Advice please

[jasetheace]

I am in a bit of a situation and looking for advice. I am trying to take my daughter (half Thai/half kiwi) to Australia with me next week however my ex wife (thai) who is crazy is threatening to block me. My daughter has lived with her grandparents in rural isaan since she was 1yr, now 10yrs. My ex wife lives in Melbourne with a new partner and 2 kids. I visit my daughter at least once a year and have been supporting her and the grandparents the whole time. My plan has been to take my daughter to oz and put her in a couple of terms of school so she can learn English, my Thai is fairly basic so if she can speak English I can have a better relationship with her and she gets the advantage of being bi lingual. Then I plan to bring her back. I have had agreeance from the grandparents, visited her school and cleared it with her teachers, her auntie, etc.... So I have now taken her from udon and she is with me in Phuket. It's just the mum is going absolutely mental on me and says she will not let me leave the country. My daughter is wanting to come with me, her only reservation is she is scared of her mum coz she has told her not to go. My daughter has a Nz passport only and we will be on a one way ticket to Australia. I just want to know if I should expect problems, what I can do about it, and any relevant advice would be appreciated. Can my wife have me stopped from leaving the country even though she is in Australia?

[post]

Just a matter of interest:

 

1) Where was she born?

 

2) Do you have her birth certificate (named with your name as her biological father)? 

 

3) Did you divorce the child's mother officially?

Edited October 19, 2016 by post

[Apiwan2]

Read my reply here.....



She may be going crazy bit 9 times out of 10 she won't contact immigration to fore warn them she's only threatening you.

Secondly don't tell her your plans to start with.

If you in phuket take her on a e day trip abroad locally first.

Now she's with you only speak English with her, she'll grasp it quicker than you think also will help at the airport.

If father and daughter can't communicate may send a flag to immigration.


Hope this helps

[jasetheace]

POST
1 Australia
2 Yes - birth certs Australian and Thai
3 Yes - divorced in Canberra Thai embassy

[jasetheace]

Apiwan2

I hope you are right, there is a chance she is just threatening but does have a Falang partner in Melbourne on her side.

She already knows my plans, was too hard to keep secret and I wanted to be upfront with her grandmother and the school

My current Thai wife is traveling with us and my daughter and her are besties so this should help there.

Day trip from Phuket, like Singapore or something? Penang? Problem is she only has a kiwi passport and has need in Thailand for 8+ years so bringing her back in might be more difficult due to her overstaying so long

[Paul Catton]

Perhaps another option would be to look at repatriating her back to New Zealand, documentation shows she is recognized as a New Zealand citizen by virtue of the passport, and without detail it who would appear she has been abandoned by her mother in an overseas domain.

 

Was this divorce also recorded by the Australian authority, whereby the dissolution of marriage would have an agreement or court order, regarding the "care of child/ren" and addressed as part of the divorce process. 

[jasetheace]

Paul, I live in Brisbane which is why I'm taking here there with me. Yes she is a Nz citizen by decent as I organized that for her when she was born. The divorce was recorded only at the Thai embassy in Canberra as we were married in Thailand. Apparently we were allocated 50/50 custody although I have no record of it, I just receive a divorce certificate. Once I have her in oz I will get lawyers involved and battle for custody. For now I just want to know how I can get her out of Thailand without too many problems, or if there will be problems what to expect. I really appreciate all the comments so far....... This site always seems to be helpful

[Paul Catton]

1 hour ago, jasetheace said:

Paul, I live in Brisbane which is why I'm taking here there with me. Yes she is a Nz citizen by decent as I organized that for her when she was born. The divorce was recorded only at the Thai embassy in Canberra as we were married in Thailand. Apparently we were allocated 50/50 custody although I have no record of it, I just receive a divorce certificate. Once I have her in oz I will get lawyers involved and battle for custody. For now I just want to know how I can get her out of Thailand without too many problems, or if there will be problems what to expect. I really appreciate all the comments so far....... This site always seems to be helpful

Place your current residence to one side for a moment. You are a New Zealander with NZ passport (I assume), daughter likewise through your foresight, so would still consider the extraction from Thailand initially to NZ garnering assistance that may be required from Embassy sources so as not to impede you and your daughters legitimate travel "home" per requisite of the printed declarations in your passports.

