  

 

Yes OK they are technically Regional Hospitals, being the largest government hospital in the province, force of habit makes me refer to them as Provincial not regional. The strict definitions are:

 

Regional hospitals (โรงพยาบาลศูนย์) are in provincial centres, have a capacity of at least 500 beds and have a comprehensive set of specialists on staff.

General hospitals (โรงพยาบาลทั่วไป) are in province capitals or major districts and have a capacity of 200 to 500 beds.

Community hospitals (โรงพยาบาลชุมชน) are at the district level and further classified by size:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_in_Thailand

[mankondang]

7 hours ago, Farang99 said:

And no company will insure you if you have any pre-existing health problems. In which case you depend  on the sympathy and help of your local doctor. They always ask if you have insurance, and when you say "no" and why, they will often prescribe drugs you can buy in town at a pharmacy rather than from the hospital, and try to avoid any expensive diagnosis tests.

Not exactly true. The insurance company will NOT insure you for THE existing health problem. For example, if you have a pre-existing heart problem, then you can still get insurance for cancer of the bowel, etc.

[Gary A]

My provider had in the contract that they would never drop me because of age. They didn't tell me that they would price me out, which they did. I am now self insured and the money I saved on premiums so far would cover even the most serious problems. I have a substantial nest egg that would cover nearly anything. Our provincial hospital is quite good. A couple years ago I had a stroke. The hospital put me through the mill. An MRI, lots of different tests over three days which I had no idea what they were for and even a chest X Ray. I thought I may have to make a couple trips to the ATM. When we checked out, they gave me a whole bag of drugs. I was surprised when I got the final bill. A whopping 7,000 baht. I go to a small local hospital every three months for a blood test to check many different things. They give me a three month supply of whatever the doctor prescribes. The last visit cost a total of 550 baht, drugs and all.

[impulse]

27 minutes ago, Gary A said:

My provider had in the contract that they would never drop me because of age. They didn't tell me that they would price me out, which they did.

 

There was a US insurance company that advertised for years on TV that "you can never be singled out for a rate increase".  What they did was to raise the rates on everyone in your plan, then offer a cheaper plan to the healthy people.   Which, of course, the healthy people jumped on, leaving a higher percentage of sick people in the plan.  So the rates went up.  And they offered cheaper plans to the healthy people...

 

Eventually, they had plans with nobody but the morbidly ill, and they raised the rates every year until they all went away.

[drummer boy]

Hi terry you are right i am married to a goverment woman but she is a officer The workers only get insurance not for there husbands thats why i am covered lucky me it also covers her two sons untill they are 20yrs old !

[drummer boy]

You are a very lucky man gary where do you live and what hospital was that i would think every body would like to know i had one night in hospital before i married a goverment lady in pattaya that cost me 22000baht !

[gemguy]

Well....if you can, then you have to start living a far more healthy life style...which can be done if need be.

Better diet ..no alcohol or drugs or cigarettes ....regular exercise...vitamin and mineral supplements...more sleep ...less stress.....lots of water....cut out the sugar intake....some meaningful activities...a happy ending at least once a week, preferably 2 times a week..lol .......many possibilities that could lessen the impact of growing old.....and or feeling old and worn down....

Cheers