Auckland to Coolangatta is a cheap fare these days as Air Asia services the route and then a short coach ride back to water the plants at home.

PM if you feel it more appropriate as there is much detail omitted regarding actual circumstances, to give anything but a broad response.

Being an forefront runner of MRA in the decade past, facing numerous challenges culminating in a life changing semi-victory in the Swedish Supreme Court enables me to be able to type response.

 

[jasetheace]

Hi Paul, I spoke with the Nz embassy yesterday, they can't do much for me as they said it's a matter for immigration and Thai police. The mum now wants me to go to a police station here in Phuket and sign an agreement that I will bring my daughter back in 6 months. I am prepared to do that this morning, but now she wants me to call her while I'm at the station so she can speak with the police........ Im a little bit worried I could be walking into a trap, however at this point I've don't nothing wrong so I don't see a reason they could arrest me and I will have my current Thai wife with me. But this is Thailand [emoji13]

[Paul Catton]

Just now, jasetheace said:

Hi Paul, I spoke with the Nz embassy yesterday, they can't do much for me as they said it's a matter for immigration and Thai police. The mum now wants me to go to a police station here in Phuket and sign an agreement that I will bring my daughter back in 6 months. I am prepared to do that this morning, but now she wants me to call her while I'm at the station so she can speak with the police........ Im a little bit worried I could be walking into a trap, however at this point I've don't nothing wrong so I don't see a reason they could arrest me and I will have my current Thai wife with me. But this is Thailand

Opals niece is down in Phuket, she was a high scoring graduate of Chiang Mai University - Faculty of Law, although she is working in the area of commercial law, she may be an asset to you if you decide to attend the police station.    

[Mattd]

I'd have thought that the most important issue is who, from the Thai authorities POV, has the legal guardianship of your daughter whilst she lives in Thailand?

When you divorced custody must have been given to somebody?

If the legal guardians are the grand parents whilst she is in Thailand, then they can give the permission for her to leave Thailand.

[jasetheace]

Update - attended Thai police today, has to wait ages to see the correct person. They didn't seem to think I have anything to worry about, said I would need to show I'm the father which I have birth certs, and said my ex could only really try and stop me if she was here as they wont accept a complaint over the phone, she would need to be here. Also said if she wants to have the agreement she is asking me for she has to organize it, then up to me if I agree to sign.
In terms of custody we were given 50/50 at the divorce but my ex must have the paperwork as I only got a divorce cert. So I'm a bit more relaxed about it now, but will be nice to have her back in oz, then I can see lawyers and take it from there. Thanks for all the advice, always appreciated [emoji106][emoji482][emoji482]

[Paul Catton]

10 hours ago, jasetheace said:

Update - attended Thai police today, has to wait ages to see the correct person. They didn't seem to think I have anything to worry about, said I would need to show I'm the father which I have birth certs, and said my ex could only really try and stop me if she was here as they wont accept a complaint over the phone, she would need to be here. Also said if she wants to have the agreement she is asking me for she has to organize it, then up to me if I agree to sign.
In terms of custody we were given 50/50 at the divorce but my ex must have the paperwork as I only got a divorce cert. So I'm a bit more relaxed about it now, but will be nice to have her back in oz, then I can see lawyers and take it from there. Thanks for all the advice, always appreciated

Sounds like you've rounded the bend for the home straight, best of luck and fortune for you, wife and daughter.

Possible update regarding immigration clearance process, post departure might be of benefit to others facing similar challenge.

[jasetheace]

Thanks Paul, Definitely, will let everyone know how I get on next weekend, should be interesting

[jasetheace]

Update - We are in Brisbane now, made it home with my wife and daughter in tow so feeling pretty relieved.
We did however have dramas at immigration on the way out. As soon as my daughters passport swiped through the officer flicked a switch and turned to me and my wife. Within seconds there was another office present who whisked us off to another area. We were hit with lots of questions about the situation and why did she not have a Thai passport. Main things is they wanted to see the passport she came in on which I had luckily, or there could have been real problems. After half an hour of surly looking officers filling out forms they basically transferred her over to her new passport in their system and let us pass. No overstay fine due to her being under 14. They said I might have issues bringing her back to Thailand one a one way ticket without a Thai passport, that will be my ex wife's problem now. Thanks again for all the advice, always appreciated. It was a rough trip thanks to my ex but I got the result I was after. There is still plenty of crap to deal with re custody and other stuff moving forward but so far so good. [emoji106]

[Paul Catton]

6 hours ago, jasetheace said:

Update - We are in Brisbane now, made it home with my wife and daughter in tow so feeling pretty relieved.
We did however have dramas at immigration on the way out. As soon as my daughters passport swiped through the officer flicked a switch and turned to me and my wife. Within seconds there was another office present who whisked us off to another area. We were hit with lots of questions about the situation and why did she not have a Thai passport. Main things is they wanted to see the passport she came in on which I had luckily, or there could have been real problems. After half an hour of surly looking officers filling out forms they basically transferred her over to her new passport in their system and let us pass. No overstay fine due to her being under 14. They said I might have issues bringing her back to Thailand one a one way ticket without a Thai passport, that will be my ex wife's problem now. Thanks again for all the advice, always appreciated. It was a rough trip thanks to my ex but I got the result I was after. There is still plenty of crap to deal with re custody and other stuff moving forward but so far so good.

Thanks for the update, am relieved for you, and wish fruition on the journey ahead.

[evadgib]

Have you considered that she may try to reclaim possession in OZ now that 'her' (!) daughter is within reach?

 

Why didn't you apply for Thai passport and ID card for your daughter while in Thailand, assuming of course that you haven't?

 

We Brits have an organisation called families need fathers.  OZ and NZ have similar but their name escapes me. You should look the latter pair up as they cover international scenarios such as yours and are staffed by fathers who have been there...

 

https://fnf.org.uk/

 

HTH & good luck :)

Edited October 30, 2016 by evadgib
Link to British example added

[jasetheace]

She has tried to convince me to send my daughter down to Melbourne to visit her, no chance. We both have 50% custody and I have just obtained proof of this from the Thai embassy. She won't try to come up to Brisbane to get her.

She has a Thai ID card and we did attempt to get her the Thai passport but failed once again, need permission from the mum.

When I take her back it will be on a return ticket so o don't need the Thai passport. Once she turns 14 or 15 however it will become an issue as she loses the child overstay exemption.

Still plenty of challenges ahead [emoji13]

[Apiwan2]

Update - We are in Brisbane now, made it home with my wife and daughter in tow so feeling pretty relieved.
We did however have dramas at immigration on the way out. As soon as my daughters passport swiped through the officer flicked a switch and turned to me and my wife. Within seconds there was another office present who whisked us off to another area. We were hit with lots of questions about the situation and why did she not have a Thai passport. Main things is they wanted to see the passport she came in on which I had luckily, or there could have been real problems. After half an hour of surly looking officers filling out forms they basically transferred her over to her new passport in their system and let us pass. No overstay fine due to her being under 14. They said I might have issues bringing her back to Thailand one a one way ticket without a Thai passport, that will be my ex wife's problem now. Thanks again for all the advice, always appreciated. It was a rough trip thanks to my ex but I got the result I was after. There is still plenty of crap to deal with re custody and other stuff moving forward but so far so good. [emoji106]

Well done mate.

Happy for you.

Keep trying for the thai passport now you have proof of custody,

If not sooner or later mom will realise she has to help get her the passport for her kids future